Obama's ACORN: Crime Syndicate

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Obama's ACORN: Crime Syndicate

Post by travelinman67 »

Now that their election extortion task has been completed, what will ACORN do in between campaign cycles...

...utilize their national organization to break into foreclosed homes and "reappropriate" them to their former owners...

...unapologetic, and falsely labeling their actions as "civil disobedience".

[youtube][/youtube]

Breaking and entering, forcibly entering a building to unlawfully "take possession" of the property...

...is a crime, not civil disobedience. The fact that ACORN has apparently endorsed this behavior on a national level, should call into question their standing as a non-profit organization, and reclassify them as a crime syndicate, which is a more appropriate description of their activities.
Last edited by travelinman67 on Mon May 04, 2009 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by Appaholic »

travelinman67 wrote:Now that their election extortion task has been completed, what will ACORN do in between campaign cycles...

...utilize their national organization to break into foreclosed homes and "reappropriate" them to their former owners...

...unapologetic, and falsely labeling their actions as "civil disobedience".

[youtube][/youtube]

Breaking and entering, forcibly entering a building to unlawfully "take possession" of the property...

...is a crime, not civil disobedience. The fact that ACORN has apparently endorsed this behavior on a national level, should call into question their standing as a non-profit organization, and reclassify them as a crime syndicate, which is a more appropriate description of their activities.
Gotta agree.....if PETA had their tax-exempt status revoked for their "crimes", ACORN ought to be in prison for theirs....BTW, when do churches who hand out voter cards lose their tax-exempt status :roll:
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by travelinman67 »

Appaholic wrote:
travelinman67 wrote:Now that their election extortion task has been completed, what will ACORN do in between campaign cycles...

...utilize their national organization to break into foreclosed homes and "reappropriate" them to their former owners...

...unapologetic, and falsely labeling their actions as "civil disobedience".

[youtube][/youtube]

Breaking and entering, forcibly entering a building to unlawfully "take possession" of the property...

...is a crime, not civil disobedience. The fact that ACORN has apparently endorsed this behavior on a national level, should call into question their standing as a non-profit organization, and reclassify them as a crime syndicate, which is a more appropriate description of their activities.
Gotta agree.....if PETA had their tax-exempt status revoked for their "crimes", ACORN ought to be in prison for theirs....BTW, when do churches who hand out voter cards lose their tax-exempt status :roll:
...when the cards have been pre-filled out with "Republican" rather than "Democrat".
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by hank scorpio »

Part of the vast leftwing conspiracy? :roll:
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by Appaholic »

travelinman67 wrote:
Appaholic wrote:
Gotta agree.....if PETA had their tax-exempt status revoked for their "crimes", ACORN ought to be in prison for theirs....BTW, when do churches who hand out voter cards lose their tax-exempt status :roll:
...when the cards have been pre-filled out with "Republican" rather than "Democrat".
So the Religious Right hasn't made any inroads to the political process? Because they are democrats?
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by travelinman67 »

...and the first arrests are made in this criminal endeavor...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,498669,00.html

Arrest Made in Home Foreclosure Civil Disobedience Program

Monday, February 23, 2009
Police in Baltimore today made what is believed to be the first arrest in a civil disobedience program aimed at supporting homeowners who refuse to vacate their foreclosed homes.

An activist with ACORN — the Association of Community Organization for Reform Now — faces criminal charges after breaking into a home in southeast Baltimore on Thursday to protest the foreclosure crisis sweeping the country.

"This is our house now," ACORN member Louis Beverly reportedly said after cutting a lock with bolt cutters at the home.

Beverly will be charged with fourth-degree burglary, according to Anthony Guglielmi, a spokesman for the Baltimore Police. Attempts to reach his attorney, Justin Brown, were not immediately successful.

Donna Hanks, who owned the home since 2001, lost it in September when she couldn't make her $1,995 mortgage payments. It was not immediately clear whether Hanks re-entered her home last week, but she was not expected to be arrested, Guglielmi said.
Tman tip to Baltimore Police: Donna Hanks entered the home. Please review the news report at 1:21 into the story. Ms. Hanks is standing inside her former home and made an admission implying she had inspected the insides of the house.
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by Appaholic »

travelinman67 wrote:...and the first arrests are made in this criminal endeavor...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,498669,00.html

Arrest Made in Home Foreclosure Civil Disobedience Program

Monday, February 23, 2009
Police in Baltimore today made what is believed to be the first arrest in a civil disobedience program aimed at supporting homeowners who refuse to vacate their foreclosed homes.

An activist with ACORN — the Association of Community Organization for Reform Now — faces criminal charges after breaking into a home in southeast Baltimore on Thursday to protest the foreclosure crisis sweeping the country.

"This is our house now," ACORN member Louis Beverly reportedly said after cutting a lock with bolt cutters at the home.

Beverly will be charged with fourth-degree burglary, according to Anthony Guglielmi, a spokesman for the Baltimore Police. Attempts to reach his attorney, Justin Brown, were not immediately successful.

Donna Hanks, who owned the home since 2001, lost it in September when she couldn't make her $1,995 mortgage payments. It was not immediately clear whether Hanks re-entered her home last week, but she was not expected to be arrested, Guglielmi said.
Tman tip to Baltimore Police: Donna Hanks entered the home. Please review the news report at 1:21 into the story. Ms. Hanks is standing inside her former home and made an admission implying she had inspected the insides of the house.
But TMan....these people were preyed upon by the evil lenders.....surely, you're not advocating arresting someone for refusing to leave THEIR HOME?!? :o (note to homebuyers - it's reallly NOT your home until you pay off the mortgage.....hence the reason you need to make mortgage payments)
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by travelinman67 »

Appaholic wrote:
travelinman67 wrote:...and the first arrests are made in this criminal endeavor...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,498669,00.html

Arrest Made in Home Foreclosure Civil Disobedience Program

Monday, February 23, 2009



Tman tip to Baltimore Police: Donna Hanks entered the home. Please review the news report at 1:21 into the story. Ms. Hanks is standing inside her former home and made an admission implying she had inspected the insides of the house.
But TMan....these people were preyed upon by the evil lenders.....surely, you're not advocating arresting someone for refusing to leave THEIR HOME?!? :o (note to homebuyers - it's reallly NOT your home until you pay off the mortgage.....hence the reason you need to make mortgage payments)
I'm not defending the lenders. What they did was a white collar crime. Herb & Marion Sandler, John Mack, Frank Raines, Angelo Mozilo, Richard Fuld, and yes George Soros (king of currency devaluation which initiated the price declines). There are a few hundred greed driven investment pigs who should be sitting in a cell for several decades along with other carreer criminals. What they did was take the CRA loophole initiated by Dodd and Frank, and spin it into a looting of the poor and lower middle class selling them "the dream" the full time KNOWING THAT THE MORTGAGES WERE GARBAGE.

But two wrongs don't make a right. This isn't the land of Hamurabi. We are a country of laws and procedure. If people don't agree, they can replace their elected officials, which in effect, they have. So if there are any beefs with the current laws and process, they need to get on the phone to Congress and the White House, not break the law.
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

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travelinman67 wrote:
Appaholic wrote:
But TMan....these people were preyed upon by the evil lenders.....surely, you're not advocating arresting someone for refusing to leave THEIR HOME?!? :o (note to homebuyers - it's reallly NOT your home until you pay off the mortgage.....hence the reason you need to make mortgage payments)
I'm not defending the lenders. What they did was a white collar crime. Herb & Marion Sandler, John Mack, Frank Raines, Angelo Mozilo, Richard Fuld, and yes George Soros (king of currency devaluation which initiated the price declines). There are a few hundred greed driven investment pigs who should be sitting in a cell for several decades along with other carreer criminals. What they did was take the CRA loophole initiated by Dodd and Frank, and spin it into a looting of the poor and lower middle class selling them "the dream" the full time KNOWING THAT THE MORTGAGES WERE GARBAGE.

But two wrongs don't make a right. This isn't the land of Hamurabi. We are a country of laws and procedure. If people don't agree, they can replace their elected officials, which in effect, they have. So if there are any beefs with the current laws and process, they need to get on the phone to Congress and the White House, not break the law.
Don't misintepret me....I blame the lenders, but I blame the borrowers more....buyer beware....those fokkers knew whether they could make payments or not....
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by BigApp »

Appaholic wrote:

But TMan....these people were preyed upon by the evil lenders.....surely, you're not advocating arresting someone for refusing to leave THEIR HOME?!? :o (note to homebuyers - it's reallly NOT your home until you pay off the mortgage.....hence the reason you need to make mortgage payments)
It's NEVER "your" home! Try not paying taxes on it, even after paying off the mortgage, and see who REALLY owns it!

Oh yeah, and ACORN gets to stimulate the economy with an extra $2 BILLION dollars...
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by dbackjon »

BigApp wrote:
Appaholic wrote:

But TMan....these people were preyed upon by the evil lenders.....surely, you're not advocating arresting someone for refusing to leave THEIR HOME?!? :o (note to homebuyers - it's reallly NOT your home until you pay off the mortgage.....hence the reason you need to make mortgage payments)


Oh yeah, and ACORN gets to stimulate the economy with an extra $2 BILLION dollars...
i see someone is believing the lies spewed by the right wing media.

Blatant lies get passed along as truth...

SMFH
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by BigApp »

dbackjon wrote:

i see someone is believing the lies spewed by the right wing media.

Blatant lies get passed along as truth...

SMFH
are you implying that ACORN is NOT getting $$ in the "Stimulus" package?
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by dbackjon »

BigApp wrote:
dbackjon wrote:

i see someone is believing the lies spewed by the right wing media.

Blatant lies get passed along as truth...

SMFH
are you implying that ACORN is NOT getting $$ in the "Stimulus" package?
Yes, that is what I am implying.

Prove that they are.
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by travelinman67 »

Appaholic wrote:
travelinman67 wrote:
I'm not defending the lenders. What they did was a white collar crime. Herb & Marion Sandler, John Mack, Frank Raines, Angelo Mozilo, Richard Fuld, and yes George Soros (king of currency devaluation which initiated the price declines). There are a few hundred greed driven investment pigs who should be sitting in a cell for several decades along with other carreer criminals. What they did was take the CRA loophole initiated by Dodd and Frank, and spin it into a looting of the poor and lower middle class selling them "the dream" the full time KNOWING THAT THE MORTGAGES WERE GARBAGE.

But two wrongs don't make a right. This isn't the land of Hamurabi. We are a country of laws and procedure. If people don't agree, they can replace their elected officials, which in effect, they have. So if there are any beefs with the current laws and process, they need to get on the phone to Congress and the White House, not break the law.
Don't misintepret me....I blame the lenders, but I blame the borrowers more....buyer beware....those fokkers knew whether they could make payments or not....
I disagree. A person looking to purchase a home needs to either work in the industry, study the laws and regulations for months, or hire a broker/attorney to review the contract in advance. I've bought plenty of properties in my life, and in the past 15 years, especially in CA, it's a caveat emptor market. There are so many loopholes and options, the "average" person (assuming HS education), could never figure out all the ins and outs without counseling or experience. The CRA was merely a license for all the predators to legally add a few more pages of boilerplate that the borrowers could not understand.
And it didn't used to be this way. I'm only speaking for CA, but 20-25 years ago, the residential real estate contracts were pretty simple and the lenders have fairly well defined terms depending on the loan originator. I realize we have some board members who work in the real estate and lending industry, but don't forget that some of the laws vary from state to state...and it's no surprise that ground zero for the foreclosure crisis happens to be in the CA central valley around Merced and it's surrounding communities...demographics are majority of Hispanic American/Mexican, often with poor language skills, no HS education, and no understanding of real estate or lending practices. Now you can try to "blame" the borrowers all you like, but having commissioned realtors and lenders whip out labyrinth contracts, specifically crafted to maximize the loan amount, with a minefield of back end adjusters, and pushing them in a market of undereducated, unrepresented poor and lower middle class Americans, is not just inexcusable, but fraudulent and willfully criminal. The lenders KNEW the dangers of these instruments, yet used them with the hopes that an inflationary economy would provide just enough stability to the housing prices so they could pull off the scam with minimal attention.



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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by Appaholic »

travelinman67 wrote:
Appaholic wrote:
Don't misintepret me....I blame the lenders, but I blame the borrowers more....buyer beware....those fokkers knew whether they could make payments or not....
I disagree. A person looking to purchase a home needs to either work in the industry, study the laws and regulations for months, or hire a broker/attorney to review the contract in advance. I've bought plenty of properties in my life, and in the past 15 years, especially in CA, it's a caveat emptor market. There are so many loopholes and options, the "average" person (assuming HS education), could never figure out all the ins and outs without counseling or experience. The CRA was merely a license for all the predators to legally add a few more pages of boilerplate that the borrowers could not understand.
And it didn't used to be this way. I'm only speaking for CA, but 20-25 years ago, the residential real estate contracts were pretty simple and the lenders have fairly well defined terms depending on the loan originator. I realize we have some board members who work in the real estate and lending industry, but don't forget that some of the laws vary from state to state...and it's no surprise that ground zero for the foreclosure crisis happens to be in the CA central valley around Merced and it's surrounding communities...demographics are majority of Hispanic American/Mexican, often with poor language skills, no HS education, and no understanding of real estate or lending practices. Now you can try to "blame" the borrowers all you like, but having commissioned realtors and lenders whip out labyrinth contracts, specifically crafted to maximize the loan amount, with a minefield of back end adjusters, and pushing them in a market of undereducated, unrepresented poor and lower middle class Americans, is not just inexcusable, but fraudulent and willfully criminal. The lenders KNEW the dangers of these instruments, yet used them with the hopes that an inflationary economy would provide just enough stability to the housing prices so they could pull off the scam with minimal attention.



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Don't disagree with what you are saying, but I would add that NO ONE held a gun to anyone's heads....sure, they should know what they are signing, and I realize this is overly simplistic, but if the people refuse to sign those crap contracts and demanded the mortgages you are talking about from the past, then the market will provide....you're right, thewith the lenders did know and tried to rely on the inflationary economy for stability, but the people accepting those loans were hoping on the same inflationary to justify their higher payments when the ARMS came due....
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by BigApp »

dbackjon wrote:
Yes, that is what I am implying.

Prove that they are.
Jon, really. Are you serious?

You're telling all of us right here and now that you don't believe ACORN will apply for and get a substantial amount of the $4.19 BILLION earmarked for "neighborhood stabilization activities"??
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by dbackjon »

BigApp wrote:
dbackjon wrote:
Yes, that is what I am implying.

Prove that they are.
Jon, really. Are you serious?

You're telling all of us right here and now that you don't believe ACORN will apply for and get a substantial amount of the $4.19 BILLION earmarked for "neighborhood stabilization activities"??
It is possible. They would be just as worthy as anyone else. But to say that they WILL GET at this point is unknown.
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ACORN's Crime Syndicate Investigated By Congress

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Hill panel testimony to accuse ACORN of mob tactics

S.A. Miller (Contact)
Thursday, March 19, 2009

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/200 ... ob-tactic/
A lawyer for a whistleblower on the activist group ACORN is prepared to tell a House panel Thursday that the group provided liberal causes with protest-for-hire services and coerced donations from the targets of demonstrations through a mob-style "protection" racket.

ACORN called it the "muscle for the money" program, according to prepared testimony Pittsburgh lawyer Heather Heidelbaugh plans to deliver at a hearing of the House Judiciary subcommittee on the Constitution, civil rights and civil liberties.

A copy of her prepared testimony was obtained by The Washington Times.

The protest shakedowns are among a slew of accusations that Ms. Heidelbaugh intends to make against the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now. She also will accuse the nonprofit group of violating tax, campaign-finance and other laws by sharing a list of President Obama's maxed-out campaign donors to solicit more funds for a get-out-the-vote drive.

The accusations, which are based entirely on sworn court testimony late last year by ACORN whistleblower Anita Moncrief, range from unlawfully coordinating campaign activity with Mr. Obama's presidential campaign to deliberately engaging in voter-registration fraud and misusing federal grant money.

The prepared testimony described two facets of the "muscle for the money" program, an official and unofficial program.

The "official" program is the name of the ACORN voter-registration drives. The Obama campaign paid an ACORN affiliate group more than $800,000 for these get-out-the-vote services during the primary race, though the expenditure was initially misrepresented to the Federal Election Commission as for "sound and lighting equipment," but later corrected.

The "unofficial" program collected payments to organize protests. For example, the Service Employees International Union hired ACORN to harass the Carlyle Group, a global private equity firm. Other paid protests targeted Sherwin-Williams, H&R Block, Jackson Hewitt and Money Mart, according to the testimony.

The protests then became a way to extract corporate donations.

"The protesting was used to get companies to negotiate. The companies would pay money to get the protesting to stop," Ms. Heidelbaugh said, quoting Ms. Moncrief's court testimony. "In addition to calling this activity 'Muscle for the Money,' the insiders at ACORN called it 'protection.' "

The hearing likely will rekindle criticism of the financial ties and close cooperation between Mr. Obama's campaign and ACORN and its sister organizations Citizens Services Inc. and Project Vote.

The groups came under fire during the campaign after probes into suspected voter fraud in a series of presidential battleground states, including Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, New Mexico and Nevada.
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New Fraud Charges Filed Against ACORN

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State attorney general files charges against ACORN, 2 employees
May. 04, 2009
By ALAN CHOATE

http://www.lvrj.com/news/breaking_news/44307912.html
ACORN, an activist group that turned in 90,000 completed voter registration forms in Clark County for last year's election, violated state law by setting mandatory quotas for workers who canvassed neighborhoods looking for people to register to vote, according to the state attorney general's office.

Officials this morning released a complaint naming the Association of Community Organization for Reform Now Inc., as well as Christopher Howell Edwards, who was the group's Las Vegas field director, and deputy regional director Amy Busefink.

Canvassers were required to register at least 20 people a day, and could be fired if they didn't, officials said. ACORN also instituted a bonus program called "blackjack" or "21 plus" in which a worker could earn an extra $5 per shift by registering 21 or more people.

The problem with the quota system is it encouraged workers to turn in false registrations, said Secretary of State Ross Miller and Larry Lomax, Clark County's registrar of voters...

...Nevada Attorney General Catherine Cortez Masto said ACORN's policy required "illegal acts in performing the job."

"These practices are clearly in violation of Nevada law," she said. "By structuring employment and compensation around a quota system, ACORN facilitated voter registration fraud in this state."

The criminal complaint lists 26 counts of compensation for registration of voters and another 13 counts of principal to the crime of registration of voters.

In October, state authorities raided the organization's offices and alleged that its canvassers falsified forms with bogus names, fake addresses or famous personalities...
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by houndawg »

dbackjon wrote:
BigApp wrote:
Jon, really. Are you serious?

You're telling all of us right here and now that you don't believe ACORN will apply for and get a substantial amount of the $4.19 BILLION earmarked for "neighborhood stabilization activities"??
It is possible. They would be just as worthy as anyone else. But to say that they WILL GET at this point is unknown.
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

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travelinman67 wrote:
Appaholic wrote:
Don't misintepret me....I blame the lenders, but I blame the borrowers more....buyer beware....those fokkers knew whether they could make payments or not....
I disagree. A person looking to purchase a home needs to either work in the industry, study the laws and regulations for months, or hire a broker/attorney to review the contract in advance. I've bought plenty of properties in my life, and in the past 15 years, especially in CA, it's a caveat emptor market. There are so many loopholes and options, the "average" person (assuming HS education), could never figure out all the ins and outs without counseling or experience. The CRA was merely a license for all the predators to legally add a few more pages of boilerplate that the borrowers could not understand.
And it didn't used to be this way. I'm only speaking for CA, but 20-25 years ago, the residential real estate contracts were pretty simple and the lenders have fairly well defined terms depending on the loan originator. I realize we have some board members who work in the real estate and lending industry, but don't forget that some of the laws vary from state to state...and it's no surprise that ground zero for the foreclosure crisis happens to be in the CA central valley around Merced and it's surrounding communities...demographics are majority of Hispanic American/Mexican, often with poor language skills, no HS education, and no understanding of real estate or lending practices. Now you can try to "blame" the borrowers all you like, but having commissioned realtors and lenders whip out labyrinth contracts, specifically crafted to maximize the loan amount, with a minefield of back end adjusters, and pushing them in a market of undereducated, unrepresented poor and lower middle class Americans, is not just inexcusable, but fraudulent and willfully criminal. The lenders KNEW the dangers of these instruments, yet used them with the hopes that an inflationary economy would provide just enough stability to the housing prices so they could pull off the scam with minimal attention.



(AZGrizfan in...5-4-3-2...)
There's no doubt there's some of that out there. But that does NOT explain what has happened in the past 24 months. Do a little reading. You'll find out that it's not these evil "toxic" mortgages made by those bullies working for the predatory lenders that have caused us to be in the position we're in. It was the bubble brought on by "investor" money that was attracted by double-digit value increases. We saw a 100% "value" increase in 5 years in Arizona, and 50% in less than 2 years. Investors were flipping houses in months and making tens (nay, hundreds) of thousands of dollars. When the music stopped in THAT game of musical chairs, tens of thousands of homes were held by investors with nowhere to "flip" them. And a LOT of those "investor" homes were owned by realtors. These investors were on the hook for mortgage payments on mutiple homes, with no market to make a killing on. Take a drive down any street....odds are the sign on the front lawn either says "bank owned" or "owner/agent". There are areas in Phoenix where houses are selling for less than 40% of what they sold for 3 years ago. My house, bought in 2001 for $355k, once appraised for $755k. Now....$360K. In fact, when the housing meltdown started, the bulk of the "toxic" mortgages that were out there hadn't even repriced yet! And in fact, most still have not....

All of this, combined with the horrific gas prices, slowing economy, etc., etc., etc., caused the meltdown that we're still trying to claw our way out of. Yeah, there were bad mortgages made by crooked lenders, but I'm here to tell you the bulk of mortgages going bad NOW are caused by people just not wanting to pay for a depreciating asset. So yeah, AZGrizFan in 5-4-3-2-1...but not to disagree about the predatory lenders, but instead to continue to beat the drum of the disappearance of personal accountability.
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by travelinman67 »

AZGrizFan wrote:
travelinman67 wrote:
I disagree. A person looking to purchase a home needs to either work in the industry, study the laws and regulations for months, or hire a broker/attorney to review the contract in advance. I've bought plenty of properties in my life, and in the past 15 years, especially in CA, it's a caveat emptor market. There are so many loopholes and options, the "average" person (assuming HS education), could never figure out all the ins and outs without counseling or experience. The CRA was merely a license for all the predators to legally add a few more pages of boilerplate that the borrowers could not understand.
And it didn't used to be this way. I'm only speaking for CA, but 20-25 years ago, the residential real estate contracts were pretty simple and the lenders have fairly well defined terms depending on the loan originator. I realize we have some board members who work in the real estate and lending industry, but don't forget that some of the laws vary from state to state...and it's no surprise that ground zero for the foreclosure crisis happens to be in the CA central valley around Merced and it's surrounding communities...demographics are majority of Hispanic American/Mexican, often with poor language skills, no HS education, and no understanding of real estate or lending practices. Now you can try to "blame" the borrowers all you like, but having commissioned realtors and lenders whip out labyrinth contracts, specifically crafted to maximize the loan amount, with a minefield of back end adjusters, and pushing them in a market of undereducated, unrepresented poor and lower middle class Americans, is not just inexcusable, but fraudulent and willfully criminal. The lenders KNEW the dangers of these instruments, yet used them with the hopes that an inflationary economy would provide just enough stability to the housing prices so they could pull off the scam with minimal attention.



(AZGrizfan in...5-4-3-2...)
There's no doubt there's some of that out there. But that does NOT explain what has happened in the past 24 months. Do a little reading. You'll find out that it's not these evil "toxic" mortgages made by those bullies working for the predatory lenders that have caused us to be in the position we're in. It was the bubble brought on by "investor" money that was attracted by double-digit value increases. We saw a 100% "value" increase in 5 years in Arizona, and 50% in less than 2 years. Investors were flipping houses in months and making tens (nay, hundreds) of thousands of dollars. When the music stopped in THAT game of musical chairs, tens of thousands of homes were held by investors with nowhere to "flip" them. And a LOT of those "investor" homes were owned by realtors. These investors were on the hook for mortgage payments on mutiple homes, with no market to make a killing on. Take a drive down any street....odds are the sign on the front lawn either says "bank owned" or "owner/agent". There are areas in Phoenix where houses are selling for less than 40% of what they sold for 3 years ago. My house, bought in 2001 for $355k, once appraised for $755k. Now....$360K. In fact, when the housing meltdown started, the bulk of the "toxic" mortgages that were out there hadn't even repriced yet! And in fact, most still have not....

All of this, combined with the horrific gas prices, slowing economy, etc., etc., etc., caused the meltdown that we're still trying to claw our way out of. Yeah, there were bad mortgages made by crooked lenders, but I'm here to tell you the bulk of mortgages going bad NOW are caused by people just not wanting to pay for a depreciating asset. So yeah, AZGrizFan in 5-4-3-2-1...but not to disagree about the predatory lenders, but instead to continue to beat the drum of the disappearance of personal accountability.
As I said in another thread, AZ, that may be true for some, but with over a million jobs lost in CA in the past 18 months...it's hard for the unemployed to pay bills.

Maybe a more germane questions is: With a depreciating asset, why are the lenders not defering repayment for unemployed (at risk) borrowers rather than filing for default and taking the write-down?

Oh, yeah...it's a tax "deduction"... :jack:






...speaking of disappearing "accountability"... :roll:
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by AZGrizFan »

travelinman67 wrote:As I said in another thread, AZ, that may be true for some, but with over a million jobs lost in CA in the past 18 months...it's hard for the unemployed to pay bills.

Maybe a more germane questions is: With a depreciating asset, why are the lenders not defering repayment for unemployed (at risk) borrowers rather than filing for default and taking the write-down?

Oh, yeah...it's a tax "deduction"... :jack:

...speaking of disappearing "accountability"... :roll:
Believe me, T-Man, if we could "defer repayment" and NOT write if off, I'd do that in New York MINUTE. The writedowns are KILLING the financial services industry, and banks and credit unions are disappearing at record pace. There's this pesky little thing called GAAP though, that prevents us from doing that. If you don't like it (and believe that it's lenders dodging "accountability"), go talk to FASB and get it changed so we can just defer repayment until such time as the borrower can afford the payment. You do THAT, and I'll suck YOUR dick on Main Street at Noon. :D :D :D :D
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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by travelinman67 »

AZGrizFan wrote:
travelinman67 wrote:As I said in another thread, AZ, that may be true for some, but with over a million jobs lost in CA in the past 18 months...it's hard for the unemployed to pay bills.

Maybe a more germane questions is: With a depreciating asset, why are the lenders not defering repayment for unemployed (at risk) borrowers rather than filing for default and taking the write-down?

Oh, yeah...it's a tax "deduction"... :jack:

...speaking of disappearing "accountability"... :roll:
Believe me, T-Man, if we could "defer repayment" and NOT write if off, I'd do that in New York MINUTE. The writedowns are KILLING the financial services industry, and banks and credit unions are disappearing at record pace. There's this pesky little thing called GAAP though, that prevents us from doing that. If you don't like it (and believe that it's lenders dodging "accountability"), go talk to FASB and get it changed so we can just defer repayment until such time as the borrower can afford the payment. You do THAT, and I'll suck YOUR dick on Main Street at Noon. :D :D :D :D
Ohhh-kay...

What prevents the lender from requiring mortgage payment insurance on all loans, or underwriting it's own self-funded plan to provide discretionary "at risk" protection coverage?


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Re: Obama's ACORN New Role: Crime Syndicate

Post by AZGrizFan »

travelinman67 wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:
Believe me, T-Man, if we could "defer repayment" and NOT write if off, I'd do that in New York MINUTE. The writedowns are KILLING the financial services industry, and banks and credit unions are disappearing at record pace. There's this pesky little thing called GAAP though, that prevents us from doing that. If you don't like it (and believe that it's lenders dodging "accountability"), go talk to FASB and get it changed so we can just defer repayment until such time as the borrower can afford the payment. You do THAT, and I'll suck YOUR dick on Main Street at Noon. :D :D :D :D
Ohhh-kay...

What prevents the lender from requiring mortgage payment insurance on all loans, or underwriting it's own self-funded plan to provide discretionary "at risk" protection coverage?


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Wow. Did you just completely change the subject or WHAT? We went from evil lenders suckering in unwitting immigrants to stupid lenders at fault for not requiring mortgage insurance. :lol: :lol: :roll: :roll: Which is it? And FYI, underwriting a discretionary plan, whether it's self funded or not, is NOT free. And you can't get Mortgage Insurance on a home equity loan.
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