FCS Cupcake Feast

[FargoBison]

But really, to put these things on the schedule and count them as wins or losses on the FCS record book is a little ridiculous especially when they arent considered as counters for FCS playoff purposes.

While we're on the issue of scheduling - I was wondering why NDSU folks are being so sensitive about the whole east coast limited/non-schollie cupcake scheduling. Then I looked at your schedule. You have no room to be critical of anyone about playing Division II schools when you open up the season with Lafayette and St. Francis.

Umm aren't Lafayette and St. Francis FCS schools? Not sure I get your point about not having room of being critical of schools that play DII schools.

But if you want, why don't you pompous Big Sky fans go tell Patriot League and NEC fans that post here and at AGS that their schools don't belong in the FCS.

[clenz]

While we're on the issue of scheduling - I was wondering why NDSU folks are being so sensitive about the whole east coast limited/non-schollie cupcake scheduling. Then I looked at your schedule. You have no room to be critical of anyone about playing Division II schools when you open up the season with Lafayette and St. Francis.

Umm aren't Lafayette and St. Francis FCS schools? Not sure I get your point about not having room of being critical of schools that play DII schools.

But if you want, why don't you pompous Big Sky fans go tell Patriot League and NEC fans that post here and at AGS that their schools don't belong in the FCS.

It's not that they don't belong in the FCS, or that they aren't FCS.

It is the fact there are D2's out west that could probably handle them more often than not.

[FargoBison]

Umm aren't Lafayette and St. Francis FCS schools? Not sure I get your point about not having room of being critical of schools that play DII schools.

But if you want, why don't you pompous Big Sky fans go tell Patriot League and NEC fans that post here and at AGS that their schools don't belong in the FCS.

It's not that they don't belong in the FCS, or that they aren't FCS.

It is the fact there are D2's out west that could probably handle them more often than not.

Didn't a Patriot League team end your season? I've watched some of these teams play, yes some are not great and would get handled by a DII power. Others are pretty good and could give a good DII school a beat down.

[Screamin_Eagle174]

It's not that they don't belong in the FCS, or that they aren't FCS.

It is the fact there are D2's out west that could probably handle them more often than not.

Didn't a Patriot League team end your season? I've watched some of these teams play, yes some are not great and would get handled by a DII power. Others are pretty good and could give a good DII school a beat down.

Didn't a Big Sky team end your season?

CWU > St. Francis by a mile.
CWU > or = Lafayette

[FargoBison]

Didn't a Big Sky team end your season?

Your point? I'll gladly play a Big Sky team in non-conference anytime and anyplace. In fact our AD has lined up a few games vs Big Sky opponents.

CWU > St. Francis by a mile.
CWU > or = Lafayette

Agreed for the most part, neither of those teams were very good last year. Lafayette is usually pretty decent though, St Francis not so much but that game was originally vs Georgia Southern which would have been a great match up.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

While we're on the issue of scheduling - I was wondering why NDSU folks are being so sensitive about the whole east coast limited/non-schollie cupcake scheduling. Then I looked at your schedule. You have no room to be critical of anyone about playing Division II schools when you open up the season with Lafayette and St. Francis.

Umm aren't Lafayette and St. Francis FCS schools? Not sure I get your point about not having room of being critical of schools that play DII schools.

But if you want, why don't you pompous Big Sky fans go tell Patriot League and NEC fans that post here and at AGS that their schools don't belong in the FCS.

No, what's funny is that we have played good teams like Albany out of the NEC and then had dipshits from NDSU talking about how great there schedule was...much like they still do today.

There are good teams in there and it's nice to see you guys play them so some of your ilk can shut their mouthes about what good teams are and what appropriate scheduling is. Hell, you all had that wake up call when RMU came into the FD and gave you a whale of a game until the end.

Also, as clenz said, there are some D2's that are competing at that same level as well. Some of your ilk have trouble looking at things honestly because it peels away what you've set up for yourselves and the talking points you like to run with.

I ain't saying it's you specifically FB but I seem to remember having some of these kinds of conversations with you a few years back.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Didn't a Big Sky team end your season?

Your point? I'll gladly play a Big Sky team in non-conference anytime and anyplace. In fact our AD has lined up a few games vs Big Sky opponents.

CWU > St. Francis by a mile.
CWU > or = Lafayette

Agreed for the most part, neither of those teams were very good last year. Lafayette is usually pretty decent though, St Francis not so much but that game was originally vs Georgia Southern which would have been a great match up.

Given the circumstances that's a real good schedule considering you were left in the lurch. It would have been pretty decent work any year. The thing is the dick measuring that some do about what their schedule is and what it proves that brings out this kind of shit. NDSU fans are notorious for wanting to see how big their dick is.

I'm not saying it's you specifically FB but I remember you asking if you could take a peek in my knickers a few years back.

[FargoBison]

Umm aren't Lafayette and St. Francis FCS schools? Not sure I get your point about not having room of being critical of schools that play DII schools.

But if you want, why don't you pompous Big Sky fans go tell Patriot League and NEC fans that post here and at AGS that their schools don't belong in the FCS.

No, what's funny is that we have played good teams like Albany out of the NEC and then had dipshits from NDSU talking about how great there schedule was...much like they still do today.

There are good teams in there and it's nice to see you guys play them so some of your ilk can shut their mouthes about what good teams are and what appropriate scheduling is. Hell, you all had that wake up call when RMU came into the FD and gave you a whale of a game until the end.

Also, as clenz said, there are some D2's that are competing at that same level as well. Some of your ilk have trouble looking at things honestly because it peels away what you've set up for yourselves and the talking points you like to run with.

I ain't saying it's you specifically FB but I seem to remember having some of these kinds of conversations with you a few years back.

I've always been supportive and respectful of the NEC. Mostly because the conference wants to better itself, it earned a playoff bid by stepping and playing tough schedules.I am fully aware and know that other NDSU fans have not been so gracious. A few of them got a wake up call from RMU which was needed.

I never gave Montana crap for playing Albany. I have long been a proponent of more FCS teams playing each other in non conference. I do give schools lots of crap for playing non-DIs and that won't stop, not because I think all DII schools are terrible but because I'd rather see more intra-FCS games in non-conference play.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

No, what's funny is that we have played good teams like Albany out of the NEC and then had dipshits from NDSU talking about how great there schedule was...much like they still do today.

There are good teams in there and it's nice to see you guys play them so some of your ilk can shut their mouthes about what good teams are and what appropriate scheduling is. Hell, you all had that wake up call when RMU came into the FD and gave you a whale of a game until the end.

Also, as clenz said, there are some D2's that are competing at that same level as well. Some of your ilk have trouble looking at things honestly because it peels away what you've set up for yourselves and the talking points you like to run with.

I ain't saying it's you specifically FB but I seem to remember having some of these kinds of conversations with you a few years back.

I've always been supportive and respectful of the NEC. Mostly because the conference wants to better itself, it earned a playoff bid by stepping and playing tough schedules.I am fully aware and know that other NDSU fans have not been so gracious. A few of them got a wake up call from RMU which was needed.

I never gave Montana crap for playing Albany. I have long been a proponent of more FCS teams playing each other in non conference. I do give schools lots of crap for playing non-DIs and that won't stop, not because I think all DII schools are terrible but because I'd rather see more intra-FCS games in non-conference play.

My mistake. I think much like yourself on the matter.

[EWURanger]

Umm aren't Lafayette and St. Francis FCS schools? Not sure I get your point about not having room of being critical of schools that play DII schools.

But if you want, why don't you pompous Big Sky fans go tell Patriot League and NEC fans that post here and at AGS that their schools don't belong in the FCS.

It's not that they don't belong in the FCS, or that they aren't FCS.

It is the fact there are D2's out west that could probably handle them more often than not.

Thank you. Someone finally gets it.

[EWURanger]

No, what's funny is that we have played good teams like Albany out of the NEC and then had dipshits from NDSU talking about how great there schedule was...much like they still do today.

There are good teams in there and it's nice to see you guys play them so some of your ilk can shut their mouthes about what good teams are and what appropriate scheduling is. Hell, you all had that wake up call when RMU came into the FD and gave you a whale of a game until the end.

Also, as clenz said, there are some D2's that are competing at that same level as well. Some of your ilk have trouble looking at things honestly because it peels away what you've set up for yourselves and the talking points you like to run with.

I ain't saying it's you specifically FB but I seem to remember having some of these kinds of conversations with you a few years back.

I've always been supportive and respectful of the NEC. Mostly because the conference wants to better itself, it earned a playoff bid by stepping and playing tough schedules.I am fully aware and know that other NDSU fans have not been so gracious. A few of them got a wake up call from RMU which was needed.

I never gave Montana crap for playing Albany. I have long been a proponent of more FCS teams playing each other in non conference. I do give schools lots of crap for playing non-DIs and that won't stop, not because I think all DII schools are terrible but because I'd rather see more intra-FCS games in non-conference play.

The point is you (and other NDSU folks on BV) are thumping your collective chests about playing an all "Division I" schedule while putting other schools down for playing Division II's when the competition in some of those OOC contests is not all that different. History proves that there will be several teams that make the playoffs that have a Division II on their schedule.

Like I said over on BV, if you want to kid yourselves into thinking that you are playing tougher competition simply because a couple of your OOC opponents have the "Division I" or "FCS" moniker, then that is your prerogative, but it's an oversimplification of the situation, IMO. EWU, Sac St, Weber, and many other schools all play a full 2011 schedule against Division I opposition that carry at least 63 scholarships, but you don't see anyone bragging about it.

You also accuse folks of being elitists for being critical of playing non-schollie FCS programs, while simultaneously criticizing schools for playing Division II. That's a bit ironic - who's the elitists?

[FargoBison]

The point is you (and other NDSU folks on BV) are thumping your collective chests about playing an all "Division I" schedule while putting other schools down for playing Division II's when the competition in some of those OOC contests is not all that different. History proves that there will be several teams that make the playoffs that have a Division II on their schedule.

The thing is, the vast majority of non-DI games are vs non-DI also rans. So lets not make it seem like most teams are running out and scheduling Grand Valley State here, Western State would be by far the most typical kind of non-DI opponent. St. Francis would pound Western State.


If supporting playing NEC and Patriot League teams in non conference play over DII schools makes me an elitist than I'll gladly carry that label. Last time I checked those schools were in the FCS, I'll always support an FCS vs FCS matchup over any FCS vs non-DI matchup. Saying things like those schools are FCS in name only is very elitist.

This goes both ways, I've long been critical of the Pioneer League for not scheduling games against the FCS. Especially when their fans whine about not making the playoffs while they have multiple non-DI games on their schedule. If I'm going to be critical of them, I've got to be the same way to others.

I'm not attacking the Big Sky here, I'm attacking the thought process that the FCS should count non-DI games. That would do nothing but marginalize the FCS by making it even more regional and would ultimately weaken our brand. FCS vs FCS non-conference only help to make the subdivision stronger and more competitive.

[EWURanger]

The point is you (and other NDSU folks on BV) are thumping your collective chests about playing an all "Division I" schedule while putting other schools down for playing Division II's when the competition in some of those OOC contests is not all that different. History proves that there will be several teams that make the playoffs that have a Division II on their schedule.

The thing is, the vast majority of non-DI games are vs non-DI also rans. So lets not make it seem like most teams are running out and scheduling Grand Valley State here, Western State would be by far the most typical kind of non-DI opponent. St. Francis would pound Western State.


If supporting playing NEC and Patriot League teams in non conference play over DII schools makes me an elitist than I'll gladly carry that label. Last time I checked those schools were in the FCS, I'll always support an FCS vs FCS matchup over any FCS vs non-DI matchup. Saying things like those schools are FCS in name only is very elitist.

This goes both ways, I've long been critical of the Pioneer League for not scheduling games against the FCS. Especially when their fans whine about not making the playoffs while they have multiple non-DI games on their schedule. If I'm going to be critical of them, I've got to be the same way to others.

I'm not attacking the Big Sky here, I'm attacking the thought process that the FCS should count non-DI games. That would do nothing but marginalize the FCS by making it even more regional and would ultimately weaken our brand. FCS vs FCS non-conference only help to make the subdivision stronger and more competitive.

So if a Big Sky school played San Diego, for instance, instead of a Central Washington or Humboldt State, that would be more acceptable in your opinon, simply because San Diego is an FCS school?

I'm sure that if the situation were reversed and we had more scheduling options out west things would be a little different. The MVFC (and others) do have the benefit of being somewhat centrally located and therefore has more scheduling opportunities. It's easy to be critical when you have FCS teams you can schedule that aren't going to cost an arm and a leg in travelling costs or that you can pay a somewhat modest sum to have them come to your house. I'm not sure what else Big Sky schools could do in that regard, perhaps outside of some more home and homes with the Southland and MVFC. We don't have the luxury of two conferences of San Diego's within traveling distance.

[Thumper 76]

While the BSC is worrying about the likes of Minot State, Central Washington, Fort lewis et al.

And competing in, and winning, National Championship games. Something NDSU has yet to do at this level.

[FargoBison]

Yes, much more acceptable in my eyes.

I've said it before in this thread that Montana is stepping up and picking up more intra-FCS games, which is a great. NDSU, SDSU and USD are all a long ways from most FCS schools, the only teams close to us not in the MVFC are Drake and UND. So there are opportunities there.

The SLC is losing a football school so there should be more opportunities there as well for the Big Sky to find some games.

[JBB]

I dont think anybody is bragging about the NDSU schedule. It is what it is, all D1 and all counters. The only point Im making is the D2 should be listed as exhibition.

Fargo Bison and the rest can brag about Central Washington and the rest of the tough D2s out there but counting them as a regular season win isnt right.

Both divisions get penalized for playing the games, heck UND quit playing NDSU when we moved up because of that, I guess? Now they make a living playing NAIA and D2 and want to call them regular season games along with the rest of the BSC.

NDSU plays a D1 schedule, say what you will they are all counters, not exhibition games. I have no problem with the exhibition games but call them what they are.

[JBB]

I dont think anybody is bragging about the NDSU schedule. It is what it is, all D1 and all counters. The only point Im making is the D2 should be listed as exhibition.

Fargo Bison and the rest can brag about Central Washington and the rest of the tough D2s out there but counting them as a regular season win isnt right.

Both divisions get penalized for playing the games, heck UND quit playing NDSU when we moved up because of that, I guess? Now they make a living playing NAIA and D2 and want to call them regular season games along with the rest of the BSC.

NDSU plays a D1 schedule, say what you will they are all counters, not exhibition games. I have no problem with the exhibition games but call them what they are: EXHIBITION GAMES

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Yes, much more acceptable in my eyes.

I've said it before in this thread that Montana is stepping up and picking up more intra-FCS games, which is a great. NDSU, SDSU and USD are all a long ways from most FCS schools, the only teams close to us not in the MVFC are Drake and UND. So there are opportunities there.

The SLC is losing a football school so there should be more opportunities there as well for the Big Sky to find some games.

Doesn't make a big difference in the final analysis though. Whatever anyone wants to think doesn't pass muster as far as all this goes. You schedule the most economically feasible that you can and work from there on getting other things accomplished as far as who it is.

When/if you get to the playoffs is where the rubber hits the road. It doesn't matter what anybody thinks about the competition you played to get there. Once those teams that have been wagging their willies around get a load of you it can't be denied that the scheduling isn't all it's about.

In 1995 we piss pounded the teams on the way to the NC game to the tune of 163-14 and then went in to Marshall and beat them on their home turf.

We played Eastern N. Mexico , Minnesota-Duluth, and UC Davis that year on the way to conference. That's right...3 D2's and then conference...and then total annihilation of the opponents on the way to the chipper.

The "all D1 schedule" thing is great if you can do it but it don't mean shit if you don't have the team & schemes to make the playoff run.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

I dont think anybody is bragging about the NDSU schedule. It is what it is, all D1 and all counters. The only point Im making is the D2 should be listed as exhibition.

Fargo Bison and the rest can brag about Central Washington and the rest of the tough D2s out there but counting them as a regular season win isnt right.

Both divisions get penalized for playing the games, heck UND quit playing NDSU when we moved up because of that, I guess? Now they make a living playing NAIA and D2 and want to call them regular season games along with the rest of the BSC.

NDSU plays a D1 schedule, say what you will they are all counters, not exhibition games. I have no problem with the exhibition games but call them what they are: EXHIBITION GAMES

I don't disagree with your sentiments on that. D2 games shouldn't count and they are primarily exhibition games. Some are as tough as some of the D1 schedule but they don't and shouldn't count.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

I dont think anybody is bragging about the NDSU schedule. It is what it is, all D1 and all counters. The only point Im making is the D2 should be listed as exhibition.

Fargo Bison and the rest can brag about Central Washington and the rest of the tough D2s out there but counting them as a regular season win isnt right.

Both divisions get penalized for playing the games, heck UND quit playing NDSU when we moved up because of that, I guess? Now they make a living playing NAIA and D2 and want to call them regular season games along with the rest of the BSC.

NDSU plays a D1 schedule, say what you will they are all counters, not exhibition games. I have no problem with the exhibition games but call them what they are: EXHIBITION GAMES

I don't disagree with your sentiments on that. D2 games shouldn't count and they are primarily exhibition games. Some are as tough as some of the D1 schedule but they don't and shouldn't count.

[JBB]

Exactly. The others can argue all they want but they should appear on the schedule as an exhibition just like out of division basketball. They are what they are.

[grizzaholic]

Exactly. The others can argue all they want but they should appear on the schedule as an exhibition just like out of division basketball. They are what they are.

What they are is a schedule out of the Playoffs. That is what the D2/NAIA games are.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Exactly. The others can argue all they want but they should appear on the schedule as an exhibition just like out of division basketball. They are what they are.

They already don't count so no need going any further than that. We know what they are.

[JBB]

Im sorry, but by not listing them on the schedule as exhibition games there is an element of deception. The games should state on the schedule they are exhibitions. Back east and down south and even around here, not everybody knows who these schools are that are being scheduled so they might take it for granted that the defending National Champions or another Big Sky team is playing a Division 1 game and they shouldn't be deceived. They should be informed.

Its done in Basketball. Of course if you have no stomach to be accountable on the exhibitions games thats another story.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Im sorry, but by not listing them on the schedule as exhibition games there is an element of deception. The games should state on the schedule they are exhibitions. Back east and down south and even around here, not everybody knows who these schools are that are being scheduled so they might take it for granted that the defending National Champions or another Big Sky team is playing a Division 1 game and they shouldn't be deceived. They should be informed.

Its done in Basketball. Of course if you have no stomach to be accountable on the exhibitions games thats another story.

Ah, fuck it. I tried to show where we agree and be agreeable with you on matters but you want to be a dick anyway so shame on me I guess.

I couldn't give a fuck what you call them. You seem to think that trivialities matter so term them however you'd like.

You lost to a team that had an exhibition game last year and you did not compete against them with any more integrity than the exhibition team did. In fact, you competed less valiantly.

Stomach that shit.