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From Real Clear Politics:

"'The term Muslim Brotherhood is an umbrella term for a variety of movements. In the case of Egypt, a very heterogeneous group, largely secular, which has eschewed violence and has decried al-Qaeda as a perversion of Islam,' Director of National Intelligence James Clapper told a congressional hearing today." ...

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/ ... group.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Do you agree with Obama's Director of National Intelligence, that the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood is secular?

"Allah is our objective. The Prophet is our leader. The Qur'an is our law. Jihad is our way. Dying in the way of Allah is our highest hope." -The Muslim Brotherhood

http://www.meforum.org/687/the-muslim-b ... -of-europe" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

native wrote:From Real Clear Politics:

"'The term Muslim Brotherhood is an umbrella term for a variety of movements. In the case of Egypt, a very heterogeneous group, largely secular, which has eschewed violence and has decried al-Qaeda as a perversion of Islam,' Director of National Intelligence James Clapper told a congressional hearing today." ...

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/ ... group.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Do you agree with Obama's Director of National Intelligence, that the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood is secular?

everything he said was completely accurate

they've been denounced by Al Qaeda, they just this week told Ahmedinejad to stfu they wanted nothing to do with them...

they have their roots in an Islmaist movement but they've largely moved away from it - they aren't by any stretch what we'd like to see take over... but they shouldn't be lumped in with Al Qaeda or Hezbollah or the Ayatollah's in Iran...

I guess I'm not sure why it matters. They may not be secular but if this is in relation to what is happening in Egypt that is very secular and the Muslim Brotherhood is a very small part of that overall effort.

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:I guess I'm not sure why it matters. They may not be secular but if this is in relation to what is happening in Egypt that is very secular and the Muslim Brotherhood is a very small part of that overall effort.

a much more important point.

Obama has shown that he not only doesn't have a clue with domestic policy but now demonstrates that he's clueless in foreign affairs...or maybe he does have a plan.

==

Obama Administration Lifts US Ban on Muslim Brotherhood Leader
IsraelNationalNews ^ | January 28 2011 | Avi Yellin

The Barack Obama administration has decided to lift a ban preventing Muslim Scholar Professor Tariq Ramadan from entering the United States. Ramadan, an Egyptian currently living in Switzerland, is a leading member of Europe’s Muslim Brotherhood branch and the grandson of the movement’s founder Hassan al-Banna.

The Muslim Brotherhood is the parent organization for Hamas and some of the groups that recently merged into al-Qaeda, including Ayman al Zawahiri’s Egyptian Islamic Jihad.

Ramadan was invited to teach at the University of Notre Dame in 2004 but the George W. Bush administration revoked his visa, citing a statute that applies to those who have “endorsed or espoused” terrorism.

State Department spokesman Philip Crowley told reporters that the government no longer views Ramadan or Habib as representing threats to the United States. “The next time Professor Ramadan or Professor Habib apply for a visa, they will not be found inadmissible on the basis of the facts that led to denial when they last applied.”

(Excerpt) Read more at israelnationalnews.com ...



U.S. 'Held Secret Meeting with Muslim Brotherhood'
Fox News ^ | 2/1/2011 | By Aaron Klein


The Egyptian government has information a diplomat at the U.S. embassy in Cairo secretly met yesterday with a senior leader of the Muslim Brotherhood, the nation's major Islamist opposition group, WND has learned.

The topic of the meeting was the future of Egypt following the "fall" of President Hosni Mubarak, an Egyptian intelligence official told WND.

(Excerpt) Read more at nation.foxnews.com ...

Not trying to make excuses here but doesn’t Obama rely on our intelligence folks who are there and are suppose to inform him/gov leaders what is going on?

The Muslim Brotherhood is not a secular organization. They are not even "mostly" secular. They have secular fringe elements that have latched on to them because of Mubarak, Israel and other motivations, but make no mistakes... they will rule by Sharia law if they come to power. Egypt won't be Afghanistan, but it won't be Egypt, either.

CID1990 wrote:The Muslim Brotherhood is not a secular organization. They are not even "mostly" secular. They have secular fringe elements that have latched on to them because of Mubarak, Israel and other motivations, but make no mistakes... they will rule by Sharia law if they come to power. Egypt won't be Afghanistan, but it won't be Egypt, either.

You think the Egyptian military will sit still for that?

Bronco wrote:Obama has shown that he not only doesn't have a clue with domestic policy but now demonstrates that he's clueless in foreign affairs...or maybe he does have a plan.

==

Obama Administration Lifts US Ban on Muslim Brotherhood Leader
IsraelNationalNews ^ | January 28 2011 | Avi Yellin

The Barack Obama administration has decided to lift a ban preventing Muslim Scholar Professor Tariq Ramadan from entering the United States. Ramadan, an Egyptian currently living in Switzerland, is a leading member of Europe’s Muslim Brotherhood branch and the grandson of the movement’s founder Hassan al-Banna.

The Muslim Brotherhood is the parent organization for Hamas and some of the groups that recently merged into al-Qaeda, including Ayman al Zawahiri’s Egyptian Islamic Jihad.

Ramadan was invited to teach at the University of Notre Dame in 2004 but the George W. Bush administration revoked his visa, citing a statute that applies to those who have “endorsed or espoused” terrorism.

State Department spokesman Philip Crowley told reporters that the government no longer views Ramadan or Habib as representing threats to the United States. “The next time Professor Ramadan or Professor Habib apply for a visa, they will not be found inadmissible on the basis of the facts that led to denial when they last applied.”

(Excerpt) Read more at israelnationalnews.com ...



U.S. 'Held Secret Meeting with Muslim Brotherhood'
Fox News ^ | 2/1/2011 | By Aaron Klein


The Egyptian government has information a diplomat at the U.S. embassy in Cairo secretly met yesterday with a senior leader of the Muslim Brotherhood, the nation's major Islamist opposition group, WND has learned.

The topic of the meeting was the future of Egypt following the "fall" of President Hosni Mubarak, an Egyptian intelligence official told WND.

(Excerpt) Read more at nation.foxnews.com ...

You haven't even scratched the surface, honco. There is already a plan in place to double welfare payments to black folk and give each of them a Cadillac with spinners. Not only that there are persistent rumors of a golf tax.

TwinTownBisonFan wrote:

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:I guess I'm not sure why it matters. They may not be secular but if this is in relation to what is happening in Egypt that is very secular and the Muslim Brotherhood is a very small part of that overall effort.

a much more important point.

I share the hope with you and ursus that this is true, ttbf, that the mb is a small part of the protest, but we do not know for a fact that it is so.

houndawg wrote:

CID1990 wrote:The Muslim Brotherhood is not a secular organization. They are not even "mostly" secular. They have secular fringe elements that have latched on to them because of Mubarak, Israel and other motivations, but make no mistakes... they will rule by Sharia law if they come to power. Egypt won't be Afghanistan, but it won't be Egypt, either.

You think the Egyptian military will sit still for that?

We do not know the extent of the Muslim Brotherhood's penetration of the Egyptian military.

native wrote:

houndawg wrote:
You think the Egyptian military will sit still for that?

We do not know the extent of the Muslim Brotherhood's penetration of the Egyptian military.

We don't?

houndawg wrote:

native wrote:
We do not know the extent of the Muslim Brotherhood's penetration of the Egyptian military.

We don't?

We know with a high percentage that it is not a MB driven thing but is possible although unlikely that they could fill some of the vacuum. If you believe that this is MB led then you are being taken for a fool by some news sources.

There is not as much drama or fear to be culled by not using this as a lightning rod so our entertainment shows avoid the reality that there are all facets of that culture, including Catholics that were rebelling.

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:

houndawg wrote:
We don't?

We know with a high percentage that it is not a MB driven thing but is possible although unlikely that they could fill some of the vacuum. If you believe that this is MB led then you are being taken for a fool by some news sources.

There is not as much drama or fear to be culled by not using this as a lightning rod so our entertainment shows avoid the reality that there are all facets of that culture, including Catholics that were rebelling.

THIS.

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:

houndawg wrote:
We don't?

We know with a high percentage that it is not a MB driven thing but is possible although unlikely that they could fill some of the vacuum. If you believe that this is MB led then you are being taken for a fool by some news sources.

There is not as much drama or fear to be culled by not using this as a lightning rod so our entertainment shows avoid the reality that there are all facets of that culture, including Catholics that were rebelling.

This meaning the military?

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:

houndawg wrote:
We don't?

We know with a high percentage that it is not a MB driven thing but is possible although unlikely that they could fill some of the vacuum. If you believe that this is MB led then you are being taken for a fool by some news sources.

There is not as much drama or fear to be culled by not using this as a lightning rod so our entertainment shows avoid the reality that there are all facets of that culture, including Catholics that were rebelling.

Let's be more precise: I did not make the claim that the anti-Mubarak protests are "MB driven," and I hold out hope that the Muslim Brotherhood will not come to dominate the political opposition in Egypt. We can also agree that the motivation for many of the protesters is not necessarily Islamic.

However, we also know with a high degree of certainty that the Muslim Brotherhood is the most well organized among opposition groups. And we know with absolute certainty that Muslim Brotherhood is a radical anti-western, anti-liberty, Islamist and jihadist group. I do not know the extent of penetration of the Egyptian military by the MB. Do you have a source, dawg?

Nor am I aware of any reliable handicap of whether the MB will or will not be able to control the opposition.

For the record, there are hardly any Catholics in Egypt, where more than 90% of the Christians are Coptic. Perhaps you meant Copts instead of Catholics. Christians represent a total of about 10-15% of the population. The Christians, however, have NOT been at the forefront of the protests, even though they have been the subject of thuggish brutality and discrimination under all regimes since the inception of Islam, but especially lately while the police are otherwise occupied during the protests.

TwinTownBisonFan wrote:

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote: We know with a high percentage that it is not a MB driven thing but is possible although unlikely that they could fill some of the vacuum. If you believe that this is MB led then you are being taken for a fool by some news sources.

There is not as much drama or fear to be culled by not using this as a lightning rod so our entertainment shows avoid the reality that there are all facets of that culture, including Catholics that were rebelling.

THIS.

You boys need a reality check. Show us the sources. Obama's DNI making a fool of himself on national television - again - is not a very good reference.

native wrote:

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:
We know with a high percentage that it is not a MB driven thing but is possible although unlikely that they could fill some of the vacuum. If you believe that this is MB led then you are being taken for a fool by some news sources.

There is not as much drama or fear to be culled by not using this as a lightning rod so our entertainment shows avoid the reality that there are all facets of that culture, including Catholics that were rebelling.

Let's be more precise: I did not make the claim that the anti-Mubarak protests are "MB driven," and I hold out hope that the Muslim Brotherhood will not come to dominate the political opposition in Egypt. We can also agree that the motivation for many of the protesters is not necessarily Islamic.

However, we also know with a high degree of certainty that the Muslim Brotherhood is the most well organized among opposition groups. And we know with absolute certainty that Muslim Brotherhood is a radical anti-western, anti-liberty, Islamist and jihadist group. I do not know the extent of penetration of the Egyptian military by the MB. Do you have a source, dawg?

Nor am I aware of any reliable handicap of whether the MB will or will not be able to control the opposition.

For the record, there are hardly any Catholics in Egypt, where more than 90% of the Christians are Coptic. Perhaps you meant Copts instead of Catholics. Christians represent a total of about 10-15% of the population. The Christians, however, have NOT been at the forefront of the protests, even though they have been the subject of thuggish brutality and discrimination under all regimes since the inception of Islam, but especially lately while the police are otherwise occupied during the protests.

No, I don't, hence the question.

Another thing that we know with a high degree of certainty is that Egypt is under martial law now and will probably stay that way for a while. I don't see the MB making any moves under that scenario.

houndawg wrote:

native wrote:
Let's be more precise: I did not make the claim that the anti-Mubarak protests are "MB driven," and I hold out hope that the Muslim Brotherhood will not come to dominate the political opposition in Egypt. We can also agree that the motivation for many of the protesters is not necessarily Islamic.

However, we also know with a high degree of certainty that the Muslim Brotherhood is the most well organized among opposition groups. And we know with absolute certainty that Muslim Brotherhood is a radical anti-western, anti-liberty, Islamist and jihadist group. I do not know the extent of penetration of the Egyptian military by the MB. Do you have a source, dawg?

Nor am I aware of any reliable handicap of whether the MB will or will not be able to control the opposition.

For the record, there are hardly any Catholics in Egypt, where more than 90% of the Christians are Coptic. Perhaps you meant Copts instead of Catholics. Christians represent a total of about 10-15% of the population. The Christians, however, have NOT been at the forefront of the protests, even though they have been the subject of thuggish brutality and discrimination under all regimes since the inception of Islam, but especially lately while the police are otherwise occupied during the protests.

No, I don't, hence the question.

Another thing that we know with a high degree of certainty is that Egypt is under martial law now and will probably stay that way for a while. I don't see the MB making any moves under that scenario.

One good thing about our modern military is the number of experienced civil affairs specialists who know their stuff. Hopefully the Egyptians will be able to take advantage of their contacts in the U.S. to get a little behind the scenes assistance.

native wrote:

houndawg wrote:
No, I don't, hence the question.

Another thing that we know with a high degree of certainty is that Egypt is under martial law now and will probably stay that way for a while. I don't see the MB making any moves under that scenario.

One good thing about our modern military is the number of experienced civil affairs specialists who know their stuff. Hopefully the Egyptians will be able to take advantage of their contacts in the U.S. to get a little behind the scenes assistance.

Hopefully we'll stay the fcvk away for a while until things cool down.

houndawg wrote:

native wrote:
One good thing about our modern military is the number of experienced civil affairs specialists who know their stuff. Hopefully the Egyptians will be able to take advantage of their contacts in the U.S. to get a little behind the scenes assistance.

Hopefully we'll stay the fcvk away for a while until things cool down.

Location: Egypt

Well, you'd better get the fuck out, first.

the Egyptian officer corps is almost entirely trained in or by the US...

however - keep this in mind. the MB was denounced by Al-Zwahiri and the Iranians over the last 15 years as they have moderated their message against violence and Jihad. A lot of the info being put out their by certain western news sources is very dated...

TwinTownBisonFan wrote:the Egyptian officer corps is almost entirely trained in or by the US...

however - keep this in mind. the MB was denounced by Al-Zwahiri and the Iranians over the last 15 years as they have moderated their message against violence and Jihad. A lot of the info being put out their by certain western news sources is very dated...

...which does not change the historical perspective of MB or jihad one whit. They say what they have to say to survive and prosper, until the day when they have enough power to bring the hammer of sharia down.

If they were going to be democrats and freedom lovers, then that is what they would be. They have chosen otherwise.

houndawg wrote:

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote: We know with a high percentage that it is not a MB driven thing but is possible although unlikely that they could fill some of the vacuum. If you believe that this is MB led then you are being taken for a fool by some news sources.

There is not as much drama or fear to be culled by not using this as a lightning rod so our entertainment shows avoid the reality that there are all facets of that culture, including Catholics that were rebelling.

This meaning the military?

Sorry hound, I was in concert with what you were saying and shouldn't have quoted that post.