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The College Football Playoff selection committee protocol seems to contradict what the College Football Playoff selection committee is doing.

Understand that I WANT Ohio State in the playoff. I think it's a team that has the horses to take on Alabama. I think the thing with Ohio State is being focused and ready to play and I think if they're playing Alabama that won't be a problem. Ohio State, I think, is clearly more talented than Penn State or Wisconsin. Also, when you just look at the records and such they're a better team than either Penn State or Wisconsin.

BUT...take a look at the protocol at

http://d30ratpzqzalg7.cloudfront.net/CD ... mkEd00PiAY

I looked it up thinking it'd support my view that a conference championship is just one of many factors and not that important. But when I saw it I saw that that's not the case. Here's one paragraph I think is particularly interesting:

We believe that a committee of experts properly instructed (based on beliefs that the regular season is
unique and must be preserved; and that championships won on the field and strength of schedule are
important values that must be incorporated into the selection process) has very strong support
throughout the college football community.

Under the current construct, polls (although well-intended) have not expressed these values; particularly
at the margins where teams that have won head-to-head competition and championships are sometimes
ranked behind non-champions and teams that have lost in head-to-head competition. Nuanced
mathematical formulas ignore some teams who “deserve” to be selected.

Underline added for emphasis.

I gotta say I will be glad if Ohio State is in and think that if the objective is to make the best effort to select the four best teams Ohio State SHOULD be in. But they do appear to be kind of contradicting themselves.

If Wisconsin beats Penn State, the Committee breathes a huge sigh of relief. If PSU wins, then they will have a tough decision to make. Ohio State is the better team on paper, but they lost the head to head.

Regardless, it's amazing where PSU has come from in a short amount of time coming out of the NCAA sanctions.

JohnStOnge wrote:The College Football Playoff selection committee protocol seems to contradict what the College Football Playoff selection committee is doing.

Understand that I WANT Ohio State in the playoff. I think it's a team that has the horses to take on Alabama. I think the thing with Ohio State is being focused and ready to play and I think if they're playing Alabama that won't be a problem. Ohio State, I think, is clearly more talented than Penn State or Wisconsin. Also, when you just look at the records and such they're a better team than either Penn State or Wisconsin.

BUT...take a look at the protocol at

http://d30ratpzqzalg7.cloudfront.net/CD ... mkEd00PiAY

I looked it up thinking it'd support my view that a conference championship is just one of many factors and not that important. But when I saw it I saw that that's not the case. Here's one paragraph I think is particularly interesting:

We believe that a committee of experts properly instructed (based on beliefs that the regular season is
unique and must be preserved; and that championships won on the field and strength of schedule are
important values that must be incorporated into the selection process) has very strong support
throughout the college football community.

Under the current construct, polls (although well-intended) have not expressed these values; particularly
at the margins where teams that have won head-to-head competition and championships are sometimes
ranked behind non-champions and teams that have lost in head-to-head competition. Nuanced
mathematical formulas ignore some teams who “deserve” to be selected.

Underline added for emphasis.

I gotta say I will be glad if Ohio State is in and think that if the objective is to make the best effort to select the four best teams Ohio State SHOULD be in. But they do appear to be kind of contradicting themselves.

The objective is to send the teams with the four best resumes, not the four best teams. Big difference.

93henfan wrote:If Wisconsin beats Penn State, the Committee breathes a huge sigh of relief. If PSU wins, then they will have a tough decision to make. Ohio State is the better team on paper, but they lost the head to head.

Regardless, it's amazing where PSU has come from in a short amount of time coming out of the NCAA sanctions.

OSU would still have the better record and that win against Oklahoma earlier in the year should be enough to keep them ahead of Penn State. Head to head is great, but mostly when two teams are equal in record.

GannonFan wrote:

93henfan wrote:If Wisconsin beats Penn State, the Committee breathes a huge sigh of relief. If PSU wins, then they will have a tough decision to make. Ohio State is the better team on paper, but they lost the head to head.

Regardless, it's amazing where PSU has come from in a short amount of time coming out of the NCAA sanctions.

OSU would still have the better record and that win against Oklahoma earlier in the year should be enough to keep them ahead of Penn State. Head to head is great, but mostly when two teams are equal in record.

Especially when the head to head is a close loss on the road.

Yes I think others have basically said it but if it's "best resumes" Ohio State probably has the best of anybody if you go by the CFP rankings. They've played four teams in the current top 10 and gone 3-1 in those games with the only loss being on the road vs. Penn State on a blocked field goal when they had the lead.

Alabama, Clemson, and Washington haven't even played anybody in the top 10.

You go by resumes and Ohio State is a lock.

The reaffirmation of Ohio St being a lock was leaving them at #2 in the rankings this week. Ohio St is in, no questions asked. I'd be worried if I was Washington - a Penn St win, especially an impressive one, and they could leap frog Washington. Washington needs to be uber-impressive in beating Colorado this weekend.

What's really cool is this kind of thing:

http://sports.mynorthwest.com/214770/hu ... -rankings/

You could very well have both Ohio State and Michigan in the 4 team playoff even though neither made the Big 10 championship game. That could become especially likely if Washington loses to Colorado and I don't think that is all that unlikely a prospect.

The committee just proved that head to head and conference championships don't matter.

BDKJMU wrote:The committee just proved that head to head and conference championships don't matter.

They don't. Wins and losses matter. It's a 4 team playoff with 1 undefeated and 3 1-loss Power-5 teams. Each of the 2-loss teams needed to not lose 2 games if they wanted to be in.

BDKJMU wrote:The committee just proved that head to head and conference championships don't matter.

Just like that this new playoff format and selection process proves to be nothing more than a more intricate cronied version of the BCS system.

Here is a good Wetzel column on an 8 team playoff.

Rob Iola wrote:

BDKJMU wrote:The committee just proved that head to head and conference championships don't matter.

They don't. Wins and losses matter. It's a 4 team playoff with 1 undefeated and 3 1-loss Power-5 teams. Each of the 2-loss teams needed to not lose 2 games if they wanted to be in.

Yeah but that's not how the playoff was sold. PSU getting "snubbed" basically makes the CCG's meaningless. Your argument is basically the same crap we heard when the BCS still existed...wasn't the point of the playoff to determine that on the field? Whoops.

SDHornet wrote:

Rob Iola wrote: They don't. Wins and losses matter. It's a 4 team playoff with 1 undefeated and 3 1-loss Power-5 teams. Each of the 2-loss teams needed to not lose 2 games if they wanted to be in.

Yeah but that's not how the playoff was sold. PSU getting "snubbed" basically makes the CCG's meaningless. Your argument is basically the same crap we heard when the BCS still existed...wasn't the point of the playoff to determine that on the field? Whoops.

I was at the PSU/OSU game. I'm a huge PSU fan. They're the best 9-2 team in the nation. But they're not good enough to be in a 4-team playoff. Frankly, the 4 teams in the playoffs all pass the eye test in terms of belonging to be there.

The alternative is to go to a 3-game, 8-team playoff and do away with the conference championship games.

Rob Iola wrote:

SDHornet wrote: Yeah but that's not how the playoff was sold. PSU getting "snubbed" basically makes the CCG's meaningless. Your argument is basically the same crap we heard when the BCS still existed...wasn't the point of the playoff to determine that on the field? Whoops.

I was at the PSU/OSU game. I'm a huge PSU fan. They're the best 9-2 team in the nation. But they're not good enough to be in a 4-team playoff. Frankly, the 4 teams in the playoffs all pass the eye test in terms of belonging to be there.

The alternative is to go to a 3-game, 8-team playoff and do away with the conference championship games.

PSU beat OSU head to head....then won the conference title...but they're not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff?

PSU earned their way into the 4 team playoff. Period.

SDHornet wrote:

Rob Iola wrote: I was at the PSU/OSU game. I'm a huge PSU fan. They're the best 9-2 team in the nation. But they're not good enough to be in a 4-team playoff. Frankly, the 4 teams in the playoffs all pass the eye test in terms of belonging to be there.

The alternative is to go to a 3-game, 8-team playoff and do away with the conference championship games.

PSU beat OSU head to head....then won the conference title...but they're not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff

. Period.

You are correct. PSU is not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff.

Rob Iola wrote:

SDHornet wrote: PSU beat OSU head to head....then won the conference title...but they're not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff

. Period.

You are correct. PSU is not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff.

So you ignored the part where I said PSU earned their way into the playoff...you know the way it is suppose to work. Yeaokay.

SDHornet wrote:

Rob Iola wrote: You are correct. PSU is not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff.

So you ignored the part where I said PSU earned their way into the playoff...you know the way it is suppose to work. Yeaokay.

Again you are correct. I ignored that part.

Rob Iola wrote:

BDKJMU wrote:The committee just proved that head to head and conference championships don't matter.

They don't. Wins and losses matter. It's a 4 team playoff with 1 undefeated and 3 1-loss Power-5 teams. Each of the 2-loss teams needed to not lose 2 games if they wanted to be in.

And you have a team that wasn't good enough to make their league title game, much less win it, get in over a team that beat them head to head, made, and won their conference title game.

A simple fix would be no teams in the Final 4 if you're not even good enough to make your conference title game..

SDHornet wrote:

Rob Iola wrote: I was at the PSU/OSU game. I'm a huge PSU fan. They're the best 9-2 team in the nation. But they're not good enough to be in a 4-team playoff. Frankly, the 4 teams in the playoffs all pass the eye test in terms of belonging to be there.

The alternative is to go to a 3-game, 8-team playoff and do away with the conference championship games.

PSU beat OSU head to head....then won the conference title...but they're not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff?

PSU earned their way into the 4 team playoff. Period.

Bingo.

Again. SIMPLE fix. In order to make the Final 4, must make your conference title game...If that was the case this year there would be no controversy: Bama, Clempson, Washington, and PSU.

Not good enough to make the final 2 in your conference, but good enough to make the Final 4..

Penn State lost to Pitt and got curb-stomped by Michigan. That sealed their fate, unfortunately.

This season did prove that conference championships are pointless though.

Still, the four-game playoff beats the hell out of the old system. Under the old system, OSU drops to #3 and is out and the bitching in Columbus would have been priceless. Instead, all thee teams with a legit claim to be in the final game still have a shot, and a creampuff Pac12 team is thrown in for Bama to knock the rust off against.

I'm a PSU fan and still feel the system worked. Just get rid of the meaningless conference championship games.

Conference championship games, and overly focusing on them, ignores the non-conference games. Placing too much value on the conference games only is where people who think Penn St got screwed miss the point. Stop taking a subset of the games - Penn St had two losses on their schedule, Ohio St had one. When two teams aren't tied (one loss is still better than two losses) then the head to head doesn't come into place as some tiebreaker because there isn't a tie. Ohio St beat Michigan and Oklahoma while losing to Penn St - Penn St lost to Michigan and Pitt while beating Ohio St. In the end just too many losses.

SDHornet wrote:

Rob Iola wrote: I was at the PSU/OSU game. I'm a huge PSU fan. They're the best 9-2 team in the nation. But they're not good enough to be in a 4-team playoff. Frankly, the 4 teams in the playoffs all pass the eye test in terms of belonging to be there.

The alternative is to go to a 3-game, 8-team playoff and do away with the conference championship games.

PSU beat OSU head to head....then won the conference title...but they're not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff?

PSU earned their way into the 4 team playoff. Period.

PSU lost by 39 to Michigan

93henfan wrote:Penn State lost to Pitt and got curb-stomped by Michigan. That sealed their fate, unfortunately.

This season did prove that conference championships are pointless though.

Still, the four-game playoff beats the hell out of the old system. Under the old system, OSU drops to #3 and is out and the bitching in Columbus would have been priceless. Instead, all thee teams with a legit claim to be in the final game still have a shot, and a creampuff Pac12 team is thrown in for Bama to knock the rust off against.

I'm a PSU fan and still feel the system worked. Just get rid of the meaningless conference championship games.

Tough to eliminate them with unbalanced conference schedules but in so doing you could expand to 8 teams without having to hear the whining of missing more school.

kalm wrote:

93henfan wrote:Penn State lost to Pitt and got curb-stomped by Michigan. That sealed their fate, unfortunately.

This season did prove that conference championships are pointless though.

Still, the four-game playoff beats the hell out of the old system. Under the old system, OSU drops to #3 and is out and the bitching in Columbus would have been priceless. Instead, all thee teams with a legit claim to be in the final game still have a shot, and a creampuff Pac12 team is thrown in for Bama to knock the rust off against.

I'm a PSU fan and still feel the system worked. Just get rid of the meaningless conference championship games.

Tough to eliminate them with unbalanced conference schedules but in so doing you could expand to 8 teams without having to hear the whining of missing more school.

Yep. The think the ideal would either be:
6 teams: 5 P5 conference championship game winners + 1 at large. In that case you'd have Bama, Clempson, Washington, PSU, OK, and the at large would be Ohio State
or
8 teams: 5 P5 conference championship game winners + 3 at large. In that case you'd the at larges would be Ohio State, Michigan, & Wis. Or possibly the last At large could be the top G5 provided they were say top 12-15 in the polls. In that case W Mich instead of Wisconsin.

This year:
12/3 conference champ games
12/31 semifinals
1/9 NC game

With 6 or 8 teams just insert the quarterfinals on 12/17. Still use the same format of the semis is 2 of the 5 major bowls.

clenz wrote:

SDHornet wrote: PSU beat OSU head to head....then won the conference title...but they're not good enough to be in the 4 team playoff?

PSU earned their way into the 4 team playoff. Period.

PSU lost by 39 to Michigan

And still won the B10...which now obviously means nothing.