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House Approves Puerto Rico Vote Legislation
Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:32 pm
by FargoBison
Could we be headed toward adding another state?
The House of Representatives voted Thursday to allow Puerto Ricans to decide their own political future and relationship with the United States.
The vote was 223 to 169. Rep. Louise Slaughter, D-N.Y., voted present.
The bill introduced a two-step ballot measure for Puerto Rico to decide if its residents want to change their current relationship with the United States. If they vote to change their status, they can then choose to become a state, pursue independence, or seek some other "political association between sovereign nations."
Proponents say the measure gives citizens of the island the right to self-determination. Critics say the measure is a device to impose statehood on a population that doesn't want it. Thursday's action was nonbinding, and if Puerto Ricans eventually select statehood, Congress would still have to vote to admit the island to the union as the 51st state.
The issue divided Democrats and Republicans alike as liberal Democrats with ties to Puerto Rico teamed with conservative Republicans to oppose the measure.
Re: House Approves Puerto Rico Vote Legislation
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 6:24 am
by OL FU
Everytime PR votes on statehood they vote no. And everytime they vote on independence they vote no.
I have to admit this is one where I don't understand all the arguments, but it seems to me that they either want to be a state or we simply give them independence (whether they want it or not)
What am I missing?
Re: House Approves Puerto Rico Vote Legislation
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 6:30 am
by Col Hogan
OL FU wrote:Everytime PR votes on statehood they vote no. And everytime they vote on independence they vote no.
I have to admit this is one where I don't understand all the arguments, but it seems to me that they either want to be a state or we simply give them independence (whether they want it or not)
What am I missing?
They don't want to leave the public teet they currently enjoy...no federal income tax, but the get federal benefits...
If they become a state, they will lose many of the free benefits they get, and will have to pay federal income tax as everyone else does...if they become independent, they automatically become a third world nation...
Re: House Approves Puerto Rico Vote Legislation
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 6:42 am
by GannonFan
Isn't this like the 3rd or 4th time recently that we've brought up a vote for Puerto Rico? I thought the last time the option of "None of the Above" won in a landslide. I understand that Dems want statehood as PR is almost guaranteed to be 6 automatic Dem seats in the House, and I understand that the GOP is against it because it would be 6 Dem seats in the House (at the expense of somewhere else since we're locked into 435). But other than that is there some pressing reason why we need to keep checking to see what people in PR want when it's clear there is no groundswell of opinion there one way or another?
Re: House Approves Puerto Rico Vote Legislation
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 6:58 am
by OL FU
Col Hogan wrote:OL FU wrote:Everytime PR votes on statehood they vote no. And everytime they vote on independence they vote no.
I have to admit this is one where I don't understand all the arguments, but it seems to me that they either want to be a state or we simply give them independence (whether they want it or not)
What am I missing?
They don't want to leave the public teet they currently enjoy...no federal income tax, but the get federal benefits...
If they become a state, they will lose many of the free benefits they get, and will have to pay federal income tax as everyone else does...if they become independent, they automatically become a third world nation...
It has been awhile since I looked into but I thought PR paid a commonwealth tax that was basically equivalent to the federal income tax, just all the money stayed in PR. Of course that may be what you meant, that they pay zero to the feds while the feds to shuffle money down to PR.
I know in the Virgin Islands, the feds do collect the tax and then turn around and sent it back to the USVI.
Once again though, is there a good reason for our option not to be simply to cut PR lose. We can sign an agreement to provide defense but other than that why not simply let them be stand on their own.
Re: House Approves Puerto Rico Vote Legislation
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 7:07 am
by dbackjon
GannonFan wrote:Isn't this like the 3rd or 4th time recently that we've brought up a vote for Puerto Rico? I thought the last time the option of "None of the Above" won in a landslide. I understand that Dems want statehood as PR is almost guaranteed to be 6 automatic Dem seats in the House, and I understand that the GOP is against it because it would be 6 Dem seats in the House (at the expense of somewhere else since we're locked into 435). But other than that is there some pressing reason why we need to keep checking to see what people in PR want when it's clear there is no groundswell of opinion there one way or another?
The House is not technically locked into 435 - there was a move to get Utah and DC a seat recently - it would add to the 435. The House expanded as states were added - but has been static for a century or so. The House could vote to simply add 6 seats.
Re: House Approves Puerto Rico Vote Legislation
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 7:24 am
by GannonFan
dbackjon wrote:GannonFan wrote:Isn't this like the 3rd or 4th time recently that we've brought up a vote for Puerto Rico? I thought the last time the option of "None of the Above" won in a landslide. I understand that Dems want statehood as PR is almost guaranteed to be 6 automatic Dem seats in the House, and I understand that the GOP is against it because it would be 6 Dem seats in the House (at the expense of somewhere else since we're locked into 435). But other than that is there some pressing reason why we need to keep checking to see what people in PR want when it's clear there is no groundswell of opinion there one way or another?
The House is not technically locked into 435 - there was a move to get Utah and DC a seat recently - it would add to the 435. The House expanded as states were added - but has been static for a century or so. The House could vote to simply add 6 seats.
The House can vote to increase, but as it is a law which established the 435 it would take another law to change that number, and that means the Senate needs to approve it (as well as the President, obviously). The Senate blocked the last change and I don't see any way they wouldn't block it again. You'd need a supermajority to do that and the Dems didn't ram it through last year when they had the chance (although ramming it through would bring it's own consequences, obviously).
Re: House Approves Puerto Rico Vote Legislation
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 8:11 am
by mainejeff
Col Hogan wrote:OL FU wrote:Everytime PR votes on statehood they vote no. And everytime they vote on independence they vote no.
I have to admit this is one where I don't understand all the arguments, but it seems to me that they either want to be a state or we simply give them independence (whether they want it or not)
What am I missing?
They don't want to leave the public teet they currently enjoy...no federal income tax, but the get federal benefits...
If they become a state, they will lose many of the free benefits they get, and will have to pay federal income tax as everyone else does...if they become independent, they automatically become a third world nation...
