Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by bluehenbillk »

Healthcare to me is the biggest issue for me this election & I'm just waiting for either candidate to have a stand on the issue. Healthcare costs are spiraling at a higher rate than higher education.

I'm pretty high up in the tax bracket column & we pay almost as much in benefits per year as we do in taxes - which is completely insane. Granted we need the Cadillac plan in coverage or else we'd be even paying more.

Obamacare, while it has done some good - you can keep kids on until they're 26, and it grants coverage to people who before it couldn't get it. But really outside of those examples it's been a massive failure. It's done absolutely zero to control costs of healthcare & I'd argue the annual (non-Obamacare)premium increases have accelerated during the Obama years.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

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"OBAMA ADMINISTRATION CONFIRMS DOUBLE-DIGIT PREMIUM HIKES

Before taxpayer-provided subsidies, premiums for a midlevel benchmark plan will increase an average of 25 percent across the 39 states served by the federally run online market, according to a report from the Department of Health and Human Services. Some states will see much bigger jumps, others less.

Moreover, about 1 in 5 consumers will have plans only from a single insurer to pick from, after major national carriers such as UnitedHealth Group, Humana and Aetna scaled back their roles.

"Consumers will be faced this year with not only big premium increases but also with a declining number of insurers participating, and that will lead to a tumultuous open enrollment period," said Larry Levitt, who tracks the health care law for the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation...

....But an estimated 5 million to 7 million people are either not eligible for the income-based assistance, or they buy individual policies outside of the health law's markets, where the subsidies are not available. The administration is urging the latter group to check out HealthCare.gov. The spike in premiums generally does not affect the employer-provided plans that cover most workers and their families.

In some states, the premium increases are striking. In Arizona, unsubsidized premiums for a hypothetical 27-year-old buying a benchmark "second-lowest cost silver plan" will jump by 116 percent, from $196 to $422, according to the administration report....."
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/ ... 4-17-03-27

Way to go Obama..
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by ∞∞∞ »

Of course the ACA is failing; the way the exchange is run is a twisted, ridiculous method to provide insurance. But nonetheless, it's a stepping stone in the right direction: a single-payer system.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by Pwns »

Why do liberals think even rudimentary restrictions on abortion are a government encroachment of health care, but government deciding what treatments and medications you will get in a leviathan single-payer system is okay?
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by Gil Dobie »

Pwns wrote:Why do liberals think even rudimentary restrictions on abortion are a government encroachment of health care, but government deciding what treatments and medications you will get in a leviathan single-payer system is okay?
Liberal pro-choice is over-rated. :nod:
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by Baldy »

∞∞∞ wrote:Of course the ACA is failing; the way the exchange is run is a twisted, ridiculous method to provide insurance. But nonetheless, it's a stepping stone in the right direction: a single-payer system.
Yeah, just like aiming your car at a telephone pole at 100 mph is a stepping stone to dying.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by kalm »

Pwns wrote:Why do liberals think even rudimentary restrictions on abortion are a government encroachment of health care, but government deciding what treatments and medications you will get in a leviathan single-payer system is okay?
Like the people on Medicare?
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by ASUG8 »

A handy chart comparing single payer with Affordable care act:

http://www.pnhp.org/sites/default/files ... 202013.pdf
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by SDHornet »

ASUG8 wrote:A handy chart comparing single payer with Affordable care act:

http://www.pnhp.org/sites/default/files ... 202013.pdf
This reads like one of those poli pamphlets I get in the mail this time of the election cycle. :lol:
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by SDHornet »

∞∞∞ wrote:Of course the ACA is failing; the way the exchange is run is a twisted, ridiculous method to provide insurance. But nonetheless, it's a stepping stone in the right direction: a single-payer system.
Duh. The gubmint runs it, of course it is not going to be efficient. What the fuck did you think was going to happen? :dunce: :roll: :lol: :dunce:

Oh and get better? Yeah because things get better when the gubmunt gets involved. :dunce: :dunce: :dunce:
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by Ibanez »

SDHornet wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote:Of course the ACA is failing; the way the exchange is run is a twisted, ridiculous method to provide insurance. But nonetheless, it's a stepping stone in the right direction: a single-payer system.
Duh. The gubmint runs it, of course it is not going to be efficient. What the fuck did you think was going to happen? :dunce: :roll: :lol: :dunce:

Oh and get better? Yeah because things get better when the gubmunt gets involved. :dunce: :dunce: :dunce:
Hey, we've gotten better at killing people. :tothehand: We're back to back World War Champions!
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by ASUG8 »

SDHornet wrote:
ASUG8 wrote:A handy chart comparing single payer with Affordable care act:

http://www.pnhp.org/sites/default/files ... 202013.pdf
This reads like one of those poli pamphlets I get in the mail this time of the election cycle. :lol:
:lol:
Yeah, I don't know if pnhp has strong political leanings, but I needed to brush up on the differences between the programs.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by kalm »

ASUG8 wrote:
SDHornet wrote: This reads like one of those poli pamphlets I get in the mail this time of the election cycle. :lol:
:lol:
Yeah, I don't know if pnhp has strong political leanings, but I needed to brush up on the differences between the programs.
PNHP has been pro single payer all along but they've made solid arguments for it all along too.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by kalm »

SDHornet wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote:Of course the ACA is failing; the way the exchange is run is a twisted, ridiculous method to provide insurance. But nonetheless, it's a stepping stone in the right direction: a single-payer system.
Duh. The gubmint runs it, of course it is not going to be efficient. What the fuck did you think was going to happen? :dunce: :roll: :lol: :dunce:

Oh and get better? Yeah because things get better when the gubmunt gets involved. :dunce: :dunce: :dunce:
Valid but what we have now and had before is massively inefficient. Less efficient than even the VA and Medicare.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by SDHornet »

kalm wrote:
SDHornet wrote: Duh. The gubmint runs it, of course it is not going to be efficient. What the fuck did you think was going to happen? :dunce: :roll: :lol: :dunce:

Oh and get better? Yeah because things get better when the gubmunt gets involved. :dunce: :dunce: :dunce:
Valid but what we have now and had before is massively inefficient. Less efficient than even the VA and Medicare.
Yup, it'll only get worse as the gubmint gets more control and more involved. This is what happens when you vote for something and then read it. :lol:
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by ∞∞∞ »

kalm wrote:
ASUG8 wrote:
:lol:
Yeah, I don't know if pnhp has strong political leanings, but I needed to brush up on the differences between the programs.
PNHP has been pro single payer all along but they've made solid arguments for it all along too.
Let's face it, no one really cares about the faceless people they'll never meet which make up our society. This is a capitalist nation and our mindset is that we like to have things others can't, which apparently includes healthcare. People don't want to pay more in taxes to help fellow Americans...because "socialism."

So what do we get? Obamacare (despite plenty of industrial nations setting a standard we could work from).

We need to take a look in the mirror and be honest with ourselves; unless we actually care about each other, this whole venture into universal healthcare is a big joke.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by ASUG8 »

∞∞∞ wrote:
kalm wrote:
PNHP has been pro single payer all along but they've made solid arguments for it all along too.
Let's face it, no one really cares about the faceless people they'll never meet which make up our society. This is a capitalist nation and our mindset is that we like to have things others can't, which apparently includes healthcare. People don't want to pay more in taxes to help fellow Americans...because "socialism."

So what do we get? Obamacare (despite plenty of industrial nations setting a standard we could work from).

We need to take a look in the mirror and be honest with ourselves; unless we actually care about each other, this whole venture into universal healthcare is a big joke.
Do you know why you can bleed to death waiting in an ER? Because people who have the sniffles but don't have health care go there because they won't be turned away. Putting in place a program like ACA that monetarily penalizes people (who can't afford healthcare) for not affording healthcare makes zero sense, but that's what the prez and the Dems wanted because they had to vote for it to know what was in it. Classic case of ready/fire/aim. :coffee:
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by Bronco »

-
BHO seems to be scrambling trying to change history on his legacy. He lied his way into office...lying his way into a good legacy will probably work on the Hillary voters
Obama on soaring health insurance premiums: ‘I had nothing to do with that’
Canada Free Press ^ | 10/21/16 | Dan Calabrese



ObamaCare has had a disastrous effect on the health insurance market in this country, and it takes a hell of a lot of nerve for this guy to stand there and say it couldn't possibly have anything to do with him



Speaking in Florida, Obama insists that rising health insurance rates have nothing whatsoever to do with ObamaCare, and argues that most people get their health insurance from employer plans that are not ObamaCare plans. Thus, how can it possibly be his fault?
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by SDHornet »

∞∞∞ wrote:
kalm wrote:
PNHP has been pro single payer all along but they've made solid arguments for it all along too.
Let's face it, no one really cares about the faceless people they'll never meet which make up our society. This is a capitalist nation and our mindset is that we like to have things others can't, which apparently includes healthcare. People don't want to pay more in taxes to help fellow Americans...because "socialism."

So what do we get? Obamacare (despite plenty of industrial nations setting a standard we could work from).

We need to be honest with ourselves, unless we actually care about each other, this whole thing is a big joke.
I don't want to pay more in taxes because:
1) I've busted my ass getting to where I am at now, I don't see why others cant bust their ass to come up in the world either. This coming from a guy that grew up in a drug and gang infested inner city neighborhood and went through some of the shittiest public schools in the area.
2) The gubmint has stepped up to play captain savahoe for everyone which discourages me to give a shit since the gubmint will take what it needs to fill that role.
3) Charities and religious organizations should be filling the "care for the needy" role. I would be inclined to give/care for those causes if not for #2 above.
4) 'Merica!!!
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by Ivytalk »

SDHornet wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote: Let's face it, no one really cares about the faceless people they'll never meet which make up our society. This is a capitalist nation and our mindset is that we like to have things others can't, which apparently includes healthcare. People don't want to pay more in taxes to help fellow Americans...because "socialism."

So what do we get? Obamacare (despite plenty of industrial nations setting a standard we could work from).

We need to be honest with ourselves, unless we actually care about each other, this whole thing is a big joke.
I don't want to pay more in taxes because:
1) I've busted my ass getting to where I am at now, I don't see why others cant bust their ass to come up in the world either. This coming from a guy that grew up in a drug and gang infested inner city neighborhood and went through some of the shittiest public schools in the area.
2) The gubmint has stepped up to play captain savahoe for everyone which discourages me to give a **** since the gubmint will take what it needs to fill that role.
3) Charities and religious organizations should be filling the "care for the needy" role. I would be inclined to give/care for those causes if not for #2 above.
4) 'Merica!!!
Game, set, match to SDHornet. Trips, go find another liberal cause to cry about.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by ∞∞∞ »

Ivytalk wrote:
SDHornet wrote: I don't want to pay more in taxes because:
1) I've busted my ass getting to where I am at now, I don't see why others cant bust their ass to come up in the world either. This coming from a guy that grew up in a drug and gang infested inner city neighborhood and went through some of the shittiest public schools in the area.
2) The gubmint has stepped up to play captain savahoe for everyone which discourages me to give a **** since the gubmint will take what it needs to fill that role.
3) Charities and religious organizations should be filling the "care for the needy" role. I would be inclined to give/care for those causes if not for #2 above.
4) 'Merica!!!
Game, set, match to SDHornet. Trips, go find another liberal cause to cry about.
It's fine, I understand no one actually cares or wants to pay more taxes. I'll keep advocating for it but I'm also realistic; I know that with the political climate we have right now it won't happen.

Hopefully in a decade or two the branches will be liberal enough for it to be a realistic goal. Baby steps.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by YoUDeeMan »

∞∞∞ wrote:
kalm wrote:
PNHP has been pro single payer all along but they've made solid arguments for it all along too.
Let's face it, no one really cares about the faceless people they'll never meet which make up our society. This is a capitalist nation and our mindset is that we like to have things others can't, which apparently includes healthcare. People don't want to pay more in taxes to help fellow Americans...because "socialism."

So what do we get? Obamacare (despite plenty of industrial nations setting a standard we could work from).

We need to take a look in the mirror and be honest with ourselves; unless we actually care about each other, this whole venture into universal healthcare is a big joke.
You're gay....you want everyone in America to care about you and your feewings.

And yet...YOU don't give a rat's arse about the people Hillary and Obama are killing all over the world.

You're a fvcking hypocrite. :nod:

Over 250,000 dead in Syria (funny how that number hasn't changed), add in tens of thousands more each from Libya, Yemen, etc. Millions of refugees...kids drowning, innocent Christians getting killed on boats...and you don't give one shIt about any of those people. NOT. ONE. SHIT. You'll vote for Hillary for YOUR OWN SELF INTEREST. :nod:

Hypocrite. :lol:
These signatures have a 500 character limit?

What if I have more personalities than that?
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by Pwns »

We don't need to even think about an SP system until we can get costs under control.
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by ASUG8 »

Pwns wrote:We don't need to even think about an SP system until we can get costs under control.
When the government can demonstrate that they can operate efficiently and not squander our tax money I'll be on board.

:rofl: I actually typed that with a straight face. :lol:
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Re: Can we now call Øbamacare a failure?

Post by Ibanez »

SDHornet wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote: Let's face it, no one really cares about the faceless people they'll never meet which make up our society. This is a capitalist nation and our mindset is that we like to have things others can't, which apparently includes healthcare. People don't want to pay more in taxes to help fellow Americans...because "socialism."

So what do we get? Obamacare (despite plenty of industrial nations setting a standard we could work from).

We need to be honest with ourselves, unless we actually care about each other, this whole thing is a big joke.
I don't want to pay more in taxes because:
1) I've busted my ass getting to where I am at now, I don't see why others cant bust their ass to come up in the world either. This coming from a guy that grew up in a drug and gang infested inner city neighborhood and went through some of the shittiest public schools in the area.
2) The gubmint has stepped up to play captain savahoe for everyone which discourages me to give a shit since the gubmint will take what it needs to fill that role.
3) Charities and religious organizations should be filling the "care for the needy" role. I would be inclined to give/care for those causes if not for #2 above.
4) 'Merica!!!
Wait a minute, you mean a white man didn't come around your neighborhood and prevent you from going to school? A white man didn't keep you out of college, or from getting a job? A white man didn't force you to turn to a life to crime? Damnit, Merle had 1 job!! Fuckin' Merle.
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