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kalm wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 6:00 am

UNI88 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 5:47 am So what does what the US did in Iraq or Afghanistan or NATO did in Bosnia have to do with Ukraine and why are they repeatedly brought up in a thread about Ukraine?

If someone feels strongly that US transgressions and hypocrisy need to be discussed they should start a thread about them.

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But then he’d be agreeing with the left…

UNI88 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 26, 2022 12:19 pm

SeattleGriz wrote:
I didn't say he didn't invade. I was asking for your list of past Putin transgressions that show he has a track record of saying one thing and then doing another.

How are US fuckups a distraction? Because it's okay when the US trots into some third world country and completely over turns it for faulty reasons? It matters because we are talking about justification for starting shit.

If you are going to hold Putin accountable, are you holding the US to the same level of accountability?

Do I think Putin uses really weak excuses and subterfuge to skirt international law? You bet. But does the US pull the same shit when they want. Yes.

Look at Yugoslavia. That was a NATO war that was not UN approved, but hey, it's okay!

Maybe I'm looking at it too formulaic by expecting there to be some standard, but all I'm seeing is as long as you're on the right team, you get to make up rules as you go.

How is repeatedly bringing up US (or NATO) actions in a thread about Ukraine not a deflection or attempted hijack?



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UNI88 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 5:47 am

SDHornet wrote:
Because NATO is poking around and supporting a country that isn't a NATO member. People seem to be conflating Russian actions against Ukraine (as unfounded and belligerent as they are) as direct acts against NATO or a NATO member.

There's a difference between Russia attacking a NATO member and attacking a non-NATO member. People seem to be forgetting that context.

So what does what the US did in Iraq or Afghanistan or NATO did in Bosnia have to do with Ukraine and why are they repeatedly brought up in a thread about Ukraine?

If someone feels strongly that US transgressions and hypocrisy need to be discussed they should start a thread about them.

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SDHornet wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:57 pm Oh...so it is plausible the Bucha massacre was the result of Ukrainian shelling...

SDHornet wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:53 pm

UNI88 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 5:47 am So what does what the US did in Iraq or Afghanistan or NATO did in Bosnia have to do with Ukraine and why are they repeatedly brought up in a thread about Ukraine?

If someone feels strongly that US transgressions and hypocrisy need to be discussed they should start a thread about them.

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Oh so the argument of the US not having a "coalition" going in not matter?

houndawg wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:00 pm

SDHornet wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:53 pm

Oh so the argument of the US not having a "coalition" going in not matter?

Who's "going in"?

We're just supplying Ukraine with equipment so they can kill Russians - the enemy of my enemy is my friend. "Payback time" in the common speech.

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 6:38 pm

houndawg wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:00 pm

Who's "going in"?

We're just supplying Ukraine with equipment so they can kill Russians - the enemy of my enemy is my friend. "Payback time" in the common speech.

Patton was right. Should have taken care of the Russians in 45'/46'. And it got him killed.

Coal Makes a Comeback as the World Thirsts for Energy

…The push is being led by Europe, which is boosting coal purchases to ensure it can keep power flowing to homes and factories after Russia cut gas supplies to the continent. Germany, which has promised to eliminate coal as a power source by 2030, is among the nations now importing more. Economy Minister Robert Habeck called the increased reliance on coal bitter but necessary.

“Right now the sentiment is that more coal is better than more Russia,” said Alex Msimang, a London-based partner at law firm Vinson & Elkins LLP specializing in the energy sector.

Parts of the U.S. are boosting use of coal power, as high demand for electricity amid unusually hot temperatures pushes regional power grids to the brink of blackouts this summer.

China, the world’s biggest coal consumer, is expanding production of the fuel and its use in power generation, spooked by shortages last year that caused electricity cuts and outages throughout the country, energy experts say.

India is also leaning hard on coal as energy demand increases. The nation’s coal-power generation hit a record in April, said Rahul Tongia, a senior fellow at New Delhi-based think tank the Centre for Social and Economic Progress.

Domestic coal production in China and India helped drive a 10% increase in global investment in 2021, the International Energy Agency reported last month. The IEA projects another 10% increase this year as China and India try to stave off shortages…..

….Coal use fell in many major Western countries over the past decade, displaced by cleaner forms of energy that became more cost-competitive. Natural gas became more plentiful thanks to the American fracking boom and Russian exports to Europe. Renewable energy sources such as wind and solar power also gained market share, buoyed by falling prices and government subsidies and mandates.

Still, global coal demand held strong, fueled by fast-growing energy needs in much of the rest of the world—and is on track to hit record highs this year, according to forecasts by the IEA…..

…Still, efforts to wean Western nations off Russian energy figure to strain global supplies for the foreseeable future. In April, the European Union agreed to ban imports of Russian coal. Before the war, Russia was Europe’s largest supplier of the thermal coal used in power generation, and the ban affected around 70% of the supply that European power stations require, according to Rystad Energy.

In addition to Germany, Italy, France, the U.K., the Netherlands and Austria have now said they are preparing to restart coal-fired power plants, boost their production or keep them running longer than planned. Many countries say they are trying to build up stockpiles of natural gas ahead of winter, when it is in high demand as a heating fuel.….

….China, the world’s largest greenhouse-gas emitter, already comprises around half of the world’s coal-power capacity, with plants accounting for nearly a third of global coal consumption, according to energy data trackers.

The country is still building new coal plants at a rapid clip, at risk of oversupply, “because it can’t afford a power shortage,” says Ryna Cui, co-director of the China program at the University of Maryland’s Center for Global Sustainability….

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 7:46 am

Coal Makes a Comeback as the World Thirsts for Energy

…The push is being led by Europe, which is boosting coal purchases to ensure it can keep power flowing to homes and factories after Russia cut gas supplies to the continent. Germany, which has promised to eliminate coal as a power source by 2030, is among the nations now importing more. Economy Minister Robert Habeck called the increased reliance on coal bitter but necessary.

“Right now the sentiment is that more coal is better than more Russia,” said Alex Msimang, a London-based partner at law firm Vinson & Elkins LLP specializing in the energy sector.

Parts of the U.S. are boosting use of coal power, as high demand for electricity amid unusually hot temperatures pushes regional power grids to the brink of blackouts this summer.

China, the world’s biggest coal consumer, is expanding production of the fuel and its use in power generation, spooked by shortages last year that caused electricity cuts and outages throughout the country, energy experts say.

India is also leaning hard on coal as energy demand increases. The nation’s coal-power generation hit a record in April, said Rahul Tongia, a senior fellow at New Delhi-based think tank the Centre for Social and Economic Progress.

Domestic coal production in China and India helped drive a 10% increase in global investment in 2021, the International Energy Agency reported last month. The IEA projects another 10% increase this year as China and India try to stave off shortages…..

….Coal use fell in many major Western countries over the past decade, displaced by cleaner forms of energy that became more cost-competitive. Natural gas became more plentiful thanks to the American fracking boom and Russian exports to Europe. Renewable energy sources such as wind and solar power also gained market share, buoyed by falling prices and government subsidies and mandates.

Still, global coal demand held strong, fueled by fast-growing energy needs in much of the rest of the world—and is on track to hit record highs this year, according to forecasts by the IEA…..

…Still, efforts to wean Western nations off Russian energy figure to strain global supplies for the foreseeable future. In April, the European Union agreed to ban imports of Russian coal. Before the war, Russia was Europe’s largest supplier of the thermal coal used in power generation, and the ban affected around 70% of the supply that European power stations require, according to Rystad Energy.

In addition to Germany, Italy, France, the U.K., the Netherlands and Austria have now said they are preparing to restart coal-fired power plants, boost their production or keep them running longer than planned. Many countries say they are trying to build up stockpiles of natural gas ahead of winter, when it is in high demand as a heating fuel.….

….China, the world’s largest greenhouse-gas emitter, already comprises around half of the world’s coal-power capacity, with plants accounting for nearly a third of global coal consumption, according to energy data trackers.

The country is still building new coal plants at a rapid clip, at risk of oversupply, “because it can’t afford a power shortage,” says Ryna Cui, co-director of the China program at the University of Maryland’s Center for Global Sustainability….

https://www.wsj.com/articles/coal-makes ... 1656936180

The US is the Saudi Arabia of coal. We should be taking full advantage of this. Mine baby mine.

houndawg wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:00 pm

SDHornet wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:53 pm

Oh so the argument of the US not having a "coalition" going in not matter?

Who's "going in"?

We're just supplying Ukraine with equipment so they can kill Russians - the enemy of my enemy is my friend. "Payback time" in the common speech.

SDHornet wrote: ↑Tue Jul 05, 2022 5:49 pm

houndawg wrote: ↑Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:00 pm

Who's "going in"?

We're just supplying Ukraine with equipment so they can kill Russians - the enemy of my enemy is my friend. "Payback time" in the common speech.

Don't think I ever had an issue selling arms to the Ukrainians...but of course the irony with that support is that now NATO stockpiles are starting to run low and the Russians keep gobbling up more territory. Go figure.

houndawg wrote: ↑Wed Jul 06, 2022 6:51 am

SDHornet wrote: ↑Tue Jul 05, 2022 5:49 pm

Don't think I ever had an issue selling arms to the Ukrainians...but of course the irony with that support is that now NATO stockpiles are starting to run low and the Russians keep gobbling up more territory. Go figure.

gobbling it up and holding it are two different things.

We can outspend them. Again.

GannonFan wrote:

houndawg wrote: ↑Wed Jul 06, 2022 6:51 am gobbling it up and holding it are two different things.

We can outspend them. Again.

Ukraine is never getting that land back. Crimea was something like 8 years ago, it's never going back to Ukrainian hands. I'm no fan of Russia, and they're gobbling up of territory from weaker neighbors just because they can (and despite SG's insistence, there is no justification whatsoever for what Russia is doing in the Ukraine right now) is immoral and should be condemned far and wide. But unless someone is willing to put troops on the ground to move them out, that land is never going back to Ukraine. Normally you could count on an insurgency or inhabitants rising up, but Russia empties these areas of the inhabitants and replaces them with Russian civilians. It's what they do.

UNI88 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 06, 2022 12:41 pm

GannonFan wrote:
Ukraine is never getting that land back. Crimea was something like 8 years ago, it's never going back to Ukrainian hands. I'm no fan of Russia, and they're gobbling up of territory from weaker neighbors just because they can (and despite SG's insistence, there is no justification whatsoever for what Russia is doing in the Ukraine right now) is immoral and should be condemned far and wide. But unless someone is willing to put troops on the ground to move them out, that land is never going back to Ukraine. Normally you could count on an insurgency or inhabitants rising up, but Russia empties these areas of the inhabitants and replaces them with Russian civilians. It's what they do.

Yep but trying to claim that the Russians taking over eastern territories is a win is spin.

They aimed for Kiev to take over almost all of Ukraine or install a Putin-approved puppet but they tripped on their dick. Any victories after that fiasco might save a little face but can't hide how inept their military has shown itself to be.

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Skjellyfetti wrote: ↑Sun Jul 10, 2022 6:43 pm

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Fri Jun 24, 2022 1:25 pm

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:27 am

Lithuania can do whatever the heck they want to do. Russia doesn't own the ground in Lithuania. They have no inherent right to have rail access through that country. If Russia wants to ship things that are on the sanctioned list (and there are plenty of things, including passengers, that aren't on the sanction list so there is plenty that can be shipped through Lithuania at this time) the Russia can put them on a boat and sail those things to Kaliningrad. No one's blockading anything, there's free access through the Baltic. But if you're going to be a belligerent nation who launches offensive wars of destruction on your neighbors in an attempt to take territory and build an empire, then you have to realize that not everyone is going to play nice with you.

The issue, as I'm understanding it, is that Russia and Lithuania have an agreement with wording that specifies how this agreement can be severed, and this isn't how it's done. In addition, the materials being transported were not listed as items the EU was sanctioning. So now we have the EU and Lithuania changing the rules.

It's a little extreme, but what happens when the mob determines what rules they want to make and keep?

The EU's executive body, the European Commission, announced that Lithuania must allow sanctioned Russian goods to transit between the Russian exclave of Kaliningrad and Russia proper. Sandwiched between Poland, Lithuania, and the Baltic Sea, Kaliningrad has suffered escalating economic and energy challenges over Lithuania's enforcement of the EU's sanctions that were introduced following Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Those sanctions prohibited the use of EU territory for the passage of restricted Russian goods. On Wednesday, however, the European Commission invented the notion that its sanctions did not apply to Russian rail transports between the Russian mainland and Kaliningrad.

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:28 pm

You guys tired of being gaslit yet.

GannonFan wrote: ↑Thu Jul 14, 2022 9:58 am

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 7:28 pm

You guys tired of being gaslit yet.

The irony of you thinking other people are gaslighting, and not recognizing your own, is incredibly rich.