2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby css75 » Sun Oct 20, 2019 9:42 pm

kalm wrote:
UNI88 wrote:
Emphasis on "has been." The current pack of candidates is not center right.

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Harris, Booker, Butti, Biden, Yang are.



Right of who? Maybe Mao And Lenin.


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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby mainejeff2 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:02 am

Don't forget to bring the sand paper if you hook up with Tulsi! :?

:coffee:

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Re: RE: Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby UNI88 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:20 am

kalm wrote:
UNI88 wrote:
Emphasis on "has been." The current pack of candidates is not center right.

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Harris, Booker, Butti, Biden, Yang are.


Are they to the right of 89?

89Hen wrote:About as close to the center as you can get...

Economic Left/Right: -1.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.23


:D

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby BDKJMU » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:21 am

kalm wrote:But Trip is right in his overall thoughts regarding the ideological spectrum. The Dems have been a center right party and both parties are clearly to the right of polling on most issues. Political outcomes follow cash rather than voter sentiment. The wealthy and large corporations are the constituency.

EG: you’d find a hell of a lot more support on environmental protection if there was money to be made and spent on campaigns there.

:nod:

That may have been the case with the democrat party in the past, but no longer, as it has moved left. Some examples:
-gay marriage- donks used to be as late as mostly against as late as the 90s, now universally for.
-Immigration- go back and listen to some donk 90s-early 00s speeches (Clinton & Shumer come to mind). They spunded like today’s conks on immigration. Now donks are tacitly open borders.
-legalization marijuana- donk party used to be a generation ago against now universally for.
-gays military- donk party a used to be a generation ago against now universally for.

Current crop of donk candidates are batshit crazy left.
Go look at Clintons 1992 campaign platform, compare it to the campaign platforms of the current donk candidates, and tell me the donk party hasn’t gone way left.

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby BDKJMU » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:38 am

Another thing- Go back a couple decades both parties might have been to the right of the issues polling.

But NOT to the right those who bother to vote in the NON POTUS local, state & federal midterm elections. That electorate has always been more right than the POTUS election electorate.

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby UNI88 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:58 pm

BDKJMU wrote:
kalm wrote:But Trip is right in his overall thoughts regarding the ideological spectrum. The Dems have been a center right party and both parties are clearly to the right of polling on most issues. Political outcomes follow cash rather than voter sentiment. The wealthy and large corporations are the constituency.

EG: you’d find a hell of a lot more support on environmental protection if there was money to be made and spent on campaigns there.

:nod:

That may have been the case with the democrat party in the past, but no longer, as it has moved left. Some examples:
-gay marriage- donks used to be as late as mostly against as late as the 90s, now universally for.
-Immigration- go back and listen to some donk 90s-early 00s speeches (Clinton & Shumer come to mind). They spunded like today’s conks on immigration. Now donks are tacitly open borders.
-legalization marijuana- donk party used to be a generation ago against now universally for.
-gays military- donk party a used to be a generation ago against now universally for.

Current crop of donk candidates are batshit crazy left.
Go look at Clintons 1992 campaign platform, compare it to the campaign platforms of the current donk candidates, and tell me the donk party hasn’t gone way left.


I would hazard a guess that the average American has moved left on the issues you listed, particularly gay marriage and marijuana legalization. Immigration is divisive issue and I'm not sure where the average American is on that one.

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby CID1990 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:36 pm

kalm wrote:
CID1990 wrote:
Yes and then when they are polled on costs and consequences they swing right on back to the right

The whole “America is center left” is based on stopping at one question with no follow up

A better description would be to say that Americans are charitable - up to the point where they have to pull out their wallets




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That’s a damn fair point. But doesn’t that also suggest they lean socialistic?

:mrgreen: :mrgreen:


I don’t see that but I’m sure you do somehow


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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby Winterborn » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:41 pm

UNI88 wrote:
I would hazard a guess that the average American has moved left on the issues you listed, particularly gay marriage and marijuana legalization. Immigration is divisive issue and I'm not sure where the average American is on that one.


Based on the people I have talked to marijuana legalization is a given and the only real sticking point for some is how to implement it.

Gay marriage is a given, except with certain religious groups.

Immigration is tough and seems to be all over the board depending on their particular circumstances.
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby kalm » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:04 pm

CID1990 wrote:
kalm wrote:
That’s a damn fair point. But doesn’t that also suggest they lean socialistic?

:mrgreen: :mrgreen:


I don’t see that but I’m sure you do somehow


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Oh for fucks all sake...because they want the rich to take care of it?

Is this mic on?

:ohno:
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby css75 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:14 pm

Winterborn wrote:
UNI88 wrote:
I would hazard a guess that the average American has moved left on the issues you listed, particularly gay marriage and marijuana legalization. Immigration is divisive issue and I'm not sure where the average American is on that one.


Based on the people I have talked to marijuana legalization is a given and the only real sticking point for some is how to implement it.

Gay marriage is a given, except with certain religious groups.

Immigration is tough and seems to be all over the board depending on their particular circumstances.



The marijuana thing is really going to come back and bite users in a few years, there could be many health and mental health issues. There has been very little research on the long term effects of it. But potheads want it legal for instant gratification.


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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby kalm » Tue Oct 22, 2019 4:56 am

css75 wrote:
Winterborn wrote:
Based on the people I have talked to marijuana legalization is a given and the only real sticking point for some is how to implement it.

Gay marriage is a given, except with certain religious groups.

Immigration is tough and seems to be all over the board depending on their particular circumstances.



The marijuana thing is really going to come back and bite users in a few years, there could be many health and mental health issues. There has been very little research on the long term effects of it. But potheads want it legal for instant gratification.


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Better make steak illegal too.
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Re: RE: Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby UNI88 » Tue Oct 22, 2019 7:14 am

css75 wrote:
Winterborn wrote:
Based on the people I have talked to marijuana legalization is a given and the only real sticking point for some is how to implement it.

Gay marriage is a given, except with certain religious groups.

Immigration is tough and seems to be all over the board depending on their particular circumstances.



The marijuana thing is really going to come back and bite users in a few years, there could be many health and mental health issues. There has been very little research on the long term effects of it. But potheads want it legal for instant gratification.


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I'm not a pothead and think it should be legal. There are upsides in addition to the downsides. Will it be worse than alcohol? Should alcohol be illegal?

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby mainejeff2 » Thu Oct 24, 2019 5:37 am

What about the long term effects of tattoos?

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:ohno:

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Re: RE: Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby UNI88 » Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:21 am

mainejeff2 wrote:What about the long term effects of tattoos?

Image

:ohno:
Is that Houndie?

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby Ivytalk » Fri Oct 25, 2019 3:11 am

Tulsi is keeping her eyes on the prize: she’s not running for re-election to the House in 2020. :clap:
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby Ivytalk » Fri Oct 25, 2019 3:11 am

And Ryan bowed out so he could keep his House seat. :coffee:
Last edited by Ivytalk on Fri Oct 25, 2019 3:16 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby mainejeff2 » Fri Oct 25, 2019 4:04 am

Ivytalk wrote:Tulsi is keeping her eyes on the prize: she’s not running for re-election to the House in 2020. :clap:


She already has the Faux News gig wrapped up.

:coffee:

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby AZGrizFan » Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:33 am

CID1990 wrote:
kalm wrote:
That’s a damn fair point. But doesn’t that also suggest they lean socialistic?

:mrgreen: :mrgreen:


I don’t see that but I’m sure you do somehow


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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby css75 » Fri Oct 25, 2019 3:24 pm

kalm wrote:
css75 wrote:

The marijuana thing is really going to come back and bite users in a few years, there could be many health and mental health issues. There has been very little research on the long term effects of it. But potheads want it legal for instant gratification.


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Better make steak illegal too.


Quit being a doofus, all I am stating is that more long term effect research needs to be done.


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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby houndawg » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:07 pm

css75 wrote:
Winterborn wrote:
Based on the people I have talked to marijuana legalization is a given and the only real sticking point for some is how to implement it.

Gay marriage is a given, except with certain religious groups.

Immigration is tough and seems to be all over the board depending on their particular circumstances.



The marijuana thing is really going to come back and bite users in a few years, there could be many health and mental health issues. There has been very little research on the long term effects of it. But potheads want it legal for instant gratification.


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Wow. How far out do you live CS?
Subvert the dominant paradigm

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby kalm » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:26 pm

css75 wrote:
kalm wrote:
Better make steak illegal too.


Quit being a doofus, all I am stating is that more long term effect research needs to be done.


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No...you said more than that. :coffee:
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Re: RE: Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby houndawg » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:33 pm

UNI88 wrote:
mainejeff2 wrote:What about the long term effects of tattoos?

Image

:ohno:
Is that Houndie?

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:lol:
Subvert the dominant paradigm

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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby JohnStOnge » Fri Nov 01, 2019 1:50 pm

This is encouraging:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... 1b1b#gid=0

As you know I consider the ABC News/Washington Post poll to the best public poll. One of only 6 polls among the 396 rated by 538 rated as A+. Small simple average error at 2.9. Bias near 0 at 0.6 (towards Democrats but very small).

And its latest effort...conducted October 27 - 30...has Trump 20 points underwater on the Approval/Disapproval front.

Here's a particularly encouraging thing: The exit polling estimates had Trump winning among Independents by 46% to 42% over Clinton. This poll has 57% of Independents disapproving of his job performance vs. 38% approving. And when it comes to feeling strongly: 46% of Independents said they strongly disapprove of his job vs. only 29% who said they strongly approve.

As always, we must recognize that this is a snapshot in time. But this is a VERY beatable incumbent. ANY Democrat among the crowd that's running for the nomination right now would have a good shot at beating him if the election were held tomorrow. Most of the people in the country do not like him and most of the people in the country do not approve of the job he's doing.
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby Col Hogan » Fri Nov 01, 2019 2:41 pm

Robert Francis has dropped out of the race...

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/01/us/p ... s-out.html
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Re: 2020 Democratic Nomination Process Mega-thread

Postby Skjellyfetti » Fri Nov 01, 2019 2:46 pm

Robert Francis didn't exactly drop out. He was doing pretty well and had just won the California primary when he was shot by Sirhan Sirhan in a hotel kitchen.

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