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Just for the record, I'm fine with charging these two guys (as long as prosecutors don't stupidly go for premeditated murder charges or hate crimes out of pandering).GannonFan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:14 am I don't blame the victim at all. Clear case in my mind on this one that the two white dudes in the pickup truck are fully in the wrong. This wasn't their property, they didn't have any standing to accost this guy in the middle of the street brandishing weapons. If I think two guys with weapons might kill me I might fight back as well. There wasn't any need to stop this guy while brandishing weapons. The two white guys should spend a long time in prison as a result of this. Fortunately it was filmed - video isn't perfect, but it's more than enough to show the white dudes in the wrong here.
These guys are claiming a citizen's arrest. Good luck with that defense. And regarding your statement, "do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent'... lolwtf? No, if you feel your life is in danger, you do whatever the fuck you think you need to do to survive. The dipshit with the long gun broke every rule of defensive carry. You DO NOT present the weapon unless your life is in imminent danger. That's how Zimmerman got off. There was no video and his lawyer painted the picture that his life was in danger. The pickup bubba's obviously were in no danger that they didn't create themselves.Pwns wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:34 amJust for the record, I'm fine with charging these two guys (as long as prosecutors don't stupidly go for premeditated murder charges or hate crimes out of pandering).GannonFan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:14 am I don't blame the victim at all. Clear case in my mind on this one that the two white dudes in the pickup truck are fully in the wrong. This wasn't their property, they didn't have any standing to accost this guy in the middle of the street brandishing weapons. If I think two guys with weapons might kill me I might fight back as well. There wasn't any need to stop this guy while brandishing weapons. The two white guys should spend a long time in prison as a result of this. Fortunately it was filmed - video isn't perfect, but it's more than enough to show the white dudes in the wrong here.
But I don't care if you're getting robbed or if you're up against some wannabe neighborhood cop...do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent.
Really, this seems a lot like Trayvon Martin except there's a chance Martin didn't know George Zimmerman was armed.
According to reports, Arbery was jogging in the Satilla Shores neighborhood on February 23 when a man and his son chased him down and confronted him. A struggle would follow and would end with Arbery shot and killed. The men, Gregory and Travis McMichael, told police later that they thought he looked like the suspect in a series of recent break-ins in the area.
To date, no charges have been filed in the incident. Travis McMichael claims he was acting within the scope of a citizen's arrest.
Wait...they haven’t been charges?93henfan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:39 amThese guys are claiming a citizen's arrest. Good luck with that defense. And regarding your statement, "do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent'... lolwtf? No, if you feel your life is in danger, you do whatever the fuck you think you need to do to survive. The dipshit with the long gun broke every rule of defensive carry. You DO NOT present the weapon unless your life is in imminent danger. That's how Zimmerman got off. There was no video and his lawyer painted the picture that his life was in danger. The pickup bubba's obviously were in no danger that they didn't create themselves.Pwns wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:34 am
Just for the record, I'm fine with charging these two guys (as long as prosecutors don't stupidly go for premeditated murder charges or hate crimes out of pandering).
But I don't care if you're getting robbed or if you're up against some wannabe neighborhood cop...do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent.
Really, this seems a lot like Trayvon Martin except there's a chance Martin didn't know George Zimmerman was armed.
More background:According to reports, Arbery was jogging in the Satilla Shores neighborhood on February 23 when a man and his son chased him down and confronted him. A struggle would follow and would end with Arbery shot and killed. The men, Gregory and Travis McMichael, told police later that they thought he looked like the suspect in a series of recent break-ins in the area.
To date, no charges have been filed in the incident. Travis McMichael claims he was acting within the scope of a citizen's arrest.
I don't see premeditated murder, but I have no problem if they tacked on the hate crime label. Would they have gone after another guy if he was white? Unlikely. The fact that they were white and he was black is certainly going to be material in this. But that can come out in discovery and at the trial. These guys are guilty and are going to jail, I don't think there's a lot of doubt about that. Just a question of how long.Pwns wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:34 amJust for the record, I'm fine with charging these two guys (as long as prosecutors don't stupidly go for premeditated murder charges or hate crimes out of pandering).GannonFan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:14 am I don't blame the victim at all. Clear case in my mind on this one that the two white dudes in the pickup truck are fully in the wrong. This wasn't their property, they didn't have any standing to accost this guy in the middle of the street brandishing weapons. If I think two guys with weapons might kill me I might fight back as well. There wasn't any need to stop this guy while brandishing weapons. The two white guys should spend a long time in prison as a result of this. Fortunately it was filmed - video isn't perfect, but it's more than enough to show the white dudes in the wrong here.
But I don't care if you're getting robbed or if you're up against some wannabe neighborhood cop...do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent.
Really, this seems a lot like Trayvon Martin except there's a chance Martin didn't know George Zimmerman was armed.
kalm wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:48 amWait...they haven’t been charges?93henfan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:39 am
These guys are claiming a citizen's arrest. Good luck with that defense. And regarding your statement, "do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent'... lolwtf? No, if you feel your life is in danger, you do whatever the fuck you think you need to do to survive. The dipshit with the long gun broke every rule of defensive carry. You DO NOT present the weapon unless your life is in imminent danger. That's how Zimmerman got off. There was no video and his lawyer painted the picture that his life was in danger. The pickup bubba's obviously were in no danger that they didn't create themselves.
More background:
There will be now with this video.kalm wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:48 amWait...they haven’t been charges?93henfan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:39 am
These guys are claiming a citizen's arrest. Good luck with that defense. And regarding your statement, "do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent'... lolwtf? No, if you feel your life is in danger, you do whatever the fuck you think you need to do to survive. The dipshit with the long gun broke every rule of defensive carry. You DO NOT present the weapon unless your life is in imminent danger. That's how Zimmerman got off. There was no video and his lawyer painted the picture that his life was in danger. The pickup bubba's obviously were in no danger that they didn't create themselves.
More background:
I'm sure they'll now look into the background of these guys - have they been in a crime before, do they have a history of trying to make citizen's arrests and is there a racial pattern to that, what have they posted on the internet, etc. If they've done stuff or said stuff that paints them as racists then they'll likely go with the hate crime label. I don't feel sorry for them if that's the case - don't want to get charged with a hate crime? Well, don't be a white person and have a racist background and then go out with weapons, confront an unarmed black guy in the street, and shoot him dead. Avoiding a hate crime was very possible in this case. And who makes citizen's arrests anyway? In the middle of the day, with this guy jogging in broad daylight on a public road?
You're talking about legalities, here. I don't think there's any question which party committed the crime. I'm just saying if it's me, my concern isn't being in the right legally but surviving. If someone tries to rob me at gunpoint or carjack me, I understand some thugs will shoot even if you give them what you want, but I'm not trying to get the gun unless I'm sure I'll get shot no matter what I do (especially if there's two guys).93henfan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:39 am
These guys are claiming a citizen's arrest. Good luck with that defense. And regarding your statement, "do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent'... lolwtf? No, if you feel your life is in danger, you do whatever the fuck you think you need to do to survive. The dipshit with the long gun broke every rule of defensive carry. You DO NOT present the weapon unless your life is in imminent danger. That's how Zimmerman got off. There was no video and his lawyer painted the picture that his life was in danger. The pickup bubba's obviously were in no danger that they didn't create themselves.
Oh, so you can tell this in a split second upon having someone pull a gun on you? Sure.Pwns wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 9:19 amYou're talking about legalities, here. I don't think there's any question which party committed the crime. I'm just saying if it's me, my concern isn't being in the right legally but surviving. If someone tries to rob me at gunpoint or carjack me, I understand some thugs will shoot even if you give them what you want, but I'm not trying to get the gun unless I'm sure I'll get shot no matter what I do (especially if there's two guys).93henfan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:39 am
These guys are claiming a citizen's arrest. Good luck with that defense. And regarding your statement, "do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent'... lolwtf? No, if you feel your life is in danger, you do whatever the fuck you think you need to do to survive. The dipshit with the long gun broke every rule of defensive carry. You DO NOT present the weapon unless your life is in imminent danger. That's how Zimmerman got off. There was no video and his lawyer painted the picture that his life was in danger. The pickup bubba's obviously were in no danger that they didn't create themselves.
This didn't look like a robbery or a carjacking - it looked like these white guys thought this black guy was a criminal and they were going to do something about it - with weapons. And the fact that this happened in late February and these guys have been free and uncharged since then (so about two and a half months) and would still be in the clear if there wasn't a video, at least goes to show that there's a reasonable belief in that area that white people with weapons can confront a black guy without one and do whatever they want. If I'm a black guy in that scenario I'm not going to just let happen whatever they want - I wouldn't trust these guys to be fair and judicial.Pwns wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 9:19 amYou're talking about legalities, here. I don't think there's any question which party committed the crime. I'm just saying if it's me, my concern isn't being in the right legally but surviving. If someone tries to rob me at gunpoint or carjack me, I understand some thugs will shoot even if you give them what you want, but I'm not trying to get the gun unless I'm sure I'll get shot no matter what I do (especially if there's two guys).93henfan wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 8:39 am
These guys are claiming a citizen's arrest. Good luck with that defense. And regarding your statement, "do not try to take the gun unless you're sure getting shot is imminent'... lolwtf? No, if you feel your life is in danger, you do whatever the fuck you think you need to do to survive. The dipshit with the long gun broke every rule of defensive carry. You DO NOT present the weapon unless your life is in imminent danger. That's how Zimmerman got off. There was no video and his lawyer painted the picture that his life was in danger. The pickup bubba's obviously were in no danger that they didn't create themselves.
The two grabbed a shotgun and a pistol and followed Arbery in their truck, police said. Travis McMichael, the driver, followed Arbery and then attempted to cut him off, the report said. Arbery turned around and began running in the opposite direction, the police report said.
They chased Arbery to a nearby intersection, where they caught up to him, the report said.
...
At best, the men had the authority to follow Arbery and send law enforcement to that location, Merritt said. The 911 calls show the call taker was asking the men what Arbery is doing that was of criminal concern, Merritt said.
"They didn't give any answer for that, they said, 'He's a black man running down our road,'" Merritt said.
No argument from me on that one. He's fanned those flames.Skjellyfetti wrote: ↑Wed May 06, 2020 12:47 pm Trump has done a poor job healing the racial divisions of the country.
