Obama to seek repeal of "Don't ask, Don't Tell"

[mainejeff]

Gay guys have mind powers that may turn straight guys gay!

[93henfan]

Gay guys have mind powers that may turn straight guys gay!

You must have spent time in jail.

[Rob Iola]

What I don't understand is - wouldn't homophobes WANT gays to serve, preferably on the front lines?

[Skjellyfetti]

edit: I see your edited post now, 93, and I agree with it

[93henfan]

What I don't understand is - wouldn't homophobes WANT gays to serve, preferably on the front lines?

Yes, and for reasons you might not have thought about. I believe there are studies that show that a sizable percentage of homophobes are simply suppressing their own homosexuality. If that is the case, they probably want a gay guy in front of them, in the tightest pants possible. Oh, they'll cover his ass, alright.

[CID1990]

I don't think women have any business in combat roles... but, they aren't put in combat roles.

Heard an interesting episode of This American Life recently about life onboard an aircraft carrier... one of the best interviews was with this girl that stocked vending machines onboard the ship for 12 hours a day. What a shitty ass job... but, why shouldn't a woman be able to perform that job?

Not correct.

[CID1990]

I said combat role... and I should have said ground combat role. My bad, Hogan.

Y'all know good and well women aren't allowed in ground combat ROLES... MOS, rating, etc.

Jessica Lynch was in the Quartermaster Corps and a supply clerk:

Subsistence supply clerks perform clerical and stock handling duties incident to funding, requisitioning, purchasing, receiving, accounting, and storing subsistence supplies required for troop consumption and/or for resale activities, units, and organizations. Typical duties of subsistence supply clerks arm to check incoming shipments, prepare reports of supplies received, prepare, edit, and consolidate back-orders for subsistence stores.

Incorrect again.

How about the little gal that rode on top of my Humvee in Baghdad every day for half a year manning the .50 cal? She was in the 571st MPs out of Ft. Lewis. In fact, that particular company had about 10 women and every one of them were not only in combat roles, but were sending things downrange, as well. She popped a guy who was involved in a SAF attack on our two-vehicle squad back in 2004 so I'm pretty sure that's a ground combat role. (although she was technically in a Humvee and not actually standing on the ground, so I guess you're right in a "who's on first?" kind of way.) The same company had another woman who had her arm taken off by an RPG a few weeks before I joined them, and she was standing on the ground with a rifle. Maybe that counts.

You can point to something you read, some official policy, but I'll tell you I was there and the women are fightin'.

[Ibanez]

You can not tell me that a woman flying a fighter is not in a combat role. SHE'S FLYING A GODDAMN GUNSHIP!

I said combat role... and I should have said ground combat role. My bad, Hogan.

"direct ground combat roles"

Air to ground not count?

[Ibanez]

I said combat role... and I should have said ground combat role. My bad, Hogan.

Y'all know good and well women aren't allowed in ground combat ROLES... MOS, rating, etc.

Jessica Lynch was in the Quartermaster Corps and a supply clerk:

Incorrect again.

How about the little gal that rode on top of my Humvee in Baghdad every day for half a year manning the .50 cal? She was in the 571st MPs out of Ft. Lewis. In fact, that particular company had about 10 women and every one of them were not only in combat roles, but were sending things downrange, as well. She popped a guy who was involved in a SAF attack on our two-vehicle squad back in 2004 so I'm pretty sure that's a ground combat role. (although she was technically in a Humvee and not actually standing on the ground, so I guess you're right in a "who's on first?" kind of way.) The same company had another woman who had her arm taken off by an RPG a few weeks before I joined them, and she was standing on the ground with a rifle. Maybe that counts.

You can point to something you read, some official policy, but I'll tell you I was there and the women are fightin'.

Man, that's what they WANT YOU TO THINK!


Man!

[Ibanez]

I said combat role... and I should have said ground combat role. My bad, Hogan.

Y'all know good and well women aren't allowed in ground combat ROLES... MOS, rating, etc.

Jessica Lynch was in the Quartermaster Corps and a supply clerk:

Incorrect again.

How about the little gal that rode on top of my Humvee in Baghdad every day for half a year manning the .50 cal? She was in the 571st MPs out of Ft. Lewis. In fact, that particular company had about 10 women and every one of them were not only in combat roles, but were sending things downrange, as well. She popped a guy who was involved in a SAF attack on our two-vehicle squad back in 2004 so I'm pretty sure that's a ground combat role. (although she was technically in a Humvee and not actually standing on the ground, so I guess you're right in a "who's on first?" kind of way.) The same company had another woman who had her arm taken off by an RPG a few weeks before I joined them, and she was standing on the ground with a rifle. Maybe that counts.

You can point to something you read, some official policy, but I'll tell you I was there and the women are fightin'.

I work with a female Marine that was in the same p osition. Then again, she was rolling, it's not combat.

[BDKJMU]

I said combat role... and I should have said ground combat role. My bad, Hogan.

Y'all know good and well women aren't allowed in ground combat ROLES... MOS, rating, etc.

Jessica Lynch was in the Quartermaster Corps and a supply clerk:

Thanks but when the bad guys are shooting at you, it's called combat.

Give him a break. He's confused and probably wouldn't know which end of the tube the round came out of.

To set the record straight, women can serve on combat ships (but not on subs) and as pilots, including fighter pilots. Women are barred from serving in ground combat units (infantry, armor, field artillery, special ops units). Women can however serve on the staffs of infantry and armor units at Division level and above. However, there are cases of women being attached to ground combat units (medics, detailed to search female Iraqi prisoners). They can serve as military police, which do do among other things convoy escorts and often see combat. That's how Sgt Leigh Ann Hester became the 1st woman to earn the Silver star.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leigh_Ann_Hester

And as has been exampled in Iraq, often what aren't considered front line combat units, ie. "in the rear with the gear" can all of a sudden be in combat under indirect or even direct fire, one of many examples being convoys.

A much lower percentage of women in the military will see combat than men, but some will see combat.

Edit: Damn it, I replied before reading all the other replies, and see that several poster had already set the record straight.

[CID1990]

We were doing combat patrols in Rustimiyah with two female gunners, Policy is sometimes divergent from reality.

[COBBLESTONE]

I'm a military veteran (probably why Cap'N'Cat hates my guts) and wrote this recent article in my local paper on this issue.

Fire away...

Unlike most people in this state I served in the military. Between Active Duty Army & Army National Guard I totaled up 21 years. I retired as an E-7 and spent half of those 21 years leading troops either as a squad leader and/or platoon sergeant.

That being said, my feeling is if someone wants to serve in the military and wants to do their job with technical proficiency as well as discipline then let them. I am neither an opponent nor proponent of gays in the military. I am interested in soldiers who can perform under pressure. If I'm in an Infantry unit and I am waiting for fire support from the artillery, I really don't care if the FDC chief or anybody on the howitzer crew is homosexual, heterosexual or a-sexual. I just want the steel to hit the target.

As for morale of the troops. I've seen soldiers who did not openly admit to being gay nor were they accused of being gay but it was a very safe bet that they were. I never had a problem with any of them since I never witnessed any homosexual behavior in my platoon. I might add that I would not have tolerated any flirting between soldiers of the opposite sex during duty hours and while in uniform. Both of these situations would indeed effect the performance of a platoon or squad and be in violation of UCMJ. All of that sort of behavior should be kept during off duty hours and out of uniform.

Bottom line in my book... a good soldier is a valuable commodity in this day and age. For those of you who served during the draft years, keep in mind that we no longer have the luxury of big numbers in the military. During my career I saw units that were as low as 50% in strength when it came to boots on the ground. With an all volunteer force we should be thankful that there are young men and women still willing to step forward and take on the responsibility of a military career. We should be interested in their character and willingness to serve technically proficiently and honorably. I fail to see where sexual orientation comes into play in all of this.

FYI, I am a happily married (heterosexual) man to a woman and have a great child.

[dbackjon]

Great letter, Cobblestone!

Well put.

[Col Hogan]

I'm a military veteran (probably why Cap'N'Cat hates my guts) and wrote this recent article in my local paper on this issue.

Fire away...

Unlike most people in this state I served in the military. Between Active Duty Army & Army National Guard I totaled up 21 years. I retired as an E-7 and spent half of those 21 years leading troops either as a squad leader and/or platoon sergeant.

That being said, my feeling is if someone wants to serve in the military and wants to do their job with technical proficiency as well as discipline then let them. I am neither an opponent nor proponent of gays in the military. I am interested in soldiers who can perform under pressure. If I'm in an Infantry unit and I am waiting for fire support from the artillery, I really don't care if the FDC chief or anybody on the howitzer crew is homosexual, heterosexual or a-sexual. I just want the steel to hit the target.

As for morale of the troops. I've seen soldiers who did not openly admit to being gay nor were they accused of being gay but it was a very safe bet that they were. I never had a problem with any of them since I never witnessed any homosexual behavior in my platoon. I might add that I would not have tolerated any flirting between soldiers of the opposite sex during duty hours and while in uniform. Both of these situations would indeed effect the performance of a platoon or squad and be in violation of UCMJ. All of that sort of behavior should be kept during off duty hours and out of uniform.

Bottom line in my book... a good soldier is a valuable commodity in this day and age. For those of you who served during the draft years, keep in mind that we no longer have the luxury of big numbers in the military. During my career I saw units that were as low as 50% in strength when it came to boots on the ground. With an all volunteer force we should be thankful that there are young men and women still willing to step forward and take on the responsibility of a military career. We should be interested in their character and willingness to serve technically proficiently and honorably. I fail to see where sexual orientation comes into play in all of this.

FYI, I am a happily married (heterosexual) man to a woman and have a great child.

Thanks for your service, and for sharing this...well put...

[AZGrizFan]

Air to ground not count?

Jesus. Watching KY try to spin his way out of this is fuckin' priceless.

[houndawg]

I'm a military veteran (probably why Cap'N'Cat hates my guts) and wrote this recent article in my local paper on this issue.

Fire away...

Unlike most people in this state I served in the military. Between Active Duty Army & Army National Guard I totaled up 21 years. I retired as an E-7 and spent half of those 21 years leading troops either as a squad leader and/or platoon sergeant.

That being said, my feeling is if someone wants to serve in the military and wants to do their job with technical proficiency as well as discipline then let them. I am neither an opponent nor proponent of gays in the military. I am interested in soldiers who can perform under pressure. If I'm in an Infantry unit and I am waiting for fire support from the artillery, I really don't care if the FDC chief or anybody on the howitzer crew is homosexual, heterosexual or a-sexual. I just want the steel to hit the target.

As for morale of the troops. I've seen soldiers who did not openly admit to being gay nor were they accused of being gay but it was a very safe bet that they were. I never had a problem with any of them since I never witnessed any homosexual behavior in my platoon. I might add that I would not have tolerated any flirting between soldiers of the opposite sex during duty hours and while in uniform. Both of these situations would indeed effect the performance of a platoon or squad and be in violation of UCMJ. All of that sort of behavior should be kept during off duty hours and out of uniform.

Bottom line in my book... a good soldier is a valuable commodity in this day and age. For those of you who served during the draft years, keep in mind that we no longer have the luxury of big numbers in the military. During my career I saw units that were as low as 50% in strength when it came to boots on the ground. With an all volunteer force we should be thankful that there are young men and women still willing to step forward and take on the responsibility of a military career. We should be interested in their character and willingness to serve technically proficiently and honorably. I fail to see where sexual orientation comes into play in all of this.

FYI, I am a happily married (heterosexual) man to a woman and have a great child.

Exactly.

BTW, Cap'n doesn't hate you because you're a vet, he loves me. (Of course, I send him weed so he'll get me on his POY Awards.)