How Long Will The Shutdown Last? (Dec 2018)

[JohnStOnge]

24 days ago may as well be 24 years ago to Trump. He's flip-flopped multiple times since then. Even refused to sign a Republican-approved bill to fund the government. That's about the only defense I can give McConnell for doing nothing since then. No negotiation, no leadership, and back home to Kentucky while 850,000 families go without pay. He's sick of Trump's bullshit too.

What good, honestly, would it have done for McConnell to stay in DC when 30 donks went to Puerto Rico?

Yes I've noted that conservative media have been trying to make a big deal out of the Hispanic Caucus participating in a conference they'd been planning for over a year. Would've been real nice of them to pull out and leave all the organizers high and dry when everybody knows that where they were for those few days made no difference whatsoever; especially when one reason they scheduled it as they did was to give Puerto Rico some business as it tries to recover. They spent all last week voting on bills to get the government going again. McConnell could have done some good by bringing them to the Senate floor for votes. There's a chance they would have passed. Trump would've vetoed but it still would've been progress by virtue of sending a message.

Actually if McConnell put the country first instead of his Party he already would've told the President that they're going to fund government and if Trump vetos they're going to over ride it. That's what's really needed here because if Congress doesn't stand up to that 10 year old things like this are going to continue to happen. The Republicans in Congress need to grow spines and put him in his place. The People don't want his stupid wall and the People overwhelmingly support the idea of opening the government THEN negotiating on the wall thing.

[BDKJMU]

Republican Congressman Bill Hurd represents this District:



He also voted with the Democrats this past Thursday to restore funding to agencies. He does not buy into the Trump wall idea:

phpBB [video]

He is a former CIA officer. He had tours of duty in Afghanistan, Pakistan, and India. He was undercover in Pakistan. That may be a factor in his belief that the money would be better spent on an "intelligence led" approach.

And if you're wondering based on his appearance: He is not Hispanic.

So I guess we need to ask ourselves if we think a former CIA officer who represents that District or a former con man involved in New York Real Estate with no involvement in border issues knows more about what is needed at the border.

I would think we need to ask ourselves if we think a former head of the Border Patrol knows more about what is needed at the border than a Congressman.
Jan 9:
Obama Border Patrol chief to Trump: ‘Stay the course’ on the border wall
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... 5d4c68ab23

[BDKJMU]

The silver lining?

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/01/ ... rs-1098380

Note this content near the end of the article:

Union officials representing Border Patrol and Immigration and Customs Enforcement employees last week spoke in support of the shutdown at an impromptu White House briefing,

I know the Border Patrol union endorsed Trump and the current President is a big supporter. But I also know that under previous leadership the border Patrol Union said the wall would be wasting taxpayer money.

I would love to see a confidential poll of rank and file Border Patrol Union members where they are asked if they'd rather keep working while missing paychecks for some indefinite period or keep the government funded while negotiations proceed. I'm sure a lot of them will be absolutely thrilled if things go as it looks like they will and they miss a second paycheck so that they've gone without pay for a month and have a bunch of bills due.

Couldn’t find any poll of agents since the partial shutdown started, but did find this from this past April:
“..The NBPC’s survey, of more than 600 agents in two of the Border Patrol’s busiest sectors, found just the opposite: A stunning 89 percent of line agents say a “wall system in strategic locations is necessary to securing the border.” Just 7 percent disagreed...”
https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018 ... vey-finds/

I’d put more stock in the opinions of the agents who are actually working the border than of polls of the general public or even those that live in border states.

Another thing with these public opinion polls you cite. I assume most of them use the word ‘wall’. Change ‘wall’ to ‘fence’ (after all aren’t see through steel slats 25-30 feet above ground as much if not more fence like than wall like?) and I bet you support rises..

[CID1990]

Note this content near the end of the article:



I know the Border Patrol union endorsed Trump and the current President is a big supporter. But I also know that under previous leadership the border Patrol Union said the wall would be wasting taxpayer money.

I would love to see a confidential poll of rank and file Border Patrol Union members where they are asked if they'd rather keep working while missing paychecks for some indefinite period or keep the government funded while negotiations proceed. I'm sure a lot of them will be absolutely thrilled if things go as it looks like they will and they miss a second paycheck so that they've gone without pay for a month and have a bunch of bills due.

Couldn’t find any poll of agents since the partial shutdown started, but did find this from this past April:
“..The NBPC’s survey, of more than 600 agents in two of the Border Patrol’s busiest sectors, found just the opposite: A stunning 89 percent of line agents say a “wall system in strategic locations is necessary to securing the border.” Just 7 percent disagreed...”
https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018 ... vey-finds/

I’d put more stock in the opinions of the agents who are actually working the border than of polls of the general public or even those that live in border states.

Another thing with these public opinion polls you cite. I assume most of them use the word ‘wall’. Change ‘wall’ to ‘fence’ (after all aren’t see through steel slats 25-30 feet above ground as much if not more fence like than wall like?) and I bet you support rises..

This is anecdotal, but law enforcement unions frequently differ with the rank and file on policy issues not affecting pay or benefits. Example: police unions and police chiefs' associations frequently support stricter gun control, while the rank and file are much more conservative.

LE unions walk a tightrope when it comes to political support because the Dems are friendlier to unions. This is primarily true in the Northeast but also true to a degree at the Federal level.

That poll of CBP agents rings true to me based on my experience.

[∞∞∞]

I’d put more stock in the opinions of the agents who are actually working the border than of polls of the general public or even those that live in border states.

I wish you did the same for scientists.

[93henfan]

What good, honestly, would it have done for McConnell to stay in DC when 30 donks went to Puerto Rico?

Yes I've noted that conservative media have been trying to make a big deal out of the Hispanic Caucus participating in a conference they'd been planning for over a year. Would've been real nice of them to pull out and leave all the organizers high and dry when everybody knows that where they were for those few days made no difference whatsoever; especially when one reason they scheduled it as they did was to give Puerto Rico some business as it tries to recover. They spent all last week voting on bills to get the government going again. McConnell could have done some good by bringing them to the Senate floor for votes. There's a chance they would have passed. Trump would've vetoed but it still would've been progress by virtue of sending a message.

Actually if McConnell put the country first instead of his Party he already would've told the President that they're going to fund government and if Trump vetos they're going to over ride it. That's what's really needed here because if Congress doesn't stand up to that 10 year old things like this are going to continue to happen. The Republicans in Congress need to grow spines and put him in his place. The People don't want his stupid wall and the People overwhelmingly support the idea of opening the government THEN negotiating on the wall thing.

Exactly.

Complete failure of leadership by Republicans on this. McConnell has no balls.

[Ivytalk]

Yes I've noted that conservative media have been trying to make a big deal out of the Hispanic Caucus participating in a conference they'd been planning for over a year. Would've been real nice of them to pull out and leave all the organizers high and dry when everybody knows that where they were for those few days made no difference whatsoever; especially when one reason they scheduled it as they did was to give Puerto Rico some business as it tries to recover. They spent all last week voting on bills to get the government going again. McConnell could have done some good by bringing them to the Senate floor for votes. There's a chance they would have passed. Trump would've vetoed but it still would've been progress by virtue of sending a message.

Actually if McConnell put the country first instead of his Party he already would've told the President that they're going to fund government and if Trump vetos they're going to over ride it. That's what's really needed here because if Congress doesn't stand up to that 10 year old things like this are going to continue to happen. The Republicans in Congress need to grow spines and put him in his place. The People don't want his stupid wall and the People overwhelmingly support the idea of opening the government THEN negotiating on the wall thing.

Exactly.

Complete failure of leadership by Republicans on this. McConnell has no balls.

He has no chin, either.

[Ibanez]

Republican Congressman Bill Hurd represents this District:



He also voted with the Democrats this past Thursday to restore funding to agencies. He does not buy into the Trump wall idea:

phpBB [video]

He is a former CIA officer. He had tours of duty in Afghanistan, Pakistan, and India. He was undercover in Pakistan. That may be a factor in his belief that the money would be better spent on an "intelligence led" approach.

And if you're wondering based on his appearance: He is not Hispanic.

So I guess we need to ask ourselves if we think a former CIA officer who represents that District or a former con man involved in New York Real Estate with no involvement in border issues knows more about what is needed at the border.

I would think we need to ask ourselves if we think a former head of the Border Patrol knows more about what is needed at the border than a Congressman.
Jan 9:
Obama Border Patrol chief to Trump: ‘Stay the course’ on the border wall
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... 5d4c68ab23

Whoa Nellie!!! Look who has returned. Where've you been?!

[Ibanez]

I’d put more stock in the opinions of the agents who are actually working the border than of polls of the general public or even those that live in border states.

I wish you did the same for scientists.

This is actually a very valid point.

[93henfan]

Exactly.

Complete failure of leadership by Republicans on this. McConnell has no balls.

He has no chin, either.

He talks without his jaw moving. He'd have been a better ventriloquist than senator.

[Chizzang]

I’d put more stock in the opinions of the agents who are actually working the border than of polls of the general public or even those that live in border states.

I wish you did the same for scientists.

This ...

[houndawg]

Note this content near the end of the article:



I know the Border Patrol union endorsed Trump and the current President is a big supporter. But I also know that under previous leadership the border Patrol Union said the wall would be wasting taxpayer money.

I would love to see a confidential poll of rank and file Border Patrol Union members where they are asked if they'd rather keep working while missing paychecks for some indefinite period or keep the government funded while negotiations proceed. I'm sure a lot of them will be absolutely thrilled if things go as it looks like they will and they miss a second paycheck so that they've gone without pay for a month and have a bunch of bills due.

Couldn’t find any poll of agents since the partial shutdown started, but did find this from this past April:
“..The NBPC’s survey, of more than 600 agents in two of the Border Patrol’s busiest sectors, found just the opposite: A stunning 89 percent of line agents say a “wall system in strategic locations is necessary to securing the border.” Just 7 percent disagreed...”
https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018 ... vey-finds/

I’d put more stock in the opinions of the agents who are actually working the border than of polls of the general public or even those that live in border states.

Another thing with these public opinion polls you cite. I assume most of them use the word ‘wall’. Change ‘wall’ to ‘fence’ (after all aren’t see through steel slats 25-30 feet above ground as much if not more fence like than wall like?) and I bet you support rises..

The goalposts have been moved.

[houndawg]

I wish you did the same for scientists.

This ...

..and Civil Engineers..

[houndawg]

Exactly.

Complete failure of leadership by Republicans on this. McConnell has no balls.

He has no chin, either.

Every time I see that mug I expect him to inflate his throat pouch and croak like a frog.

[houndawg]

Couldn’t find any poll of agents since the partial shutdown started, but did find this from this past April:
“..The NBPC’s survey, of more than 600 agents in two of the Border Patrol’s busiest sectors, found just the opposite: A stunning 89 percent of line agents say a “wall system in strategic locations is necessary to securing the border.” Just 7 percent disagreed...”
https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018 ... vey-finds/

I’d put more stock in the opinions of the agents who are actually working the border than of polls of the general public or even those that live in border states.

Another thing with these public opinion polls you cite. I assume most of them use the word ‘wall’. Change ‘wall’ to ‘fence’ (after all aren’t see through steel slats 25-30 feet above ground as much if not more fence like than wall like?) and I bet you support rises..

This is anecdotal, but law enforcement unions frequently differ with the rank and file on policy issues not affecting pay or benefits. Example: police unions and police chiefs' associations frequently support stricter gun control, while the rank and file are much more conservative.

LE unions walk a tightrope when it comes to political support because the Dems are friendlier to unions. This is primarily true in the Northeast but also true to a degree at the Federal level.

That poll of CBP agents rings true to me based on my experience.

Well, who doesn't want more money for their agency?

[Ivytalk]

Is Lindsay Graham now the biggest political whore in America?

[houndawg]

What good, honestly, would it have done for McConnell to stay in DC when 30 donks went to Puerto Rico?

Yes I've noted that conservative media have been trying to make a big deal out of the Hispanic Caucus participating in a conference they'd been planning for over a year. Would've been real nice of them to pull out and leave all the organizers high and dry when everybody knows that where they were for those few days made no difference whatsoever; especially when one reason they scheduled it as they did was to give Puerto Rico some business as it tries to recover. They spent all last week voting on bills to get the government going again. McConnell could have done some good by bringing them to the Senate floor for votes. There's a chance they would have passed. Trump would've vetoed but it still would've been progress by virtue of sending a message.

Actually if McConnell put the country first instead of his Party he already would've told the President that they're going to fund government and if Trump vetos they're going to over ride it. That's what's really needed here because if Congress doesn't stand up to that 10 year old things like this are going to continue to happen. The Republicans in Congress need to grow spines and put him in his place. The People don't want his stupid wall and the People overwhelmingly support the idea of opening the government THEN negotiating on the wall thing.

JSO just laying the wood to the conk chorus of whimpering snowflakes...

[Ibanez]

Is Lindsay Graham now the biggest political whore in America?

Yes. Next question.

[houndawg]

Man, the longer this goes on, the worse the Don's chances for reelection get. Maybe he knows that, and is just looking for a way out that doesn't technically involve quitting.

I don't think that much planning is involved - the hounds are running him down and he needs a diversion now. Have to let tomorrow take care of itself.....



...cold grinding grizzly bear jaws hot on your heels.... Jim Morrison - The Soft Parade

[Ivytalk]

So Ann Coulter is the only woman in America that Trump listens to, and this is the result.

[houndawg]

So Ann Coulter is the only woman in America that Trump listens to, and this is the result.

I bet she slaps him around and calls him Mushroomdick when they're alone.

[dbackjon]

[93henfan]

This must be really fun to watch when you're still getting paid.

Meanwhile, the Delaware Unemployment Office just called me to tell me that my claim for last week was denied. Because I work in DC, I have to file a claim with the DC Unemployment Office.

Yeah, I bet they're not busy right now.

FML.

Also, fuck Trump and the Republican Party.

[dbackjon]

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/425 ... Py9vqoGvhQ

McConnell blocks House bill to reopen government for second time

Senate Republicans blocked a House-passed package to reopen the federal government for a second time in as many weeks on Tuesday.

Democratic Sens. Chris Van Hollen (Md.) and Ben Cardin (Md.) asked for consent take up a package of bills that would reopen the federal government.

One bill would fund the Department of Homeland Security through Feb. 8, while the other would fund the rest of the impacted departments and agencies through Sept. 30, the end of the fiscal year.

[kalm]

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/425 ... Py9vqoGvhQ

McConnell blocks House bill to reopen government for second time

Senate Republicans blocked a House-passed package to reopen the federal government for a second time in as many weeks on Tuesday.

Democratic Sens. Chris Van Hollen (Md.) and Ben Cardin (Md.) asked for consent take up a package of bills that would reopen the federal government.

One bill would fund the Department of Homeland Security through Feb. 8, while the other would fund the rest of the impacted departments and agencies through Sept. 30, the end of the fiscal year.

Is it me or is McConnell not taking enough flack for this?