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FYI: Whatever your take on the travel ban, it's not over yet. The 9th Circuit apparently has an 80% reversal rate on cases taken to the Supreme Court, the second-highest in the nation. If their decisions are THAT bad across the spectrum, there's something goofy going on there....

From what I heard, if it goes to the Supreme court and there is a 4-4 split, the decision of the 9th Circuit prevails. Trump will probably wait until his appointment is confirmed before taking that action.

YAY!!!!

Gil Dobie wrote:From what I heard, if it goes to the Supreme court and there is a 4-4 split, the decision of the 9th Circuit prevails. Trump will probably wait until his appointment is confirmed before taking that action.

But, by then the order will probably have expired. So, with apologies to HRC, at that point, what difference does it make?

I think what's more likely... is that they redo the order and release it in a non-haphazard way... allowing Justice Department / Dept of Homeland Security / State Department, etc. to give some input and advice.

The biggest problem with the executive order was how it was handled and the chaos and confusion it caused.

Skjellyfetti wrote:

Gil Dobie wrote:From what I heard, if it goes to the Supreme court and there is a 4-4 split, the decision of the 9th Circuit prevails. Trump will probably wait until his appointment is confirmed before taking that action.

But, by then the order will probably have expired. So, with apologies to HRC, at that point, what difference does it make?

I think what's more likely... is that they redo the order and release it in a non-haphazard way... allowing Justice Department / Dept of Homeland Security / State Department, etc. to give some input and advice.

The biggest problem with the executive order was how it was handled and the chaos and confusion it caused.

SuperHornet wrote:FYI: Whatever your take on the travel ban, it's not over yet. The 9th Circuit apparently has an 80% reversal rate on cases taken to the Supreme Court, the second-highest in the nation. If their decisions are THAT bad across the spectrum, there's something goofy going on there....

Maybe because they're liberal activists?

Nah, that couldn't be it.

Rob Iola wrote:

Best thing on SNL in a loooooong time...

SuperHornet wrote:FYI: Whatever your take on the travel ban, it's not over yet. The 9th Circuit apparently has an 80% reversal rate on cases taken to the Supreme Court, the second-highest in the nation. If their decisions are THAT bad across the spectrum, there's something goofy going on there....

Fact Check... ^
Firstly the Supreme Court overturns 70% of all lower courts rulings
Secondly - Nope

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/st ... -country-/

6th Circuit - 87 percent;

11th Circuit - 85 percent;

9th Circuit - 79 percent;

3rd Circuit - 78 percent;

So, the 9th Circuit is barely above the Mendoza Line.

That's pathetic. I guess that's why they're still in the minors.

Grizalltheway wrote:

Rob Iola wrote:

Best thing on SNL in a loooooong time...

I can't stand Rosie O'Donnell, but she'd be awesome as Bannon...

93henfan wrote:So, the 9th Circuit is barely above the Mendoza Line.

That's pathetic. I guess that's why they're still in the minors.

So basically it's fake news...

Chizzang wrote:

SuperHornet wrote:FYI: Whatever your take on the travel ban, it's not over yet. The 9th Circuit apparently has an 80% reversal rate on cases taken to the Supreme Court, the second-highest in the nation. If their decisions are THAT bad across the spectrum, there's something goofy going on there....

Fact Check... ^
Firstly the Supreme Court overturns 70% of all lower courts rulings
Secondly - Nope

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/st ... -country-/

6th Circuit - 87 percent;

11th Circuit - 85 percent;

9th Circuit - 79 percent;

3rd Circuit - 78 percent;

Politifact is just lazy.

While the 9th Circuit has a higher than average reversal rate among cases it sends to the Supreme Court, it has not had the highest rate since at least 2004 (the oldest data point we could find).

The American Bar Association has data points all the way back to at least 1999. From 1999 through 2008, the SCOTUS heard 175 cases from the 9th Circus. Of those 175 cases, 140 were either reversed or vacated...80%.
1st Circuit was 55%
2nd Circuit was 72%
3rd Circuit was 68%
4th Circuit was 61%
5th Circuit was 73%
6th Circuit was 73%
7th CIrcuit was 55%
8th Circuit was 68%
9th Circuit was 80%
10th Circuit was 75%
11th Circuit was 60%
DC Circuit was 65%

Politifact

http://www.americanbar.org/content/dam/ ... eckdam.pdf

Alrighty then, there you have it. 9th Circuit = liberal activists.

93henfan wrote:Alrighty then, there you have it. 9th Circuit = liberal activists.

What about the 10th?

Poorly written, poorly executed, poorly defended. The justice dept attorneys didn't put any effort into defending it. Remember the Obama holdover Atty Gen instructed the dept not to defend it before Trump fired her, and Sessions wasn't confirmed yet. There was no justice dept leadership in place yet who was behind the ban.

Judge Robart: “How many arrests have there been of foreign nationals for those seven countries since 9/11?”
Justice dept attorney: “Your Honor, I don’t have that information,”
Robart: “Let me tell you,The answer to that is none, as best I can tell. So, I mean, you’re here arguing on behalf of someone [President Trump] that says: We have to protect the United States from these individuals coming from these countries, and there’s no support for that.”

Well, Judge Robart was lying when he said there hadn't been any arrests of foreign nationals since 9/11, and the justice dept attorney made no effort to point this out.
"Last year the Senate Judiciary Subcommittee on Immigration and the National Interest released information showing that at least 60 people born in the seven countries had been convicted — not just arrested, but convicted — of terror-related offenses in the United States since Sept. 11, 2001. And that number did not include more recent cases like Abdul Artan, a Somali refugee who wounded 11 people during a machete attack on the campus of Ohio State University last November.
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/byron ... le/2614298#!

This same charade was repeated in the 9th circuit before the 3 judges..

Vidav wrote:

93henfan wrote:Alrighty then, there you have it. 9th Circuit = liberal activists.

What about the 10th?

They appear to be liberal enthusiasts. I don't think they have enough street cred to be activists yet. If they can get one honky to flash his lights at a four way stop and then one jumps out and busts a cap in his ass, then I am prepared to crown them activists.

Any more questions you want to axe me?

Baldy wrote:

Chizzang wrote:
Fact Check... ^
Firstly the Supreme Court overturns 70% of all lower courts rulings
Secondly - Nope

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/st ... -country-/

6th Circuit - 87 percent;

11th Circuit - 85 percent;

9th Circuit - 79 percent;

3rd Circuit - 78 percent;

Politifact is just lazy.

While the 9th Circuit has a higher than average reversal rate among cases it sends to the Supreme Court, it has not had the highest rate since at least 2004 (the oldest data point we could find).

The American Bar Association has data points all the way back to at least 1999. From 1999 through 2008, the SCOTUS heard 175 cases from the 9th Circus. Of those 175 cases, 140 were either reversed or vacated...80%.
1st Circuit was 55%
2nd Circuit was 72%
3rd Circuit was 68%
4th Circuit was 61%
5th Circuit was 73%
6th Circuit was 73%
7th CIrcuit was 55%
8th Circuit was 68%
9th Circuit was 80%
10th Circuit was 75%
11th Circuit was 60%
DC Circuit was 65%

Politifact

http://www.americanbar.org/content/dam/ ... eckdam.pdf

Your link includes older data than politifact.

Politifact includes newer data than yours.

Yours is only goes to 2008.

Which is more relevant to the discussion?

Data from 1999 - 2008

or

Data from 2004 - present

?

93henfan wrote:

Vidav wrote:
What about the 10th?

They appear to be liberal enthusiasts. I don't think they have enough street cred to be activists yet. If they can get one honky to flash his lights at a four way stop and then one jumps out and busts a cap in his ass, then I am prepared to crown them activists.

Any more questions you want to axe me?

Nah, I good.

Skjellyfetti wrote:

Baldy wrote: Politifact is just lazy.



The American Bar Association has data points all the way back to at least 1999. From 1999 through 2008, the SCOTUS heard 175 cases from the 9th Circus. Of those 175 cases, 140 were either reversed or vacated...80%.
1st Circuit was 55%
2nd Circuit was 72%
3rd Circuit was 68%
4th Circuit was 61%
5th Circuit was 73%
6th Circuit was 73%
7th CIrcuit was 55%
8th Circuit was 68%
9th Circuit was 80%
10th Circuit was 75%
11th Circuit was 60%
DC Circuit was 65%

Politifact

http://www.americanbar.org/content/dam/ ... eckdam.pdf

Your link includes older data than politifact.

Politifact includes newer data than yours.

Yours is only goes to 2008.

Which is more relevant to the discussion?

Data from 1999 - 2008

or

Data from 2004 - present

?

U don't not read 2 gud...

Politifact said (that quote thingy) they wanted the information and looked but couldn't find anything prior to 2004. A lie. They are lazy.

The problem with that statement is the data prior to 2004 doesn't support their bias.

It is all relevant to the discussion because only 7 of the 29 justices on that court were appointed after 2008.

Keep

trying...

BDKJMU wrote:Poorly written, poorly executed, poorly defended. The justice dept attorneys didn't put any effort into defending it. Remember the Obama holdover Atty Gen instructed the dept not to defend it before Trump fired her, and Sessions wasn't confirmed yet. There was no justice dept leadership in place yet who was behind the ban.

Judge Robart: “How many arrests have there been of foreign nationals for those seven countries since 9/11?”
Justice dept attorney: “Your Honor, I don’t have that information,”
Robart: “Let me tell you,The answer to that is none, as best I can tell. So, I mean, you’re here arguing on behalf of someone [President Trump] that says: We have to protect the United States from these individuals coming from these countries, and there’s no support for that.”

Well, Judge Robart was lying when he said there hadn't been any arrests of foreign nationals since 9/11, and the justice dept attorney made no effort to point this out.
"Last year the Senate Judiciary Subcommittee on Immigration and the National Interest released information showing that at least 60 people born in the seven countries had been convicted — not just arrested, but convicted — of terror-related offenses in the United States since Sept. 11, 2001. And that number did not include more recent cases like Abdul Artan, a Somali refugee who wounded 11 people during a machete attack on the campus of Ohio State University last November.
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/byron ... le/2614298#!

This same charade was repeated in the 9th circuit before the 3 judges..

so whose fault is that?



We don't need both you and JSO here.

Vidav wrote:

93henfan wrote:Alrighty then, there you have it. 9th Circuit = liberal activists.

What about the 10th?

damn fly over states

Btw, 4th Circuit, FTW

The Fourth is the most efficient circuit, taking an average of just over seven months to resolve each appeal. From 2000 to 2008, the Court had the highest rate of non-publication (92%) on the Federal Circuit.[5]

The Chief Justice is always assigned to the Fourth Circuit as the circuit advisory justice, due to Richmond's close proximity to Washington, D.C.

The Fourth Circuit is considered an extremely collegial court. By tradition, the Judges of the Fourth Circuit come down from the bench following each oral argument to greet the lawyers.[6]

Chizzang wrote:

SuperHornet wrote:FYI: Whatever your take on the travel ban, it's not over yet. The 9th Circuit apparently has an 80% reversal rate on cases taken to the Supreme Court, the second-highest in the nation. If their decisions are THAT bad across the spectrum, there's something goofy going on there....

Fact Check... ^
Firstly the Supreme Court overturns 70% of all lower courts rulings
Secondly - Nope

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/st ... -country-/

6th Circuit - 87 percent;

11th Circuit - 85 percent;

9th Circuit - 79 percent;

3rd Circuit - 78 percent;

1%. We're talking about a 1% difference between the American Bar and the Politifact article. 5% difference in total. Does it really matter?

Ibanez wrote:

Chizzang wrote:
Fact Check... ^
Firstly the Supreme Court overturns 70% of all lower courts rulings
Secondly - Nope

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/st ... -country-/

6th Circuit - 87 percent;

11th Circuit - 85 percent;

9th Circuit - 79 percent;

3rd Circuit - 78 percent;

1%. We're talking about a 1% difference between the American Bar and the Politifact article. 5% difference in total. Does it really matter?

Gawdammit...the polls were wrong, and the damn rent is too high!

It doesn't matter
Trump lost and is re-writing the travel ban