Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Political discussions
User avatar
CID1990
Level5
Level5
Posts: 19844
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:40 am
I am a fan of: Pie
A.K.A.: CID 1990
Location: กรุงเทพมหานคร

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby CID1990 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 5:37 pm

Ibanez wrote:
CID1990 wrote:
I assumed it was a given that “emotion” and judgment, the ability to plan and strategize - all of those attributes would be the result of machine learning


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Emotion, yes. But the ability to plan and strategize can be attributed to AI - as long as it's been programmed.

Now if it hasn't, and it's learned it on it's own then yes - it's ML. :coffee:

And what level decision making are we referring to? That's why I think the discussion around AI is good to have, but we have to talk about it in context of AI with ML. I talk to people often at work who talk all day about AI in banking and they never once consider ML as a factor. They wrongly assume that AI and ML are the same thing. :twocents:


Correct - but human planning and strategics rely on learning to be successful - particularly in real time. For a machine to determine how many tanks to send to a particular grid reference is easily programmable. But machine learning is necessary for the AI to recognize the old human adage - that all plans go out the window once the first shot is fired.

At some point, these machines - particularly with military applications - are going to have to be able to to protect themselves. They won't even have to have judgment or emotion - just the programmed edict to protect themselves and then ML providing the how.

A purely logical computer, with the ability to learn and a core precept of self preservation - will not be our ally.
"You however, are an insufferable ankle biting mental chihuahua..." - Clizzoris

User avatar
Skjellyfetti
Anal
Anal
Posts: 11978
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:56 pm
I am a fan of: Appalachian

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Skjellyfetti » Mon Mar 11, 2019 6:37 pm

it's an interesting discussion, but i don't think there is much incentive to program an ai designed for military use for self preservation. i think it would be more useful to program them to go into kamikaze mode, inflict as much damage as possible and self destruct when it looks like they're ****.

i don't think you'd train it with it's "core precept" being self preservation. :twocents:
"The unmasking thing was all created by Devin Nunes"
- Richard Burr, (R-NC)

Cid1990 wrote:It is going to be a sad day for a lot of people when all that comes of all of this is Flynn getting whacked.

Mueller is going to take a beating on the left before this business is over

User avatar
CID1990
Level5
Level5
Posts: 19844
Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:40 am
I am a fan of: Pie
A.K.A.: CID 1990
Location: กรุงเทพมหานคร

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby CID1990 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:05 pm

Skjellyfetti wrote:it's an interesting discussion, but i don't think there is much incentive to program an ai designed for military use for self preservation. i think it would be more useful to program them to go into kamikaze mode, inflict as much damage as possible and self destruct when it looks like they're ****.

i don't think you'd train it with it's "core precept" being self preservation. :twocents:


Lethality and survivability are the two keystones of weapons systems development.

We have unmanned stealth drones - they arent stealthy to protect a pilot... they are expensive to replace, and in a conventional war the means to replace them could go away

Killer robots that rely on AI fed by machine learning would eventually subvert any hardwired “kamikaze mode”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
"You however, are an insufferable ankle biting mental chihuahua..." - Clizzoris

User avatar
Pwns
Level4
Level4
Posts: 5917
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 10:38 pm
I am a fan of: Georgia Friggin' Southern
A.K.A.: FCS_pwns_FBS (AGS)

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Pwns » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:14 pm

Ibanez wrote:
Are you using the word judgement in place of decision making?

The facet of AI that, IMO,should concern you all is the machine learning. The ML will do things it hasn't been programmed to do. Not everything that's AI will/can/should have this capability.

For instance, an AI can adapt to different situations (you see this in autonomous driving). AI, essentially, does human tasks better. But ML will actually learn, evolve and then begin to make judgement calls based off its experience and what it knows/processes. ML doesn't need as much human intervention as opposed to AI.

An AI machine can't read song lyrics and tell you if it's happy, sad or what. A ML machine can.


CID - I didn't say all that b/c I think you don't know about it. I bet you do. I'm just adding to the convo. :thumb:


Permit me to go JSO on you, here:

"Machine learning" is a misnomer. It's is just another buzz word for what I already described - finding complex and subtle patterns in data that people could never detect. To build a classification algorithm (for example), you have to have data on whatever things it is you want the program to classify and then the computer tries an enormous number of different classification schemes until it finds one that fits the data given to it, and then you go to a second set of data and see if the procedure fits data that wasn't used to come up with the classification procedure to begin with. Ultimately it's just like a pocket calculator, except it's doing more sophisticated calculations.

Let me give you an example of what I'm talking about.

There was a professor at MIT years ago that created a computer program that could grade college student essays and assign them grades that were remarkably similar to what college professors would give them. Of course the computer program is looking at things like the average number of words per sentence, the number of unique words, the frequency of certain consonants, etc. You basically have to do things like that because the computer can't read for comprehension. Of course, another professor showed you could use grammatically-correct gibberish and the machine would give it an A.

The original article CID posted raised the question of a new "Turing Test" (basically, that means a test to determine if you have "true" AI). I see no reason why the original one still isn't relevant. Basically, the original test was if you're having a conversation via a computer and you can't tell if you're talking with a person or a machine, you have true AI.

Of course, some people think that because Amazon Alexa can tell you how many ounces in a cup that that mark has already been passed, but that's nonsense (dogs and birds can understand words and simple sentences). We're nowhere close to having a Rosie from the Jetsons or machines like in iRobot. Computers can't solve fifth-grade math word problems with the text as input and can't even find all the mistakes in some piece of writing, let alone critique argumentation and tone. I don't see how more hardware and more sophisticated algorithms to detect even more subtle patterns in data is going to get around that.

BTW, I'm hardly the only one saying these things. There's more than a few AI skeptics out there with valid criticisms of AI hype.
We get the government we deserve. :nod:

User avatar
HI54UNI
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 9931
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 9:39 pm
I am a fan of: Firing Mark Farley
A.K.A.: Bikinis for JSO
Location: The Panther State

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby HI54UNI » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:30 pm

Chizzang wrote:
HI54UNI wrote:
But do they know how many miles a Ford Escape can go on a tank of gas?

It's all relative.

:D


a vehicle that you accused me of having modified in some way..? (if I remember)
I think all we'd done to that thing was get Google Kirkland to install some autonomous driving gadgets

:ohno:

you guys are all assholes


I did not accuse you of modifying it. I said you were full of ****.

And yes we are all a bunch of assholes. That's what makes this place great! :thumb:
Image

All my posts are satire.

User avatar
Ibanez
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 49785
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 5:16 pm
I am a fan of: Coastal Carolina

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Ibanez » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:40 pm

Pwns wrote:
Ibanez wrote:
Are you using the word judgement in place of decision making?

The facet of AI that, IMO,should concern you all is the machine learning. The ML will do things it hasn't been programmed to do. Not everything that's AI will/can/should have this capability.

For instance, an AI can adapt to different situations (you see this in autonomous driving). AI, essentially, does human tasks better. But ML will actually learn, evolve and then begin to make judgement calls based off its experience and what it knows/processes. ML doesn't need as much human intervention as opposed to AI.

An AI machine can't read song lyrics and tell you if it's happy, sad or what. A ML machine can.


CID - I didn't say all that b/c I think you don't know about it. I bet you do. I'm just adding to the convo. :thumb:


Permit me to go JSO on you, here:

"Machine learning" is a misnomer. It's is just another buzz word for what I already described - finding complex and subtle patterns in data that people could never detect. To build a classification algorithm (for example), you have to have data on whatever things it is you want the program to classify and then the computer tries an enormous number of different classification schemes until it finds one that fits the data given to it, and then you go to a second set of data and see if the procedure fits data that wasn't used to come up with the classification procedure to begin with. Ultimately it's just like a pocket calculator, except it's doing more sophisticated calculations.

Let me give you an example of what I'm talking about.

There was a professor at MIT years ago that created a computer program that could grade college student essays and assign them grades that were remarkably similar to what college professors would give them. Of course the computer program is looking at things like the average number of words per sentence, the number of unique words, the frequency of certain consonants, etc. You basically have to do things like that because the computer can't read for comprehension. Of course, another professor showed you could use grammatically-correct gibberish and the machine would give it an A.

The original article CID posted raised the question of a new "Turing Test" (basically, that means a test to determine if you have "true" AI). I see no reason why the original one still isn't relevant. Basically, the original test was if you're having a conversation via a computer and you can't tell if you're talking with a person or a machine, you have true AI.

Of course, some people think that because Amazon Alexa can tell you how many ounces in a cup that that mark has already been passed, but that's nonsense (dogs and birds can understand words and simple sentences). We're nowhere close to having a Rosie from the Jetsons or machines like in iRobot. Computers can't solve fifth-grade math word problems with the text as input and can't even find all the mistakes in some piece of writing, let alone critique argumentation and tone. I don't see how more hardware and more sophisticated algorithms to detect even more subtle patterns in data is going to get around that.

BTW, I'm hardly the only one saying these things. There's more than a few AI skeptics out there with valid criticisms of AI hype.

Misnomer? That I don’t agree with.
Turns out I might be a little gay. 89Hen 11/7/17

css75
Level2
Level2
Posts: 1664
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2018 10:45 pm

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby css75 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:09 pm

Ivytalk wrote:What’s the under on Tucker Carlson’s tenure at Fox News? Shyt’s about to get real for that snot-nosed punk.


What did he do now?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

User avatar
Chizzang
Level5
Level5
Posts: 16967
Joined: Mon Apr 20, 2009 7:36 am
I am a fan of: Deflate Gate
A.K.A.: The Quasar Kid
Location: Don't call it Seattle...

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Chizzang » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:48 am

When the President of the United States quotes Carbon Dioxide is the main building block of all life...

:rofl:

Dear Mr. President, Carbon is the main building block not Carbon Dioxide

Image

Image
How would you define a Republican?
"Somebody comfortable betting that science is wrong and oil companies are right..."

User avatar
AZGrizFan
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 49768
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 4:40 pm
I am a fan of: Sexual Chocolate
Location: Just to the right of center

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby AZGrizFan » Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:59 am

Chizzang wrote:When the President of the United States quotes Carbon Dioxide is the main building block of all life...

:rofl:

Dear Mr. President, Carbon is the main building block not Carbon Dioxide

Image

Image


Doesn't he get 50% credit for that answer? :lol: :lol: I believe we used to call that the "shotgun" approach in school...throw enough **** on the wall and see if something sticks!
"Ah ****. You are right." KYJelly, 11/6/12
"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam." Barack Obama, 9/25/12
Image

User avatar
AZGrizFan
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 49768
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 4:40 pm
I am a fan of: Sexual Chocolate
Location: Just to the right of center

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby AZGrizFan » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:00 pm

HI54UNI wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
a vehicle that you accused me of having modified in some way..? (if I remember)
I think all we'd done to that thing was get Google Kirkland to install some autonomous driving gadgets

:ohno:

you guys are all assholes


I did not accuse you of modifying it. I said you were full of ****.

And yes we are all a bunch of assholes. That's what makes this place great! :thumb:


Amen. ****. :suspicious: :suspicious:
"Ah ****. You are right." KYJelly, 11/6/12
"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam." Barack Obama, 9/25/12
Image

User avatar
Grizalltheway
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 35781
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:01 pm
A.K.A.: DJ Honey BBQ
Location: BSC

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Grizalltheway » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:31 pm

Chizzang wrote:When the President of the United States quotes Carbon Dioxide is the main building block of all life...

:rofl:

Dear Mr. President, Carbon is the main building block not Carbon Dioxide

Image

Image

Oooh oooh, today he's play aeronautical engineer! :lol:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump- ... e-my-pilot

∞∞∞
Level4
Level4
Posts: 9713
Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 7:30 am

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby ∞∞∞ » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:46 pm

Grizalltheway wrote:Oooh oooh, today he's play aeronautical engineer! :lol:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump- ... e-my-pilot

God he's so stupid:

Image

Image

But he knows everything about anything. :roll:

User avatar
AZGrizFan
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 49768
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 4:40 pm
I am a fan of: Sexual Chocolate
Location: Just to the right of center

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby AZGrizFan » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:49 pm

He knows one thing: He's living rent free in all your heads. :lol:
"Ah ****. You are right." KYJelly, 11/6/12
"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam." Barack Obama, 9/25/12
Image

User avatar
Skjellyfetti
Anal
Anal
Posts: 11978
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:56 pm
I am a fan of: Appalachian

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Skjellyfetti » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:06 pm

Grizalltheway wrote:Oooh oooh, today he's play aeronautical engineer! :lol:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump- ... e-my-pilot


Image
"The unmasking thing was all created by Devin Nunes"
- Richard Burr, (R-NC)

Cid1990 wrote:It is going to be a sad day for a lot of people when all that comes of all of this is Flynn getting whacked.

Mueller is going to take a beating on the left before this business is over

User avatar
CAA Flagship
4th&29
4th&29
Posts: 33089
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 5:01 pm
I am a fan of: Old Dominion
Location: Pizza Hell

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:46 pm

AZGrizFan wrote:He knows one thing: He's living rent free in all your heads. :lol:

:rofl: :rofl: :notworthy: :notworthy:

User avatar
JohnStOnge
Egalitarian
Egalitarian
Posts: 16945
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:47 pm
I am a fan of: McNeese State
A.K.A.: JohnStOnge

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby JohnStOnge » Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:01 pm

CAA Flagship wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:He knows one thing: He's living rent free in all your heads. :lol:

:rofl: :rofl: :notworthy: :notworthy:


That's fine. We SHOULD be concerned about having somebody like that in that position. Having someone like that as President of the United States is a big problem.

If I woke up tomorrow and the news was that an asteroid is heading for Earth impact that would be in my head. And it should be.
Well, I believe that I must tell the truth
And say things as they really are
But if I told the truth and nothing but the truth
Could I ever be a star?

Deep Purple: No One Came
Image

User avatar
Ibanez
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 49785
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 5:16 pm
I am a fan of: Coastal Carolina

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Ibanez » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:11 am

AZGrizFan wrote:He knows one thing: He's living rent free in all your heads. :lol:

Right next to AOC in the minds of "conservatives" and "republicans." :thumb:
Turns out I might be a little gay. 89Hen 11/7/17

∞∞∞
Level4
Level4
Posts: 9713
Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2009 7:30 am

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby ∞∞∞ » Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:12 am

https://www.newsweek.com/king-trump-gop ... op-1361192
More than a dozen Republican senators introduced new legislation seeking to put a cap on presidential emergency powers, days before they were expected to vote on a measure against President Donald Trump's national emergency declaration on immigration.

In a statement introducing the legislation, Senator Mike Lee of Utah said he spearheaded the bill in a bid to stop a president from "acting like a king [by] taking back the legislative powers that allow him to do so." The new bill, he said, "will go a long way to restoring the balance of powers in our republic."

...While Lee's measure would not affect Trump's current national emergency declaration, it would apply to future declarations.

:roll:

User avatar
Ibanez
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 49785
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 5:16 pm
I am a fan of: Coastal Carolina

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Ibanez » Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:19 am

∞∞∞ wrote:https://www.newsweek.com/king-trump-gop-senators-introduce-new-bill-curbing-emergency-powers-stop-1361192
More than a dozen Republican senators introduced new legislation seeking to put a cap on presidential emergency powers, days before they were expected to vote on a measure against President Donald Trump's national emergency declaration on immigration.

In a statement introducing the legislation, Senator Mike Lee of Utah said he spearheaded the bill in a bid to stop a president from "acting like a king [by] taking back the legislative powers that allow him to do so." The new bill, he said, "will go a long way to restoring the balance of powers in our republic."

...While Lee's measure would not affect Trump's current national emergency declaration, it would apply to future declarations.

:roll:

They have to vote on his emergency declaration anyway, in fact aren't they doing that today?
Turns out I might be a little gay. 89Hen 11/7/17

User avatar
AZGrizFan
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 49768
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 4:40 pm
I am a fan of: Sexual Chocolate
Location: Just to the right of center

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby AZGrizFan » Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:56 am

JohnStOnge wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote: :rofl: :rofl: :notworthy: :notworthy:


That's fine. We SHOULD be concerned about having somebody like that in that position. Having someone like that as President of the United States is a big problem.

If I woke up tomorrow and the news was that an asteroid is heading for Earth impact that would be in my head. And it should be.


What in the actual ****?

Put down the acid, John. :dunce: :dunce: :suspicious:
"Ah ****. You are right." KYJelly, 11/6/12
"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam." Barack Obama, 9/25/12
Image

User avatar
Grizalltheway
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 35781
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:01 pm
A.K.A.: DJ Honey BBQ
Location: BSC

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Grizalltheway » Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:03 am

AZGrizFan wrote:
JohnStOnge wrote:
That's fine. We SHOULD be concerned about having somebody like that in that position. Having someone like that as President of the United States is a big problem.

If I woke up tomorrow and the news was that an asteroid is heading for Earth impact that would be in my head. And it should be.


What in the actual ****?

Put down the acid, John. :dunce: :dunce: :suspicious:

Shall we go back and dig up some of your hand wringing about Obama and how he was going to destroy life as we know it? :roll:

User avatar
Winterborn
Level2
Level2
Posts: 1301
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 2:33 pm
I am a fan of: Beer and Diesel Pickups
Location: Wherever I hang my hat

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Winterborn » Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:04 am

Ibanez wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:He knows one thing: He's living rent free in all your heads. :lol:

Right next to AOC in the minds of "conservatives" and "republicans." :thumb:


I would have to give the edge to the conservatives/republicans. Miss perky tits would make a much better roommate than Trump. As long as you could get used to her eating your food out of the refrigerator and her "borrowing" your stuff from time to time.

Ivytalk
Supporter
Supporter
Posts: 21608
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:22 pm
I am a fan of: Salisbury University
Location: Dela-Where?

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Ivytalk » Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:21 pm

Skjellyfetti wrote:
Grizalltheway wrote:Oooh oooh, today he's play aeronautical engineer! :lol:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump- ... e-my-pilot


Image

Chizzang’s in the cockpit?

No homo.
Don’t get me wrong. I am generally a fan of tax increases. — John “Bernie!” St. Onge 11/16/18

User avatar
Skjellyfetti
Anal
Anal
Posts: 11978
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:56 pm
I am a fan of: Appalachian

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby Skjellyfetti » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:47 am

"The unmasking thing was all created by Devin Nunes"
- Richard Burr, (R-NC)

Cid1990 wrote:It is going to be a sad day for a lot of people when all that comes of all of this is Flynn getting whacked.

Mueller is going to take a beating on the left before this business is over

css75
Level2
Level2
Posts: 1664
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2018 10:45 pm

Re: Miscellaneous news items that don't warrant their own thread

Postby css75 » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:38 am

http://time.com/5551140/italy-rape-ugly-masculine/

Interesting case


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Return to “Politics”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: bearkat91 and 98 guests