Coronavirus COVID-19

[Winterborn]

I've personally known about 6 people with actual positive tests, and none of them had anything other than mild symptoms. I hear of a lot of more cases of folks with it through my kids school and again, no one with any of the real serious conditions or complications. Only person I have any personal knowledge of having a serious outcome was the elderly father of a high school classmate and he spent a good 3-4 weeks in the hospital. It matches the data we hear and what's reported - for the vast majority of people who get COVID they either don't even know they have it or they have very mild symptoms. You still lament the tiny fraction of people that do get it severely or die, so that doesn't minimize that suffering.

It is sad that people pass from this but that emotional feeling should not be influencing our response to this. Unfortunately it is as it is all about the emotion and playing to that emotional response by politicians.

[Gil Dobie]

I've personally known about 6 people with actual positive tests, and none of them had anything other than mild symptoms. I hear of a lot of more cases of folks with it through my kids school and again, no one with any of the real serious conditions or complications. Only person I have any personal knowledge of having a serious outcome was the elderly father of a high school classmate and he spent a good 3-4 weeks in the hospital. It matches the data we hear and what's reported - for the vast majority of people who get COVID they either don't even know they have it or they have very mild symptoms. You still lament the tiny fraction of people that do get it severely or die, so that doesn't minimize that suffering.

It is sad that people pass from this but that emotional feeling should not be influencing our response to this. Unfortunately it is as it is all about the emotion and playing to that emotional response by politicians.

This is why there are so many differing opinions outside the medical profession, on Covid. Some people see many people with light symptoms, others see the other side, where there are more fatal results. From what I'm observing, it is probably heart related, directly (heart condition), indirectly (lack of O2 going to the heart via another condition). Some people just go too far into a illness before they seek help and the lungs may be too far gone by then to recover. That might be the case for the few cases I've heard, where people on their death bed were saying they thought it was a hoax, they couldn't believe they had Covid. The chance of a younger person having a heart condition is a lot lower than an older person.

[GannonFan]

It is sad that people pass from this but that emotional feeling should not be influencing our response to this. Unfortunately it is as it is all about the emotion and playing to that emotional response by politicians.

This is why there are so many differing opinions outside the medical profession, on Covid. Some people see many people with light symptoms, others see the other side, where there are more fatal results. From what I'm observing, it is probably heart related, directly (heart condition), indirectly (lack of O2 going to the heart via another condition). Some people just go too far into a illness before they seek help and the lungs may be too far gone by then to recover. That might be the case for the few cases I've heard, where people on their death bed were saying they thought it was a hoax, they couldn't believe they had Covid. The chance of a younger person having a heart condition is a lot lower than an older person.

Yup, and not only is the chance of having a heart condition substantially lower in a younger person than an older person, the chances of even knowing about that heart condition in a young person versus an old person is substantially lower as well simply because younger people aren't really screened for heart conditions to the extent that older patients are. That's why in those more rare cases of a non-elderly person dying from this that's it's even more of a shock simply because they probably never knew they had any underlying health issues.

[kalm]

I've personally known about 6 people with actual positive tests, and none of them had anything other than mild symptoms. I hear of a lot of more cases of folks with it through my kids school and again, no one with any of the real serious conditions or complications. Only person I have any personal knowledge of having a serious outcome was the elderly father of a high school classmate and he spent a good 3-4 weeks in the hospital. It matches the data we hear and what's reported - for the vast majority of people who get COVID they either don't even know they have it or they have very mild symptoms. You still lament the tiny fraction of people that do get it severely or die, so that doesn't minimize that suffering.

It is sad that people pass from this but that emotional feeling should not be influencing our response to this. Unfortunately it is as it is all about the emotion and playing to that emotional response by politicians.

A quick search indicates around 80% of cases are mild to moderate. Still learning about long term effects.

I apologize for using the WWII comparison again but we will pass combat deaths this month. We’re exceeding a 9/11 and Pearl Harbor every day right now and probably will for the next month or so.

People emotionally react to those type of numbers differently. We’re still mourning those tragedies decades later. I’m all for using cold-hearted calculations but at some point morality plays a role in decisions. Like the preventable nature of Covid at the sacrifice of temporary bar attendance and family gatherings. And emergency financial aide to get us through.

“That fascism sounds dangerous and all but I’m not sure we can afford to build all of these tanks, President Roosevelt. It will surely put us in debt and we need to at least prioritize Wall Street first”.

[GannonFan]

It is sad that people pass from this but that emotional feeling should not be influencing our response to this. Unfortunately it is as it is all about the emotion and playing to that emotional response by politicians.

A quick search indicates around 80% of cases are mild to moderate. Still learning about long term effects.

I apologize for using the WWII comparison again but we will pass combat deaths this month. We’re exceeding a 9/11 and Pearl Harbor every day right now and probably will for the next month or so.

People emotionally react to those type of numbers differently. We’re still mourning those tragedies decades later. I’m all for using cold-hearted calculations but at some point morality plays a role in decisions. Like the preventable nature of Covid at the sacrifice of temporary bar attendance and family gatherings. And emergency financial aide to get us through.

“That fascism sounds dangerous and all but I’m not sure we can afford to build all of these tanks, President Roosevelt. It will surely put us in debt and we need to at least prioritize Wall Street first”.

Man, you're swinging for the fences today with some of these analogies but you're not making a lot of contact. FDR didn't have to worry about Wall Street - the economy being on a war footing meant that the economy got the biggest shot in the arm it could conceivably get. He didn't have to pick between the economy and the problem at hand.

[kalm]

A quick search indicates around 80% of cases are mild to moderate. Still learning about long term effects.

I apologize for using the WWII comparison again but we will pass combat deaths this month. We’re exceeding a 9/11 and Pearl Harbor every day right now and probably will for the next month or so.

People emotionally react to those type of numbers differently. We’re still mourning those tragedies decades later. I’m all for using cold-hearted calculations but at some point morality plays a role in decisions. Like the preventable nature of Covid at the sacrifice of temporary bar attendance and family gatherings. And emergency financial aide to get us through.

“That fascism sounds dangerous and all but I’m not sure we can afford to build all of these tanks, President Roosevelt. It will surely put us in debt and we need to at least prioritize Wall Street first”.

Man, you're swinging for the fences today with some of these analogies but you're not making a lot of contact. FDR didn't have to worry about Wall Street - the economy being on a war footing meant that the economy got the biggest shot in the arm it could conceivably get. He didn't have to pick between the economy and the problem at hand.

No shit? You mean we didn’t go into debt for WWII? Or perhaps the increased tax receipts stimulated by addressing an existential crisis paid for it? Maybe we used our cash reserves?

[GannonFan]

Man, you're swinging for the fences today with some of these analogies but you're not making a lot of contact. FDR didn't have to worry about Wall Street - the economy being on a war footing meant that the economy got the biggest shot in the arm it could conceivably get. He didn't have to pick between the economy and the problem at hand.

No shit? You mean we didn’t go into debt for WWII? Or perhaps the increased tax receipts stimulated by addressing an existential crisis paid for it? Maybe we used our cash reserves?

Maybe we took advantage of being the single largest economy, by a huge margin, still left standing after the rest of world was recovering from the massive destruction of that war. Or something.

[kalm]

No shit? You mean we didn’t go into debt for WWII? Or perhaps the increased tax receipts stimulated by addressing an existential crisis paid for it? Maybe we used our cash reserves?

Maybe we took advantage of being the single largest economy, by a huge margin, still left standing after the rest of world was recovering from the massive destruction of that war. Or something.

True. We also took advantage of high corporate and marginal tax rates.

But that’s beside the point I was making. History doesn’t repeat but it does echo and there things to learn from it. Like when you face a real threat you may not have the time to wait around until you can afford to pay for it.

[BDKJMU]

It is sad that people pass from this but that emotional feeling should not be influencing our response to this. Unfortunately it is as it is all about the emotion and playing to that emotional response by politicians.

A quick search indicates around 80% of cases are mild to moderate. Still learning about long term effects.

I apologize for using the WWII comparison again but we will pass combat deaths this month. We’re exceeding a 9/11 and Pearl Harbor every day right now and probably will for the next month or so.

People emotionally react to those type of numbers differently. We’re still mourning those tragedies decades later. I’m all for using cold-hearted calculations but at some point morality plays a role in decisions. Like the preventable nature of Covid at the sacrifice of temporary bar attendance and family gatherings. And emergency financial aide to get us through.

“That fascism sounds dangerous and all but I’m not sure we can afford to build all of these tanks, President Roosevelt. It will surely put us in debt and we need to at least prioritize Wall Street first”.

We've already passed the 295k+ US WWII combat deaths (was 405k all deaths). So what. We double WWII combat deaths in cancer deaths every year. And in heart disease deaths. We hit WWII combat deaths in this country from all deaths every 5-6 weeks. We're a country of 330+ million versus 130+ million back then.

[Winterborn]

It is sad that people pass from this but that emotional feeling should not be influencing our response to this. Unfortunately it is as it is all about the emotion and playing to that emotional response by politicians.

A quick search indicates around 80% of cases are mild to moderate. Still learning about long term effects.

I apologize for using the WWII comparison again but we will pass combat deaths this month. We’re exceeding a 9/11 and Pearl Harbor every day right now and probably will for the next month or so.

People emotionally react to those type of numbers differently. We’re still mourning those tragedies decades later. I’m all for using cold-hearted calculations but at some point morality plays a role in decisions. Like the preventable nature of Covid at the sacrifice of temporary bar attendance and family gatherings. And emergency financial aide to get us through.

“That fascism sounds dangerous and all but I’m not sure we can afford to build all of these tanks, President Roosevelt. It will surely put us in debt and we need to at least prioritize Wall Street first”.

7,123 people die every day in the U.S. from a wide variety of causes. I don't see anybody making a deal about those people and their family's. All deaths are a tragedy and we should do our best to prevent them shouldn't we? It shouldn't matter if it is from the COVID epidemic or the obesity epidemic.

Obesity is a direct contributor to about 300,000 deaths a year, yet I don't see a mandatory exercise program and meal plan put in place for everybody to try and prevent the above deaths. Isn't the point is if it just saves one life, we should do whatever it takes? Think of how many people (grandma's and grandpa's) could live fuller lives and see their family's if we all just gave up our fast food and exercised a bit more.

The above is tongue-in-cheek a bit but it isn't it hypocritical of us to do what we are doing via lock downs and these "extraordinary" measures when we could save the same number of lives by banning Big Macs or McRibs? I fully realize that this was a bit of uncharted territory and we didn't know how the virus acted in the beginning, so I am not arguing against the measures taken back then but to continue to extend them and treat this "epidemic" the same now as it was back then is purely political in nature. Clear thinking and level headedness has gone straight out the window in the name of political gamesmanship and taking advantage of peoples emotions.

I realize I am probably a full bastard for even going down this road and not having empathy for the dead but to continue to make excuses of not knowing enough or peoples feelings is just a bit mind boggling to me. I fully admit we don't know the long term consequences yet but to use that as some kind of crutch to support ones position is disingenuous in the face of the data we do know, and that is for the vast majority of people it will do nothing and extrapolating long term based on the data we do know, the risk is minimal in the face of what our "cure" is doing to peoples livelihood.

A quote from season two of the Mandalorian stuck with me where an Imperial officer, Valin Hess, stated "Everybody thinks they want freedom, but what they really want is order". Isn't that the true mindset of the response of the majority American people during this "crises"?


Not directing this directly at you Klam, just using your point as a segway into something I have been giving a bit of thought to lately. Probably should cut back on the rum and brandy in my Tom & Jerry mix.

[Gil Dobie]

A lot of additional people died this year.

Data is provided through the 48th week of 2020. So far this year, the CDC reports that 2,877,601 people have died.
At the same point in 2018, the number was 2,606,928, and in 2019, it was 2,614,950.
The number of deaths to this point in 2020 is at least 260,000 greater than either of the past two years. But that number is an underestimate because the CDC publishes data based on the number of death certificates it has received.
Another way to see the effect of COVID-19 is that more people have died already this year than did in the entirety of either 2018 or 2019. There were 2,831,836 deaths in all of 2018 and 2,845,793 in all of 2019.

CBS 19 Link

[AZGrizFan]

A quick search indicates around 80% of cases are mild to moderate. Still learning about long term effects.

I apologize for using the WWII comparison again but we will pass combat deaths this month. We’re exceeding a 9/11 and Pearl Harbor every day right now and probably will for the next month or so.

People emotionally react to those type of numbers differently. We’re still mourning those tragedies decades later. I’m all for using cold-hearted calculations but at some point morality plays a role in decisions. Like the preventable nature of Covid at the sacrifice of temporary bar attendance and family gatherings. And emergency financial aide to get us through.

“That fascism sounds dangerous and all but I’m not sure we can afford to build all of these tanks, President Roosevelt. It will surely put us in debt and we need to at least prioritize Wall Street first”.

7,123 people die every day in the U.S. from a wide variety of causes. I don't see anybody making a deal about those people and their family's. All deaths are a tragedy and we should do our best to prevent them shouldn't we? It shouldn't matter if it is from the COVID epidemic or the obesity epidemic.

Obesity is a direct contributor to about 300,000 deaths a year, yet I don't see a mandatory exercise program and meal plan put in place for everybody to try and prevent the above deaths. Isn't the point is if it just saves one life, we should do whatever it takes? Think of how many people (grandma's and grandpa's) could live fuller lives and see their family's if we all just gave up our fast food and exercised a bit more.

The above is tongue-in-cheek a bit but it isn't it hypocritical of us to do what we are doing via lock downs and these "extraordinary" measures when we could save the same number of lives by banning Big Macs or McRibs? I fully realize that this was a bit of uncharted territory and we didn't know how the virus acted in the beginning, so I am not arguing against the measures taken back then but to continue to extend them and treat this "epidemic" the same now as it was back then is purely political in nature. Clear thinking and level headedness has gone straight out the window in the name of political gamesmanship and taking advantage of peoples emotions.

I realize I am probably a full bastard for even going down this road and not having empathy for the dead but to continue to make excuses of not knowing enough or peoples feelings is just a bit mind boggling to me. I fully admit we don't know the long term consequences yet but to use that as some kind of crutch to support ones position is disingenuous in the face of the data we do know, and that is for the vast majority of people it will do nothing and extrapolating long term based on the data we do know, the risk is minimal in the face of what our "cure" is doing to peoples livelihood.

A quote from season two of the Mandalorian stuck with me where an Imperial officer, Valin Hess, stated "Everybody thinks they want freedom, but what they really want is order". Isn't that the true mindset of the response of the majority American people during this "crises"?


Not directing this directly at you Klam, just using your point as a segway into something I have been giving a bit of thought to lately. Probably should cut back on the rum and brandy in my Tom & Jerry mix.

AZGrizFan approves of this post 1000%.

[AZGrizFan]

A lot of additional people died this year.

Data is provided through the 48th week of 2020. So far this year, the CDC reports that 2,877,601 people have died.
At the same point in 2018, the number was 2,606,928, and in 2019, it was 2,614,950.
The number of deaths to this point in 2020 is at least 260,000 greater than either of the past two years. But that number is an underestimate because the CDC publishes data based on the number of death certificates it has received.
Another way to see the effect of COVID-19 is that more people have died already this year than did in the entirety of either 2018 or 2019. There were 2,831,836 deaths in all of 2018 and 2,845,793 in all of 2019.

CBS 19 Link

Here’s my prediction: When we come out the other side of this, we’re going to have a couple of lower than average years in 2021 (maybe) or 2022/2023.

[Gil Dobie]

Update

So far, more than 350,000 Americans have died of COVID-19. According to preliminary weekly data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) (as of January 6, 2021), 3,187,086 people died from all causes between January 1 and December 26, 2020. While this data is preliminary and is incomplete for at least the last eight weeks of reported data, it provides for useful context.

[kalm]

A quick search indicates around 80% of cases are mild to moderate. Still learning about long term effects.

I apologize for using the WWII comparison again but we will pass combat deaths this month. We’re exceeding a 9/11 and Pearl Harbor every day right now and probably will for the next month or so.

People emotionally react to those type of numbers differently. We’re still mourning those tragedies decades later. I’m all for using cold-hearted calculations but at some point morality plays a role in decisions. Like the preventable nature of Covid at the sacrifice of temporary bar attendance and family gatherings. And emergency financial aide to get us through.

“That fascism sounds dangerous and all but I’m not sure we can afford to build all of these tanks, President Roosevelt. It will surely put us in debt and we need to at least prioritize Wall Street first”.

7,123 people die every day in the U.S. from a wide variety of causes. I don't see anybody making a deal about those people and their family's. All deaths are a tragedy and we should do our best to prevent them shouldn't we? It shouldn't matter if it is from the COVID epidemic or the obesity epidemic.

Obesity is a direct contributor to about 300,000 deaths a year, yet I don't see a mandatory exercise program and meal plan put in place for everybody to try and prevent the above deaths. Isn't the point is if it just saves one life, we should do whatever it takes? Think of how many people (grandma's and grandpa's) could live fuller lives and see their family's if we all just gave up our fast food and exercised a bit more.

The above is tongue-in-cheek a bit but it isn't it hypocritical of us to do what we are doing via lock downs and these "extraordinary" measures when we could save the same number of lives by banning Big Macs or McRibs? I fully realize that this was a bit of uncharted territory and we didn't know how the virus acted in the beginning, so I am not arguing against the measures taken back then but to continue to extend them and treat this "epidemic" the same now as it was back then is purely political in nature. Clear thinking and level headedness has gone straight out the window in the name of political gamesmanship and taking advantage of peoples emotions.

I realize I am probably a full bastard for even going down this road and not having empathy for the dead but to continue to make excuses of not knowing enough or peoples feelings is just a bit mind boggling to me. I fully admit we don't know the long term consequences yet but to use that as some kind of crutch to support ones position is disingenuous in the face of the data we do know, and that is for the vast majority of people it will do nothing and extrapolating long term based on the data we do know, the risk is minimal in the face of what our "cure" is doing to peoples livelihood.

A quote from season two of the Mandalorian stuck with me where an Imperial officer, Valin Hess, stated "Everybody thinks they want freedom, but what they really want is order". Isn't that the true mindset of the response of the majority American people during this "crises"?


Not directing this directly at you Klam, just using your point as a segway into something I have been giving a bit of thought to lately. Probably should cut back on the rum and brandy in my Tom & Jerry mix.

No worries, I truly appreciate your thoughts here.

Covid is contagious. Fast food is not. Some dude eating an extra Big Mac doesn’t immediately threaten my life or my family’s. Same dude not taking precautions to prevent Covid infection does and can also impact my “freedoms.”

Other causes of potentially long term illness and the premature deaths they cause are addressed constantly in our culture. Because mitigating untimely deaths is a good thing. That they (untimely deaths) continue to occur doesn’t mean we still don’t try to reduce them or that lumping an additional 350K on top is worth the sacrifice.

The obvious concern is the value of preventative measures and their extended threat to freedom.

Since we don’t know all the long term consequences of lockdowns versus herd immunity or the long term economic impacts of either, I’m going to err on the side of caution.

The simultaneous tragedy here is not taking the financial steps to make lockdowns survivable.

Question: If businesses and incomes were guaranteed security through lockdowns would you have the same issues?

[SeattleGriz]

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/01/08 ... task-force

Looks like speculation run wild...just like the UK/S Africa variants being more lethal.

More scaremongering by the media. Dr Birx was correct in her assumption, but the media did what the media does.

Officials Say Reports of New U.S. Coronavirus Variant Are Inaccurate

[BDKJMU]

A quick search indicates around 80% of cases are mild to moderate. Still learning about long term effects.

I apologize for using the WWII comparison again but we will pass combat deaths this month. We’re exceeding a 9/11 and Pearl Harbor every day right now and probably will for the next month or so.

People emotionally react to those type of numbers differently. We’re still mourning those tragedies decades later. I’m all for using cold-hearted calculations but at some point morality plays a role in decisions. Like the preventable nature of Covid at the sacrifice of temporary bar attendance and family gatherings. And emergency financial aide to get us through.

“That fascism sounds dangerous and all but I’m not sure we can afford to build all of these tanks, President Roosevelt. It will surely put us in debt and we need to at least prioritize Wall Street first”.

7,123 people die every day in the U.S. from a wide variety of causes. I don't see anybody making a deal about those people and their family's. All deaths are a tragedy and we should do our best to prevent them shouldn't we? It shouldn't matter if it is from the COVID epidemic or the obesity epidemic.

Obesity is a direct contributor to about 300,000 deaths a year, yet I don't see a mandatory exercise program and meal plan put in place for everybody to try and prevent the above deaths. Isn't the point is if it just saves one life, we should do whatever it takes? Think of how many people (grandma's and grandpa's) could live fuller lives and see their family's if we all just gave up our fast food and exercised a bit more.

The above is tongue-in-cheek a bit but it isn't it hypocritical of us to do what we are doing via lock downs and these "extraordinary" measures when we could save the same number of lives by banning Big Macs or McRibs? I fully realize that this was a bit of uncharted territory and we didn't know how the virus acted in the beginning, so I am not arguing against the measures taken back then but to continue to extend them and treat this "epidemic" the same now as it was back then is purely political in nature. Clear thinking and level headedness has gone straight out the window in the name of political gamesmanship and taking advantage of peoples emotions.

I realize I am probably a full bastard for even going down this road and not having empathy for the dead but to continue to make excuses of not knowing enough or peoples feelings is just a bit mind boggling to me. I fully admit we don't know the long term consequences yet but to use that as some kind of crutch to support ones position is disingenuous in the face of the data we do know, and that is for the vast majority of people it will do nothing and extrapolating long term based on the data we do know, the risk is minimal in the face of what our "cure" is doing to peoples livelihood.

A quote from season two of the Mandalorian stuck with me where an Imperial officer, Valin Hess, stated "Everybody thinks they want freedom, but what they really want is order". Isn't that the true mindset of the response of the majority American people during this "crises"?


Not directing this directly at you Klam, just using your point as a segway into something I have been giving a bit of thought to lately. Probably should cut back on the rum and brandy in my Tom & Jerry mix.

2.8 million deaths 2019 / 365 = 7,676.93 deaths a day.

[BDKJMU]

7,123 people die every day in the U.S. from a wide variety of causes. I don't see anybody making a deal about those people and their family's. All deaths are a tragedy and we should do our best to prevent them shouldn't we? It shouldn't matter if it is from the COVID epidemic or the obesity epidemic.

Obesity is a direct contributor to about 300,000 deaths a year, yet I don't see a mandatory exercise program and meal plan put in place for everybody to try and prevent the above deaths. Isn't the point is if it just saves one life, we should do whatever it takes? Think of how many people (grandma's and grandpa's) could live fuller lives and see their family's if we all just gave up our fast food and exercised a bit more.

The above is tongue-in-cheek a bit but it isn't it hypocritical of us to do what we are doing via lock downs and these "extraordinary" measures when we could save the same number of lives by banning Big Macs or McRibs? I fully realize that this was a bit of uncharted territory and we didn't know how the virus acted in the beginning, so I am not arguing against the measures taken back then but to continue to extend them and treat this "epidemic" the same now as it was back then is purely political in nature. Clear thinking and level headedness has gone straight out the window in the name of political gamesmanship and taking advantage of peoples emotions.

I realize I am probably a full bastard for even going down this road and not having empathy for the dead but to continue to make excuses of not knowing enough or peoples feelings is just a bit mind boggling to me. I fully admit we don't know the long term consequences yet but to use that as some kind of crutch to support ones position is disingenuous in the face of the data we do know, and that is for the vast majority of people it will do nothing and extrapolating long term based on the data we do know, the risk is minimal in the face of what our "cure" is doing to peoples livelihood.

A quote from season two of the Mandalorian stuck with me where an Imperial officer, Valin Hess, stated "Everybody thinks they want freedom, but what they really want is order". Isn't that the true mindset of the response of the majority American people during this "crises"?


Not directing this directly at you Klam, just using your point as a segway into something I have been giving a bit of thought to lately. Probably should cut back on the rum and brandy in my Tom & Jerry mix.

No worries, I truly appreciate your thoughts here.

Covid is contagious. Fast food is not. Some dude eating an extra Big Mac doesn’t immediately threaten my life or my family’s. Same dude not taking precautions to prevent Covid infection does and can also impact my “freedoms.”

Other causes of potentially long term illness and the premature deaths they cause are addressed constantly in our culture. Because mitigating untimely deaths is a good thing. That they (untimely deaths) continue to occur doesn’t mean we still don’t try to reduce them or that lumping an additional 350K on top is worth the sacrifice.

The obvious concern is the value of preventative measures and their extended threat to freedom.

Since we don’t know all the long term consequences of lockdowns versus herd immunity or the long term economic impacts of either, I’m going to err on the side of caution.

The simultaneous tragedy here is not taking the financial steps to make lockdowns survivable.

Question: If businesses and incomes were guaranteed security through lockdowns would you have the same issues?

Where would the literally tens of trillions of $$$ come from to pay for a year for almost the entire country to be shut down?

[Gil Dobie]

7,123 people die every day in the U.S. from a wide variety of causes. I don't see anybody making a deal about those people and their family's. All deaths are a tragedy and we should do our best to prevent them shouldn't we? It shouldn't matter if it is from the COVID epidemic or the obesity epidemic.

Obesity is a direct contributor to about 300,000 deaths a year, yet I don't see a mandatory exercise program and meal plan put in place for everybody to try and prevent the above deaths. Isn't the point is if it just saves one life, we should do whatever it takes? Think of how many people (grandma's and grandpa's) could live fuller lives and see their family's if we all just gave up our fast food and exercised a bit more.

The above is tongue-in-cheek a bit but it isn't it hypocritical of us to do what we are doing via lock downs and these "extraordinary" measures when we could save the same number of lives by banning Big Macs or McRibs? I fully realize that this was a bit of uncharted territory and we didn't know how the virus acted in the beginning, so I am not arguing against the measures taken back then but to continue to extend them and treat this "epidemic" the same now as it was back then is purely political in nature. Clear thinking and level headedness has gone straight out the window in the name of political gamesmanship and taking advantage of peoples emotions.

I realize I am probably a full bastard for even going down this road and not having empathy for the dead but to continue to make excuses of not knowing enough or peoples feelings is just a bit mind boggling to me. I fully admit we don't know the long term consequences yet but to use that as some kind of crutch to support ones position is disingenuous in the face of the data we do know, and that is for the vast majority of people it will do nothing and extrapolating long term based on the data we do know, the risk is minimal in the face of what our "cure" is doing to peoples livelihood.

A quote from season two of the Mandalorian stuck with me where an Imperial officer, Valin Hess, stated "Everybody thinks they want freedom, but what they really want is order". Isn't that the true mindset of the response of the majority American people during this "crises"?


Not directing this directly at you Klam, just using your point as a segway into something I have been giving a bit of thought to lately. Probably should cut back on the rum and brandy in my Tom & Jerry mix.

2.8 million deaths 2019 / 365 = 7,676.93 deaths a day.

3,187,086 million deaths 2020 / 366 = 8707.89 deaths a day.

[BDKJMU]

2.8 million deaths 2019 / 365 = 7,676.93 deaths a day.

3,187,086 million deaths 2020 / 366 = 8707.89 deaths a day.

About 89% which weren't China Virus deaths..

[Gil Dobie]

3,187,086 million deaths 2020 / 366 = 8707.89 deaths a day.

About 89% which weren't China Virus deaths..

You missed this before, Covid is #3 for 2020.

Heart disease and cancer lead causes of death for 2020. Still over 45,000 flu/pneumonia deaths despite Covid totals.
link

[BDKJMU]

About 89% which weren't China Virus deaths..

You missed this before, Covid is #3 for 2020.

Heart disease and cancer lead causes of death for 2020. Still over 45,000 flu/pneumonia deaths despite Covid totals.
link

350k out of 3.2 million + about 11%..

[Gil Dobie]

You missed this before, Covid is #3 for 2020.

Heart disease and cancer lead causes of death for 2020. Still over 45,000 flu/pneumonia deaths despite Covid totals.
link

350k out of 3.2 million + about 11%..

I know you don't give a fuck about anyone that dies from Covid, typical Trumpette.

[BDKJMU]

350k out of 3.2 million + about 11%..

I know you don't give a fuck about anyone that dies from Covid, typical Trumpette.

Quit hyperventilating. You have clearly fallen for the plandemic hysteria hook, line, and sinker.

[UNI88]

I know you don't give a fuck about anyone that dies from Covid, typical Trumpette.

Quit hyperventilating. You have clearly fallen for the plandemic hysteria hook, line, and sinker.

Kind of like you falling for the election was stolen hysteria?