The Ukraine Crisis

[BDKJMU]

Whatever ends it the quickest so our benevolent govt quits pissing away ginormous sums of taxpayer $$$ into a corrupt country fighting another even more corrupt country. Because outside of our tax dollars being pissed away, whether Russia takes over all of Ukraine, some of Ukraine, or none of Ukraine, will have zero effect on my life.

Ukraine's strategic location and role as the breadbasket of Europe make it important in the grand scheme. Whether Russia takes over all of Ukraine, some of Ukraine, or none of Ukraine, might have zero effect on your life but it could have a significant long-term effects on world peace and international commerce which would impact many Americans.

Sure, Ukraine might have a couple years during this conflict with some agricultural and shipping interruptions, but short of Russia raining nukes all over Ukraine, the grain is still going to be produced and shipped no matter who's in charge of the farm and port(s). If they were a major energy exporter, or controlled a large chunk of the world's semiconductors (hello Taiwan) I'd be concerned. But whatever happen with Ukraine, meh, I don't see it having a major impact on many Americans.

[SeattleGriz]

Whatever ends it the quickest so our benevolent govt quits pissing away ginormous sums of taxpayer $$$ into a corrupt country fighting another even more corrupt country. Because outside of our tax dollars being pissed away, whether Russia takes over all of Ukraine, some of Ukraine, or none of Ukraine, will have zero effect on my life.

Ukraine's strategic location and role as the breadbasket of Europe make it important in the grand scheme. Whether Russia takes over all of Ukraine, some of Ukraine, or none of Ukraine, might have zero effect on your life but it could have a significant long-term effects on world peace and international commerce which would impact many Americans.

That was really swell of the IMF to force Ukraine to sell it's farmland in order to get an IMF loan. I'm sure there are going to be tons of mom and pop farms now that the farmland is for sale.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-ukra ... KKBN21H0J7

[Skjellyfetti]

Ukraine's strategic location and role as the breadbasket of Europe make it important in the grand scheme. Whether Russia takes over all of Ukraine, some of Ukraine, or none of Ukraine, might have zero effect on your life but it could have a significant long-term effects on world peace and international commerce which would impact many Americans.

That was really swell of the IMF to force Ukraine to sell it's farmland in order to get an IMF loan. I'm sure there are going to be tons of mom and pop farms now that the farmland is for sale.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-ukra ... KKBN21H0J7

To other Ukrainians.

Attempting to ease voters’ concerns, the new law, which takes effect in July 2021, only allows Ukrainians to buy and sell farmland.

[SeattleGriz]

That was really swell of the IMF to force Ukraine to sell it's farmland in order to get an IMF loan. I'm sure there are going to be tons of mom and pop farms now that the farmland is for sale.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-ukra ... KKBN21H0J7

To other Ukrainians.

Attempting to ease voters’ concerns, the new law, which takes effect in July 2021, only allows Ukrainians to buy and sell farmland.

I read that, but sure. You really think this is going to be a positive for Ukraine farmland and the average person?

[Skjellyfetti]

No, but I think it's small potatoes... err grechka... to what's going on to Ukrainian farmland and the average person due to the invasion.

[SeattleGriz]

No, but I think it's small potatoes... err grechka... to what's going on to Ukrainian farmland and the average person due to the invasion.

Wait until they open up land purchases to 10,000 hectares in Jan 2024. Big money is going to gobble up all the land.

[kalm]

Ukraine's strategic location and role as the breadbasket of Europe make it important in the grand scheme. Whether Russia takes over all of Ukraine, some of Ukraine, or none of Ukraine, might have zero effect on your life but it could have a significant long-term effects on world peace and international commerce which would impact many Americans.

Sure, Ukraine might have a couple years during this conflict with some agricultural and shipping interruptions, but short of Russia raining nukes all over Ukraine, the grain is still going to be produced and shipped no matter who's in charge of the farm and port(s). If they were a major energy exporter, or controlled a large chunk of the world's semiconductors (hello Taiwan) I'd be concerned. But whatever happen with Ukraine, meh, I don't see it having a major impact on many Americans.

World wide food shortages are also developed country’s problem in regards to destabilization, regional wars, immigration, international aid etc.

[UNI88]

Ukraine's strategic location and role as the breadbasket of Europe make it important in the grand scheme. Whether Russia takes over all of Ukraine, some of Ukraine, or none of Ukraine, might have zero effect on your life but it could have a significant long-term effects on world peace and international commerce which would impact many Americans.

That was really swell of the IMF to force Ukraine to sell it's farmland in order to get an IMF loan. I'm sure there are going to be tons of mom and pop farms now that the farmland is for sale.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-ukra ... KKBN21H0J7

March 29, 2020 - almost 2 years before the invasion by Russian Nazis.

[Skjellyfetti]

Wait until they open up land purchases to 10,000 hectares in Jan 2024. Big money is going to gobble up all the land.

You would have been a big fan of Stalin's collectivization in Ukraine in the 30s.

[kalm]

That was really swell of the IMF to force Ukraine to sell it's farmland in order to get an IMF loan. I'm sure there are going to be tons of mom and pop farms now that the farmland is for sale.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-ukra ... KKBN21H0J7

March 29, 2020 - almost 2 years before the invasion by Russian Nazis.

Ooh…I read about those guys in the left wing echo chamber!

[SeattleGriz]

That was really swell of the IMF to force Ukraine to sell it's farmland in order to get an IMF loan. I'm sure there are going to be tons of mom and pop farms now that the farmland is for sale.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-ukra ... KKBN21H0J7

March 29, 2020 - almost 2 years before the invasion by Russian Nazis.

That's not the point. Look at the terms. Sell your farmland or we don't give you money. You really think that was to benefit the little guy? You backward hicks need to become westernized where eventually our greed will fuck everyone over.

[Silenoz]

Ah.....much becomes clear now. I had thought he was a more garden-variety evangelical wackadoodle. Them Mos are some live ones - they have figured out, like scientology, that the best bait for snaring new members (and 10% of their income), is attractive young women. And they got 'em in Utah big time.

You actually went to discussmormom? To try and refute a military capability that you didn't even refute?

How about some information on the capability of the Russians being able to "blind" US defense. Did this truly happen or is there another explanation.

No, I did it to laugh at yet another one of your whackadoo sources of information. But keep at it

[BDKJMU]

“We just don’t have these tanks available in excess in our US stocks, which is why it is going to take months to transfer these M1A2 Abrams to Ukraine,” Singh said, referencing the specific newer version of the tank the US will send.

White House officials warned Wednesday it could take up to a year before Kyiv receives the tanks that President Biden publicly pledged because they would be purchased new with Congressionally approved funds as part of the Ukraine Security Assistance Initiative.

While the Pentagon typically takes about four days to prepare and deliver weapons that come from US stocks to Ukraine, those sourced through the USAI program can take months to deliver — or even years — as the government identifies and hires defense contractors who then build the weapons from scratch.

https://nypost.com/2023/01/26/ukraine-w ... ussia-war/
Well, that answers my earlier question of are they sending older M1s, M1A1s, or the newer M1A2s. Shows you how stupid our govt is. Instead of having to create new contracts & hire the companies to build the Ukranians brand new M1A2s, courtesy of the US taxpayer, and have them delivered not until late 2023 or 2024, just get a bunch of the mothballed M1s & M1A1s that are sitting by the HUNDREDS mothballed in the desert.

It would cost a fraction of the cost to get them operational and fraction of the time to get to Ukraine vs building new M1A2s from scratch. But oh no, we can’t give the Ukranians those older models. They need the newest verison, and the military industrial complex needs to be paid billions to make them. Meanwhile, the hundreds stores in the desert will continue to sit unused..

[Skjellyfetti]

There's an export version without some tech like depleted uranium armor that we don't want other countries to have. Pretty sure those mothballed once can't be exported.

And, it seems pretty likely the Abrams announcement was just part of the negotiations for Germany to free up the Leopard 2s. Those are a bigger deal.

[BDKJMU]

There's an export version without some tech like depleted uranium armor that we don't want other countries to have. Pretty sure those mothballed once can't be exported.

And, it seems pretty likely the Abrams announcement was just part of the negotiations for Germany to free up the Leopard 2s. Those are a bigger deal.

From what have been able to look up, the original M1s built from 1979-85 (about 3300) didn’t have the depleted uranium armor. M1A1s and A2s have it.

Have to have some of those original M1s still around..

[SeattleGriz]

There's an export version without some tech like depleted uranium armor that we don't want other countries to have. Pretty sure those mothballed once can't be exported.

And, it seems pretty likely the Abrams announcement was just part of the negotiations for Germany to free up the Leopard 2s. Those are a bigger deal.

So, how is Germany going to replace the Leopards that countries like Poland are sending? Seems the US is willing to step in and replace them with Abrams tanks. That's just swell for Germany after the US blew up NordStream. Germany bending over. Ever since Fat Hillary, Merkel, left they have been getting reamed.

[houndawg]

Ah.....much becomes clear now. I had thought he was a more garden-variety evangelical wackadoodle. Them Mos are some live ones - they have figured out, like scientology, that the best bait for snaring new members (and 10% of their income), is attractive young women. And they got 'em in Utah big time.

You actually went to discussmormom? To try and refute a military capability that you didn't even refute?

How about some information on the capability of the Russians being able to "blind" US defense. Did this truly happen or is there another explanation.

I don't know - your crowd posted it. Do you believe it?

My guess is they can't judging by the pitiful performance of their military from top to bottom and the fact that they are barely more than a third-world country. If we do get involved we'll have the Ukraine airspace cleaned out in about 48 hrs. Putin is a dead man walking.

Pro tip: ...if they want to blind somebody's defense they should probably try to blind Ukraine's. After they can do that we'll see what happens....

[houndawg]

Ah.....much becomes clear now. I had thought he was a more garden-variety evangelical wackadoodle. Them Mos are some live ones - they have figured out, like scientology, that the best bait for snaring new members (and 10% of their income), is attractive young women. And they got 'em in Utah big time.

You actually went to discussmormom? To try and refute a military capability that you didn't even refute?

How about some information on the capability of the Russians being able to "blind" US defense. Did this truly happen or is there another explanation.

I did - and it seems you're even dimmer than I thought.....and an incel mormom, who'd a thunk it?

Is this the source you used to develop your theory about Poland blowing up the pipeline?

[houndawg]

There's an export version without some tech like depleted uranium armor that we don't want other countries to have. Pretty sure those mothballed once can't be exported.

And, it seems pretty likely the Abrams announcement was just part of the negotiations for Germany to free up the Leopard 2s. Those are a bigger deal.

So, how is Germany going to replace the Leopards that countries like Poland are sending? Seems the US is willing to step in and replace them with Abrams tanks. That's just swell for Germany after the US blew up NordStream. Germany bending over. Ever since Fat Hillary, Merkel, left they have been getting reamed.

They have this large group of buildings where they manufacture them. No shit.

They won't get ours until next year probably since we're going to make them custom for Ukraine.

Until then the leopards will do just fine and probably achieve a 10:1 kill ratio against the Russian's excuse for tanks. I think we'll probably wind up selling them some A-10s too. i used to work in a munitions factory that made ammo for them - you should see what they do at the test range to the armor used by Russian tanks. I truly feel nothing but sorrow and pity for any troops that have face either if those systems...

[houndawg]

“We just don’t have these tanks available in excess in our US stocks, which is why it is going to take months to transfer these M1A2 Abrams to Ukraine,” Singh said, referencing the specific newer version of the tank the US will send.

White House officials warned Wednesday it could take up to a year before Kyiv receives the tanks that President Biden publicly pledged because they would be purchased new with Congressionally approved funds as part of the Ukraine Security Assistance Initiative.

While the Pentagon typically takes about four days to prepare and deliver weapons that come from US stocks to Ukraine, those sourced through the USAI program can take months to deliver — or even years — as the government identifies and hires defense contractors who then build the weapons from scratch.

https://nypost.com/2023/01/26/ukraine-w ... ussia-war/
Well, that answers my earlier question of are they sending older M1s, M1A1s, or the newer M1A2s. Shows you how stupid our govt is. Instead of having to create new contracts & hire the companies to build the Ukranians brand new M1A2s, courtesy of the US taxpayer, and have them delivered not until late 2023 or 2024, just get a bunch of the mothballed M1s & M1A1s that are sitting by the HUNDREDS mothballed in the desert.

It would cost a fraction of the cost to get them operational and fraction of the time to get to Ukraine vs building new M1A2s from scratch. But oh no, we can’t give the Ukranians those older models. They need the newest verison, and the military industrial complex needs to be paid billions to make them. Meanwhile, the hundreds stores in the desert will continue to sit unused..

We live in a free-market society, Karen - why shouldn't we maximize profits?

That's why wars are fought, right?

[houndawg]

There's an export version without some tech like depleted uranium armor that we don't want other countries to have. Pretty sure those mothballed once can't be exported.

And, it seems pretty likely the Abrams announcement was just part of the negotiations for Germany to free up the Leopard 2s. Those are a bigger deal.

[houndawg]

There's an export version without some tech like depleted uranium armor that we don't want other countries to have. Pretty sure those mothballed once can't be exported.

And, it seems pretty likely the Abrams announcement was just part of the negotiations for Germany to free up the Leopard 2s. Those are a bigger deal.

From what have been able to look up, the original M1s built from 1979-85 (about 3300) didn’t have the depleted uranium armor. M1A1s and A2s have it.

Have to have some of those original M1s still around..

I bet they could trounce Russia's tanks with the old M-60s.

[SeattleGriz]

They sure sound tolerant. Hate to see how they treat others that don't think like them. Acting like Nazis.

[SeattleGriz]

So, how is Germany going to replace the Leopards that countries like Poland are sending? Seems the US is willing to step in and replace them with Abrams tanks. That's just swell for Germany after the US blew up NordStream. Germany bending over. Ever since Fat Hillary, Merkel, left they have been getting reamed.

They have this large group of buildings where they manufacture them. No shit.

They won't get ours until next year probably since we're going to make them custom for Ukraine.

Until then the leopards will do just fine and probably achieve a 10:1 kill ratio against the Russian's excuse for tanks. I think we'll probably wind up selling them some A-10s too. i used to work in a munitions factory that made ammo for them - you should see what they do at the test range to the armor used by Russian tanks. I truly feel nothing but sorrow and pity for any troops that have face either if those systems...

You sure you were in the military? How do you expect these tanks to make it more than a day without support?

[SeattleGriz]

You actually went to discussmormom? To try and refute a military capability that you didn't even refute?

How about some information on the capability of the Russians being able to "blind" US defense. Did this truly happen or is there another explanation.

No, I did it to laugh at yet another one of your whackadoo sources of information. But keep at it

I should actually read a little on that site.

On this board I'm considered a fundamentalist evangelical. We're the new Pharisees, so I can place my rigid rules upon the Mormons!