Stupid Things Ocasio-Cortez Says: Megathread

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby Skjellyfetti » Wed Aug 15, 2018 1:50 pm

Doesn't have to be 4-year bachelor's programs.

Tennessee, smack dab in the heart of MAGA country, made community college free. Definitely a step in the right direction. And, led by conservative Republicans. :thumb:
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Cid1990 wrote:It is going to be a sad day for a lot of people when all that comes of all of this is Flynn getting whacked.

Mueller is going to take a beating on the left before this business is over

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby ∞∞∞ » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:01 pm

Trade schools too. Hell pay people to go to those.

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby CAA Flagship » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:18 pm

∞∞∞ wrote:Trade schools too. Hell pay people to go to those.

Well at least you hit on something we need more of. It certainly isn't more Associates degrees. But why not let the related companies and unions pay for it. Why do I have to pay for it and then pay for it when my HVAC system breaks down or water valve springs a leak?

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby Ibanez » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:26 pm

CAA Flagship wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote:Wanting universal healthcare, better pay, and free education...


78% of my property taxes go to schools. And that only covers through 12th grade. The tax cost for the next 4 years will likely be at least 50% of the tax cost of the first 12 years (so $4k per year will jump to $6k per year - forever). People with 4 and 5 kids are benefiting. People with no kids are getting killed. How much more suffering do you want people with no kids to have to endure? Is that really fair?

One could argue that if we all benefit from an educated population. Better than the alternative.


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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby GannonFan » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:26 pm

Skjellyfetti wrote:Doesn't have to be 4-year bachelor's programs.

Tennessee, smack dab in the heart of MAGA country, made community college free. Definitely a step in the right direction. And, led by conservative Republicans. :thumb:


For what purpose, though? What does two more years in a community college get you? It's not a terrible thing, but again, if you don't really need college, is an associates degree really worth it? Why is 14 years of school so much better than 12, and is it worth the price tag? 4 year colleges aren't dumb, if you're going to transfer from a community college to one to finish the degree, either the credits won't transfer and you need to spend more than 2 years there, or the cost will be increased accordingly to not lose that money. In the end, what have we gained?
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby kalm » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:42 pm

GannonFan wrote:
Skjellyfetti wrote:Doesn't have to be 4-year bachelor's programs.

Tennessee, smack dab in the heart of MAGA country, made community college free. Definitely a step in the right direction. And, led by conservative Republicans. :thumb:


For what purpose, though? What does two more years in a community college get you? It's not a terrible thing, but again, if you don't really need college, is an associates degree really worth it? Why is 14 years of school so much better than 12, and is it worth the price tag? 4 year colleges aren't dumb, if you're going to transfer from a community college to one to finish the degree, either the credits won't transfer and you need to spend more than 2 years there, or the cost will be increased accordingly to not lose that money. In the end, what have we gained?


Unless CC’s have changed since I attended there are all sorts of 2 year - vocationally oriented degrees from book keeping to turf grass management to automotive repair.
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby ALPHAGRIZ1 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:31 pm

Ibanez wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:
78% of my property taxes go to schools. And that only covers through 12th grade. The tax cost for the next 4 years will likely be at least 50% of the tax cost of the first 12 years (so $4k per year will jump to $6k per year - forever). People with 4 and 5 kids are benefiting. People with no kids are getting killed. How much more suffering do you want people with no kids to have to endure? Is that really fair?

One could argue that if we all benefit from an educated population. Better than the alternative.


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Bullshit

If you want to go to school you pay for it. Im not going to. You earn things you dont get them for free, if that shit starts being the norm I know how I am going to go out.
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby CAA Flagship » Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:33 pm

Ibanez wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:
78% of my property taxes go to schools. And that only covers through 12th grade. The tax cost for the next 4 years will likely be at least 50% of the tax cost of the first 12 years (so $4k per year will jump to $6k per year - forever). People with 4 and 5 kids are benefiting. People with no kids are getting killed. How much more suffering do you want people with no kids to have to endure? Is that really fair?

One could argue that if we all benefit from an educated population. Better than the alternative.


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And I'm one of them. But the workforce does not warrant it. I'm fine with ending at 12th grade. I went to a public high school. There were plenty of people that had no business going to college. Hell, I guess they won't be accepted anyway, but then again, who knows?

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby JohnStOnge » Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:57 pm

Ibanez wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:

One could argue that if we all benefit from an educated population.


But that would mean Trump wouldn't be President. Ok. Of course I think that would be consistent with what you said. But understand that a more educated population would probably mean somebody like Trump would never be President.
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby Skjellyfetti » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:27 pm

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
For what purpose, though? What does two more years in a community college get you? It's not a terrible thing, but again, if you don't really need college, is an associates degree really worth it? Why is 14 years of school so much better than 12, and is it worth the price tag? 4 year colleges aren't dumb, if you're going to transfer from a community college to one to finish the degree, either the credits won't transfer and you need to spend more than 2 years there, or the cost will be increased accordingly to not lose that money. In the end, what have we gained?


Unless CC’s have changed since I attended there are all sorts of 2 year - vocationally oriented degrees from book keeping to turf grass management to automotive repair.


Exactly. Community colleges have a wide range of vocational programs. If anything, I bet they've expanded their programs since you attended. :nod:
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Cid1990 wrote:It is going to be a sad day for a lot of people when all that comes of all of this is Flynn getting whacked.

Mueller is going to take a beating on the left before this business is over

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby kalm » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:36 pm

ALPHAGRIZ1 wrote:
Ibanez wrote:One could argue that if we all benefit from an educated population. Better than the alternative.


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Bullshit

If you want to go to school you pay for it. Im not going to. You earn things you dont get them for free, if that shit starts being the norm I know how I am going to go out.


Me being from the great state of Washington, and you from Montana, I’ve pretty much subsidized your education.

Look what good it’s done.... :ohno:
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby GannonFan » Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:06 am

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
For what purpose, though? What does two more years in a community college get you? It's not a terrible thing, but again, if you don't really need college, is an associates degree really worth it? Why is 14 years of school so much better than 12, and is it worth the price tag? 4 year colleges aren't dumb, if you're going to transfer from a community college to one to finish the degree, either the credits won't transfer and you need to spend more than 2 years there, or the cost will be increased accordingly to not lose that money. In the end, what have we gained?


Unless CC’s have changed since I attended there are all sorts of 2 year - vocationally oriented degrees from book keeping to turf grass management to automotive repair.


I'm good with that, then. I wasn't up to speed on what you can get in the two year degree from the community college. I like the idea and I would support making that free. I still think it should be a local thing, just like K-12 schooling is. But I'd vote for it in my community.
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:31 am

Skjellyfetti wrote:Doesn't have to be 4-year bachelor's programs.

Tennessee, smack dab in the heart of MAGA country, made community college free. Definitely a step in the right direction. And, led by conservative Republicans. :thumb:

I don't think that is the entire story for Tennessee. You have to be an independent student (min. 24 years old), and they pay only the part not covered by scholarships, grants, and aids.

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby 93henfan » Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:42 am

I’m all for free four year college, as long as they can get it in place by September 2023.

And then it needs to run at least seven years.

And then I hope it is determined to be a drain on society and goes away.

So there it is: I support free college education from September 2023 through May 2030. My 8th and 5th graders support this as well.
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby Ibanez » Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:51 am

93henfan wrote:I’m all for free four year college, as long as they can get it in place by September 2023.

And then it needs to run at least seven years.

And then I hope it is determined to be a drain on society and goes away.

So there it is: I support free college education from September 2023 through May 2030. My 8th and 5th graders support this as well.

Something tells me you're biased.... :suspicious:
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby 93henfan » Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:05 am

Ibanez wrote:
93henfan wrote:I’m all for free four year college, as long as they can get it in place by September 2023.

And then it needs to run at least seven years.

And then I hope it is determined to be a drain on society and goes away.

So there it is: I support free college education from September 2023 through May 2030. My 8th and 5th graders support this as well.

Something tells me you're biased.... :suspicious:


Wuuuut?

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Re: RE: Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby ALPHAGRIZ1 » Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:20 am

kalm wrote:
ALPHAGRIZ1 wrote:

Bullshit

If you want to go to school you pay for it. Im not going to. You earn things you dont get them for free, if that shit starts being the norm I know how I am going to go out.


Me being from the great state of Washington, and you from Montana, I’ve pretty much subsidized your education.

Look what good it’s done.... :ohno:
Mine was all paid for by me.

I agree with your outcome though

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby Skjellyfetti » Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:24 am

CAA Flagship wrote:
Skjellyfetti wrote:Doesn't have to be 4-year bachelor's programs.

Tennessee, smack dab in the heart of MAGA country, made community college free. Definitely a step in the right direction. And, led by conservative Republicans. :thumb:

I don't think that is the entire story for Tennessee. You have to be an independent student (min. 24 years old), and they pay only the part not covered by scholarships, grants, and aids.


They recently expanded it to include adults - who have to be considered FAFSA independent. I believe that's what you're referencing

The original from 2014 was for recent high school graduates only.
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Mueller is going to take a beating on the left before this business is over

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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby 89Hen » Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:47 am

Free college is perhaps the biggest waste of money I've ever heard. I read an article a long time ago that about 25% of people work in the field in which they study. So 75% basically went to school to have fun and develop their social skills. Now, if you want to make trade schools free... :thumb:
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby JohnStOnge » Thu Aug 16, 2018 3:35 pm

89Hen wrote:Free college is perhaps the biggest waste of money I've ever heard. I read an article a long time ago that about 25% of people work in the field in which they study. So 75% basically went to school to have fun and develop their social skills. Now, if you want to make trade schools free... :thumb:


I'm not sure but I think that may be a little bit misleading. Like for instance I majored in biology. And I have noted that there are an awful lot of jobs that require something like "30 hours in biology" but the aren't biologists jobs.

I actually had someone talk to me about that recently. They were talking about how somebody's son got an engineering degree and he couldn't qualify for a State job as a Sanitarian because he didn't have enough biology hours.
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby CID1990 » Thu Aug 16, 2018 3:39 pm

CAA Flagship wrote:
Skjellyfetti wrote:Doesn't have to be 4-year bachelor's programs.

Tennessee, smack dab in the heart of MAGA country, made community college free. Definitely a step in the right direction. And, led by conservative Republicans. :thumb:

I don't think that is the entire story for Tennessee. You have to be an independent student (min. 24 years old), and they pay only the part not covered by scholarships, grants, and aids.


There's always the "rest of the story" that has to be clarified with this ding dong when he posts


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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby BDKJMU » Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:38 pm

CID1990 wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:I don't think that is the entire story for Tennessee. You have to be an independent student (min. 24 years old), and they pay only the part not covered by scholarships, grants, and aids.


There's always the "rest of the story" that has to be clarified with this ding dong when he posts


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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby 89Hen » Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:24 am

JohnStOnge wrote:
89Hen wrote:Free college is perhaps the biggest waste of money I've ever heard. I read an article a long time ago that about 25% of people work in the field in which they study. So 75% basically went to school to have fun and develop their social skills. Now, if you want to make trade schools free... :thumb:


I'm not sure but I think that may be a little bit misleading. Like for instance I majored in biology. And I have noted that there are an awful lot of jobs that require something like "30 hours in biology" but the aren't biologists jobs.

So that would probably fall in the 25% category then.
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby Ibanez » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:04 am

NYU just made med school free for current and future students..after planning and saving for almost 10 years.
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Re: Ocasio-Cortez: The Upper-Middle Class Doesn't Exist Anymore in America

Postby UNI88 » Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:08 am

89Hen wrote:Free college is perhaps the biggest waste of money I've ever heard. I read an article a long time ago that about 25% of people work in the field in which they study. So 75% basically went to school to have fun and develop their social skills. Now, if you want to make trade schools free... :thumb:


That's a pretty broad brush you're painting with there 89 ...
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