Israel-Palestine Drama Thread

[kalm]

The further reaching diplomatic entanglements of this situation are edgy.

Rabbi Goldschmidt spoke by phone from Israel, where he had just attended the funeral of an Israeli soldier slain in the fighting on Saturday; he said the deceased, Yuval Ben Yaakov, was the son of another former Moscow rabbi. He added that many Jewish leaders had once seen Mr. Putin as an ally in keeping the memory of World War II alive, but when the Russian president started falsely equating Ukraine’s current government to Nazi Germany to justify an invasion, “that’s when the Jews said: ‘We’re not part of it.’”

There are clear geopolitical reasons for Mr. Putin’s shift on Israel. In the Middle East, where Russia has long tried to play a kingmaker role and build relations with all major powers, Moscow now finds itself beholden to Iran — Israel’s bitter enemy — as one of its primary arms suppliers for the war in Ukraine.

And unlike in years past, when Mr. Putin sought ways to cooperate with Western countries, he now appears to see little incentive to try to work with them to broker an end to the fighting in Israel as Russian forces are being pummeled by Western weaponry in Ukraine.

But there are also, perhaps, more personal reasons. Mr. Putin appears stung that Israel and Jewish leaders around the world are not backing his false narrative about Ukraine’s being run by “Nazis.” In recent months, he has repeatedly lashed out at President Volodymyr Zelensky of Ukraine for heading a Nazi government despite being Jewish. In June, Mr. Putin claimed that his “many Jewish friends” had told him that Mr. Zelensky was “a disgrace to the Jewish people.”

There have been signs since last year that the relationship was fraying. Russia cracked down on the Jewish Agency, an Israeli nonprofit that was a mainstay of Jewish life in Russia and helped Russian Jews move to Israel. In June, Russia’s Foreign Ministry summoned the Israeli ambassador to claim that Israel’s envoy to Ukraine was complicit in “whitewashing” Nazi crimes. (Some Ukrainian independence fighters fought alongside Nazi Germany against the Soviet Union in World War II, the foundation of Mr. Putin’s spurious claims that Ukraine’s current leaders are Nazis.)

Mr. Putin has described President Volodymyr Zelensky of Ukraine as heading a “Nazi” government. Mr. Zelensky is Jewish.Credit...Nicole Tung for The New York Times
“No one in the Kremlin is rushing to show sympathy to the victims” of Hamas’s incursion into Israel, said Alexander Gabuev, director of the Carnegie Russia Eurasia Center. “This also shows you the emotional attitude — ‘grievance’ is the right word.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/10/worl ... tid=Zxz2cZ

[houndawg]

Russians being white has a lot to do with it. Notice how they're always bleeding through about "socialism"? Except when talking about Russia?

Unlike so many snot-noses here I'm old enough to remember when Republicans were all about standing firm in supporting our democtatic allies against the godless communists; at the beginning of the space race many of them were even convinced that the Russians were controlling the weather. Later on while serving in the Army the official line was that Ivan was 10 ft. tall and bulletproof. This all changed as the NRA began to accept Russian money come under Russian control through the VP of the NRA's KGB "girlfriend". I believe at one point they were getting $30,000,000/year - enough that Wayne "Lucky" Pierre could take private aviation across the country to go clothes shopping in Beverly Hills - which in and of itself speaks volumes about the NRA.

Hey Snoopy,

The White Russians put 3 seconds back on the clock to beat the USA basketball team, The Russians are still hated trust me … and when the Beatles sang The Ukraine girls really knock me out do you really think they weren’t singing about white girls …. All of your bias is comical

The Beatles?........ ........you ok CH? Wrong thread..?

[Caribbean Hen]

The irony here

I know my Beatles

I know right? You being an Beatles fan.

But excellent! Listen to their words as much as possible.

Lol

You don’t me

[houndawg]

Why is MAGAt pro russia?

Don't tell me it's because conservatives like strongmen bullies. Historically conservatives have been opposed to nations that are rivals/adversaries like russia and china and many of them have been led by strongmen bullies like Stalin and Mao.

I think it's because trump has hijacked the conservative cause and he looks out for what is best for him and his crime family. He sees the potential to profit from his relationship with russia and putin so he puts American interests aside and pursues what is best for him. His MAGAt yahoo worshippers dutifully follow. MAGAt yahoos are not pro-America, they're pro-trump.

Nope- pro Trump and pro America. To the contrary anyone who puts defending defending Ukraine’s border above defending America’s (virtually the entire democrat party and a chunk of the republican) isn’t pro America.

You'd suck him off in Times Square if somebody held his gut.

[houndawg]

Can see it now. US needs to go to war footing. Neocons strike again and their military industrial complex masters will be pleased with all the new orders for equipment.

Nobody wants Russian arms anymore.

[houndawg]

Palestinians I've talked to always made a distiction between ashkenazi and sephardic jews.

Here we have a couple of Israel is close to 100% responsible posters.

When Moses arrived there were already people living there.

[kalm]

I know right? You being an Beatles fan.

But excellent! Listen to their words as much as possible.

Lol

You don’t me

This is very, very, true.

[Baldy]

So, Iran doesn't provide Hamas with funding, training, and military equipment?

Do tell...

Of course they do. But that’s not what you asked/implied, is it?

Of course it is because you can do lots of funding, training, and equipping with $6,000,000,000 in free money.

[kalm]

Of course they do. But that’s not what you asked/implied, is it?

Of course it is because you can do lots of funding, training, and equipping with $6,000,000,000 in free money.

There you go again. That money is still in an account in Doha.

Baldy…more easily mislead than even Fox News.



https://www.foxnews.com/politics/republ ... ack-israel

[UNI88]

Here we have a couple of Israel is close to 100% responsible posters.

When Moses arrived there were already people living there.

When the Palestinians arrived there were already people living there.

[UNI88]

Why is MAGAt pro russia?

Don't tell me it's because conservatives like strongmen bullies. Historically conservatives have been opposed to nations that are rivals/adversaries like russia and china and many of them have been led by strongmen bullies like Stalin and Mao.

I think it's because trump has hijacked the conservative cause and he looks out for what is best for him and his crime family. He sees the potential to profit from his relationship with russia and putin so he puts American interests aside and pursues what is best for him. His MAGAt yahoo worshippers dutifully follow. MAGAt yahoos are not pro-America, they're pro-trump.

Nope- pro Trump and pro America. To the contrary anyone who puts defending defending Ukraine’s border above defending America’s (virtually the entire democrat party and a chunk of the republican) isn’t pro America.

A pro-American wants to defend our border and help Ukraine.

A MAGAt yahoo pushes trump's interests over America's. They wrap themselves in a flag and self-identify as patriotic Americans.

[Caribbean Hen]

Hey Snoopy,

The White Russians put 3 seconds back on the clock to beat the USA basketball team, The Russians are still hated trust me … and when the Beatles sang The Ukraine girls really knock me out do you really think they weren’t singing about white girls …. All of your bias is comical

The Beatles?........ ........you ok CH? Wrong thread..?

Where is the Beatles thread on here

[Baldy]

Of course it is because you can do lots of funding, training, and equipping with $6,000,000,000 in free money.

There you go again. That money is still in an account in Doha.

Baldy…more easily mislead than even Fox News.



https://www.foxnews.com/politics/republ ... ack-israel

Since you're really struggling with this, I'll try to help.

Iran knows there is a $6 BILLION windfall coming in within the next few months to pay for food and energy and housing and whatever else 'humanitarian aid' is. There is no way with an influx like that they would they reallocate money in their current budget to fund and support terrorism, no way at all.

[BDKJMU]

Nope- pro Trump and pro America. To the contrary anyone who puts defending defending Ukraine’s border above defending America’s (virtually the entire democrat party and a chunk of the republican) isn’t pro America.

A pro-American wants to defend our border and help Ukraine.
A MAGAt yahoo pushes trump's interests over America's. They wrap themselves in a flag and self-identify as patriotic Americans.

A pro America wants to put defending our border before defending Ukraine’s. That would include the amoubt of $$ spent.

[BDKJMU]

There you go again. That money is still in an account in Doha.

Baldy…more easily mislead than even Fox News.



https://www.foxnews.com/politics/republ ... ack-israel

Since you're really struggling with this, I'll try to help.

Iran knows there is a $6 BILLION windfall coming in within the next few months to pay for food and energy and housing and whatever else 'humanitarian aid' is. There is no way with an influx like that they would they reallocate money in their current budget to fund and support terrorism, no way at all.

Let me dumb it down for Kalm:

[UNI88]

A pro-American wants to defend our border and help Ukraine.
A MAGAt yahoo pushes trump's interests over America's. They wrap themselves in a flag and self-identify as patriotic Americans.

A pro America wants to put defending our border before defending Ukraine’s. That would include the amoubt of $$ spent.

It's not an either or choice. You just want to try and make it one to support trump's agenda.

[houndawg]

When Moses arrived there were already people living there.

When the Palestinians arrived there were already people living there.

True dat. And thats why you're off the mark with your "..someone who thinks its 100% Israel's fault .." queefing.
Thoroughout history groups of people have arrived at new lands and displaced/assimilated the locals.

This was an especially ugly incident even by the standards of the area and there is no defending it and it ain't over. Understanding how it came to happen is not condoning it. Nor should we forget that Hamas doesn't give a fuck about the Palestinians and is nothing more than an Iranian sock puppet being used to respond the warming of relations between the Israelis and the Saudis. Iran kills some Jews and Palestinians pay.

[houndawg]

A pro-American wants to defend our border and help Ukraine.
A MAGAt yahoo pushes trump's interests over America's. They wrap themselves in a flag and self-identify as patriotic Americans.

A pro America wants to put defending our border before defending Ukraine’s. That would include the amoubt of $$ spent.

What about Mexico? Shouldn't somebody be reminding them?

[kalm]

There you go again. That money is still in an account in Doha.

Baldy…more easily mislead than even Fox News.



https://www.foxnews.com/politics/republ ... ack-israel

Since you're really struggling with this, I'll try to help.

Iran knows there is a $6 BILLION windfall coming in within the next few months to pay for food and energy and housing and whatever else 'humanitarian aid' is. There is no way with an influx like that they would they reallocate money in their current budget to fund and support terrorism, no way at all.

If you had made an argument for ending all foreign aid (or in this case, frozen Iranian assets) to all countries who support terrorism as that money will eventually end up in the hands of the terrorists like Hamas, I’m on board.

But that’s clearly not what you said. You were leaching onto Republican propaganda to score political points.

Congrats!

[kalm]

Since you're really struggling with this, I'll try to help.

Iran knows there is a $6 BILLION windfall coming in within the next few months to pay for food and energy and housing and whatever else 'humanitarian aid' is. There is no way with an influx like that they would they reallocate money in their current budget to fund and support terrorism, no way at all.

Let me dumb it down for Kalm:

Thanks! I know I can always count on you to dumb things down.

[UNI88]

When the Palestinians arrived there were already people living there.

True dat. And thats why you're off the mark with your "..someone who thinks its 100% Israel's fault .." queefing.
Thoroughout history groups of people have arrived at new lands and displaced/assimilated the locals.

This was an especially ugly incident even by the standards of the area and there is no defending it and it ain't over. Understanding how it came to happen is not condoning it. Nor should we forget that Hamas doesn't give a fuck about the Palestinians and is nothing more than an Iranian sock puppet being used to respond the warming of relations between the Israelis and the Saudis. Iran kills some Jews and Palestinians pay.

So I was a little hyperbolic with the 100%. Sue me.

There are plenty of morons who want to place the majority (more than 60%) of the blame on Israel (or the Palestinians). The reality is that both sides are responsible. Both sides have been aggressors and victims. Palestinians are not getting Palestine back in the foreseeable future. If they continue to terrorize rather than trying to find a way to coexist with Israel, their people are going to suffer.

You are spot on with your sock puppet paragraph.

[Caribbean Hen]

A pro America wants to put defending our border before defending Ukraine’s. That would include the amoubt of $$ spent.

It's not an either or choice. You just want to try and make it one to support trump's agenda.

Not a Trump agenda

We defended the border long before Trump rented your spacious head

[LeadBolt]

A critical difference is that while Israel is content to co-exist, Iran and, as they were correctly identified their sock puppets Hamas and Hezbollah are not.

The Palestinians are exploited by Iran through the sock puppets and caught up and punished in the Israeli response to the sock puppets violence.

The only way that the Palestinians can get out of this downward spiral is to repudiate and expel the sock puppets.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[UNI88]

It's not an either or choice. You just want to try and make it one to support trump's agenda.

Not a Trump agenda

We defended the border long before Trump rented your spacious head

I support defending the border. I also support helping Ukraine. It's not an either or choice and it's disingenuous to try and make it one.

[Pwns]

A critical difference is that while Israel is content to co-exist, Iran and, as they were correctly identified their sock puppets Hamas and Hezbollah are not.

The Palestinians are exploited by Iran through the sock puppets and caught up and punished in the Israeli response to the sock puppets violence.

The only way that the Palestinians can get out of this downward spiral is to repudiate and expel the sock puppets.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The more I try to learn about this issue and think about it, the more I think this is close to the truth.

Israel can make concessions and agree to scale down their presence in Gaza but all the hate propaganda that comes from these Iran proxies just helps Hamas win elections and increase their saber rattling, which in turn makes Israel bear down harder on the Palestinians, which in turn pisses off Palestinians emboldens Hamas. Hamas and Hezbollah are the battery that's there is to restart the combustion cycle any time anyone tries to stop it.

People anger needs to be directed at these fanatics and not regular Palestinian people or the Israeli government.