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kalm wrote:

CitadelGrad wrote:
Sorry, but you are full of shit. Those who make the argument that revenue growth under Carter was greater than Reagan either a) measure revenue as a percentage of GDP or b) don't adjust for inflation.

In the case of a), GDP was much lower under Carter except for the recession of '81 - '82. Naturally, by that measure revenues and revenues growth were higher.

In the case of b), inflation under Carter was significantly higher than during the Reagan years. Unless you adjust for inflation (real $), you will get a distortion.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fac ... c75e0b7e36

Some of the number are just wrong. Important information was omitted. Distortions abound.

Just another WaPo propaganda piece.

CitadelGrad wrote:

JohnStOnge wrote:
The rate of growth in revenue during the Reagan years was lower than it was during the Carter years. That's bears upon the fallacy of the Reagan tax cuts thing. Yes, revenues typically grow as the population grows and GDP grows. The question is if something like Reagan's tax cuts slows or increases the rate of revenue increase. And Reagan's tax cuts were associated with the rate SLOWING.

I don't think you did it intentionally but I think what you did is part of the big lie with respect to the effect of Reagan's tax cuts on revenues. Yes, revenues increased under Reagan. But the rate of increase slowed. All indications are that the country got LESS revenue than it would have gotten if the Reagan tax cuts would never have happened.

Sorry, but you are full of shit. Those who make the argument that revenue growth under Carter was greater than Reagan either a) measure revenue as a percentage of GDP or b) don't adjust for inflation.

In the case of a), GDP was much lower under Carter except for the recession of '81 - '82. Naturally, by that measure revenues and revenues growth were higher.

In the case of b), inflation under Carter was significantly higher than during the Reagan years. Unless you adjust for inflation (real $), you will get a distortion.

Is that when all HUMINT was murdered in Iran?

Our anti-war President just vetoed a resolution to end our support for the war in Yemen.

CID1990 wrote:Our anti-war President just vetoed a resolution to end our support for the war in Yemen.

Are we great again?

Ibanez wrote:

CID1990 wrote:Our anti-war President just vetoed a resolution to end our support for the war in Yemen.

Are we great again?

So much for the War Powers Resolution.

Molten Bolton was behind that veto.

CitadelGrad wrote:

kalm wrote:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fac ... c75e0b7e36

Some of the number are just wrong. Important information was omitted. Distortions abound.

Just another WaPo propaganda piece.

Do tell...

UNI88 wrote:

JohnStOnge wrote:
The rate of growth in revenue during the Reagan years was lower than it was during the Carter years. That's bears upon the fallacy of the Reagan tax cuts thing. Yes, revenues typically grow as the population grows and GDP grows. The question is if something like Reagan's tax cuts slows or increases the rate of revenue increase. And Reagan's tax cuts were associated with the rate SLOWING.

I don't think you did it intentionally but I think what you did is part of the big lie with respect to the effect of Reagan's tax cuts on revenues. Yes, revenues increased under Reagan. But the rate of increase slowed. All indications are that the country got LESS revenue than it would have gotten if the Reagan tax cuts would never have happened.

John, you're assuming the full impact of the tax cuts occurs during the terms of the POTUS who signed the bill. The impact IS NOT immediate. I would argue that it took nearly a decade for the full impact of Reagan's tax cuts to be felt and the POTUS at the time was Slick Willy. How was GDP and the economy doing during Slick Willy's presidency?

The problem for that outlook is that the GDP and the economy during the Slick Willy economy was associated with Slick Willy RAISING taxes. I've heard the stuff about the "delayed effect" before. I think that is just people who want to take that point of view trying to find SOME way to support it. But Reagan cut taxes and the rate of revenue increase slowed. It increased some later after Reagan had to go back and INCREASE taxes. Then it REALLY increased after Slick Willy raised taxes. And it's "Oh wait, that was REALLY because Reagan CUT taxes back in the 1980s, not because Clinon RAISED taxes right before it happened!"

I'm sorry. But the idea that tax cuts are going not going to cost us revenue just isn't supported by what's historically happened.

That doesn't mean I'm against tax cuts. But I believe in being honest about it like Reagan was. Again: Reagan did not claim tax cuts would not cost us revenue. His thing was that government needed to have its allowance cut.

CitadelGrad wrote:

kalm wrote:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fac ... c75e0b7e36

Some of the number are just wrong. Important information was omitted. Distortions abound.

Just another WaPo propaganda piece.

Anybody with a full deck of tarot cards would make a passable economist.

houndawg wrote:

CitadelGrad wrote:
Some of the number are just wrong. Important information was omitted. Distortions abound.

Just another WaPo propaganda piece.

Anybody with a double digit IQ would graduate with honors from SIU.

UNI88 wrote:

houndawg wrote:
Anybody with a double digit IQ would graduate with honors from SIU.

touched a nerve did we?

houndawg wrote:

UNI88 wrote:

touched a nerve did we?

Nope, just having a little fun.

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Woman gets fired after she goes all TDS on an elderly man wearing a MAGA hat..
https://www.foxnews.com/us/man-wearing- ... ting-trump

BDKJMU wrote:Woman gets fired after she goes all TDS on an elderly man wearing a MAGA hat..
https://www.foxnews.com/us/man-wearing- ... ting-trump

Gil will point out that this is probably a set-up
and is actually a Conservative pretending to be a lunatic Liberal

(Right Gil..?)

“...former White House official defied a subpoena and the Treasury Department ignored a deadline for providing President Donald Trump’s tax returns...

....Carl Kline, a former White House personnel security director, who was subpoenaed by Democrats.

Kline did not show up Tuesday for a scheduled deposition,...

....Meanwhile, the administration on Tuesday defied a demand from Ways and Means Committee Chairman Richard Neal, D-Mass., to turn over six years of Trump’s tax returns by the close of business — a strong signal that they intend to reject the request....

....White House has stonewalled the oversight panel in several different investigations. On Monday, Trump and his business organization sued Cummings to block a subpoena that seeks years of the president’s financial records. The complaint, filed in federal court in Washington, said a subpoena from Cummings “has no legitimate legislative purpose” and accused Democrats of harassing Trump.

Cummings said the White House “has refused to produce a single piece of paper or a single witness” in any of the panel’s investigations this year. Democrats took control of the House in January.

The back and forth over Kline’s testimony played out in a series of letters over the past month between the White House, the oversight committee and Kline’s lawyer. The White House demanded that one of its lawyers attend the deposition to ensure executive privilege was protected, but Cummings rejected that request. The White House then ordered Kline, who now works at the Pentagon, to defy the subpoena.....”
https://apnews.com/b1de0b62669c42e88939e0fdfa792092

The Trump admin is going to ignore, stonewall, delay, sue..Let the donks in Congress with their plethora of politically motivated investigations pound sand all the way through 2020

BDKJMU wrote:“...former White House official defied a subpoena and the Treasury Department ignored a deadline for providing President Donald Trump’s tax returns...

....Carl Kline, a former White House personnel security director, who was subpoenaed by Democrats.

Kline did not show up Tuesday for a scheduled deposition,...

....Meanwhile, the administration on Tuesday defied a demand from Ways and Means Committee Chairman Richard Neal, D-Mass., to turn over six years of Trump’s tax returns by the close of business — a strong signal that they intend to reject the request....

....White House has stonewalled the oversight panel in several different investigations. On Monday, Trump and his business organization sued Cummings to block a subpoena that seeks years of the president’s financial records. The complaint, filed in federal court in Washington, said a subpoena from Cummings “has no legitimate legislative purpose” and accused Democrats of harassing Trump.

Cummings said the White House “has refused to produce a single piece of paper or a single witness” in any of the panel’s investigations this year. Democrats took control of the House in January.

The back and forth over Kline’s testimony played out in a series of letters over the past month between the White House, the oversight committee and Kline’s lawyer. The White House demanded that one of its lawyers attend the deposition to ensure executive privilege was protected, but Cummings rejected that request. The White House then ordered Kline, who now works at the Pentagon, to defy the subpoena.....”
https://apnews.com/b1de0b62669c42e88939e0fdfa792092

The Trump admin is going to ignore, stonewall, delay, sue..Let the donks in Congress with their plethora of politically motivated investigations pound sand all the way through 2020

And let the next Democrat in the White House say FUCK YOU to Republicans in Congress.

mainejeff wrote:

BDKJMU wrote:“...former White House official defied a subpoena and the Treasury Department ignored a deadline for providing President Donald Trump’s tax returns...

....Carl Kline, a former White House personnel security director, who was subpoenaed by Democrats.

Kline did not show up Tuesday for a scheduled deposition,...

....Meanwhile, the administration on Tuesday defied a demand from Ways and Means Committee Chairman Richard Neal, D-Mass., to turn over six years of Trump’s tax returns by the close of business — a strong signal that they intend to reject the request....

....White House has stonewalled the oversight panel in several different investigations. On Monday, Trump and his business organization sued Cummings to block a subpoena that seeks years of the president’s financial records. The complaint, filed in federal court in Washington, said a subpoena from Cummings “has no legitimate legislative purpose” and accused Democrats of harassing Trump.

Cummings said the White House “has refused to produce a single piece of paper or a single witness” in any of the panel’s investigations this year. Democrats took control of the House in January.

The back and forth over Kline’s testimony played out in a series of letters over the past month between the White House, the oversight committee and Kline’s lawyer. The White House demanded that one of its lawyers attend the deposition to ensure executive privilege was protected, but Cummings rejected that request. The White House then ordered Kline, who now works at the Pentagon, to defy the subpoena.....”
https://apnews.com/b1de0b62669c42e88939e0fdfa792092

The Trump admin is going to ignore, stonewall, delay, sue..Let the donks in Congress with their plethora of politically motivated investigations pound sand all the way through 2020

And let the next Democrat in the White House say **** YOU to Republicans in Congress.

That already happened with Clinton, and Obomba..What goes around, comes around.

BDKJMU wrote:

mainejeff wrote:
And let the next Democrat in the White House say **** YOU to Republicans in Congress.

That already happened with Clinton, and Obomba..What goes around, comes around.

And it's coming around again.

BDKJMU wrote:“...former White House official defied a subpoena and the Treasury Department ignored a deadline for providing President Donald Trump’s tax returns...

....Carl Kline, a former White House personnel security director, who was subpoenaed by Democrats.

Kline did not show up Tuesday for a scheduled deposition,...

....Meanwhile, the administration on Tuesday defied a demand from Ways and Means Committee Chairman Richard Neal, D-Mass., to turn over six years of Trump’s tax returns by the close of business — a strong signal that they intend to reject the request....

....White House has stonewalled the oversight panel in several different investigations. On Monday, Trump and his business organization sued Cummings to block a subpoena that seeks years of the president’s financial records. The complaint, filed in federal court in Washington, said a subpoena from Cummings “has no legitimate legislative purpose” and accused Democrats of harassing Trump.

Cummings said the White House “has refused to produce a single piece of paper or a single witness” in any of the panel’s investigations this year. Democrats took control of the House in January.

The back and forth over Kline’s testimony played out in a series of letters over the past month between the White House, the oversight committee and Kline’s lawyer. The White House demanded that one of its lawyers attend the deposition to ensure executive privilege was protected, but Cummings rejected that request. The White House then ordered Kline, who now works at the Pentagon, to defy the subpoena.....”
https://apnews.com/b1de0b62669c42e88939e0fdfa792092

The Trump admin is going to ignore, stonewall, delay, sue..Let the donks in Congress with their plethora of politically motivated investigations pound sand all the way through 2020

that's a dangerous precedent. Once the tables are turned you're going to be on here bitching and moaning.

Ibanez wrote:

BDKJMU wrote:“...former White House official defied a subpoena and the Treasury Department ignored a deadline for providing President Donald Trump’s tax returns...

....Carl Kline, a former White House personnel security director, who was subpoenaed by Democrats.

Kline did not show up Tuesday for a scheduled deposition,...

....Meanwhile, the administration on Tuesday defied a demand from Ways and Means Committee Chairman Richard Neal, D-Mass., to turn over six years of Trump’s tax returns by the close of business — a strong signal that they intend to reject the request....

....White House has stonewalled the oversight panel in several different investigations. On Monday, Trump and his business organization sued Cummings to block a subpoena that seeks years of the president’s financial records. The complaint, filed in federal court in Washington, said a subpoena from Cummings “has no legitimate legislative purpose” and accused Democrats of harassing Trump.

Cummings said the White House “has refused to produce a single piece of paper or a single witness” in any of the panel’s investigations this year. Democrats took control of the House in January.

The back and forth over Kline’s testimony played out in a series of letters over the past month between the White House, the oversight committee and Kline’s lawyer. The White House demanded that one of its lawyers attend the deposition to ensure executive privilege was protected, but Cummings rejected that request. The White House then ordered Kline, who now works at the Pentagon, to defy the subpoena.....”
https://apnews.com/b1de0b62669c42e88939e0fdfa792092

The Trump admin is going to ignore, stonewall, delay, sue..Let the donks in Congress with their plethora of politically motivated investigations pound sand all the way through 2020

that's a dangerous precedent. Once the tables are turned you're going to be on here bitching and moaning.

You mean like when the IRS stonewalled Congress over the conservative targeting scandal?

That wasn’t that long ago


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ibanez wrote:

BDKJMU wrote:“...former White House official defied a subpoena and the Treasury Department ignored a deadline for providing President Donald Trump’s tax returns...

....Carl Kline, a former White House personnel security director, who was subpoenaed by Democrats.

Kline did not show up Tuesday for a scheduled deposition,...

....Meanwhile, the administration on Tuesday defied a demand from Ways and Means Committee Chairman Richard Neal, D-Mass., to turn over six years of Trump’s tax returns by the close of business — a strong signal that they intend to reject the request....

....White House has stonewalled the oversight panel in several different investigations. On Monday, Trump and his business organization sued Cummings to block a subpoena that seeks years of the president’s financial records. The complaint, filed in federal court in Washington, said a subpoena from Cummings “has no legitimate legislative purpose” and accused Democrats of harassing Trump.

Cummings said the White House “has refused to produce a single piece of paper or a single witness” in any of the panel’s investigations this year. Democrats took control of the House in January.

The back and forth over Kline’s testimony played out in a series of letters over the past month between the White House, the oversight committee and Kline’s lawyer. The White House demanded that one of its lawyers attend the deposition to ensure executive privilege was protected, but Cummings rejected that request. The White House then ordered Kline, who now works at the Pentagon, to defy the subpoena.....”
https://apnews.com/b1de0b62669c42e88939e0fdfa792092

The Trump admin is going to ignore, stonewall, delay, sue..Let the donks in Congress with their plethora of politically motivated investigations pound sand all the way through 2020

that's a dangerous precedent. Once the tables are turned you're going to be on here bitching and moaning.

The precedent was already set by Clinton and Obama. Obstruct, stonewall, deny, delay..Now is after the tables have already turned.

The donks want to rehash what has already been covered in Mueller’s 2 year investigation.

CID1990 wrote:

Ibanez wrote:
that's a dangerous precedent. Once the tables are turned you're going to be on here bitching and moaning.

You mean like when the IRS stonewalled Congress over the conservative targeting scandal?

That wasn’t that long ago


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes. Or when the Democrats used the nuclear option.

BDKJMU wrote:

Ibanez wrote:
that's a dangerous precedent. Once the tables are turned you're going to be on here bitching and moaning.

The precedent was already set by Clinton and Obama. Obstruct, stonewall, deny, delay..Now is after the tables have already turned.

The donks want to rehash what has already been covered in Mueller’s 2 year investigation.

And then it'll happen again and again. And you all will bitch about it.


Or, our "leaders" can step up and not pull this sort of crap. This tit for tat crap. But that means we need to elect leaders and actually hold them accountable.

Ibanez wrote:

BDKJMU wrote: The precedent was already set by Clinton and Obama. Obstruct, stonewall, deny, delay..Now is after the tables have already turned.

The donks want to rehash what has already been covered in Mueller’s 2 year investigation.

And then it'll happen again and again. And you all will bitch about it.


Or, our "leaders" can step up and not pull this sort of crap. This tit for tat crap. But that means we need to elect leaders and actually hold them accountable.

Well, if you were in power and the opposition party in the House was launching numerous obviously politically motivated investigations, including on issues that had already been throughly investigated in exhaustive detail the previous 2 years by a special counsel, would you just sit there and cave, or fight it though denial, stonewall and delay?

BDKJMU wrote:

Ibanez wrote: And then it'll happen again and again. And you all will bitch about it.


Or, our "leaders" can step up and not pull this sort of crap. This tit for tat crap. But that means we need to elect leaders and actually hold them accountable.

Well, if you were in power and the opposition party in the House was launching numerous obviously politically motivated investigations, including on issues that had already been throughly investigated in exhaustive detail the previous 2 years by a special counsel, would you just sit there and cave, or fight it though denial, stonewall and delay?

I wouldn't make it look like i've got something to hide. And when the report says I didn't commit treason, I'd welcome it and let that be that. I wouldn't act like a child or a bitch for most of my presidency.

Then again, I can laugh at myself and i'm not a arrogant, egotistical cunt like Trump. I can take criticism as long as it's constructive.


And unlike him, I don't think Russian interference de-legitimizes his win in 2016.

BDKJMU wrote:“...former White House official defied a subpoena and the Treasury Department ignored a deadline for providing President Donald Trump’s tax returns...

....Carl Kline, a former White House personnel security director, who was subpoenaed by Democrats.

Kline did not show up Tuesday for a scheduled deposition,...

....Meanwhile, the administration on Tuesday defied a demand from Ways and Means Committee Chairman Richard Neal, D-Mass., to turn over six years of Trump’s tax returns by the close of business — a strong signal that they intend to reject the request....

....White House has stonewalled the oversight panel in several different investigations. On Monday, Trump and his business organization sued Cummings to block a subpoena that seeks years of the president’s financial records. The complaint, filed in federal court in Washington, said a subpoena from Cummings “has no legitimate legislative purpose” and accused Democrats of harassing Trump.

Cummings said the White House “has refused to produce a single piece of paper or a single witness” in any of the panel’s investigations this year. Democrats took control of the House in January.

The back and forth over Kline’s testimony played out in a series of letters over the past month between the White House, the oversight committee and Kline’s lawyer. The White House demanded that one of its lawyers attend the deposition to ensure executive privilege was protected, but Cummings rejected that request. The White House then ordered Kline, who now works at the Pentagon, to defy the subpoena.....”
https://apnews.com/b1de0b62669c42e88939e0fdfa792092

The Trump admin is going to ignore, stonewall, delay, sue..Let the donks in Congress with their plethora of politically motivated investigations pound sand all the way through 2020

And that is the way these lib fishing expeditions should be handled.


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