∞∞∞ wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:45 am
I also agree if it was changed to this: The People pick the Legislature; the Legislature increases the size of the Judiciary. That is how it works.
SCOTUS keeps overturning the will of the People? Weaken it, because that's fundamental checks and balances. If the nation becomes more progressive with time (as is happening), it's asinine to think a conservative court should hold us back. The Executive and Legislative branches - as elected by the People - should knock down a Judicial branch not working for the People. In fact, it's their Constitutional duty.
The Constitution, while flawed, does have some beauty to it.
If the role of government is to enforce the "will of the People" and the "will of the People" is defined by what the majority wants then the last 200+ years of white people dominating culturally, economically, etc. was completely justified because that's what the majority of the people wanted.
Your ignorance and arrogance in believing that the will of the majority should always be followed is worse than any arrogance or nefarious purpose that you accuse the founders of.
You made a fundamental, although common, flaw in the argument.
"Will of the People" is not defined by what the majority wants. It is defined by what the majority want among equals.
But it isn't. It's EVOLVED to what it's become. It was OBVIOUSLY set up by the men of their times and it's been amended by the people of its time. The Peoples Representatives gave the power to the Executive. The Executive took power to make change. It has evolved.
Perfect, so there's no Constitutional issue if the Legislative Branch wants to weaken the Judicial branch and make it its b*tch. That's what we call a "check." The voters can then decide if it the representatives made the correct decision or not.
The Constitution is working exactly as intended.
Please point out where I have suggested that. I'm merely correcting your false impression that the founders set up the Executive to be more powerful. You have gripes with the current government and that's fine, but you're placing blame on a document that isn't being followed as written. It isn't Madison and Hamilton's fault.
∞∞∞ wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:45 am
I also agree if it was changed to this: The People pick the Legislature; the Legislature increases the size of the Judiciary. That is how it works.
SCOTUS keeps overturning the will of the People? Weaken it, because that's fundamental checks and balances. If the nation becomes more progressive with time (as is happening), it's asinine to think a conservative court should hold us back. The Executive and Legislative branches - as elected by the People - should knock down a Judicial branch not working for the People. In fact, it's their Constitutional duty.
The Constitution, while flawed, does have some beauty to it.
If the role of government is to enforce the "will of the People" and the "will of the People" is defined by what the majority wants then the last 200+ years of white people dominating culturally, economically, etc. was completely justified because that's what the majority of the people wanted.
Your ignorance and arrogance in believing that the will of the majority should always be followed is worse than any arrogance or nefarious purpose that you accuse the founders of.
If the role of government is to enforce the "will of the People" and the "will of the People" is defined by what the majority wants then the last 200+ years of white people dominating culturally, economically, etc. was completely justified because that's what the majority of the people wanted.
Your ignorance and arrogance in believing that the will of the majority should always be followed is worse than any arrogance or nefarious purpose that you accuse the founders of.
You made a fundamental, although common, flaw in the argument.
"Will of the People" is not defined by what the majority wants. It is defined by what the majority want among equals.
The will of the people is the majority vote as based upon their elected officials. The will of the people has given us Prohibition and women's suffrage.
Is your real complaint about the lack of power the minority has?
UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:14 am
If the role of government is to enforce the "will of the People" and the "will of the People" is defined by what the majority wants then the last 200+ years of white people dominating culturally, economically, etc. was completely justified because that's what the majority of the people wanted.
Your ignorance and arrogance in believing that the will of the majority should always be followed is worse than any arrogance or nefarious purpose that you accuse the founders of.
You made a fundamental, although common, flaw in the argument.
"Will of the People" is not defined by what the majority wants. It is defined by what the majority want among equals.
I would not be an "equal" in the ideal progressive future, so your argument has the same fundamental flaw.
The history of the US has been far from perfect but there has been a lot of positives and the pendulum is moving in the right direction. You and others want to swing that pendulum past equilibrium and make up for all of the real and perceived oppressions of the past. The problem with that is that at some point, those who will be aggrieved in your future will regain power and push the pendulum back.Why can't we be adults, stop the tit-for-tat and try to give everyone equal opportunities?
You made a fundamental, although common, flaw in the argument.
"Will of the People" is not defined by what the majority wants. It is defined by what the majority want among equals.
I would not be an "equal" in the ideal progressive future, so your argument has the same fundamental flaw.
The history of the US has been far from perfect but there has been a lot of positives and the pendulum is moving in the right direction. You and others want to swing that pendulum past equilibrium and make up for all of the real and perceived oppressions of the past. The problem with that is that at some point, those who will be aggrieved in your future will regain power and push the pendulum back.Why can't we be adults, stop the tit-for-tat and try to give everyone equal opportunities?
Because the minority wants their turn at being the majority and committing all the sins that they observe being committed by the majority. IT'S THEIR TURN!
Baldy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:19 am
To paraphrase John Adams, the United States is a nation of laws, not men. The role of the judiciary isn't to work for the people. It's job is to apply the law, period. It is insulated and cannot be subject to sudden whims of "the people".
I see why you hate the Constitution so much. You don't understand it.
The entire government works for the People, including the Judicial branch. Additionally, the system works on each branch interpreting the Constitution how it wants, and battling the interpretations of the other branches. The SCOTUS doesn't have to strictly apply law.
Ultimately, any constitution is a philosophical agreement on how to run society: they can be interpreted differently, misunderstood, disagreed with, broken, consequences handed, rewards given. We're in a period where there's lots of disagreements on it, but we'll coalesce around one eventually...until we start disagreeing again.
I thought GF may have went a little too far in his reply to you earlier, but he probably didn't go far enough.
It seems that so many people in your life have failed you in so many ways.
Re: RBG has Cancer...Again
Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:16 pm
by Ibanez
89Hen wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 11:53 am
For Raul...
I can't watch videos on this machine.
My position has been clear - The POTUS has an duty to nominate a candidate and the Senate has a duty to confirm/deny...regardless of the political parties involved.
Don't mistake me pointing out the hypocrisy of the Republicans on this as anything other than that.
You made a fundamental, although common, flaw in the argument.
"Will of the People" is not defined by what the majority wants. It is defined by what the majority want among equals.
The will of the people is the majority vote as based upon their elected officials. The will of the people has given us Prohibition and women's suffrage.
Is your real complaint about the lack of power the minority has?
And the will of the people has given us a Republican president and a Republican senate.
CARRY ON!
Re: RBG has Cancer...Again
Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 2:05 pm
by dal4018
The NOTORIOUS RBG has skeletons in her closet when it came to the subject of racism she thought Colin Kaepernick and his protest of police shootings was STUPID AND DISRESPECTFUL.She also hung around with Antonio Scalia another redneck who wore a Black Robe like she used to.
Ibanez wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:55 am
The will of the people is the majority vote as based upon their elected officials. The will of the people has given us Prohibition and women's suffrage.
Is your real complaint about the lack of power the minority has?
And the will of the people has given us a Republican president and a Republican senate.
CARRY ON!
As I have said before: It's not the will of the people. It's an artifact of our system.
In the last Presidential election, 2.9 million more of "the people" voted for the Democrat than for the Republican.
In the 2016 Senate elections, 11.1 million more of "the people" voted for Democrats than voted for Republicans. In the 2018 Senate elections, 17.5 million more of "the people" voted for Democrats than voted for Republicans.
If you take the last three Senate elections combined in order to cover all of the seats, 24.8 million more people voted for Democrats than for Republicans.
So, no, Republicans controlling the Presidency and the Senate is not a "will of the people" thing. It's what our system resulted in and one can argue that it's good that things work that way. But it's not the will of the people.
And the will of the people has given us a Republican president and a Republican senate.
CARRY ON!
As I have said before: It's not the will of the people. It's an artifact of our system.
In the last Presidential election, 2.9 million more of "the people" voted for the Democrat than for the Republican.
In the 2016 Senate elections, 11.1 million more of "the people" voted for Democrats than voted for Republicans. In the 2018 Senate elections, 17.5 million more of "the people" voted for Democrats than voted for Republicans.
If you take the last three Senate elections combined in order to cover all of the seats, 24.8 million more people voted for Democrats than for Republicans.
So, no, Republicans controlling the Presidency and the Senate is not a "will of the people" thing. It's what our system resulted in and one can argue that it's good that things work that way. But it's not the will of the people.
Which doesn’t mean squat, because if you take the last 3 senate elections combined, the Republicans won 53 races, and the Democrats won 47. SCOREBOARD.
Its like when in football you outgained the other team but still lost. Scoreboard is what matters. Conks 53, Donks 47.
Or with a football team with a losing record at the end of the season who won a few blowouts, but lost a slew of closer games. At the end of the season they outscored their opponents over the course of the season, but that doesn’t mean squat because they finished 4-7 or 5-7.
Wyoming with under 600k on one end of the spectrum gets 2 senators, and CA with 40+ million on the other side gets 2 Senators. So as long as every state has 2 senators, the nationwode vote total over 3 Senate elections doesn’t mean squat.
89Hen wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 11:53 am
For Raul...
I can't watch videos on this machine.
My position has been clear - The POTUS has an duty to nominate a candidate and the Senate has a duty to confirm/deny...regardless of the political parties involved.
Don't mistake me pointing out the hypocrisy of the Republicans on this as anything other than that.
As I have said before: It's not the will of the people. It's an artifact of our system.
In the last Presidential election, 2.9 million more of "the people" voted for the Democrat than for the Republican.
In the 2016 Senate elections, 11.1 million more of "the people" voted for Democrats than voted for Republicans. In the 2018 Senate elections, 17.5 million more of "the people" voted for Democrats than voted for Republicans.
If you take the last three Senate elections combined in order to cover all of the seats, 24.8 million more people voted for Democrats than for Republicans.
So, no, Republicans controlling the Presidency and the Senate is not a "will of the people" thing. It's what our system resulted in and one can argue that it's good that things work that way. But it's not the will of the people.
Which doesn’t mean squat, because if you take the last 3 senate elections combined, the Republicans won 53 races, and the Democrats won 47. SCOREBOARD.
Its like when in football you outgained the other team but still lost. Scoreboard is what matters. Conks 53, Donks 47.
Or with a football team with a losing record at the end of the season who won a few blowouts, but lost a slew of closer games. At the end of the season they outscored their opponents over the course of the season, but that doesn’t mean squat because they finished 4-7 or 5-7.
Wyoming with under 600k on one end of the spectrum gets 2 senators, and CA with 40+ million on the other side gets 2 Senators. So as long as every state has 2 senators, the nationwode vote total over 3 Senate elections doesn’t mean squat.
JSO must be one of those "burn it all down" morons like Trip when things don't go their way.
Re: RBG has Cancer...Again
Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:31 pm
by SDHornet
Re: RBG has Cancer...Again
Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:35 pm
by SDHornet
And the religious smears begin...
Re: RBG has Cancer...Again
Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:39 am
by Ibanez
dal4018 wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 2:05 pm
The NOTORIOUS RBG has skeletons in her closet when it came to the subject of racism she thought Colin Kaepernick and his protest of police shootings was STUPID AND DISRESPECTFUL.She also hung around with Antonio Scalia another redneck who wore a Black Robe like she used to.
And the will of the people has given us a Republican president and a Republican senate.
CARRY ON!
As I have said before: It's not the will of the people. It's an artifact of our system.
In the last Presidential election, 2.9 million more of "the people" voted for the Democrat than for the Republican.
In the 2016 Senate elections, 11.1 million more of "the people" voted for Democrats than voted for Republicans. In the 2018 Senate elections, 17.5 million more of "the people" voted for Democrats than voted for Republicans.
If you take the last three Senate elections combined in order to cover all of the seats, 24.8 million more people voted for Democrats than for Republicans.
So, no, Republicans controlling the Presidency and the Senate is not a "will of the people" thing. It's what our system resulted in and one can argue that it's good that things work that way. But it's not the will of the people.
I'm not highly intelligent nor am I slack-jawed stupid but WTF are you talking about? As our system is designed, our current political breakdown in Congress and the WH IS the will of the people. You may not like it, but those are the facts. Quit falling back on the stats...they only get you so far before you have to realize the reality of a situation.
Re: RBG has Cancer...Again
Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:56 am
by 89Hen
SDHornet wrote: ↑Tue Sep 22, 2020 9:35 pm
And the religious smears begin...
