2020 General Election

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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by kalm »

SDHornet wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:06 pm
Winterborn wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 8:32 pm Joe Biden is allegedly putting together an interesting cabinet. The ending does have some strong language as a FYI.

At what point do the progressives realize they've been hoodwinked?

Or has that come and gone and I missed it?
Considering the word “populism” has been used to describe right wing movements and candidates by establishment media, they should have anticipated getting kicked to the curb heading in to this election.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by kalm »

SDHornet wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:17 pm
JohnStOnge wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:24 pm

I think it's likely that there was a little bit of what may be characterized as "fraud" by virtue of some form of illegal voting, etc. I think there probably always is. But I also think that there was nothing unusual in that regard with this election and it can go both ways.

For example: I saw a story yesterday about a big deal that was made about a woman who brought in a mail ballot for her mother who had died. That was an illegal vote. But the daughter said the vote was for Trump. And the daughter wasn't intentionally trying to do anything wrong. She was just trying to have her recently deceased mother's will expressed.

This whole thing is ridiculous. The People have clearly spoken. Biden being President is the Will of the People. If Trump somehow succeeds in thwarting that it is going to be a historic crisis and an historic injustice. It would be a very serious problem for this country.

We already have a serious problem because Trump is even doing this bogus shit. The best case end of this situation is that the legitimate winner, Biden, takes office and almost half the country believes he's illegitimate because they buy Trump's bullshit. The worst case end is that we actually have the Will of the People overturned. Right now I don't think that's going to happen. I hope not. But the fact that we even have a Presidential candidate doing it while being supported by a major political party in his effort is a serious problem.
:rofl: at your weak ass attempt to diminish voter fraud.

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Where’s the fraud? Are the Republican SOS’s who claim no irregularities in on it?
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

Obviously don't know if all the talk is true about voter and election fraud, but it sure is interesting. Been seeing how information is coming forward you wouldn't expect, and it's due to the average person doing the work.

Right now it feels like the investigation of Obamagate. Lots of talk about proof, but not holding my breath it will see the light of day, or even worse, is bullshit.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by UNI88 »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:35 am Obviously don't know if all the talk is true about voter and election fraud, but it sure is interesting. Been seeing how information is coming forward you wouldn't expect, and it's due to the average person doing the work.

Right now it feels like the investigation of Obamagate. Lots of talk about proof, but not holding my breath it will see the light of day, or even worse, is bullshit.
Trump has been President for almost 4 years. If there was definitive proof of Obamagate wouldn't it have come to light by now? Or is the deep state hiding it? Obamagate seems to belong right there with Trump/Russia collusion, Hunter/Ukraine, etc. There is smoke but not enough substantive evidence.

The number of Uumpa Trumpas who belittle Russian collusion but scream about Hunter/Ukraine and the number of pseudo-progressives that do the opposite is mind-boggling.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

UNI88 wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 10:23 am
SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:35 am Obviously don't know if all the talk is true about voter and election fraud, but it sure is interesting. Been seeing how information is coming forward you wouldn't expect, and it's due to the average person doing the work.

Right now it feels like the investigation of Obamagate. Lots of talk about proof, but not holding my breath it will see the light of day, or even worse, is bullshit.
Trump has been President for almost 4 years. If there was definitive proof of Obamagate wouldn't it have come to light by now? Or is the deep state hiding it? Obamagate seems to belong right there with Trump/Russia collusion, Hunter/Ukraine, etc. There is smoke but not enough substantive evidence.

The number of Uumpa Trumpas who belittle Russian collusion but scream about Hunter/Ukraine and the number of pseudo-progressives that do the opposite is mind-boggling.
Oh don't think I don't agree with you. I'm on record many times on this board as saying that no one of consequence will go to jail, if anyone at all.

Supposedly Barr was hoping that his investigator, John Durham, was going to wrap up his investigation before the election, but COVID delayed that effort.

I do see how this seems exactly like all smoke.

In regards to Obamagate, there is proof that has been out there for three years. FISA judge Rosemary Colyer released a report that documented how the FBI and non FBI contractors were abusing the 702 system to perform political surveillance.

I don't view that as Dems vs Reps as much as I view it as a huge 4th amendment violation. The type of violation we were told would never happen.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

kalm wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:54 am
SDHornet wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:17 pm

:rofl: at your weak ass attempt to diminish voter fraud.

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Where’s the fraud? Are the Republican SOS’s who claim no irregularities in on it?
You'd have to ask Biden's Chief of Staff as he's the one who said it.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

kalm wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:26 am
SDHornet wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:06 pm

At what point do the progressives realize they've been hoodwinked?

Or has that come and gone and I missed it?
Considering the word “populism” has been used to describe right wing movements and candidates by establishment media, they should have anticipated getting kicked to the curb heading in to this election.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

What Trump appears to be doing now is trying to stop or delay State certification of results in States where he lost but there are Republican legislatures with the aim of having deadlines missed so that the Republican legislatures choose the electors instead of having electors chosen based on the vote of the People.

Do you Trump cultists on here support that?
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 11:46 am
UNI88 wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 10:23 am

Trump has been President for almost 4 years. If there was definitive proof of Obamagate wouldn't it have come to light by now? Or is the deep state hiding it? Obamagate seems to belong right there with Trump/Russia collusion, Hunter/Ukraine, etc. There is smoke but not enough substantive evidence.

The number of Uumpa Trumpas who belittle Russian collusion but scream about Hunter/Ukraine and the number of pseudo-progressives that do the opposite is mind-boggling.
Oh don't think I don't agree with you. I'm on record many times on this board as saying that no one of consequence will go to jail, if anyone at all.

Supposedly Barr was hoping that his investigator, John Durham, was going to wrap up his investigation before the election, but COVID delayed that effort.

I do see how this seems exactly like all smoke.

In regards to Obamagate, there is proof that has been out there for three years. FISA judge Rosemary Colyer released a report that documented how the FBI and non FBI contractors were abusing the 702 system to perform political surveillance.

I don't view that as Dems vs Reps as much as I view it as a huge 4th amendment violation. The type of violation we were told would never happen.
You really need to get out of the conservative misinformation bubble.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:55 pm
SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 11:46 am

Oh don't think I don't agree with you. I'm on record many times on this board as saying that no one of consequence will go to jail, if anyone at all.

Supposedly Barr was hoping that his investigator, John Durham, was going to wrap up his investigation before the election, but COVID delayed that effort.

I do see how this seems exactly like all smoke.

In regards to Obamagate, there is proof that has been out there for three years. FISA judge Rosemary Colyer released a report that documented how the FBI and non FBI contractors were abusing the 702 system to perform political surveillance.

I don't view that as Dems vs Reps as much as I view it as a huge 4th amendment violation. The type of violation we were told would never happen.
You really need to get out of the conservative misinformation bubble.
That's what I've been trying to do. After the 2016 election, I swore off all mainstream media and looked for alternatives. My goal was to see if I could count on these alternatives to give me correct news.

It all hinges on whether Bill Barr prosecutes anyone for Obamagate, because it's been proven the Liberal side has been lying for the last four years, so that's all that is left to run its course.

If Barr does nothing, finding the truth is impossible unless it is your full time job, because I've looked for it.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Skjellyfetti »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 11:46 am
Supposedly Barr was hoping that his investigator, John Durham, was going to wrap up his investigation before the election, but COVID delayed that effort.
'Unmasking' probe pushed by Barr ends with no charges
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justic ... s-n1243397
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

Baldy wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:26 am
SDHornet wrote: Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:17 pm

:rofl: at your weak ass attempt to diminish voter fraud.

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:lol:

Biden's new Chief of Staff.

He prolly meant to say that elections are only rigged when Donks lose.
He appears to be talking about the advantage of incumbency there. I doubt that he ever claimed a Presidential election was rigged as the Trump people are ridiculously claiming now.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

https://fox11online.com/news/beyond-the ... an-history
DHS agency: 'Nov. 3 election was most secure in American history'
“While we know there are many unfounded claims and opportunities for misinformation about the process of our elections, we can assure you we have the utmost confidence in the security and integrity of our elections, and you should too,”
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

I heard two Georgia officials talk today about the Georgia recount. And now I'm wondering why the heck they are doing it.

In each case, the Georgia official involved said that there would be differences between the hand audit and the original count because the original count was done by machine and the hand audit would be done by humans so there would be human error. So they both basically said that a hand count would not be as reliable as a machine count.

The first guy even talked about how people might get sleepy and make mistakes and such.

So why the hell are they doing it? The second guy said they're doing it because some people don't trust the machines. But they BOTH said that the machine count is more reliable.

So, in the unlikely event that there was a big difference between the two, what the heck would they do? Going in they knew that the original machine count is more accurate. So they get a big difference. THEN what?
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by BDKJMU »

JohnStOnge wrote: Mon Nov 09, 2020 8:10 pm BTW, once again I expect that people will say the polls were way off and, once again, objective assessment will indicate that perception is exaggerated. If you look at the Real Clear Politics election even projections at https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... e_map.html you will see that they had 18 jurisdictions in the Biden column and 20 in the Trump column along with 14 in the "Toss Up" column.

All 18 they had in the Biden column were won by Biden. All 20 they had in the Trump column were won by Trump. Among the "Toss Up" states, Biden won 7, Trump won 4, and 3 are currently listed as too close to call (looks like Biden will win 2 and Trump 1).

The popular vote Real Clear Politics average of polling on election even had it at Biden by 7.2 percent and right now the margin is only 2.9. However, 11% of California's votes have not been counted yet and 26% of New York's votes have not been counted yet. So the final actual popular vote margin will get somewhat higher. Probably won't be 7.2 percent. But 7.2 percent probably won't be that far off when all the counting is done.

My impression is there was probably some bias in Biden's direction. Looking at a few things I think it likely Republican turnout was greater than anticipated. But it's not going to be that much. For the most part, if there was high confidence that one candidate or the other was going to win a State that candidate won the State.
I saw your boy Nate Silver at 538 had the national polling avg at Biden +8.4. So he was WAY off. But the national polling is irrelevant. All that matters is the swing states. 538 was also further off than the RCP at swing states (maybe because 538 excluded Trafalgar). If you remove Trafalgar from some of these RCP pre election averages, its looks even worse for the polls in that they would be 1 to 2 points even further off for Biden (like 538).
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 4:28 pm
JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:55 pm

You really need to get out of the conservative misinformation bubble.
That's what I've been trying to do. After the 2016 election, I swore off all mainstream media and looked for alternatives. My goal was to see if I could count on these alternatives to give me correct news.

It all hinges on whether Bill Barr prosecutes anyone for Obamagate, because it's been proven the Liberal side has been lying for the last four years, so that's all that is left to run its course.

If Barr does nothing, finding the truth is impossible unless it is your full time job, because I've looked for it.
Whatever you looked into is totally divorced from reality.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

BDKJMU wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:46 pm
JohnStOnge wrote: Mon Nov 09, 2020 8:10 pm BTW, once again I expect that people will say the polls were way off and, once again, objective assessment will indicate that perception is exaggerated. If you look at the Real Clear Politics election even projections at https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... e_map.html you will see that they had 18 jurisdictions in the Biden column and 20 in the Trump column along with 14 in the "Toss Up" column.

All 18 they had in the Biden column were won by Biden. All 20 they had in the Trump column were won by Trump. Among the "Toss Up" states, Biden won 7, Trump won 4, and 3 are currently listed as too close to call (looks like Biden will win 2 and Trump 1).

The popular vote Real Clear Politics average of polling on election even had it at Biden by 7.2 percent and right now the margin is only 2.9. However, 11% of California's votes have not been counted yet and 26% of New York's votes have not been counted yet. So the final actual popular vote margin will get somewhat higher. Probably won't be 7.2 percent. But 7.2 percent probably won't be that far off when all the counting is done.

My impression is there was probably some bias in Biden's direction. Looking at a few things I think it likely Republican turnout was greater than anticipated. But it's not going to be that much. For the most part, if there was high confidence that one candidate or the other was going to win a State that candidate won the State.
I saw your boy Nate Silver at 538 had the national polling avg at Biden +8.4. So he was WAY off. But the national polling is irrelevant. All that matters is the swing states. 538 was also further off than the RCP at swing states (maybe because 538 excluded Trafalgar). If you remove Trafalgar from some of these RCP pre election averages, its looks even worse for the polls in that they would be 1 to 2 points even further off for Biden (like 538).
I will wait until the results are completely in before taking a final look at it. But it's possible that when all is said and done, if you look at all of the States where Trafalgar did polling, that polling group did not do as well as you may think it did.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:18 pm I heard two Georgia officials talk today about the Georgia recount. And now I'm wondering why the heck they are doing it.

In each case, the Georgia official involved said that there would be differences between the hand audit and the original count because the original count was done by machine and the hand audit would be done by humans so there would be human error. So they both basically said that a hand count would not be as reliable as a machine count.

The first guy even talked about how people might get sleepy and make mistakes and such.

So why the hell are they doing it? The second guy said they're doing it because some people don't trust the machines. But they BOTH said that the machine count is more reliable.

So, in the unlikely event that there was a big difference between the two, what the heck would they do? Going in they knew that the original machine count is more accurate. So they get a big difference. THEN what?
Will the hand count have “glitches” that swap 6,000 votes from one candidate to the other?

The machine count is more accurate depending on what ballots are put in in the first place....if they only count legal ballots, the #’s could be very different.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:57 pm
SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 4:28 pm

That's what I've been trying to do. After the 2016 election, I swore off all mainstream media and looked for alternatives. My goal was to see if I could count on these alternatives to give me correct news.

It all hinges on whether Bill Barr prosecutes anyone for Obamagate, because it's been proven the Liberal side has been lying for the last four years, so that's all that is left to run its course.

If Barr does nothing, finding the truth is impossible unless it is your full time job, because I've looked for it.
Whatever you looked into is totally divorced from reality.
Once again. You're the one who watched the Covington Catholic video and said you saw no wrong doing by the Black Hebrew Israelites.

You, apparently have issues judging reality and reading context and people, so you have NO leg to stand on judging others bud.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by BDKJMU »

JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:04 pm
BDKJMU wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:46 pm
I saw your boy Nate Silver at 538 had the national polling avg at Biden +8.4. So he was WAY off. But the national polling is irrelevant. All that matters is the swing states. 538 was also further off than the RCP at swing states (maybe because 538 excluded Trafalgar). If you remove Trafalgar from some of these RCP pre election averages, its looks even worse for the polls in that they would be 1 to 2 points even further off for Biden (like 538).
I will wait until the results are completely in before taking a final look at it. But it's possible that when all is said and done, if you look at all of the States where Trafalgar did polling, that polling group did not do as well as you may think it did.
The polling organizations acknowleged mistakes in 2016, and claimed they had made corrections/adjustments, yet they were worse.

The Senate races were even worse than Biden/Trump. Look at all these Fake News polls.

Maine
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... -6928.html
NC:
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... -6908.html
Iowa:
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... -7072.html
Michigan:
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... -6964.html
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Re: 2020 General Election

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JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:18 pm I heard two Georgia officials talk today about the Georgia recount. And now I'm wondering why the heck they are doing it.

In each case, the Georgia official involved said that there would be differences between the hand audit and the original count because the original count was done by machine and the hand audit would be done by humans so there would be human error. So they both basically said that a hand count would not be as reliable as a machine count.

The first guy even talked about how people might get sleepy and make mistakes and such.

So why the hell are they doing it? The second guy said they're doing it because some people don't trust the machines. But they BOTH said that the machine count is more reliable.

So, in the unlikely event that there was a big difference between the two, what the heck would they do? Going in they knew that the original machine count is more accurate. So they get a big difference. THEN what?
You Leftists are psychotic. Just two short years ago you people were screaming for paper ballots because you didn't trust the machines, but now you're screaming how much more accurate the machines are.

You people are fucking nuts. :lol:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Ibanez »

Just saw the President Lawyer argued in court that this isn’t about fraud or stealing an election.



But Langhofer diverted sharply on Thursday from his boss' messaging. "This is not a fraud case. We are not alleging fraud. We are not saying anyone is trying to steal the election," the lawyer said during the evidentiary hearing.

https://www.newsweek.com/trump-campaign ... 7018?amp=1


I’m confused. I thought this WAS about fraud and stealing the election. Someone isn’t following the talking points.


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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Ibanez »

Baldy wrote:
JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:18 pm I heard two Georgia officials talk today about the Georgia recount. And now I'm wondering why the heck they are doing it.

In each case, the Georgia official involved said that there would be differences between the hand audit and the original count because the original count was done by machine and the hand audit would be done by humans so there would be human error. So they both basically said that a hand count would not be as reliable as a machine count.

The first guy even talked about how people might get sleepy and make mistakes and such.

So why the hell are they doing it? The second guy said they're doing it because some people don't trust the machines. But they BOTH said that the machine count is more reliable.

So, in the unlikely event that there was a big difference between the two, what the heck would they do? Going in they knew that the original machine count is more accurate. So they get a big difference. THEN what?
You Leftists are psychotic. Just two short years ago you people were screaming for paper ballots because you didn't trust the machines, but now you're screaming how much more accurate the machines are.

You people are fucking nuts. :lol:
That’s was 2016. Things change. Hypocrisy is post partisan.

I find it psychotic that people distrusts scientists, election experts, defense experts, cyber security experts and more BUT they’ll believe a known liar/reality tv star on everything because he’s the President. There’s a logically disconnect there.


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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Skjellyfetti »

BDKJMU wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 5:46 pm I saw your boy Nate Silver at 538 had the national polling avg at Biden +8.4. So he was WAY off. But the national polling is irrelevant. All that matters is the swing states. 538 was also further off than the RCP at swing states (maybe because 538 excluded Trafalgar). If you remove Trafalgar from some of these RCP pre election averages, its looks even worse for the polls in that they would be 1 to 2 points even further off for Biden (like 538).
Your boy Trafalgar did even worse at swing states. 538 missed 2.

Your boy missed MI, AZ, GA, NV, and PA and had the wrong guy winning.

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Re: 2020 General Election

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Lots of conk women won this election.

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