EGYPT

[TwinTownBisonFan]

by the way - it's 10 miles between Liberation Square and the Presidential Palace in Cairo... speculation that the crowd wants to make that march would be hugely significant.

[YoUDeeMan]

by the way - it's 10 miles between Liberation Square and the Presidential Palace in Cairo... speculation that the crowd wants to make that march would be hugely significant.

10 miles is nothing. They aren't double cheeseburger and mayonaise loaded American couch potatoes.

[Skjellyfetti]

50 miles is much more impressive.

[Bronco]

If Code pink thinks it's a good idea then it must be Ok.

"Obama fundraiser group Code Pink issued an emergency appeal on Thursday for thousands of dollars to help the group overthrow the Egyptian government of Hosni Mubarak."

I think it's pronounced Hose-Me Barack

But If he loses Chis Matthews now I'm really confused


MSNBC's Matthews On Handling Of Egypt: "I Feel Ashamed As An American" (video)
RealClearPolitics ^ | February 4, 2011 | RealClearPolitics

CHRIS MATTHEWS: "What was our plan for transition for our friend? Did we ever talk to him about it, encourage him? That's my view; character and planning. I feel shame about this. I feel ashamed as an American, the way we're doing this.


(Excerpt) Read more at realclearpolitics.com ...

[Appaholic]

i flipped between the big 3 for about an hour... the only mention of egypt was a blurb in the top of the hour news...

am i raging misogynist for noting what complete fluff and bullshit seemingly targeted at brain-dead housewives the morning news shows are? (maybe they've always been this way, and I just haven't noticed)

Meh, maybe it's because I live just outside DC so I am bombarded with this news all the time it seems, while you live in Canada.

It should be noted though...I turned on the TV at 6:30AM, when they actually show NEWS, and was out the door by 7AM. I only ever watch any of the 'morning shows' until about 8AM or so because that's when they definitely seem to target the brain-dead housewives.

Very true. Watch from 5:30-6:30, then get in the shower. It's amazing how much the news digresses from 6:30 to 7:15ish after I get out of the shower, get dressed & head out the door. Getting in the shower, they're discussing Middle East politics & implications for the global economy....get out of the shower & they're re-capping last night's Bachelor...

[Ibanez]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/02 ... tml?hpt=T1

Christians planned a Mass in Cairo's Tahrir Square on Sunday afternoon, anti-government protesters in the square said.

Muslim protesters said they would form a ring around the Christians to protect them during the service. The Mass will pay tribute to those killed during clashes.

Discuss. Talk amongst yourselves.

[Grizalltheway]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/02 ... tml?hpt=T1

Christians planned a Mass in Cairo's Tahrir Square on Sunday afternoon, anti-government protesters in the square said.

Muslim protesters said they would form a ring around the Christians to protect them during the service. The Mass will pay tribute to those killed during clashes.

Discuss. Talk amongst yourselves.

All Muslims are out to kill Christians/Westerners. Fact.

[kalm]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/africa/02 ... tml?hpt=T1




Discuss. Talk amongst yourselves.

All Muslims are out to kill Christians/Westerners. Fact.

Exactly. The 20% of Egyptians that are christian are lucky to still be alive.

[UNI88]

Let's light a fire under this thread ...

How much of an impact do you think the overthrow of Saddam had on events in Tunisia and Egypt?

I'm no fan of GWB but I do believe that the invasion of Iraq, the overthrow of Saddam (as bungled as it was) and the ongoing attempt to create a democratic government has caused some in the Middle East/North Africa to question their lot in life more than they would have if it hadn't occurred.

[TwinTownBisonFan]

Let's light a fire under this thread ...

How much of an impact do you think the overthrow of Saddam had on events in Tunisia and Egypt?

I'm no fan of GWB but I do believe that the invasion of Iraq, the overthrow of Saddam (as bungled as it was) and the ongoing attempt to create a democratic government has caused some in the Middle East/North Africa to question their lot in life more than they would have if it hadn't occurred.

slim to none... I would hazard a guess that part of this fuse was lit by the Lebanese who rose up against Syria and the Iranian Green Revolution against Ahmedinnanutters.

While these protests are pro-democracy, you'll be hard pressed to find many in the Muslim world who look at Iarq and say "now that was a good thing"

however - to only slightly contradict myself - more than a few interviews on al-jazeera english seemed to imply the idea that many moderates in the region felt the revolution against Saddam should have come from within... perhaps that thought was underlying some of this... but i think Lebanon, Iran in 09 and the Pakistani protests against Musharraff are more likely.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Let's light a fire under this thread ...

How much of an impact do you think the overthrow of Saddam had on events in Tunisia and Egypt?

I'm no fan of GWB but I do believe that the invasion of Iraq, the overthrow of Saddam (as bungled as it was) and the ongoing attempt to create a democratic government has caused some in the Middle East/North Africa to question their lot in life more than they would have if it hadn't occurred.

slim to none... I would hazard a guess that part of this fuse was lit by the Lebanese who rose up against Syria and the Iranian Green Revolution against Ahmedinnanutters.

While these protests are pro-democracy, you'll be hard pressed to find many in the Muslim world who look at Iarq and say "now that was a good thing"

however - to only slightly contradict myself - more than a few interviews on al-jazeera english seemed to imply the idea that many moderates in the region felt the revolution against Saddam should have come from within... perhaps that thought was underlying some of this... but i think Lebanon, Iran in 09 and the Pakistani protests against Musharraff are more likely.

Agree, these things always need come from within and even then there is gonna be some blame that America will have to shoulder because our leadership didn't do enough but if we push the effort the backlash feeds those groups that are against us tenfold.

[UNI88]

Let's light a fire under this thread ...

How much of an impact do you think the overthrow of Saddam had on events in Tunisia and Egypt?

I'm no fan of GWB but I do believe that the invasion of Iraq, the overthrow of Saddam (as bungled as it was) and the ongoing attempt to create a democratic government has caused some in the Middle East/North Africa to question their lot in life more than they would have if it hadn't occurred.

slim to none... I would hazard a guess that part of this fuse was lit by the Lebanese who rose up against Syria and the Iranian Green Revolution against Ahmedinnanutters.

While these protests are pro-democracy, you'll be hard pressed to find many in the Muslim world who look at Iarq and say "now that was a good thing"

however - to only slightly contradict myself - more than a few interviews on al-jazeera english seemed to imply the idea that many moderates in the region felt the revolution against Saddam should have come from within... perhaps that thought was underlying some of this... but i think Lebanon, Iran in 09 and the Pakistani protests against Musharraff are more likely.

Slim I can agree with as a possibility. None is to absolute as an answer. Who is to say that the Iranian green revolution wasn't influenced to some extent by events in Iraq? The Lebanon/Syria situation has been going on for a long time and is of a different nature than Iraq, Tunisia and Egypt but you could argue that events in Iraq have had some influence there as well.

I also don't think there are many that look at Iraq and say "now that was a good thing" but why can't they be looking at it and saying "we can do it better"?

I do think that is has been an influence. A minor influence but still an influence.

And I agree with Ursus that these types of revolutions are better if they come from within. Unfortunately the neocons were to arrogant to understand that. They do create a sticky mess for the U.S. Do we back the dictator who is a stalwart against Islamic extremism or do we support a popular uprising?

[TwinTownBisonFan]

slim to none... I would hazard a guess that part of this fuse was lit by the Lebanese who rose up against Syria and the Iranian Green Revolution against Ahmedinnanutters.

While these protests are pro-democracy, you'll be hard pressed to find many in the Muslim world who look at Iarq and say "now that was a good thing"

however - to only slightly contradict myself - more than a few interviews on al-jazeera english seemed to imply the idea that many moderates in the region felt the revolution against Saddam should have come from within... perhaps that thought was underlying some of this... but i think Lebanon, Iran in 09 and the Pakistani protests against Musharraff are more likely.

Slim I can agree with as a possibility. None is to absolute as an answer. Who is to say that the Iranian green revolution wasn't influenced to some extent by events in Iraq? The Lebanon/Syria situation has been going on for a long time and is of a different nature than Iraq, Tunisia and Egypt but you could argue that events in Iraq have had some influence there as well.

I also don't think there are many that look at Iraq and say "now that was a good thing" but why can't they be looking at it and saying "we can do it better"?

I do think that is has been an influence. A minor influence but still an influence.

And I agree with Ursus that these types of revolutions are better if they come from within. Unfortunately the neocons were to arrogant to understand that. They do create a sticky mess for the U.S. Do we back the dictator who is a stalwart against Islamic extremism or do we support a popular uprising?

considering the "islamist" faction in Egypt - the muslim brotherhood... just this week issued a statement that could only be described as a beeyotching to Ahmedinijad - saying in no uncertain terms that they were part of a coalition interested in pursuing an inclusive democracy - only interested in having their voice heard... (and yes, a cynic could argue that was optics for the west... but i kind of doubt it) i think it's important to be behind the attempt to democratize egypt... just not too overtly - we cannot play a heavy hand in making this happen... if the US is seen as meddling too much it will de-legitimize what is happening in the street. The discreet role being played by Clinton, McCain, Kerry and Biden (and likely Gates too) is essential - and the extent to which we should be involved.