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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Mon May 13, 2019 3:38 pm
by Chizzang
89Hen wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
93hen already said it in his own way:
It's not a cut and dry murder debate as much as that's the only ground Pro-Life has to stand on...
Even guys like CID announcing that "Honesty" is all that's required to fully understand it

It has to be completely isolated in a vacuum with no other data just "Murder"
in order for that argument to stand - unfortunately - the ugly world gets in the way
and the scenarios and situations range wildly

abortion in murder = murder is illegal
guns kill = guns should be illegal

it's never that simple - the Left gun control argument is myopic and stupid
and the Rights Abortion argument is myopic and stupid

:coffee:

No Mr Smarty Pants, you are stupid.

Seriously though, that was one of your worst posts ever.

I am pro-life and I do not stand on murder. You guys have tried time and time again to paint me into a corner on whether a woman who has an abortion should be tried for first degree murder. I'm not down with that. But not knowing exactly what the punishment should be for a crime doesn't mean it shouldn't be a crime.

FTR, SG's analogy wasn't really that bad. Society as a whole makes laws these days. Not one gender or race.


Who knows what people really believe in their heart of hearts...
the pro-life argument is a murder argument regardless of your undecided perspective

however
if we open the door just a crack and let the light in... and suggest there are cases where it's not murder
the entire argument dissolves into ether and becomes an entirely different debate

CID got that part right - stand on murder - and don't waiver
otherwise we're debating all the minutia that is the ugly reality of this world

:nod:

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Mon May 13, 2019 3:56 pm
by CID1990
Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote:No Mr Smarty Pants, you are stupid.

Seriously though, that was one of your worst posts ever.

I am pro-life and I do not stand on murder. You guys have tried time and time again to paint me into a corner on whether a woman who has an abortion should be tried for first degree murder. I'm not down with that. But not knowing exactly what the punishment should be for a crime doesn't mean it shouldn't be a crime.

FTR, SG's analogy wasn't really that bad. Society as a whole makes laws these days. Not one gender or race.


Who knows what people really believe in their heart of hearts...
the pro-life argument is a murder argument regardless of your undecided perspective

however
if we open the door just a crack and let the light in... and suggest there are cases where it's not murder
the entire argument dissolves into ether and becomes an entirely different debate

CID got that part right - stand on murder - and don't waiver
otherwise we're debating all the minutia that is the ugly reality of this world

:nod:


You say that like I somehow think murder is bad

We aborted cities full of Germans and Japanese in the name of saving the world from basic human nature

don’t look now but it needs saving again


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 3:33 am
by Ivytalk
CID1990 wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
Who knows what people really believe in their heart of hearts...
the pro-life argument is a murder argument regardless of your undecided perspective

however
if we open the door just a crack and let the light in... and suggest there are cases where it's not murder
the entire argument dissolves into ether and becomes an entirely different debate

CID got that part right - stand on murder - and don't waiver
otherwise we're debating all the minutia that is the ugly reality of this world

:nod:


You say that like I somehow think murder is bad

We aborted cities full of Germans and Japanese in the name of saving the world from basic human nature

don’t look now but it needs saving again


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Whenever I’m down in the dumps, I pull out my copy of Albert Camus’ Neither Victims Nor Executioners. It should be required reading for John Bolton.

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 6:50 am
by 89Hen
Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote:No Mr Smarty Pants, you are stupid.

Seriously though, that was one of your worst posts ever.

I am pro-life and I do not stand on murder. You guys have tried time and time again to paint me into a corner on whether a woman who has an abortion should be tried for first degree murder. I'm not down with that. But not knowing exactly what the punishment should be for a crime doesn't mean it shouldn't be a crime.

FTR, SG's analogy wasn't really that bad. Society as a whole makes laws these days. Not one gender or race.


Who knows what people really believe in their heart of hearts...
the pro-life argument is a murder argument regardless of your undecided perspective

however
if we open the door just a crack and let the light in... and suggest there are cases where it's not murder
the entire argument dissolves into ether and becomes an entirely different debate

CID got that part right - stand on murder - and don't waiver
otherwise we're debating all the minutia that is the ugly reality of this world

:nod:

:lol: So I guess all the service men and women who have combat kills better lawyer up. Holy shit are you stupid on this topic.

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 7:05 am
by AZGrizFan
CID1990 wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
Who knows what people really believe in their heart of hearts...
the pro-life argument is a murder argument regardless of your undecided perspective

however
if we open the door just a crack and let the light in... and suggest there are cases where it's not murder
the entire argument dissolves into ether and becomes an entirely different debate

CID got that part right - stand on murder - and don't waiver
otherwise we're debating all the minutia that is the ugly reality of this world

:nod:


You say that like I somehow think murder is bad

We aborted cities full of Germans and Japanese in the name of saving the world from basic human nature

don’t look now but it needs saving again


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

:nod: :nod: :nod:

Time for a purge. :coffee: :coffee:

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 7:21 am
by Chizzang
89Hen wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
Who knows what people really believe in their heart of hearts...
the pro-life argument is a murder argument regardless of your undecided perspective

however
if we open the door just a crack and let the light in... and suggest there are cases where it's not murder
the entire argument dissolves into ether and becomes an entirely different debate

CID got that part right - stand on murder - and don't waiver
otherwise we're debating all the minutia that is the ugly reality of this world

:nod:

:lol: So I guess all the service men and women who have combat kills better lawyer up. Holy shit are you stupid on this topic.


Yeah that's me... I'm all stupid on this
and thanks for bringing in that really helpful analogy

:coffee:

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 8:29 am
by 89Hen
Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote: :lol: So I guess all the service men and women who have combat kills better lawyer up. Holy shit are you stupid on this topic.


Yeah that's me... I'm all stupid on this
and thanks for bringing in that really helpful analogy

:coffee:

This topic is like Kleets Kryptonite rendering your brain worthless. Funny, I always thought the pro-lifers get all emotional and illogical about this. :lol:

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 8:30 am
by Chizzang
89Hen wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
Yeah that's me... I'm all stupid on this
and thanks for bringing in that really helpful analogy

:coffee:

This topic is like Kleets Kryptonite rendering your brain worthless. Funny, I always thought the pro-lifers get all emotional and illogical about this. :lol:


Yeah I'm crazy right now...

:nod:

read all my crazy posts

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 8:36 am
by 89Hen
Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote:This topic is like Kleets Kryptonite rendering your brain worthless. Funny, I always thought the pro-lifers get all emotional and illogical about this. :lol:


Yeah I'm crazy right now...

:nod:

read all my crazy posts

I did. Your IQ dropped 73 points during this discussion.

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 8:40 am
by Chizzang
89Hen wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
Yeah I'm crazy right now...

:nod:

read all my crazy posts

I did. Your IQ dropped 73 points during this discussion.


I see...
I guess that must mean you win

:dance:

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 8:51 am
by 89Hen
Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote:I did. Your IQ dropped 73 points during this discussion.


I see...
I guess that must mean you win

:dance:

Nobody wins an abortion argument, but you sure lost. :king:

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 11:24 am
by Pwns
I don't understand the notion that the unborn must either be property that you can do whatever you damn well please with or must have an absolute right to life from conception no matter the circumstances.

We take a middle ground with animals. Most people don't want to bean meat or hunting or medical research where animals are sacrificed but most agree there should be some rules about how animals are treated and they shouldn't be killed for shits and giggles.

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 12:14 pm
by 89Hen
Pwns wrote:I don't understand the notion that the unborn must either be property that you can do whatever you damn well please with or must have an absolute right to life from conception no matter the circumstances.

We take a middle ground with animals. Most people don't want to bean meat or hunting or medical research where animals are sacrificed but most agree there should be some rules about how animals are treated and they shouldn't be killed for shits and giggles.

We take middle ground with humans: self-defense, war, capital punishment...

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 1:12 pm
by SeattleGriz
89Hen wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
I see...
I guess that must mean you win

:dance:

Nobody wins an abortion argument, but you sure lost. :king:
Don't let him have a gun!!!

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Tue May 14, 2019 6:40 pm
by UNI88
89Hen wrote:
UNI88 wrote:And on the pro-life side, what about the hypocrisy of opposing sex ed, contraceptives and the many good things that planned Parenthood and similar groups provide that can actually help reduce abortions? Which side has more/fewer straw-men probably depends whether you're pro-life or choice.

You've demonstrated the ability and open mind to adapt your positions based on information. Too many people on both sides haven't.

Those again are red herrings for the pro-choice side in an attempt to divert the discussion. I am 100% in favor of sex ed and birth control, as I'm sure many on the pro-life side are.


You're 100% in favor of sex ed and birth control but how many on the pro-life side aren't? You dismiss as red herrings the pro-choice arguments that don't fit you personally. Have there been attempts to defund Planned Parenthood despite the good things it does? Have abortion clinics been bombed and doctors been shot? There are fringe elements on both sides and there are red herring pro-life arguments that don't fit all pro-choicers.

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 8:35 am
by Pwns
I'm starting to seriously think the Alabama and Georgia abortion bills aren't designed to survive a lawsuit, but they're designed to get the left talking about abortion instead of economic liberalism.

That doesn't mean they lose if they talk about abortion. The pro-abortion side could probably win the battle of popular opinion if they talk about 11-year-olds that get pregnant from 26-year-old rapists or women who had complications that make birth really dangerous. Instead, we get frantic cawing about the "war on wimmin". In other words, exactly the stuff that didn't help at all in the 2014 midterms and the stuff that helped elect Trump.

It's just not going to work when a large majority of people aren't too stupid or too militant to not understand why abortion is controversial and appendectomies are not.

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 8:47 am
by 89Hen
UNI88 wrote:
89Hen wrote:Those again are red herrings for the pro-choice side in an attempt to divert the discussion. I am 100% in favor of sex ed and birth control, as I'm sure many on the pro-life side are.


You're 100% in favor of sex ed and birth control but how many on the pro-life side aren't? You dismiss as red herrings the pro-choice arguments that don't fit you personally. Have there been attempts to defund Planned Parenthood despite the good things it does? Have abortion clinics been bombed and doctors been shot? There are fringe elements on both sides and there are red herring pro-life arguments that don't fit all pro-choicers.

Of course there is fringe on both sides, but the fringe on the pro-choice side are the ones who don't use the talking points of rape, incest, child care after the fact, men having no say.... I've actually never met a pro-choice person who doesn't use those. I've also never met a pro-life person who has bombed a clinic or shot a doctor, but obviously there are folks who have done that (I'm guessing more rare than a sharknado). In fairness, I have met pro-life who don't believe in birth control, but they are few and far between in my circles.

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 9:54 am
by 89Hen
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/jameela-jamil-abortion-the-good-place-actress-opens-up-and-slams-georgia-abortion-law-2019-05-14/

Jameela Jamil, best known for her role on "The Good Place," has opened up about having an abortion, calling it "the best decision I have ever made."

"Both for me, and for the baby I didn't want, and wasn't ready for, emotionally, psychologically and financially," Jamil tweeted on Monday.

This is NOT the fringe. This is every day and quite honestly nothing short of disgusting. :ohno:

I'm sure the baby is thrilled with her decision.

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 12:20 pm
by dbackjon
UNI88 wrote:
89Hen wrote:Those again are red herrings for the pro-choice side in an attempt to divert the discussion. I am 100% in favor of sex ed and birth control, as I'm sure many on the pro-life side are.


You're 100% in favor of sex ed and birth control but how many on the pro-life side aren't? You dismiss as red herrings the pro-choice arguments that don't fit you personally. Have there been attempts to defund Planned Parenthood despite the good things it does? Have abortion clinics been bombed and doctors been shot? There are fringe elements on both sides and there are red herring pro-life arguments that don't fit all pro-choicers.



What used to be fringe on the Forced Birth side is now main-stream Republican Thinking.

Talabama just passed a no exception for rape abortion ban. Defunding PP is a plank that EVERY Republican that doesn't want to get primaried has to support. The violence from the forced birth side has, and always will be greater than from the pro-choice side.

Fringe elements like Operation Rescue's radicalism are now GOP Platform Planks.

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 12:22 pm
by Ivytalk
dbackjon wrote:
UNI88 wrote:
You're 100% in favor of sex ed and birth control but how many on the pro-life side aren't? You dismiss as red herrings the pro-choice arguments that don't fit you personally. Have there been attempts to defund Planned Parenthood despite the good things it does? Have abortion clinics been bombed and doctors been shot? There are fringe elements on both sides and there are red herring pro-life arguments that don't fit all pro-choicers.



What used to be fringe on the Forced Birth side is now main-stream Republican Thinking.

Talabama just passed a no exception for rape abortion ban. Defunding PP is a plank that EVERY Republican that doesn't want to get primaried has to support. The violence from the forced birth side has, and always will be greater than from the pro-choice side.

Fringe elements like Operation Rescue's radicalism are now GOP Platform Planks.

:fuel: :stir: :popcorn:

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 12:23 pm
by 89Hen
dbackjon wrote:
UNI88 wrote:
You're 100% in favor of sex ed and birth control but how many on the pro-life side aren't? You dismiss as red herrings the pro-choice arguments that don't fit you personally. Have there been attempts to defund Planned Parenthood despite the good things it does? Have abortion clinics been bombed and doctors been shot? There are fringe elements on both sides and there are red herring pro-life arguments that don't fit all pro-choicers.



What used to be fringe on the Forced Birth side is now main-stream Republican Thinking.

Talabama just passed a no exception for rape abortion ban. Defunding PP is a plank that EVERY Republican that doesn't want to get primaried has to support. The violence from the forced birth side has, and always will be greater than from the pro-choice side.

Fringe elements like Operation Rescue's radicalism are now GOP Platform Planks.

See... it's hard to take anything you say seriously. We were having an adult discussion and you come in with Forced Birth and Talabama...

:ohno:

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 2:20 pm
by dbackjon
89Hen wrote:
dbackjon wrote:

What used to be fringe on the Forced Birth side is now main-stream Republican Thinking.

Talabama just passed a no exception for rape abortion ban. Defunding PP is a plank that EVERY Republican that doesn't want to get primaried has to support. The violence from the forced birth side has, and always will be greater than from the pro-choice side.

Fringe elements like Operation Rescue's radicalism are now GOP Platform Planks.

See... it's hard to take anything you say seriously. We were having an adult discussion and you come in with Forced Birth and Talabama...

:ohno:



As opposed to Pro-Abortion? Most Pro-Choice supporters aren't Pro Abortion. They don't want abortions, would rather the conditions that lead to abortions be corrected as much as possible.


But you don't call anyone out that uses that slanted verbiage, which shows that you are biased yourself

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 2:20 pm
by dbackjon
And note you skip over the no rape exception. When you can't refute, you attack the style of the message, instead of the facts.

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 2:35 pm
by Gil Dobie
There's good people in Alabama, shouldn't damn the entire populace because of the politicians.

Re: 11 yr. old rape victim must carry and deliver baby...

Posted: Wed May 15, 2019 3:16 pm
by Chizzang
Gil Dobie wrote:There's good people in Alabama, shouldn't damn the entire populace because of the politicians.


:lol: You're priceless

There are good people in California too and I've never seen you once say that
and for a decade we've had entire threads on libtard cesspool California