CAA Footbal Future

[49RFootballNow]

Always hear a lot of talk about the CAA moving to FBS as a conference, but everyone knows certain schools in the conference will never even consider such a move. I'm not as up to date on the CAA's schools' football ambitions; but it seems like it would make sense that if there was a split, it wouldn't be geographic in nature, but ambitions/budgets that would cause it and might even be for the best.

I don't see a conference move up - it would fall in line below the Sunbelt and the MAAC, etc and what's the point of that? If it happens it will be individual schools doing what's best for their situation. UR's not moving up, W&M is not moving up. JMU is leaning that way. And the rest, who knows?

I think you give a CAA based FBS conference too little credit. What CAA schools would/would not be interested in a move up?

[ChooChoo]

Here's how I think the CAA football schools stack up as far as FBS is concerned:
No Desire to Improbable- Maine, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, Villanova, Richmond, William & Mary
Improbable to Possible- Towson
Possible to Probable- UMass, Delaware
Probable- James Madison, Old Dominion, Georgia State

[Keeper]

The Big Ten is looking at expansion.
I'm sure some of the CAA South schools would fit right in.

[∞∞∞]

I don't get why some people still think we want to move to FBS. Wilder and the administration has CLEARLY said that ODU's goal is to build an FCS power on the east coast and win a National Championship, and no one at the top has even hinted at going FBS. For us, even mentioning moving to FBS is something so distant in the future (10-12+) years that it's not even relevant to any current discussions, unless we get an offer we simply can't refuse...which I doubt. JMU seems to be gettin' ready with their stadium, and GSU has stated that FBS are their intentions.

That said, we are getting a new AD next year when Dr. Jarett retires (longest serving AD in the country), so the thinking at ODU's top is changing, be that for better or worse...

[89Hen]

Possible to Probable-Delaware
Probable- James Madison

Not sure there's much of a difference except that JMU's stadium improvements are ahead of Delaware's. We have yet to see if they will support 20k+. I think they very well may, but we don't know that. They are also in the heart of VT and UVA territory. I'm not sure that area will support a I-A team and where would they go? Honestly, I don't think either is even close to Probable and borderline if it's even Possible without a good home.

[Col Hogan]

Given the current crappy system in FBS, moving up from FCS without being in a BCS conference is worthless IMHO...There is a potential to make some money, but getting to play in the Massingill Douche Bowl in Alamogordo NM just isn't that appealing...

[andy7171]

Here's how I think the CAA football schools stack up as far as FBS is concerned:
No Desire to Improbable- Maine, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, Villanova, Richmond, William & Mary
Improbable to Possible- Towson
Possible to Probable- UMass, Delaware
Probable- James Madison, Old Dominion, Georgia State

I don't like it, but I would put Towson in the Possible to Probable. It would be unwise, in my opinion. But our target enrolement is for 26-27,000 student by 2015. We're at 20K now.
If Delaware, JMU and ODU go, I would think Towson jumps too. Foolishly, I might add.

[henfan]

Here's how I think the CAA football schools stack up as far as FBS is concerned:
No Desire to Improbable- Maine, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, Villanova, Richmond, William & Mary
Improbable to Possible- Towson
Possible to Probable- UMass, Delaware
Probable- James Madison, Old Dominion, Georgia State

Realistically, if I had to venture a guess:

A. No administrative desire- Maine, New Hampshire, Rhode Island, Towson, Richmond, William & Mary

B. Moderate administrative desire but can't support/afford it- UMass, Villanova

C. Can support/afford it but no evident administrative desire- Delaware, ODU, JMU

D. Financing & support unknown- GSU

I don't see any school's FBS desires impacting the CAA FB in the immediate future. The economy being what it is, I'm far more concerned with more schools dropping or deemphasizing.

[BlueHen86]

Given the current crappy system in FBS, moving up from FCS without being in a BCS conference is worthless IMHO...There is a potential to make some money, but getting to play in the Massingill Douche Bowl in Alamogordo NM just isn't that appealing...

I agree. I think it's inevitable that the Big East will expand to 12 football members, so there may be opportunities there. Villanova and perhaps UMass would fit in nicely, but I don't think they have any interest.

The only way I'd like to see UD move up is if they can join either the ACC or Big East, neither of which is likely.

[SUUTbird]

Given the current crappy system in FBS, moving up from FCS without being in a BCS conference is worthless IMHO...There is a potential to make some money, but getting to play in the Massingill Douche Bowl in Alamogordo NM just isn't that appealing...

I agree. I think it's inevitable that the Big East will expand to 12 football members, so there may be opportunities there. Villanova and perhaps UMass would fit in nicely, but I don't think they have any interest.

The only way I'd like to see UD move up is if they can join either the ACC or Big East, neither of which is likely.

I could see this happening as it seems that more and more conferences are moving to 12 teams to get the media exposure and to just get a conference championship game. If they Big East expands i can see Army, Navy, Delaware and JMU joining

[mcveyrl]

Possible to Probable-Delaware
Probable- James Madison

Not sure there's much of a difference except that JMU's stadium improvements are ahead of Delaware's. We have yet to see if they will support 20k+. I think they very well may, but we don't know that. They are also in the heart of VT and UVA territory. I'm not sure that area will support a I-A team and where would they go? Honestly, I don't think either is even close to Probable and borderline if it's even Possible without a good home.

Yea, the key is finding the right home. I don't think either school wants to jump to a Sun Belt type situation. We've a long way to go to see if we can get there. As you mentioned, we've got to fill up the 24K on a consistent basis. I'm sure that if we move up we'll look at expanding the stadium more (the design was such that it would be easy to do) so you want to fill up what you've got first.

I'm not too concerned about being in the middle of VT and UVa country. No matter what, we'll always be behind those two. If anything we might get a few JMU alums that normally pull for Tech and the Hoos 'cause they are "D 1."

[HenZoneNation]

The Big Ten is looking to add a school to it's conference and Rutgers has been named as one of those schools who could possibly go. The Big East has been on record as saying that if Notre Dame stayed as an Independent in football that they might be removed from all other sports in that conference. This opens some slots in multiple sports. If Rutgers leaves I could see the Big East making a push for one of the top CAA schools and UD with it's fan base and 1.34 billion dollar endowment could be a very appealing school to nab.

I hope not though. I'm and FCS fan....and our horrible men's basketball team would get murdered.

[BlueHen86]

The Big Ten is looking to add a school to it's conference and Rutgers has been named as one of those schools who could possibly go. The Big East has been on record as saying that if Notre Dame stayed as an Independent in football that they might be removed from all other sports in that conference. This opens some slots in multiple sports. If Rutgers leaves I could see the Big East making a push for one of the top CAA schools and UD with it's fan base and 1.34 billion dollar endowment could be a very appealing school to nab.

I hope not though. I'm and FCS fan....and our horrible men's basketball team would get murdered.

I think Notre Dame is the first choice of the Big Ten, but they have always said no in the past. Rutgers Syracuse and Pitt have all been mentioned as being posible candidates for the Big Ten. If any of them leave then the Big East will only have 7 football teams. My guess is that the Big East will raid Conference USA first, and maybe the MAC. It would be funny if they let Temple back in. Geographically CAA schools make sense, but they don't do anything to help the Big East maintain itself as a BCS conference.

If UD joined for all sports I think the B-ball team would improve dramatically. I'd like to see that, but I doubt it will happen. Besides, the Big East has enough B-ball teams.

[BlueHen86]

I agree. I think it's inevitable that the Big East will expand to 12 football members, so there may be opportunities there. Villanova and perhaps UMass would fit in nicely, but I don't think they have any interest.

The only way I'd like to see UD move up is if they can join either the ACC or Big East, neither of which is likely.

I could see this happening as it seems that more and more conferences are moving to 12 teams to get the media exposure and to just get a conference championship game. If they Big East expands i can see Army, Navy, Delaware and JMU joining

I say no to all four of those schools. UD and JMU would have to move up first and that is a way off, if it even happens at all. Besides, the Big East may have already expanded to 12 teams before either UD or JMU complete a move up.

Army left Conference USA because the schedule was too demanding, I doubt if they want to join a BCS conference. Navy also seems to be very happy as an independent. The main drawback of being an independent is scheduling, Army and Navy don't have this problem, they can always find schools willing to play them.

You are more likely to see Conference USA get raided.

[collegesportsinfo]

The Big Ten is looking to add a school to it's conference and Rutgers has been named as one of those schools who could possibly go. The Big East has been on record as saying that if Notre Dame stayed as an Independent in football that they might be removed from all other sports in that conference. This opens some slots in multiple sports. If Rutgers leaves I could see the Big East making a push for one of the top CAA schools and UD with it's fan base and 1.34 billion dollar endowment could be a very appealing school to nab.

I hope not though. I'm and FCS fan....and our horrible men's basketball team would get murdered.

I'd be interested in seeing these records, especially since by all accounts thus far, it is untrue.

In fact, Notre Dame football gets Big East bowl tie-ins when it suits them/the bowls. The Big East has been able to secure some of their previous and current bowls BECAUSE of the Notre Dame clause. The bowls have outright rejected the Big East unless the Notre Dame exception was included.

I do agree that the Big East could protect itself from the threat of losing any of the "football 8" by sacrificing Notre Dame: tell them all sports or none and they'd likely leave for the Big Ten (vs being in the A10/MVC for non-football sports).

But other than blogs by people like me and some media folks having fun, nobody has ever written anything of substance on the matter that indicates that the Big East would ever do anything as such.

So if you have access to these records, please share since they'd be HUGE resources regarding the conference realignment front.

[ccd494]

No offense to the northern teams, but NO THANKS. I'd rather stick with programs that are spending money on their facilities (and also happen to be a LOT closer to me ).

Thankfully, you are not in charge.

Also, no one has ever really explained to me what is wrong with Maine's facilities, other than geography and weather.

[CAA Flagship]

Thankfully, you are not in charge.

Also, no one has ever really explained to me what is wrong with Maine's facilities, other than geography and weather.

Did you get the second goal post yet?

[danefan]

Also, no one has ever really explained to me what is wrong with Maine's facilities, other than geography and weather.

Did you get the second goal post yet?

Apparently nobody told the butterfly fans that we play half-court football in the Northeast.

[GA St. MBB Fan]

I'm not sure why everybody thinks that Ga State is going to go to FBS soon. They have miserable attendance at their basketball, and in football will have to compete with Ga Tech. A few of their fans bluster about going to FBS and making a huge splash on the college football scene, but frankly I don't see it.

It seems they're having enough difficulty funding an entry to FCS. They apparently have not secured the funds to complete a practice field, which was to be a first order of business. They are moving into their first season of competition, and investment from the Atlanta business community, and their alumni base does not approach what ODU had at the same point.

GSU Football Facility Ahead of Schedule ->
http://www.ajc.com/sports/gsu-football- ... orts_88838

[Tribe4SF]

It seems they're having enough difficulty funding an entry to FCS. They apparently have not secured the funds to complete a practice field, which was to be a first order of business. They are moving into their first season of competition, and investment from the Atlanta business community, and their alumni base does not approach what ODU had at the same point.

GSU Football Facility Ahead of Schedule ->
http://www.ajc.com/sports/gsu-football- ... orts_88838

Saw that on the GSU board, and while it's somewhat encouraging, it's also clear that the remaining two phases are dependent on fundraising. The context for my comment was the discussion here of the probablility of a move to FBS for CAA schools. In that context, Georgia State appears to be lacking the financial investment to even consider such a move. By contrast, ODU's facilities were ready as soon as S.B. Ballard Construction could get them built.

There's been discussion from some on the GSU board that if the Big East was take in GSU, the school could then parlay Big East related revenues to develop the needed facilities. Unfortunately that's polar opposite of the way it would need to work. The Big East would want to see the available investment from alumni, and the Atlanta community before even considering GSU.

Again in contrast to ODU, GSU's business plan for launching its football program appears to have an "on-the-fly" character to it as regards fundraising. If all the "what-ifs" were to come to pass over the next ten years, GSU could conceivably be in a position to consider a move up, but there's no hard evidence at this point to suggest those hopes are even possible, let alone probable.

[GA St. MBB Fan]

There's been discussion from some on the GSU board that if the Big East was take in GSU, the school could then parlay Big East related revenues to develop the needed facilities. Unfortunately that's polar opposite of the way it would need to work. The Big East would want to see the available investment from alumni, and the Atlanta community before even considering GSU.

Again in contrast to ODU, GSU's business plan for launching its football program appears to have an "on-the-fly" character to it as regards fundraising. If all the "what-ifs" were to come to pass over the next ten years, GSU could conceivably be in a position to consider a move up, but there's no hard evidence at this point to suggest those hopes are even possible, let alone probable.

Please don't take speculation by those on the GSU board and turn it into GSU's "business plan." I was the one that posted the scenario that your speaking of, and let me assure you that it was nothing more than something conjured in my head. Merely a fan, positing for thoughts.

I don't know what amount of disclosure ODU's athletics department did, or knowledge you have personally of ODU's "business plan." Or how it compares to GSU's "business plan." But, I would think the Georgia State administration and athletics department are preparing a "business plan" on a lot more than "what ifs." Yet, due to various reasons that "business plan" something that is not spoken of, out side of the board or conference room in which it was discussed. Just because you don't see a press release or something doesn't mean it doesn't exist, it may just mean than it isn't being discussed openly. And please do not substitute what is discussed on the GSU board as the "official business plan" of Georgia State athletics, and assume that it is based on the "what ifs" of GSU fans merely speculating on their schools future.

[Tribe4SF]

I wasn't inferring that the Big East concept was part of the business plan. What I was saying is that the four stage plan for the practice facility, field house, offices and weight room is apparently not yet fully funded. If it was you would think it would be under construction because it is needed now. The ODU facilities were funded and construction was complete prior to their first season. That was what I meant by "on-the-fly".

[GA St. MBB Fan]

I wasn't inferring that the Big East concept was part of the business plan. What I was saying is that the four stage plan for the practice facility, field house, offices and weight room is apparently not yet fully funded. If it was you would think it would be under construction because it is needed now. The ODU facilities were funded and construction was complete prior to their first season. That was what I meant by "on-the-fly".

I don't think it is too outside of the norm to build something in "phases." And I wouldn't call that approach to building something in phases, "on the fly."

What is "needed" right now, are the fields. And all accounts are they will be ready by Spring practice. And even if they aren't, what is wrong with practicing at the NFL YET facility until they are? I wouldn't call that "on the fly." I would call that making good use of the resources that you have, and planning for contingecies.

Offices, weight rooms, are secondary and GSU has those facilities - the fact they aren't concentrated at the football facility is a minor point. GSU has plenty of office space for coaches on campus, whether it be temporary or permanent space, and have already expanded the current weight room to accommodate football for the time being.

[GA St. MBB Fan]

Also I did a little additional research.

First of all, ODU acquired its land for football practice facilities through a land swap with the city of Norfolk. I wonder how much money that saved ODU, to use to build their facility?
http://hamptonroads.com/node/92931

Second, ODU announced football in 2006, and was fundraising before then. In 2006 the economy was thriving (by most standards - I'm not attempting to get into an economic debate). GSU didn't announce football until April of 2008, 6 months before the "credit crisis." And although they hired Dan Reeves in 2007 to "gauge interest" and raise funds, they didn't do a heavy fund raising campaign until after the announcement of football.
http://www.odu.edu/ao/alumni_magazine/S ... ising.html
http://www.georgiastatesports.com/ViewA ... LID=860313

So would Georgia State be guilty of being in the wrong place at the wrong time? Yes, but then again who expected the economy to fall apart like it did? But, is Georgia State doing things "on the fly," I don't think so.

[49RFootballNow]

So would Georgia State be guilty of being in the wrong place at the wrong time? Yes, but then again who expected the economy to fall apart like it did? But, is Georgia State doing things "on the fly," I don't think so.

Football is a long term investment for the University, any University. Football is something you hope is permanent and lasts for hundreds of years. There's typically a 5 to 6 year buildup from the time you start examining starting a football program to the day the team takes the field. Making any changes now could look really stupid next year or 5 years down the road. The University made this decision with a long range intent. Football was a good investment in their judgement in a good economy and it still will be a good invest when the economy turns around. GSU was right to continue on track, it will pay off in the end.