2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

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Re: RE: Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Winterborn »

UNI88 wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
Meh...
Trump is loved
even by the people that recognize he's a ridiculous twat as well as shockingly uninformed
he's still loved

even by the people that claim they didn't vote for him
like the 20 some odd conservatives on this website that all claim they voted for somebody else

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Trump 2020
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Winterborn »

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
Agreed. Making college tuition-free wouldn't result in a really more educated workforce, it would just result in a workforce with more college credits and possibly more college degrees. But forcing that to happen through free tuition in no way has any direct relation to innovation and productivity improvements. I could make every college football team in America an "FBS" school by forcing all of them to play in FBS, but the number of NFL-ready QB's year after year would remain the same no matter how fancy I called their colleges. Handing out degrees doesn't improve innovation.


I don’t recall anyone’s shitty/meaningless free tuition plan. :|

Like I replied, there needs to be vocational options as well and regulation of which degrees are eligible.
I have seen what happens when one is too prescriptive in the standards world. You get products that have features that are 10, 20, and 30 years out of date just so the box can get checked and it is salable in a particular market.

Education needs to be able to react much quicker than any government entity can to keep up with the changing trends in the business world, least you wind up with more kids with unusable degrees.
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Re: RE: Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Ivytalk »

Winterborn wrote:
UNI88 wrote:Trump is Andy Jackson reborn. Popular for his lack of couth and culture.

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And Old Hickory made the 20 dollar bill. :coffee:
But Old Hickory kicked some serious enemy ass in the military. Drumpf had bone spurs.
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Baldy »

:lol:

Always keep your receipts. :nod:

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
Agreed. Making college tuition-free wouldn't result in a really more educated workforce, it would just result in a workforce with more college credits and possibly more college degrees. But forcing that to happen through free tuition in no way has any direct relation to innovation and productivity improvements. I could make every college football team in America an "FBS" school by forcing all of them to play in FBS, but the number of NFL-ready QB's year after year would remain the same no matter how fancy I called their colleges. Handing out degrees doesn't improve innovation.


I don’t recall anyone’s shitty/meaningless free tuition plan. :|

Like I replied, there needs to be vocational options as well and regulation of which degrees are eligible.
Well, who was manning the keyboard under your username when you said this a few posts ago...
kalm wrote:I’d rather have free college than tax free defense spending. At least education investments can lead to innovation and productivity.


I'm assuming by "innovation and productivity" you were implying more vocational degrees. :rofl:
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by kalm »

GannonFan wrote:
kalm wrote:


I don’t recall anyone’s shitty/meaningless free tuition plan. :|

Like I replied, there needs to be vocational options as well and regulation of which degrees are eligible.
Well, who was manning the keyboard under your username when you said this a few posts ago...
kalm wrote:I’d rather have free college than tax free defense spending. At least education investments can lead to innovation and productivity.


I'm assuming by "innovation and productivity" you were implying more vocational degrees. :rofl:
I know how much you struggle with big picture concepts but yes, there’s more to it than just waving the magic everything is free wand.

If I told you that part of our post war growth/innovation/productivity was a result of sending an entire generation of vets to college for free you’d just respond...”but Europe and Japan were in shambles!”

:lol:

If you’d like I’ll produce a 129 page policy paper on the deets to satisfy your curiosity. :lol:
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by 93henfan »

Baldy wrote: :lol:

Always keep your receipts. :nod:

:rofl: :notworthy:
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by CID1990 »

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
Well, who was manning the keyboard under your username when you said this a few posts ago...



I'm assuming by "innovation and productivity" you were implying more vocational degrees. :rofl:
I know how much you struggle with big picture concepts but yes, there’s more to it than just waving the magic everything is free wand.

If I told you that part of our post war growth/innovation/productivity was a result of sending an entire generation of vets to college for free you’d just respond...”but Europe and Japan were in shambles!”

:lol:

If you’d like I’ll produce a 129 page policy paper on the deets to satisfy your curiosity. :lol:
1. We didn’t send them for college for “free”

2. That “free” college scheme is still available to anyone who wants it


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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by kalm »

CID1990 wrote:
kalm wrote:
I know how much you struggle with big picture concepts but yes, there’s more to it than just waving the magic everything is free wand.

If I told you that part of our post war growth/innovation/productivity was a result of sending an entire generation of vets to college for free you’d just respond...”but Europe and Japan were in shambles!”

:lol:

If you’d like I’ll produce a 129 page policy paper on the deets to satisfy your curiosity. :lol:
1. We didn’t send them for college for “free”

2. That “free” college scheme is still available to anyone who wants it


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1. Correct

2. Correct

How many would have gone to college back then or would go today without the GI bill...more or less?

So again, tuition you don't have to pay for :mrgreen: increases education levels and productivity. And yes there are valid concerns with how government handles it and abuses and lack of efficiency in the system. Still...
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
Well, who was manning the keyboard under your username when you said this a few posts ago...



I'm assuming by "innovation and productivity" you were implying more vocational degrees. :rofl:
I know how much you struggle with big picture concepts but yes, there’s more to it than just waving the magic everything is free wand.

If I told you that part of our post war growth/innovation/productivity was a result of sending an entire generation of vets to college for free you’d just respond...”but Europe and Japan were in shambles!”

:lol:

If you’d like I’ll produce a 129 page policy paper on the deets to satisfy your curiosity. :lol:
Yes, I would tell you that we were dealing with a less competitive world, but I would also challenge your assertion that US productivity increases came as a result of the post WWII GI bill. Productivity increases in the US didn't start to really take off until the 1990's and onward, which is well after the impact of the GI bill folks into the workforce. Heck, most of those folks were already retired or were retiring by the time the US saw its biggest increases in productivity. Furthermore, although the GI bill was great, the idea that "an entire generation" go to go to college for free is undermined by the fact that not that many actually did go to college. By 1950, 5 years after the war, only 7.3% of American males had a bachelor's degree (granted, up from 5.5% in 1940, but not really a huge increase). Growth has been pretty normal for the past 50 years in terms of folks getting their bachelor's degree in terms of year on year growth, so there's never been an isolated surge. The biggest innovations we've had have had almost nothing to do with free college.
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Re: RE: Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Winterborn »

Ivytalk wrote:
Winterborn wrote:
And Old Hickory made the 20 dollar bill. :coffee:
But Old Hickory kicked some serious enemy ass in the military. Drumpf had bone spurs.
Trump has a higher calling in fighting his "Twitter War". That should be enough to get him on a 3 dollar bill by some future generations. :coffee: :D
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by CID1990 »

kalm wrote:
CID1990 wrote:
1. We didn’t send them for college for “free”

2. That “free” college scheme is still available to anyone who wants it


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1. Correct

2. Correct

How many would have gone to college back then or would go today without the GI bill...more or less?

So again, tuition you don't have to pay for :mrgreen: increases education levels and productivity. And yes there are valid concerns with how government handles it and abuses and lack of efficiency in the system. Still...
All that twisting and smoke aside-

anyone who wants “free” college can have it

(Ask not what your country can do for you)


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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by kalm »

CID1990 wrote:
kalm wrote:
1. Correct

2. Correct

How many would have gone to college back then or would go today without the GI bill...more or less?

So again, tuition you don't have to pay for :mrgreen: increases education levels and productivity. And yes there are valid concerns with how government handles it and abuses and lack of efficiency in the system. Still...
All that twisting and smoke aside-

anyone who wants “free” college can have it

(Ask not what your country can do for you)


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Yes...you said that and I agreed. Would you like some reaffirmation?
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by kalm »

GannonFan wrote:
kalm wrote:
I know how much you struggle with big picture concepts but yes, there’s more to it than just waving the magic everything is free wand.

If I told you that part of our post war growth/innovation/productivity was a result of sending an entire generation of vets to college for free you’d just respond...”but Europe and Japan were in shambles!”

:lol:

If you’d like I’ll produce a 129 page policy paper on the deets to satisfy your curiosity. :lol:
Yes, I would tell you that we were dealing with a less competitive world, but I would also challenge your assertion that US productivity increases came as a result of the post WWII GI bill. Productivity increases in the US didn't start to really take off until the 1990's and onward, which is well after the impact of the GI bill folks into the workforce. Heck, most of those folks were already retired or were retiring by the time the US saw its biggest increases in productivity. Furthermore, although the GI bill was great, the idea that "an entire generation" go to go to college for free is undermined by the fact that not that many actually did go to college. By 1950, 5 years after the war, only 7.3% of American males had a bachelor's degree (granted, up from 5.5% in 1940, but not really a huge increase). Growth has been pretty normal for the past 50 years in terms of folks getting their bachelor's degree in terms of year on year growth, so there's never been an isolated surge. The biggest innovations we've had have had almost nothing to do with free college.
Interesting stuff. Care to share a link to the stats? I’m genuinely interested.

Also...please define “the biggest innovations we’ve had”...
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Ivytalk »

Will any of these Donk nimrods pull out before the NH primary?
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
Yes, I would tell you that we were dealing with a less competitive world, but I would also challenge your assertion that US productivity increases came as a result of the post WWII GI bill. Productivity increases in the US didn't start to really take off until the 1990's and onward, which is well after the impact of the GI bill folks into the workforce. Heck, most of those folks were already retired or were retiring by the time the US saw its biggest increases in productivity. Furthermore, although the GI bill was great, the idea that "an entire generation" go to go to college for free is undermined by the fact that not that many actually did go to college. By 1950, 5 years after the war, only 7.3% of American males had a bachelor's degree (granted, up from 5.5% in 1940, but not really a huge increase). Growth has been pretty normal for the past 50 years in terms of folks getting their bachelor's degree in terms of year on year growth, so there's never been an isolated surge. The biggest innovations we've had have had almost nothing to do with free college.
Interesting stuff. Care to share a link to the stats? I’m genuinely interested.

Also...please define “the biggest innovations we’ve had”...
College degree stuff is here:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/184 ... by-gender/

Productivity stuff here:

https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2002/06/art4full.pdf

As for the innovation, entirely subjective, but seeing how the biggest productivity improvements in the US happened post 1973, I'm going to go with the technological innovations (internet, computers, etc) in the 80's and 90's as the biggest ones for the US right now. You're certainly entitled to disagree with that.
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by kalm »

GannonFan wrote:
kalm wrote:
Interesting stuff. Care to share a link to the stats? I’m genuinely interested.

Also...please define “the biggest innovations we’ve had”...
College degree stuff is here:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/184 ... by-gender/

Productivity stuff here:

https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2002/06/art4full.pdf

As for the innovation, entirely subjective, but seeing how the biggest productivity improvements in the US happened post 1973, I'm going to go with the technological innovations (internet, computers, etc) in the 80's and 90's as the biggest ones for the US right now. You're certainly entitled to disagree with that.
Thanks, Ganny. I’ll read up on them. :thumb:
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
College degree stuff is here:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/184 ... by-gender/

Productivity stuff here:

https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2002/06/art4full.pdf

As for the innovation, entirely subjective, but seeing how the biggest productivity improvements in the US happened post 1973, I'm going to go with the technological innovations (internet, computers, etc) in the 80's and 90's as the biggest ones for the US right now. You're certainly entitled to disagree with that.
Thanks, Ganny. I’ll read up on them. :thumb:
I didn't do any background checks on the sources so if you find any skeletons let me know!
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by AZGrizFan »

kalm wrote:
GannonFan wrote:
Yes, I would tell you that we were dealing with a less competitive world, but I would also challenge your assertion that US productivity increases came as a result of the post WWII GI bill. Productivity increases in the US didn't start to really take off until the 1990's and onward, which is well after the impact of the GI bill folks into the workforce. Heck, most of those folks were already retired or were retiring by the time the US saw its biggest increases in productivity. Furthermore, although the GI bill was great, the idea that "an entire generation" go to go to college for free is undermined by the fact that not that many actually did go to college. By 1950, 5 years after the war, only 7.3% of American males had a bachelor's degree (granted, up from 5.5% in 1940, but not really a huge increase). Growth has been pretty normal for the past 50 years in terms of folks getting their bachelor's degree in terms of year on year growth, so there's never been an isolated surge. The biggest innovations we've had have had almost nothing to do with free college.
Interesting stuff. Care to share a link to the stats? I’m genuinely interested.

Also...please define “the biggest innovations we’ve had”...
1) Sliced Bread
2) Everything else...
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Ivytalk »

Hey, JSO, who is your favorite in this motley crew from your party? Just answer: DO NOT show your work.
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

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Ivytalk wrote:Hey, JSO, who is your favorite in this motley crew from your party? Just answer: DO NOT show your work.
JSO is a work in progress - he’s evolving

Give him a few more weeks and he’ll be a Che tshirt wearing BernieBro


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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by AZGrizFan »

CID1990 wrote:
Ivytalk wrote:Hey, JSO, who is your favorite in this motley crew from your party? Just answer: DO NOT show your work.
JSO is a work in progress - he’s evolving

Give him a few more weeks and he’ll be a Che tshirt wearing BernieBro


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:lol: :lol:
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Ibanez »

Ivytalk wrote:Hey, JSO, who is your favorite in this motley crew from your party? Just answer: DO NOT show your work.
:rofl: I'd be shocked if he just gave a name
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Ivytalk »

JohnStOnge wrote:I think it's safe to say that this thread has swerved off topic.
Then bring it back on point by answering the question I just asked you. :coffee:
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Post by Skjellyfetti »

Media Urged Not To Release Names Of Any More Presidential Candidates In Effort To Prevent Copycats
https://politics.theonion.com/media-urg ... ssion=true
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Cid1990 wrote:It is going to be a sad day for a lot of people when all that comes of all of this is Flynn getting whacked.

Mueller is going to take a beating on the left before this business is over

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