The Official "Making America Great Again" Thread

[BDKJMU]

Like I said on the MOAB thread, when it turns out Trump didn't have anything to do with the decision to drop it, good, let the generals general. Well, Trump, unlike W or Obomba, is doing just that.

"Compared to George W. Bush And Obama, Trump Doesn't Micromanage

WASHINGTON -- President George W. Bush spoke with his military commander in Iraq nearly every week.

President Barack Obama was so deeply involved in military operations that his first three Defense secretaries all complained, sometimes bitterly, about what they considered White House micromanagement.

In nearly five months in office, President Donald Trump has yet to meet or speak with either his Iraq or Afghanistan commander, even as his administration weighs deeper and longer-term involvement in both conflicts and asks Congress for a vast increase in defense spending.

Trump's hands-off approach to America's longest wars demonstrates how much control his administration has entrusted to Defense Secretary James N. Mattis, a retired four-star Marine general, and commanders on the ground.

Senior Pentagon officials and military officers who often chafed under Obama's centralized decision-making have welcomed the shift, saying it has freed them to carry out operations based on military, and not political, considerations........"

[Aho Old Guy]

Like I said on the MOAB thread, when it turns out Trump didn't have anything to do with the decision to drop it, good, let the generals general. Well, Trump, unlike W or Obomba, is doing just that.

"Compared to George W. Bush And Obama, Trump Doesn't Micromanage

WASHINGTON -- President George W. Bush spoke with his military commander in Iraq nearly every week.

President Barack Obama was so deeply involved in military operations that his first three Defense secretaries all complained, sometimes bitterly, about what they considered White House micromanagement.

In nearly five months in office, President Donald Trump has yet to meet or speak with either his Iraq or Afghanistan commander, even as his administration weighs deeper and longer-term involvement in both conflicts and asks Congress for a vast increase in defense spending.

Trump's hands-off approach to America's longest wars demonstrates how much control his administration has entrusted to Defense Secretary James N. Mattis, a retired four-star Marine general, and commanders on the ground.

Senior Pentagon officials and military officers who often chafed under Obama's centralized decision-making have welcomed the shift, saying it has freed them to carry out operations based on military, and not political, considerations........"

You swung.
You missed.
Are you considered redeemable?

First Ridiculous Idea: That Dubs and Obummer were micro-managers.
--- ► President's Cheney's Rube was a big proponent of 'one-minute manager,' or "the executive equivalent of paper-training your dog."

and, EL-OH-EL at the Dee-OH!-Dee. Whining about President Obama. Dang that civilian control of the military!


Second Ridiculous Idea: That "Senior Pentagon officials and military officers" know their arse from a hole in the ground. How's that 25+ years in Iraq working out for you? Are we "WINNING!!!" hearts and minds in Afghanistan, yet?

Republican America: "We can spend $7 billion/month in 'Overseas Contingency Operations' but 'To Hell!' with $7 billion/year in ObamaCare subsidies for the purchase of private hospitalization insurance for 10 million citizens.

Third Ridiculous Idea: President Twit -- Our Fearless 'Detached' Leader
--- ► Perhaps you mean, "More Dumb Than Dubs" ??

[CID1990]

Like I said on the MOAB thread, when it turns out Trump didn't have anything to do with the decision to drop it, good, let the generals general. Well, Trump, unlike W or Obomba, is doing just that.

"Compared to George W. Bush And Obama, Trump Doesn't Micromanage

WASHINGTON -- President George W. Bush spoke with his military commander in Iraq nearly every week.

President Barack Obama was so deeply involved in military operations that his first three Defense secretaries all complained, sometimes bitterly, about what they considered White House micromanagement.

In nearly five months in office, President Donald Trump has yet to meet or speak with either his Iraq or Afghanistan commander, even as his administration weighs deeper and longer-term involvement in both conflicts and asks Congress for a vast increase in defense spending.

Trump's hands-off approach to America's longest wars demonstrates how much control his administration has entrusted to Defense Secretary James N. Mattis, a retired four-star Marine general, and commanders on the ground.

Senior Pentagon officials and military officers who often chafed under Obama's centralized decision-making have welcomed the shift, saying it has freed them to carry out operations based on military, and not political, considerations........"

You swung.
You missed.
Are you considered redeemable?

First Ridiculous Idea: That Dubs and Obummer were micro-managers.
--- ► President's Cheney's Rube was a big proponent of 'one-minute manager,' or "the executive equivalent of paper-training your dog."

and, EL-OH-EL at the Dee-OH!-Dee. Whining about President Obama. Dang that civilian control of the military!


Second Ridiculous Idea: That "Senior Pentagon officials and military officers" know their arse from a hole in the ground. How's that 25+ years in Iraq working out for you? Are we "WINNING!!!" hearts and minds in Afghanistan, yet?

Republican America: "We can spend $7 billion/month in 'Overseas Contingency Operations' but 'To Hell!' with $7 billion/year in ObamaCare subsidies for the purchase of private hospitalization insurance for 10 million citizens.

Third Ridiculous Idea: President Twit -- Our Fearless 'Detached' Leader
--- ► Perhaps you mean, "More Dumb Than Dubs" ??

Actually, if you ask career people at DoS and DoD, it is pretty spot on. I am currently in language training with a couple of senior political officers who have been with State for more than 20 years each, and they will tell you that both the Bush and Obama admins were extremely micromanaging, with an edge to the Obama admin.

State was blessed with more than 25 special envoys, and political appointees all the way down to the PDAS level. They exerted a large amount of control, and also served as a firewall between the Secretary's office and also the NSC.

State is largely liberal but the micromanaging aspect of the last two administrations has been one of the biggest complaints. Even the biggest Obama supporters here at DoS say this.

DoD isn't my bailiwick, but NSC was making a lot of tactical military decisions- Susan Rice was regularly in the inbox of commanders on the ground overseas. That's their prerogative- as was the ten layers of political insulation between FSOs and the Secretary - but you are inaccurate in calling it bunk.

[Skjellyfetti]

#MAGA

Gallup: Number of days to hit 60% disapproval

Obama: N/A
W Bush 1,758
Clinton N/A
HW Bush 1,290
Reagan N/A
Nixon 1,736
Trump... 143

[89Hen]

#MAGA

Gallup: Number of days to hit 60% disapproval

Obama: N/A
W Bush 1,758
Clinton N/A
HW Bush 1,290
Reagan N/A
Nixon 1,736
Trump... 143

Fairly clear the liberals of this nation are black and white in their views of politics.

[Skjellyfetti]

More data!

Carter: N/A
Ford: N/A
Johnson: N/A
Kennedy: N/A
Eisenhower: N/A
Truman: 2173 days
Roosevelt: N/A

[GannonFan]

#MAGA

Gallup: Number of days to hit 60% disapproval

Obama: N/A
W Bush 1,758
Clinton N/A
HW Bush 1,290
Reagan N/A
Nixon 1,736
Trump... 143

Fairly clear the liberals of this nation are black and white in their views of politics.

I kinda agree with this - the left has certainly become very intolerant of anything that isn't in agreement with their positions. And now, with Trump, it's taken to the hyperbolic extreme with the #Resistance. When you state that there is no room for any compromise whatsoever, that's pretty much as hardening of your position as you can get. Trump's not going to be President forever, he's obviously gone in either Jan 2021 or 2025, but this partisan fortification, especially on the left, is going to be with us for quite some time.

[Skjellyfetti]

Very impressive, guys!

I was expecting a "Fake Polls" spin job by BDK... but, instead it's a "damn liberals..." spin.







Trump's approval is 31% among independents.

[GannonFan]

Very impressive, guys!

I was expecting a "Fake Polls" spin job by BDK... but, instead it's a "damn liberals..." spin.







Trump's approval is 31% among independents.

What's his disapproval among independents? You posted disapprovals before, so just to compare apples to apples.

And really, is it that much of a shocker that liberals, especially now, are more agitated and more excited than non-liberals? You have been watching and reading the news, no?

[89Hen]

Very impressive, guys!

I was expecting a "Fake Polls" spin job by BDK... but, instead it's a "damn liberals..." spin.







Trump's approval is 31% among independents.

A majority of independents are liberals and you know it.

[Skjellyfetti]

What's his disapproval among independents? You posted disapprovals before, so just to compare apples to apples.

Gallup didn't provide it, unfortunately. Just noted approval of Independents. Their crosstabs are behind a paywall. I'd post disapproval if I had it.

Among independents, his approval is 31%, five points lower than his average among that group.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/212120/trump ... aign=tiles

And really, is it that much of a shocker that liberals, especially now, are more agitated and more excited than non-liberals? You have been watching and reading the news, no?

We're polarized as hell. But, saying either side is more polarized than the other is bullshit.

And, posting the historic numbers wasn't so much to compare R to D presidents - but, more to document Trump's historic tanking in the polls. Unprecedented.

[Grizalltheway]

Very impressive, guys!

I was expecting a "Fake Polls" spin job by BDK... but, instead it's a "damn liberals..." spin.







Trump's approval is 31% among independents.

A majority of independents are liberals and you know it.

Does he? Do you have anything other than your own perception and bias to back that up?

[GannonFan]

What's his disapproval among independents? You posted disapprovals before, so just to compare apples to apples.

Gallup didn't provide it, unfortunately. Just noted approval of Independents. Their crosstabs are behind a paywall. I'd post disapproval if I had it.

Among independents, his approval is 31%, five points lower than his average among that group.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/212120/trump ... aign=tiles

And really, is it that much of a shocker that liberals, especially now, are more agitated and more excited than non-liberals? You have been watching and reading the news, no?

We're polarized as hell. But, saying either side is more polarized than the other is bullshit.

And, posting the historic numbers wasn't so much to compare R to D presidents - but, more to document Trump's historic tanking in the polls. Unprecedented.

Not bullshit because that's not what I said - I didn't say anything about either side being more polarized than the other side, those are your words. I just noted the excitement level, which I don't think is all that controversial. We just had an election where it was noted that the left was not as motivated as it had been when electing Obama, and as a result Trump won the election. And almost immediately after, you saw things like #Resistance and large marches in opposition to him recognizing that if they had been more active prior to the election it's possible that Trump would not have won. Again, not controversial to point those out.

[Skjellyfetti]

Fairly clear the liberals of this nation are black and white in their views of politics.

A majority of independents are liberals and you know it.

I have no idea if independents are more liberal or more conservative.

I'd imagine there would have been an uptick in conservative independents since Trump became the Republican nominee, but... I don't know that for sure either.

[89Hen]

And, posting the historic numbers wasn't so much to compare R to D presidents - but, more to document Trump's historic tanking in the polls. Unprecedented.

But you unwittingly did expose it.

[Ibanez]

Fairly clear the liberals of this nation are black and white in their views of politics.

I kinda agree with this - the left has certainly become very intolerant of anything that isn't in agreement with their positions. And now, with Trump, it's taken to the hyperbolic extreme with the #Resistance. When you state that there is no room for any compromise whatsoever, that's pretty much as hardening of your position as you can get. Trump's not going to be President forever, he's obviously gone in either Jan 2021 or 2025, but this partisan fortification, especially on the left, is going to be with us for quite some time.

Democrats don't have a monopoly on the "no room for compromise". The Republicans are just as bad.

[CID1990]

What's his disapproval among independents? You posted disapprovals before, so just to compare apples to apples.

Gallup didn't provide it, unfortunately. Just noted approval of Independents. Their crosstabs are behind a paywall. I'd post disapproval if I had it.

Among independents, his approval is 31%, five points lower than his average among that group.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/212120/trump ... aign=tiles

And really, is it that much of a shocker that liberals, especially now, are more agitated and more excited than non-liberals? You have been watching and reading the news, no?

We're polarized as hell. But, saying either side is more polarized than the other is bullshit.

And, posting the historic numbers wasn't so much to compare R to D presidents - but, more to document Trump's historic tanking in the polls. Unprecedented.

Well then it will be important to drag out the Russia probe as long as possible.... until at least Nov 2018

[89Hen]

I kinda agree with this - the left has certainly become very intolerant of anything that isn't in agreement with their positions. And now, with Trump, it's taken to the hyperbolic extreme with the #Resistance. When you state that there is no room for any compromise whatsoever, that's pretty much as hardening of your position as you can get. Trump's not going to be President forever, he's obviously gone in either Jan 2021 or 2025, but this partisan fortification, especially on the left, is going to be with us for quite some time.

Democrats don't have a monopoly on the "no room for compromise". The Republicans are just as bad.

That is true, but I don't think it's in the same numbers, not even close. Do you remember large scale protests and riots on college campuses over Obama? Do you recall people taking off work to watch congressional hearings? Do you recall theatrical productions depicting the killing of the current POTUS before?

[Skjellyfetti]

Do you recall theatrical productions depicting the killing of the current POTUS before?

http://www.startribune.com/trump-themed ... 427990033/

No hubub was made about it then, though.

[Ivytalk]

Do you recall theatrical productions depicting the killing of the current POTUS before?

http://www.startribune.com/trump-themed ... 427990033/

No hubub was made about it then, though.

Because there's no comparison, Mr. Moral Equivalence. The Guthrie version didn't have "Donald J. Caesar" with a tangerine wig and a NY accent. Or "Barack Hussein Caesar," for that matter.

[BDKJMU]

Very impressive, guys!

I was expecting a "Fake Polls" spin job by BDK... but, instead it's a "damn liberals..." spin.







Trump's approval is 31% among independents.

Well Rasmussen has the approval/disapproval at 43/57..

[Ibanez]

Very impressive, guys!

I was expecting a "Fake Polls" spin job by BDK... but, instead it's a "damn liberals..." spin.







Trump's approval is 31% among independents.

Well Rasmussen has the approval/disapproval at 43/57..

Is that overall? Republicants? Indys?

[JohnStOnge]

Well Rasmussen has the approval/disapproval at 43/57..

Is that overall? Republicants? Indys?

The Rasmussen poll is a "Likely Voters" poll. That makes no sense right now.

[Skjellyfetti]

And, it doesn't give an option of "no opinion / undecided"... which also makes no sense.

[89Hen]

Democrats don't have a monopoly on the "no room for compromise". The Republicans are just as bad.

That is true, but I don't think it's in the same numbers, not even close. Do you remember large scale protests and riots on college campuses over Obama? Do you recall people taking off work to watch congressional hearings? Do you recall theatrical productions depicting the killing of the current POTUS before?

Who cued the shooter in Alexandria today? Right on time.