jstclmet wrote:
Ahhhh, the Wildcat (actually called "Cape" @ Nova). You brought up a very good point. Actually, Whitney does not go to the sideline and watch. He's thrown many a good block for Szczur against DE's when Szczur is trying to get to the edge. How many of those other QB's are willing to do the same??? Then there's the reception, Whitney's first of his career. I forget which game, but I think it was a playoff game.
Thanks for jogging the memory GF. As usual, you're a fountain of information.
Sure, so now we are to believe that Whitney is primarily responsible for Szczur's success at running the offense too? You guys are too much! Hey, we get it, nova has won a lot of games over the past 2 years, and if you want to think it's all due to Whitney (although I'm sure if we had a "rank the CAA's best *fill in the blank position* thread we'd hear how a nova player should be considered the best because, well, just look at all the wins) then hey, more power to you.
That's true. Whitney wasn't one of the most efficient passers in the league and the leading rusher on nova. Forget that he was brought up. Guys. Being a good qb means you can pass exceptionally better than anything else.
My rankings...
Devlin
Toman
no one else....
Those guys sure can sling the rock. That's why they were able to lead their teams so well when that element of the game was shut down.
jstclmet wrote:
Ahhhh, the Wildcat (actually called "Cape" @ Nova). You brought up a very good point. Actually, Whitney does not go to the sideline and watch. He's thrown many a good block for Szczur against DE's when Szczur is trying to get to the edge. How many of those other QB's are willing to do the same??? Then there's the reception, Whitney's first of his career. I forget which game, but I think it was a playoff game.
Thanks for jogging the memory GF. As usual, you're a fountain of information.
Sure, so now we are to believe that Whitney is primarily responsible for Szczur's success at running the offense too? You guys are too much! Hey, we get it, nova has won a lot of games over the past 2 years, and if you want to think it's all due to Whitney (although I'm sure if we had a "rank the CAA's best *fill in the blank position* thread we'd hear how a nova player should be considered the best because, well, just look at all the wins) then hey, more power to you.
Typical response. I don't think he ever said that Whitney was the reason for Szczur's success. He said Whitney threw an awful lot of good blocks. Apparently reading comprehension isn't taught at Transfer U. Whitney also throws blocks on a good number of his straight handoffs as well, usually taking out the DE coming from the backside.
Whitney threw for more TDs, less INTs, had a passer rating 11 points higher, and accounted for more total yards than Devlin.
GannonFan wrote:
Sure, so now we are to believe that Whitney is primarily responsible for Szczur's success at running the offense too? You guys are too much! Hey, we get it, nova has won a lot of games over the past 2 years, and if you want to think it's all due to Whitney (although I'm sure if we had a "rank the CAA's best *fill in the blank position* thread we'd hear how a nova player should be considered the best because, well, just look at all the wins) then hey, more power to you.
Typical response. I don't think he ever said that Whitney was the reason for Szczur's success. He said Whitney threw an awful lot of good blocks. Apparently reading comprehension isn't taught at Transfer U. Whitney also throws blocks on a good number of his straight handoffs as well, usually taking out the DE coming from the backside.
Whitney threw for more TDs, less INTs, had a passer rating 11 points higher, and accounted for more total yards than Devlin.
\
Villanova was also 4th in the nation in Rushing Offense at 240+ yards per game.
Delaware was 90th averaging 111 yards per game.
To say that Devlin was the main focus of opposing defenses would be an understatement.
Whitney didn't face that issue.
If Chris Paul-Etienne can stay healthy for the entire season I think he'll have a good one. Last season he went down for a bit but still put up decent numbers. He's athletic and throws well on the run. I do not fault him for our record last season. A defense of some sort would be nice.
If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away.
Henry David Thoreau, Walden, Conclusion, 1854
COBBLESTONE wrote:If Chris Paul-Etienne can stay healthy for the entire season I think he'll have a good one. Last season he went down for a bit but still put up decent numbers. He's athletic and throws well on the run. I do not fault him for our record last season. A defense of some sort would be nice.
I agree, he seemed to be a bright spot on a terrible team. Hopefully he ges some help this year.
jlcharles wrote:
Typical response. I don't think he ever said that Whitney was the reason for Szczur's success. He said Whitney threw an awful lot of good blocks. Apparently reading comprehension isn't taught at Transfer U. Whitney also throws blocks on a good number of his straight handoffs as well, usually taking out the DE coming from the backside.
Whitney threw for more TDs, less INTs, had a passer rating 11 points higher, and accounted for more total yards than Devlin.
\
Villanova was also 4th in the nation in Rushing Offense at 240+ yards per game.
Delaware was 90th averaging 111 yards per game.
To say that Devlin was the main focus of opposing defenses would be an understatement.
Whitney didn't face that issue.
(both very effective QB's BTW)
shhhh - those kind of facts are not needed here - nova's won a lot of games so the discussion is over.
Villanova was also 4th in the nation in Rushing Offense at 240+ yards per game.
Delaware was 90th averaging 111 yards per game.
To say that Devlin was the main focus of opposing defenses would be an understatement.
Whitney didn't face that issue.
(both very effective QB's BTW)
shhhh - those kind of facts are not needed here - nova's won a lot of games so the discussion is over.
You can't handle the fact that Whitney is better. More TDs and less INTs in less attempts, better QB rating, more total yards. Devlin can throw for 400 yards, but it won't matter when he throws 3 INTs.
Edit: I need to amend my statement. The Sports Network included all games in their stats, not just regular season stats, so Devlin did have more total yards than Whitney, and without manually taking out the stats from the postseason, I don't know what the comparison is on yardage. And I'm not about to waste my time doing that. But, the TD and INT numbers still hold water as a function of attempts. Same with the QB rating.
Last edited by jlcharles on Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Fact wrote:Our Father Who Art in Newark, Patrick be thy name
All Hail Devlin
Please tell me you're joking. I see a lot of posters saying Whitney is an incredible athlete but somebody disagrees with him being the best QB and you guys sound like umassfan when a Minuteman is left of the all-world team.
GannonFan wrote:
shhhh - those kind of facts are not needed here - nova's won a lot of games so the discussion is over.
You can't handle the fact that Whitney is better. More TDs and less INTs in less attempts, better QB rating, more total yards. Devlin can throw for 400 yards, but it won't matter when he throws 3 INTs.
Edit: I need to amend my statement. The Sports Network included all games in their stats, not just regular season stats, so Devlin did have more total yards than Whitney, and without manually taking out the stats from the postseason, I don't know what the comparison is on yardage. And I'm not about to waste my time doing that. But, the TD and INT numbers still hold water as a function of attempts. Same with the QB rating.
And you can't stomach the fact that if Devlin was on nova and Whitney on UD, Devlin would have just as many wins and probably much better numbers. You can't just ignore what's around the team. Whitney plays behind a far superior offensive line and he has a vastly better impact player in Sczur than what Delaware currently has. Devlin's had to play with a piecemeal offensive line and zero running game. What the QB does isn't entirely up to him - his level of play is signficantly impacted by what's around him. No one has said Whitney isn't a great player, most everyone, myself included, has said he is. But if I had my choice of a QB to put behind a quality line with a good running game and explosive players, I pick Devlin everytime. If you think side by side Whitney is the better passer, I do have to question your judgement.
jlcharles wrote:I never said he was the better passer, but QB in college is not about being the better passer.
Sorry - probably got confused when you went to the argument that Whitney had more passing yards and had better TD/INT per attempts. I shouldn't have assumed you were talking about throwing the ball.
First of all, I never said he had more passing yards, I said he had more total yards, but I was wrong and said as much. And I'm going to back pedal and say he is the better passer. While he doesn't need to throw the ball 31 times a game like Devlin, he had more TDs and less INTs per attempt, while also having a higher yards per attempt and yards per completion.
jlcharles wrote:I never said he was the better passer, but QB in college is not about being the better passer.
I can agree with that. For example, Armanti Edwards might have been considered the better college quarterback in the 2007 FCS title game. Four months later, Joe Flacco was selected in the first round at the NFL Draft. I'm guessing AE won't be. There are certainly many different standards by which QBs can be judged.
jlcharles wrote:First of all, I never said he had more passing yards, I said he had more total yards, but I was wrong and said as much. And I'm going to back pedal and say he is the better passer. While he doesn't need to throw the ball 31 times a game like Devlin, he had more TDs and less INTs per attempt, while also having a higher yards per attempt and yards per completion.
Well, there you go then, I officially question your judgement now that you've positioned Whitney as a better passing quarterback than Devlin. Well done!!!
jlcharles wrote:First of all, I never said he had more passing yards, I said he had more total yards, but I was wrong and said as much. And I'm going to back pedal and say he is the better passer. While he doesn't need to throw the ball 31 times a game like Devlin, he had more TDs and less INTs per attempt, while also having a higher yards per attempt and yards per completion.
Well, there you go then, I officially question your judgement now that you've positioned Whitney as a better passing quarterback than Devlin. Well done!!!
I have used data to back up my claim. All I've heard from you is "Devlin is better. Neener, neener, neener."
GannonFan wrote:
Well, there you go then, I officially question your judgement now that you've positioned Whitney as a better passing quarterback than Devlin. Well done!!!
I have used data to back up my claim. All I've heard from you is "Devlin is better. Neener, neener, neener."
Odd, I don't recall pointing out nova's vastly superior offensive line, running game, and presence of big play players (well, player at least in Szczur) (who make big plays without having to have Whitney even touch the ball) being anything in the vicinity of "neener, neener, neener". You bring up stats that are quite typical for a QB in an option oriented or a heavy run offense. When the QB isn't the main weapon, or the second weapon even, he can take advantage of a defense that is keying on other things. I remember JMU guys touting some of the very same numbers when saying Landers was a better passing QB than Santos from UNH. It didn't work then and it doesn't work now.
Like I said, if you can honestly look at Devlin and Whitney and convince yourself that Whitney is the better passing QB, well, maybe you should just tell us how you're related to Whitney and stop all this silly talk.
jlcharles wrote:
I have used data to back up my claim. All I've heard from you is "Devlin is better. Neener, neener, neener."
Odd, I don't recall pointing out nova's vastly superior offensive line, running game, and presence of big play players (well, player at least in Szczur) (who make big plays without having to have Whitney even touch the ball) being anything in the vicinity of "neener, neener, neener". You bring up stats that are quite typical for a QB in an option oriented or a heavy run offense. When the QB isn't the main weapon, or the second weapon even, he can take advantage of a defense that is keying on other things. I remember JMU guys touting some of the very same numbers when saying Landers was a better passing QB than Santos from UNH. It didn't work then and it doesn't work now.
Like I said, if you can honestly look at Devlin and Whitney and convince yourself that Whitney is the better passing QB, well, maybe you should just tell us how you're related to Whitney and stop all this silly talk.
Chris Whitney has a better Completion percentage and a higher yards per attempt (two stats that are considered the most important amongst football people.) I'll concede that Devlin is a better thrower, but just because a guy can throw a rocket does not mean he is a better quarterback.
Chris Whitney wasn't the Second weapon in Villanova's Offense???? Really? He only had 105 rushing yards in the national championship and 138 against Delaware along with 990 on the season despite being sacked over 30 times. Whitney was the most important part of the Villanova running game you speak of therefore he directly contributed to it. Like it or not, Chris Whitney is a great quarterback, he has the attitude, the stats, the intangibles and most importantly the W's to back that up.
Ahhh, I have found my new home now that AGS is gone. Good to see the usual UD contingent taking their shots at Nova.
Personally, I rank Whitney #1, Devlin #2. Devlin is by far the better passer, but Whitney is the better QB for the FCS level. He has the mentality of a linebacker, can run over you, and passes well enough to keep you honest. He was the key to the Nova offense this year. As he went, so did the offense. He had terrible games against Penn, UNH I and W&M II, all of which could have been losses and one of which was a loss. He is the Tim Tebow of FCS.
One other note, I love how everyone bashed Szczur during the year saying he wasn't that good and now everyone says that he was the entire Nova offense. Yes, Nova leaned on him in the NC game, but Whitney had a fantastic game in the NC, along with Ball and Babbaro. This was one of the more complete teams Nova has ever put on the field, they had playmakers all over.
Anovafan wrote:I love how everyone bashed Szczur during the year saying he wasn't that good
Welcome A, but ???
There were a lot of naysayers, mostly on AGS I suppose, and maybe mostly Montana fans, but there were quite a few doubting his talents before the NC game.
I think an important thing to remember in all of this is how much Devlin was able to do with so little. Nova fans will be hard pressed to refute this point since they saw first hand how terrible our running game was and how equally terrible our OT's were. Then add the loss of Josh Baker who was our Szczur and it makes what he did all the more impressive. I won't take anything away from Whitney, he's a winner no question and Nova is very lucky to have him. He's not a better QB than Pat. To say that he meant more to Nova's victory during the NC is silly. Just go back and watch the game and listen to the announcers. Szczur was the man and will be again next year. As far as the coaches voting, there seems to be some suggestion of a bias against transfers. Look at UD transfers from the past in regards to the WP award. Andy Hall came in third in 03 which is crazy, and Joe Flacco was 18th. You can't tell me that 17 other players were better than Joe that year. Yes, I know both players were the Offensive players of the year in their conferences, but the voters had no choice there. Hall and Flacco were just that good those years. Whitney is a great QB, Pat is an incredible QB. If our 3 star recruit Yowk can pick up our running game, our line actually blocks, and we get Baker back you are going to see some show next year.
Whitney's perfect for National Champion Nova. If I had the chance to pick my QB for next season, it would be Devlin. As much as I love Whitney's will to win (which can be argued as the most important quality in a QB), I'm not overly impressed with his arm.
