Breaking: Mass shooting in Illinois

[SeattleGriz]

These are the issues you believe are driving the shootings?

Among others. Violence is often borne of desperation and/or greed. Shifting cultural values with a perceived or real loss of freedom also contribute.

How about shitty parents?

[kalm]

Among others. Violence is often borne of desperation and/or greed. Shifting cultural values with a perceived or real loss of freedom also contribute.

How about shitty parents?

Yes of course that can contribute. And generationally.

So…create less desperation. Acknowledge that greed is not good. Promote/facilitate a society that enables positive parenting.

[houndawg]

Greater Chicago….where NO lives matter.

I'm going to butcher this, but the gist was that area also had more tough gun laws than others. A judge denied a request to have the more stringent rules lifted, as it was supposed to prevent this from happening.

works at least as well as speed limits

[houndawg]

Also supposedly the location for 16 candles and Ferris Bueller. Parade with cops already there for crowd and traffic management…something something one good guy with a gun…

Heavily armed nation. No guarantees of security. Surprised and thankful this doesn’t happen more.

Well if the guy was on a rooftop, with a good firing position & field of fire, that’s a whole another animal..

different than what?

He was shooting too fast to be aiming, the rhythm sounded like a trigger crank

Where were the good guys with the guns? They usually have some on the rooftops

[AZGrizFan]

How about shitty parents?

Yes of course that can contribute. And generationally.

So…create less desperation. Acknowledge that greed is not good. Promote/facilitate a society that enables positive parenting.

How about quit trying to convince the world that all white males are automatically toxic?

[BDKJMU]

Well if the guy was on a rooftop, with a good firing position & field of fire, that’s a whole another animal..

different than what?

He was shooting too fast to be aiming , the rhythm sounded like a trigger crank

Where were the good guys with the guns? They usually have some on the rooftops

Well since you were a potato peeler and not in the infantry maybe you never got to shoot much, much less crew serve, but even in full auto you are still aiming. This guy was shooting a semi auto rifle, maybe 2 rounds per second. Even with iron sights can still be aiming. It doesn’t need to be precise if shooting into a crowd from not that long of a distance, esp if only around 100 yards or so..

[AZGrizFan]

Well if the guy was on a rooftop, with a good firing position & field of fire, that’s a whole another animal..

different than what?

He was shooting too fast to be aiming, the rhythm sounded like a trigger crank

Where were the good guys with the guns? They usually have some on the rooftops

https://www.foxnews.com/us/richmond-pol ... s-shooting

[kalm]

Yes of course that can contribute. And generationally.

So…create less desperation. Acknowledge that greed is not good. Promote/facilitate a society that enables positive parenting.

How about quit trying to convince the world that all white males are automatically toxic?

Knock yourself out.

[GannonFan]

I bring this up to my wife all the time - we probably do have a problem with males in the school systems. We've done a real good job of trying to overcome gender stereotypes with girls, and now schools are filled with programs designed for and exclusive to girls - there's a Girls in STEM club at my kids schools, a Girls on the Run club (to get them into running and physical fitness), and a few other things that are exclusive to girls only. On the flip side, there's absolutely nothing for boys or specifically geared to boys. They publish the top 5% of the high school classes every year, and it's remarkable that almost always (although there are exceptions) girls are more prevalent on those lists than boys, and almost always significantly, often at a 2:1 ratio. Looking further, girls have long outpaced boys when it comes to attendance at college. I think the current rate right now is that girls make up 60% of all college attendees versus 40% for the guys. My son got into an honors program recently at the college he's going to attend in the Fall (incoming freshman - looking forward to cutting that check) and I asked the professors there whether they saw a difference in numbers of females to males in their program (they did, certainly much more females) and they thought it was just down to the fact that boys weren't putting the work in. Not sure how we overcome that. But it's a problem.

[AZGrizFan]

How about quit trying to convince the world that all white males are automatically toxic?

Knock yourself out.

Yeah, I’m talking about the media, social media, Hollywood, etc., etc.

[BDKJMU]

I bring this up to my wife all the time - we probably do have a problem with males in the school systems. We've done a real good job of trying to overcome gender stereotypes with girls, and now schools are filled with programs designed for and exclusive to girls - there's a Girls in STEM club at my kids schools, a Girls on the Run club (to get them into running and physical fitness), and a few other things that are exclusive to girls only. On the flip side, there's absolutely nothing for boys or specifically geared to boys. They publish the top 5% of the high school classes every year, and it's remarkable that almost always (although there are exceptions) girls are more prevalent on those lists than boys, and almost always significantly, often at a 2:1 ratio. Looking further, girls have long outpaced boys when it comes to attendance at college. I think the current rate right now is that girls make up 60% of all college attendees versus 40% for the guys. My son got into an honors program recently at the college he's going to attend in the Fall (incoming freshman - looking forward to cutting that check) and I asked the professors there whether they saw a difference in numbers of females to males in their program (they did, certainly much more females) and they thought it was just down to the fact that boys weren't putting the work in. Not sure how we overcome that. But it's a problem.

Well heck, your answer is right there. Knock down the # of programs specifically geared for girls, and create some for boys (so there's roughly an equal # of both).

[Pwns]

I bring this up to my wife all the time - we probably do have a problem with males in the school systems. We've done a real good job of trying to overcome gender stereotypes with girls, and now schools are filled with programs designed for and exclusive to girls - there's a Girls in STEM club at my kids schools, a Girls on the Run club (to get them into running and physical fitness), and a few other things that are exclusive to girls only. On the flip side, there's absolutely nothing for boys or specifically geared to boys. They publish the top 5% of the high school classes every year, and it's remarkable that almost always (although there are exceptions) girls are more prevalent on those lists than boys, and almost always significantly, often at a 2:1 ratio. Looking further, girls have long outpaced boys when it comes to attendance at college. I think the current rate right now is that girls make up 60% of all college attendees versus 40% for the guys. My son got into an honors program recently at the college he's going to attend in the Fall (incoming freshman - looking forward to cutting that check) and I asked the professors there whether they saw a difference in numbers of females to males in their program (they did, certainly much more females) and they thought it was just down to the fact that boys weren't putting the work in. Not sure how we overcome that. But it's a problem.

Correct, and it's not just academics. Its issues like underemployment and social isolation. And it's made worse that we're not allowed to talk about how we fail our young men, lest we blaspheme the state theology of wokeness.

It's not *all* of the problem, but GMAFB, guns have been around for much longer than these shootings have been epidemic.

[GannonFan]

I bring this up to my wife all the time - we probably do have a problem with males in the school systems. We've done a real good job of trying to overcome gender stereotypes with girls, and now schools are filled with programs designed for and exclusive to girls - there's a Girls in STEM club at my kids schools, a Girls on the Run club (to get them into running and physical fitness), and a few other things that are exclusive to girls only. On the flip side, there's absolutely nothing for boys or specifically geared to boys. They publish the top 5% of the high school classes every year, and it's remarkable that almost always (although there are exceptions) girls are more prevalent on those lists than boys, and almost always significantly, often at a 2:1 ratio. Looking further, girls have long outpaced boys when it comes to attendance at college. I think the current rate right now is that girls make up 60% of all college attendees versus 40% for the guys. My son got into an honors program recently at the college he's going to attend in the Fall (incoming freshman - looking forward to cutting that check) and I asked the professors there whether they saw a difference in numbers of females to males in their program (they did, certainly much more females) and they thought it was just down to the fact that boys weren't putting the work in. Not sure how we overcome that. But it's a problem.

Well heck, your answer is right there. Knock down the # of programs specifically geared for girls, and create some for boys (so there's roughly an equal # of both).

No need to diminish what's there for girls. Heck, most of those programs, even through the schools, are privately funded and staffed anyway - it's all volunteer work. No reason why the same couldn't be done for boys. Needs to be an awareness that this should be done and I'm sure private funding/staffing could be found for that too. I think it's more of the acknowledgement that there's a problem here that's the sticking point.

[kalm]

I bring this up to my wife all the time - we probably do have a problem with males in the school systems. We've done a real good job of trying to overcome gender stereotypes with girls, and now schools are filled with programs designed for and exclusive to girls - there's a Girls in STEM club at my kids schools, a Girls on the Run club (to get them into running and physical fitness), and a few other things that are exclusive to girls only. On the flip side, there's absolutely nothing for boys or specifically geared to boys. They publish the top 5% of the high school classes every year, and it's remarkable that almost always (although there are exceptions) girls are more prevalent on those lists than boys, and almost always significantly, often at a 2:1 ratio. Looking further, girls have long outpaced boys when it comes to attendance at college. I think the current rate right now is that girls make up 60% of all college attendees versus 40% for the guys. My son got into an honors program recently at the college he's going to attend in the Fall (incoming freshman - looking forward to cutting that check) and I asked the professors there whether they saw a difference in numbers of females to males in their program (they did, certainly much more females) and they thought it was just down to the fact that boys weren't putting the work in. Not sure how we overcome that. But it's a problem.

Correct, and it's not just academics. Its issues like underemployment and social isolation. And it's made worse that we're not allowed to talk about how we fail our young men, lest we blaspheme the state theology of wokeness.

It's not *all* of the problem, but GMAFB, guns have been around for much longer than these shootings have been epidemic.

It’s not hard. Teach people to be kind.

[BDKJMU]

Well heck, your answer is right there. Knock down the # of programs specifically geared for girls, and create some for boys (so there's roughly an equal # of both).

No need to diminish what's there for girls. Heck, most of those programs, even through the schools, are privately funded and staffed anyway - it's all volunteer work. No reason why the same couldn't be done for boys. Needs to be an awareness that this should be done and I'm sure private funding/staffing could be found for that too. I think it's more of the acknowledgement that there's a problem here that's the sticking point.

If you can create the same # of programs for boys, without diminishing those for girls, then sure, by all means.

[BDKJMU]

According to the left red flag laws save lives.
Illinois has a red flag law.
This Highlamd Park nutjob Crimo twice had police called to his parent’s home in 2019 for Crimo’s mental health reasons. The 2nd time was after Crimo threatended to kill his family, and police confiscated 16 knives, a dagger, and a sword from him, yet didn’t arrest him. How could they legally seize all that without PC for an arrest.
Subsequently Illinois granted Crimo am FOID card, and Crimo was allowed to purchase firearms. So apparently Illinois red flag law didn’t ok this guy possessing knives, but oked him purchasing firearms. Da fuq? Something here doesn’t add up..

[houndawg]

different than what?

He was shooting too fast to be aiming , the rhythm sounded like a trigger crank

Where were the good guys with the guns? They usually have some on the rooftops

Well since you were a potato peeler and not in the infantry maybe you never got to shoot much, much less crew serve, but even in full auto you are still aiming. This guy was shooting a semi auto rifle, maybe 2 rounds per second. Even with iron sights can still be aiming. It doesn’t need to be precise if shooting into a crowd from not that long of a distance, esp if only around 100 yards or so..

Thanks for the praphrase.

[GannonFan]

According to the left red flag laws save lives.
Illinois has a red flag law.
This Highlamd Park nutjob Crimo twice had police called to his parent’s home in 2019 for Crimo’s mental health reasons. The 2nd time was after Crimo threatended to kill his family, and police confiscated 16 knives, a dagger, and a sword from him, yet didn’t arrest him. How could they legally seize all that without PC for an arrest.
Subsequently Illinois granted Crimo am FOID card, and Crimo was allowed to purchase firearms. So apparently Illinois red flag law didn’t ok this guy possessing knives, but oked him purchasing firearms. Da fuq? Something here doesn’t add up..

Sounds like the same bureaucratic mess that allowed the shooter at VA Tech to get a gun, and that was something like 15 years ago. I understand that bureaucracy can be hard, but we have to find a better way to manage these things. This shooting in Illinois was preventable, with existing laws, if people tried hard enough. But from the parents, to the health officials, to the police at multiple levels, people just let this slip through the cracks and a crazy guy was able to buy lots of guns and do what he did. The parent should certainly be prosecuted - he knew when he signed that FOID waiver that his son had threatened violence before. We need to go after parents more when they enable this kind of crazy to flourish and do it with weapons.

[houndawg]

different than what?

He was shooting too fast to be aiming , the rhythm sounded like a trigger crank

Where were the good guys with the guns? They usually have some on the rooftops

Well since you were a potato peeler and not in the infantry maybe you never got to shoot much, much less crew serve, but even in full auto you are still aiming. This guy was shooting a semi auto rifle, maybe 2 rounds per second. Even with iron sights can still be aiming. It doesn’t need to be precise if shooting into a crowd from not that long of a distance, esp if only around 100 yards or so..

In that case it was some piss-poor shooting

[BDKJMU]

According to the left red flag laws save lives.
Illinois has a red flag law.
This Highlamd Park nutjob Crimo twice had police called to his parent’s home in 2019 for Crimo’s mental health reasons. The 2nd time was after Crimo threatended to kill his family, and police confiscated 16 knives, a dagger, and a sword from him, yet didn’t arrest him. How could they legally seize all that without PC for an arrest.
Subsequently Illinois granted Crimo am FOID card, and Crimo was allowed to purchase firearms. So apparently Illinois red flag law didn’t ok this guy possessing knives, but oked him purchasing firearms. Da fuq? Something here doesn’t add up..

Sounds like the same bureaucratic mess that allowed the shooter at VA Tech to get a gun, and that was something like 15 years ago. I understand that bureaucracy can be hard, but we have to find a better way to manage these things. This shooting in Illinois was preventable, with existing laws, if people tried hard enough. But from the parents, to the health officials, to the police at multiple levels, people just let this slip through the cracks and a crazy guy was able to buy lots of guns and do what he did. The parent should certainly be prosecuted - he knew when he signed that FOID waiver that his son had threatened violence before. We need to go after parents more when they enable this kind of crazy to flourish and do it with weapons.

And the Michigan State shooting is another case of don't need new gun laws, just need to enforce existing ones.

The local Soros backed liberal DA Carol Siemon, who during her time as Ingham County DA (2017-2022) declared her office would limit the use of felony firearm possession charges.

"The new policy concerning Felony Firearm charging is related to dramatic racial inequity in how this and certain other laws have been charged and is not in any way linked to the goal that we share of keeping the public safe. The purported link between this policy and any future rise in gun violence is disingenuous and erroneous.

The shooter Anthony McRae was arrested in the summer of 2019 and charged with carrying a concealed weapon without a license, a felony punishable by up to five years in prison. But because of the DA's new Woke, soft on crime in the name of racial justice, McRae, who is black, was allowed to plead to a misdemeanor charge of carrying a concealed firearm in a vehicle, punishable by 2 years, of which he served 18 months.

The DA Carol Siemon retired last year after facing heaving criticism from the local sheriff, police chiefs, and judges about her soft on crime criminal justice reforms. The current DA claims that even if McRae had been convicted of the felony charge, he would have been out under current sentencing guidelines (another example of why we need truth in sentencing). But if the lib DA had stuck with the original felony charge, even if McRae was out, as a felon he wouldn't have been allowed to possess or purchase firearms. But with his felony charge being downgraded to a misdemeanor, he was.
https://redstate.com/nick-arama/2023/02 ... ce-n703554
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/ ... 901983007/