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A tip of the hat to the Obama Administration and specifically Interior Sec. Salazar for finally recognizing that the sneaky, thoughtless, underhanded actions of the environmentalists are damaging America.

Report: Obama to Stick With Bush Administration Polar Bear Rule
The Interior Department is letting stand a Bush administration regulation limiting protections for polar bears from global warming.

FOXNews.com
Friday, May 08, 2009

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/05 ... bear-rule/

WASHINGTON -- The Interior Department is letting stand a Bush administration regulation that limits protection of polar bears from global warming, three people familiar with the decision told The Associated Press.

Interior Secretary Ken Salazar will announce on Friday that he will not rescind the Bush rule, although Congress gave him authority to do so. The people spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to pre-empt the secretary's announcement...

...Environmentalists have strongly opposed the rule as have many members of Congress. They argued the limits violate the Endangered Species Act because the release of greenhouse gases from power plants, factories and cars indirectly threaten the bear's survival.

In March, federal lawmakers authorized Salazar to scrap the Bush regulation without going through a long regulatory process. The deadline for such action was Saturday, 60 days after Congress acted.

But business groups and their supporters in Congress have argued strongly that the Endangered Species Act is the improper vehicle for addressing climate change and that there are other ways to deal with the global environmental issue.

Congress is trying to craft broad legislation that would limit greenhouse gases and, separately, the Environmental Protection Agency has begun a lengthy regulatory process that could lead to heat-trapping emissions being controlled under the federal Clean Air Act. Last month, the EPA declared carbon dioxide from burning fossil fuels and other greenhouse gases a danger to public health.

But after the polar bear was declared threatened in March 2008, and brought under the protection of the Endangered Species Act because of climate change, environmentalists hoped they could use the species law to force broader nationwide limits of greenhouse gases.

The Bush special rule for the polar bear "significantly undercuts protections for the polar bear by omitting global warming pollution as a factor in the polar bear's risk of extinction," said Jane Kochersperger, a spokeswoman for Greenpeace, which delivered 80,000 petitions to the Interior Department after they were collected by the two environmental groups.

On Thursday, Rep. Doc Hastings of Washington, the ranking Republican on the House Natural Resources Committee, urged Salazar to keep the Bush rule in place.

"This reaches far beyond the scope of polar bears in the Arctic and could put jobs and economic activity across the entire nation at risk," said Hastings.

First, go fvck off Tman. Second, this is supreme bullshit.

I hope Obama is not getting into this battle right now in order to focus on the economy and the wars.

I agree somewhat with T-man.


Polar Bears deserve protection, but you are right, the way it was done was wrong.

It needs to be re-examined under the existing law.

travelinman67 wrote:A tip of the hat to the Obama Administration and specifically Interior Sec. Salazar for finally recognizing that the sneaky, thoughtless, underhanded actions of the environmentalists are damaging America.

As much as I agree with the article and the assessment Interior Secretary Salazar is making...
I do not believe that "sneaky underhanded environmentalists are ruining America" as you put it

T-Man does everything have to be so emotionally disturbing for you..?
You've become such a drama queen these past few months

Again:
The whole "Outrage on demand" thing you do - it's a bit too Rush Limbaugh for my taste...

D1B wrote:First, go fvck off Tman. Second, this is supreme bullshit.

I hope Obama is not getting into this battle right now in order to focus on the economy and the wars.

It's gotta hurt to wake up and find out your side has seen the light and you've been abandoned to wallow in self-destructive, technocrat, social-engineering-failed/determinism-proven-true, Godless, piety.

Despite the social engineers best efforts to lie and suppress debate, the truth has gotten out about the Anthropogenic Global Warming Scam. Most people either understand it's a scam or minimally believe that nothing should be done until there's been more research. Concocting a scheme whereby use of the Endangered Species Act could be subverted to force social and industrial change, was a mistake: Especially considering the current economic conditions.

The American economy is on it's knee gasping for breath. 20% of all homes being financed are at risk of foreclosure over the next year. Unemployment is at an all time high (the 8.9% figure has been cooked so many times, realisticallly, that number is but a fraction of the REAL figure which I would toss out just under 17%). Folks have stopped paying their bills. Debt collection is a booming business...

...yet there are still sh!t-for-brains in our country, like Cong. Waxman, who are charging full-steam-ahead with tax-and-destroy, "punish Americans", social engineering programs built upon fantasies like AGW?

I'm REALLY glad SOMEONE in the White House with some brains has access to the President and is shedding some light on the seriousness of our country's situation. I will pray that he keeps his eyes open and begins his education.




Sidenote for Hippie...I added that at the last second...I knew it would piss you off.

travelinman67 wrote:

D1B wrote:First, go fvck off Tman. Second, this is supreme bullshit.

I hope Obama is not getting into this battle right now in order to focus on the economy and the wars.

It's gotta hurt to wake up and find out your side has seen the light and you've been abandoned to wallow in self-destructive, technocrat, social-engineering-failed/determinism-proven-true, Godless, piety.

Despite the social engineers best efforts to lie and suppress debate, the truth has gotten out about the Anthropogenic Global Warming Scam. Most people either understand it's a scam or minimally believe that nothing should be done until there's been more research. Concocting a scheme whereby use of the Endangered Species Act could be subverted to force social and industrial change, was a mistake: Especially considering the current economic conditions.

The American economy is on it's knee gasping for breath. 20% of all homes being financed are at risk of foreclosure over the next year. Unemployment is at an all time high (the 8.9% figure has been cooked so many times, realisticallly, that number is but a fraction of the REAL figure which I would toss out just under 17%). Folks have stopped paying their bills. Debt collection is a booming business...

...yet there are still sh!t-for-brains in our country, like Cong. Waxman, who are charging full-steam-ahead with tax-and-destroy, "punish Americans", social engineering programs built upon fantasies like AGW?

I'm REALLY glad SOMEONE in the White House with some brains has access to the President and is shedding some light on the seriousness of our country's situation. I will pray that he keeps his eyes open and begins his education.




Sidenote for Hippie...I added that at the last second...I knew it would piss you off.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it at 25% during the Great Depression?

Grizalltheway wrote:

travelinman67 wrote:
It's gotta hurt to wake up and find out your side has seen the light and you've been abandoned to wallow in self-destructive, technocrat, social-engineering-failed/determinism-proven-true, Godless, piety.

Despite the social engineers best efforts to lie and suppress debate, the truth has gotten out about the Anthropogenic Global Warming Scam. Most people either understand it's a scam or minimally believe that nothing should be done until there's been more research. Concocting a scheme whereby use of the Endangered Species Act could be subverted to force social and industrial change, was a mistake: Especially considering the current economic conditions.

The American economy is on it's knee gasping for breath. 20% of all homes being financed are at risk of foreclosure over the next year. Unemployment is at an all time high (the 8.9% figure has been cooked so many times, realisticallly, that number is but a fraction of the REAL figure which I would toss out just under 17%). Folks have stopped paying their bills. Debt collection is a booming business...

...yet there are still sh!t-for-brains in our country, like Cong. Waxman, who are charging full-steam-ahead with tax-and-destroy, "punish Americans", social engineering programs built upon fantasies like AGW?

I'm REALLY glad SOMEONE in the White House with some brains has access to the President and is shedding some light on the seriousness of our country's situation. I will pray that he keeps his eyes open and begins his education.




Sidenote for Hippie...I added that at the last second...I knew it would piss you off.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it at 25% during the Great Depression?

That was before all the entitlement programs had been created. With General Assistance, AFDC, SSI, Disability, Retraining, etc...once a person is enrolled in one of those programs, they're no longer classified as unemployed. Further, seasonal workers are factored out of the statistic, and in CA, they're now classifying some construction trades as "seasonal workers". Add age variables into the mix, and the U.S. is probably closer to the low to mid-30's.

Don't get lost in the technocrat argument attempting to mitigate the seriousness of our country's economic situation. It's real and it's here today. A large part of why this situation was allowed to develop emanated from folks like Bush, Paulson, Pelosi, Waxman, Boxer, Frank, and yes, Cheney, people who live in a bubble ISOLATED from mainstream Americans and businesses. Those folks STILL don't understand the severity of the jobless problem, yet they plow ahead with their schemes, and when MSM or their old-rich friends call them up to query what they're going to do, they summon major corporation CEO's and Bank heads to Washington, who then tell the Polis, "We're losing money." rather than "People have stopped paying their bills because GDP has collapsed due to trade imbalance." And the net result is these fools on the Hill pull out the taxpayer's checkbook, write a check for a few trillion to the banks, insurers, and major corporations to "hold them over until things get better", rather than making the hard choice to fix our economy by attacking the trade imbalance, eliminating foreign manufacture tax loopholes (Obama is), passing legislation to streamline permitting, place caps on approval timelines, and require expeditious hearings on civil challenges to start up businesses or facilities.
And rather than spending hundreds of billions to improve existing and construct new GOVERNMENT facilities, I STRONGLY recommend that those tax dollars be spent to fix existing and construct new transportation, energy, and water infrastucture which will facilitate expansion and improvements to industry.

travelinman67 wrote:

D1B wrote:First, go fvck off Tman. Second, this is supreme bullshit.

I hope Obama is not getting into this battle right now in order to focus on the economy and the wars.

It's gotta hurt to wake up and find out your side has seen the light and you've been abandoned to wallow in self-destructive, technocrat, social-engineering-failed/determinism-proven-true, Godless, piety.

Despite the social engineers best efforts to lie and suppress debate, the truth has gotten out about the Anthropogenic Global Warming Scam. Most people either understand it's a scam or minimally believe that nothing should be done until there's been more research. Concocting a scheme whereby use of the Endangered Species Act could be subverted to force social and industrial change, was a mistake: Especially considering the current economic conditions.

The American economy is on it's knee gasping for breath. 20% of all homes being financed are at risk of foreclosure over the next year. Unemployment is at an all time high (the 8.9% figure has been cooked so many times, realisticallly, that number is but a fraction of the REAL figure which I would toss out just under 17%). Folks have stopped paying their bills. Debt collection is a booming business...

...yet there are still sh!t-for-brains in our country, like Cong. Waxman, who are charging full-steam-ahead with tax-and-destroy, "punish Americans", social engineering programs built upon fantasies like AGW?

I'm REALLY glad SOMEONE in the White House with some brains has access to the President and is shedding some light on the seriousness of our country's situation. I will pray that he keeps his eyes open and begins his education.




Sidenote for Hippie...I added that at the last second...I knew it would piss you off.

Tman, you are a typical conk with the disease of short term thinking.

To me, economic prosperity in this day and age puts the planet and humanity in great danger. We need to slow the fvck down and live simpler lives. This does not mean we have to necessarily accept a lower standard of living either.

Global warming aside, we're polluting our oceans, over-populating the planet, and fighting each other for the last scraps of oil and fresh water. It's getting worse by the day. You think whats happening in Africa is just gonna happen there? Just wait till United States Wannabees - Brazil and Argentina destroy thier forests, like we did, it's gonna be hell, like Mexico - ever breeding poor catholics populating every square inch of north america....

We've reached our limit and we now have to start the difficult conversation about population control as well as make real progress on safer energy sources and preserving biodiversity.

D1B wrote: To me, economic prosperity in this day and age puts the planet and humanity in great danger. We need to slow the fvck down and live simpler lives.

Ladies and gentlemen, may I present to you: Theodore Kaczynski.

AZGrizFan wrote:

D1B wrote: To me, economic prosperity in this day and age puts the planet and humanity in great danger. We need to slow the fvck down and live simpler lives.

Ladies and gentlemen, may I present to you: Theodore Kaczynski.

McCain lost, get over it.

D1B wrote:

AZGrizFan wrote:
Ladies and gentlemen, may I present to you: Theodore Kaczynski.

McCain lost, get over it.

OK, Ted. Go write another chapter to your manifesto.

AZGrizFan wrote:

D1B wrote:
McCain lost, get over it.

OK, Ted. Go write another chapter to your manifesto.

Sure thing Z. Hey here's a new avatar for ya!

D1B wrote:

AZGrizFan wrote: OK, Ted. Go write another chapter to your manifesto.

Sure thing Z. Hey here's a new avatar for ya!

Actually, not THE government, just the CURRENT government. Ted.

Here's one for YOU:

D1B wrote:To me, economic prosperity in this day and age puts the planet and humanity in great danger. We need to slow the fvck down and live simpler lives. This does not mean we have to necessarily accept a lower standard of living either.

We've reached our limit and we now have to start the difficult conversation about population control as well as make real progress on safer energy sources and preserving biodiversity.

I'll be sure to pass that on to the 17.5 million unemployed Americans who have either lost their homes, are unable to pay their rent, resort to handouts for food and clothes for their children, cannot afford gas and electricity to cook and heat their home, much less a reliable car to look for work, and either are or are considering filing bankruptcy since creditors are refusing to defer or forebear debt repayment.

I'll be sure to explain how sleeping in their car, drinking river water, eating at a shelter, and watching their sick children suffer are just their contribution to living a "simpler" life to help preserve "biodiversity".

D...everytime I think you can't raise the level of idiocy any higher, you prove me wrong.

travelinman67 wrote:

D1B wrote:To me, economic prosperity in this day and age puts the planet and humanity in great danger. We need to slow the fvck down and live simpler lives. This does not mean we have to necessarily accept a lower standard of living either.

We've reached our limit and we now have to start the difficult conversation about population control as well as make real progress on safer energy sources and preserving biodiversity.

I'll be sure to pass that on to the 17.5 million unemployed Americans who have either lost their homes, are unable to pay their rent, resort to handouts for food and clothes for their children, cannot afford gas and electricity to cook and heat their home, much less a reliable car to look for work, and either are or are considering filing bankruptcy since creditors are refusing to defer or forebear debt repayment.

I'll be sure to explain how sleeping in their car, drinking river water, eating at a shelter, and watching their sick children suffer are just their contribution to living a "simpler" life to help preserve "biodiversity".

D...everytime I think you can't raise the level of idiocy any higher, you prove me wrong.

Tman, rather than the namecalling and personal attacks, AND rather than assuming your skewed vision of what a simpler life means, why don't you ask me to clarify? This is why no one responds to you.

Call me an idiot all you want, but deep down you know I'm right. The planet cannot afford more humans and certainly cannot afford another half dozen United States. If we all refuse to accept a simpler life, we all will perish. Consumerism is death.

Funny, now you care about people losing their homes, a few months ago you and your organ grinder monkey Z derided these very same people for spending beyond their means.

D1B wrote:

travelinman67 wrote:
I'll be sure to pass that on to the 17.5 million unemployed Americans who have either lost their homes, are unable to pay their rent, resort to handouts for food and clothes for their children, cannot afford gas and electricity to cook and heat their home, much less a reliable car to look for work, and either are or are considering filing bankruptcy since creditors are refusing to defer or forebear debt repayment.

I'll be sure to explain how sleeping in their car, drinking river water, eating at a shelter, and watching their sick children suffer are just their contribution to living a "simpler" life to help preserve "biodiversity".

D...everytime I think you can't raise the level of idiocy any higher, you prove me wrong.

Tman, rather than the namecalling and personal attacks, AND rather than assuming your skewed vision of what a simpler life means, why don't you ask me to clarify? This is why no one responds to you.

Call me an idiot all you want, but deep down you know I'm right. The planet cannot afford more humans and certainly cannot afford another half dozen United States. If we all refuse to accept a simpler life, we all will perish. Consumerism is death.

Funny, now you care about people losing their homes, a few months ago you and your organ grinder monkey Z derided these very same people for spending beyond their means.

A) You are not right. The Earth's biosphere adapts to the number of organisms within it. Human's are but a spec of dust within that system. Your eugenics driven beliefs are foolish and unfounded in fact.

B) I've NEVER derided homeowners who defaulted for spending beyond their means. The defaults were a function of poorly designed loans, qualifying requirements, and a weakend economy: Not the home buyers. There were real estate buyers who abused those conditions, then bailed once the market collapsed, but they were only a small percentage of the total default market.

btw...with all your hopping around from thread to thread looking for attention, squeaking Progressive soundbites and shrieking over the voices of reason...might I suggest a more appropriate avatar...

travelinman67 wrote:

D1B wrote:
Tman, rather than the namecalling and personal attacks, AND rather than assuming your skewed vision of what a simpler life means, why don't you ask me to clarify? This is why no one responds to you.

Call me an idiot all you want, but deep down you know I'm right. The planet cannot afford more humans and certainly cannot afford another half dozen United States. If we all refuse to accept a simpler life, we all will perish. Consumerism is death.

Funny, now you care about people losing their homes, a few months ago you and your organ grinder monkey Z derided these very same people for spending beyond their means.

A) You are not right. The Earth's biosphere adapts to the number of organisms within it. Human's are but a spec of dust within that system. Your eugenics driven beliefs are foolish and unfounded in fact.

B) I've NEVER derided homeowners who defaulted for spending beyond their means. The defaults were a function of poorly designed loans, qualifying requirements, and a weakend economy: Not the home buyers. There were real estate buyers who abused those conditions, then bailed once the market collapsed, but they were only a small percentage of the total default market.

btw...with all your hopping around from thread to thread looking for attention, squeaking Progressive soundbites and shrieking over the voices of reason...might I suggest a more appropriate avatar...

T, humans are fvcking up this planet. I could post hundreds of threads a day chronicaling this fact. But to me, like global warming, it's self evident. Just open your eyes and witness the death of Africa, the pandemic of the day each week, China and budding power consumers nations like India, Brazil, Russia and Argentina. Sure, ultimately the planet will adapt, but the planet don't give a fvck about humans.

We all must accept a lower standard of living and think of the planet first if we are going to survive.

'Cept the folks who comprise the richest two percent of Americans of course.

Wedgebuster wrote:'Cept the folks who comprise the richest two percent of Americans of course.

Wedgie, when the shit hits the fan, Darwin kicks in, and they will be some of the first to perish.

D1B wrote:

Wedgebuster wrote:'Cept the folks who comprise the richest two percent of Americans of course.

Wedgie, when the shit hits the fan, Darwin kicks in, and they will be some of the first to perish.

I know 'zactly what you are talking about.

D1B wrote:T, humans are fvcking up this planet.

We all must accept a lower standard of living and think of the planet first if we are going to survive.

You want me to stop calling you "Ted", you have GOTTA stop talkin' like him.

travelinman67 wrote:I'll be sure to explain how sleeping in their car, drinking river water, eating at a shelter, and watching their sick children suffer are just their contribution to living a "simpler" life to help preserve "biodiversity".

As if you could even drink the river water.....

When you're done, maybe I'll explain how there used to be mountaintops in SW Virginia/East TN/East Kent/ West Va, but people wanted their Ipods and shitty movies on-demand, so we needed the coal...then, I'll explain why they shouldn't ever attempt to eat the fish we just caught or even swim inthe lake we caught it out of because it was too expensive for the company to put in proper pollution controls....then, I'll show them pictures of buffalo, carrier pigeons, et al that used to exist, but were eliminated in the name of progress and for sport by humans....then, I'll explain how private property rights are sacred and should be preserved at all costs....unless the property in question was owned by an Indian....

AZGrizFan wrote:

D1B wrote:T, humans are fvcking up this planet.

We all must accept a lower standard of living and think of the planet first if we are going to survive.

You want me to stop calling you "Ted", you have GOTTA stop talkin' like him.

Z, call me Ted all you want. I don't give a fvck. As always, I wear your scorn and derision as a badge of honor.

Z, deep down you know I'm right. BTW hows the water situation in Arizona?

D1B wrote:

AZGrizFan wrote:
You want me to stop calling you "Ted", you have GOTTA stop talkin' like him.

BTW hows the water situation in Arizona?

Great, as of now:
http://www.srpwater.com/dwr/report.asp?dt=5/11/2009

Salt River system lakes are at 99% of capacity. Verde River lakes are at 72% (Horseshoe is low on purpose for flood control).

Total capacity is at 95%.

Z,
You do know that the precious Colorado River no longer reaches the Gulf of California, right? Wasn't that way 150 years ago.

Also, seen any pics of the water level at Lake Mead or any other reservoir out west?

You'll be showin' up at my door in that beat up old '88 Chevy Corsica Mama Z drives in a couple years, looking for a floor sweeping job and a place for you and the Z Kats to hang until an apartment opens up in Wisconsin Rapids.