Do you consider Youngstown State an elite FCS program?

[JBB]

Clearly YSU is an elite program. It is one of the largest programs in the nation. They are slightly behind NDSU but still the second largest program in the MVFC. Some people have cast doubt on the attendance figures posted by YSU. In many cases these are the same fans that will poo-poo any other doubt about any other phase of the game including the officiating. They simply are disingenuous.

Secondly they have a proud tradition. whether its yesterday or last year, success is always measured by looking to the past. Future success is pure speculation.

lastly, YSU has a commitment to the game. They are often mentioned when it comes to FBS move up talk. They fund their program and obviously take pride in it and what it can do for YSU as a whole.

YSU is an elite program.

Replace YSU with Western Kentucky or Marshall, and see the absurdity of you statement above. Caution, that would require an IQ above a working refrigerator's internal temp.

Army also had an elite FB program once. They won three national champships in 1944, 1945, 1946.

You are certainly unpleasant and undisciplined in your responses. Your inability to make a point is troubling, it my indicate cognative problems associated with your living environment in which you are trapped. Certainly you are not up to speed.

There is no reason in the world for me to change YSU to anything. I made my points, you made stupid remarks.

[AZGrizFan]

There's a LOT of hate in this thread for a team that won 3 games last year.

Ask the UNI, NDSU, WIU, and ILSU fans if we played as bad as a 3 win team?

YSU led in every game last year, led 7 times in the 4th quarter, and unfortunately blew 4th quarter leads with under 2:00 left to UNI, NDSU, WIU, and ILSU.

And the Grizzlies were about 5 plays from having a perfect record last year....what's your point? You still only won 3 games.

[Trapped in CA]

Replace YSU with Western Kentucky or Marshall, and see the absurdity of you statement above. Caution, that would require an IQ above a working refrigerator's internal temp.

Army also had an elite FB program once. They won three national championships in 1944, 1945, 1946.

You are certainly unpleasant and undisciplined in your responses. Your inability to make a point is troubling, it my indicate cognative problems associated with your living environment in which you are trapped. Certainly you are not up to speed.

There is no reason in the world for me to change YSU to anything. I made my points, you made stupid remarks.

I see no Bill Fette reference in your post - to busy filling sand bags to put together your normal Unabomber-eqse manifesto?

BTW - Trapped in CA refers to my companies' business contracts that require me to live in the crazy state. Making way to much $$ to give up on "golden handcuffs," as it were.

[JBB]

Gee trapped in CA, you remain extremly unpleasant. Your manner almost makes it impossible to believe you are making any money at all.

I think your point is YSU is not an elite program. Unfortunately when your best evidence is a personal insult its difficult to tell. I say YSU is an elite program. First a few comments on "elite".

There is no criteria set forth as to what identifies a team as elite. You have to include, and in no special order:

1) attendance
2) overall tradition
3) quality of facilities
4) recent success
5) competitiveness

There may be other relevant qualities as well that would help the lay person identify an elite program and then decide if YSU was among them.

YSU:
Attendance: top 20 in the nation, #2 MVFC. +5
Overall tradition: speaks for itself, lots of past success on a national scale +5
quality of facilities: FBS quality and scale. Among the best in the MVFC and The Fabulous Fargo Dome is in the MVFC too! +4
Recent success: This is their weakest category, again the record speaks for itself. +2
Competitiveness: YSU is a big game for any program. Overall score is tempered somewhat because of the low score on recent success. One reflects the other, but you can be very competitive and still lose. +4

When ranking elite programs YSU scores a 20 of a possible 25. Not bad, considering EWU scores a 17 and NDSU, a benchmark elite program, 23.

Heres a look at the national champs, EWU:
Attendance: Low. +2
Overall tradition: Their historic success is not on a nationsl scale. +3
quality of facilities: Decent, basic FCS facilities. +3
Recent success: This is their strongest category, again the record speaks for itself. +5
Competitiveness: +4

Now compare them to another elite program, say the NDSU BISON:

Attendance: Among the nations highest. +5
Overall tradition: Their historic success is on a national scale. +5
quality of facilities: Excellent FCS, lower end FBS similar to YSU. +4
Recent success: The BISON have been very successful. They made it to the 4th round of the playoffs last year and have been ranked #1 several times in the past 5 years. They are perennially a nationally ranked team currently top 10. +5
Competitiveness: The NDSU BISON are always a big game. Even in a 3-8 year they played close, competitive and sharp. +4

[AZGrizFan]

Gee trapped in CA, you remain extremly unpleasant. Your manner almost makes it impossible to believe you are making any money at all.

I think your point is YSU is not an elite program. I say they are. First a few comments on "best".

There is no criteria set forth as to what identifies a team as the best. You have to include, and in no special order:

1) attendance
2) overall tradition
3) quality of facilities
4) recent success
5) competitiveness

There may be other relevant qualities as well that would help the lay person identify an elite program and then decide if YSU was among them.

YSU:
Attendance: top 20 in the nation, #2 MVFC. +5
Overall tradition: speaks for itself, lots of past success on a national scale +5
quality of facilities: FBS quality and scale. Among the best in the MVFC and The Fabulous Fargo Dome is in the MVFC too! +4
Recent success: This is their weakest category, again the record speaks for itself. +2
Competitiveness: YSU is a big game for any program. Overall score is tempered somewhat because of the low score on recent success. One reflects the other, but you can be very competitive and still lose. +4

When ranking elite programs YSU scores a 20 of a possible 25. Not bad, considering EWU scores a 17 and NDSU, a benchmark elite program, 23.

Heres a look at the national champs, EWU:
Attendance: Low. +2
Overall tradition: Their historic success is not on a nationsl scale. +3
quality of facilities: Decent, basic FCS facilities. +3
Recent success: This is their strongest category, again the record speaks for itself. +5
Competitiveness: +4

Now compare them to another elite program, say the NDSU BISON:

Attendance: Among the nations highest. +5
Overall tradition: Their historic success is on a national scale. +5
quality of facilities: Excellent FCS, lower end FBS similar to YSU. +4
Recent success: The BISON have been very successful. They made it to the 4th round of the playoffs last year and have been ranked #1 several times in the past 5 years. They are perennially a nationally ranked team currently top 10. +5
Competitiveness: The NDSU BISON are always a big game. Even in a 3-8 year they played close, competitive and sharp. +4

Scary. I just realized you actually BELIEVE this shit.

[JBB]

Using a ranking system to define elite programs makes a lot more sense than blurting out something like "duh, no they arent"

Lets take a look at the Griz:

1) attendance +5
2) overall tradition +5
3) quality of facilities +5
4) recent success +4
5) competitiveness +5 = 24

UNI:
1) attendance +3
2) overall tradition +5
3) quality of facilities +4
4) recent success +4 arent much in the playoffs
5) competitiveness +4 = 20 Right there with YSU!!

SUU:
1) attendance +2
2) overall tradition +2
3) quality of facilities +3
4) recent success +4
5) competitiveness +4 = 15

[DJH]

"the fourth round of the playoffs."

[JBB]

Lets take a look at SIU:

1) attendance +3
2) overall tradition +4
3) quality of facilities +4 small, Must be FBS "regulation" to get a 5.
4) recent success +4
5) competitiveness +4 = 19 Not quite up to YSU standards.

[grizzaholic]

Lets take a look at NDSU shall we.

SUU:
1) attendance +9 It just doesn't get any better...we sold 10,000 tickets this year
2) overall tradition +8 We dominated every league we ever been in...titles galore...FCS next
3) quality of facilities +8 Dome...but it is awesome and LOUD...we kind of wish it was cold too
4) recent success +10 Second year we almost made it to the Chipper...DAMN YOU BILL FETTE
5) competitiveness +10 Just doesn't get any bigger than this

Lets total this puppy up... Lets see.

Carry the one.. Times.... Plus Pie...mmmmm....pie..... Subtract Bill Fette


And we get a total of 265 out of a possible 25. We are NDSU...We are just that good.

[guinzone]

[youtube][/youtube]

[DJH]

Lets take a look at SUI:

1) attendance +3
2) overall tradition +4
3) quality of facilities +4 small, Must be FBS "regulation" to get a 5.
4) recent success +4
5) competitiveness +4 = 19 Not quite up to YSU standards.

I can guarantee you that SIU has better facilities than ndsu.

[JBB]

You're as high as you can go at 4 because of size. If your new stadium is 15,000 plus you can have a 5 too! That puts you right there with YSU!!

[clenz]

[youtube][/youtube]

I don't get why that song would be used, if you are trying to build hype for the season.

You do realize that song is about how everytime you think your life/relationship/stuff is good and going the way you want it too something comes along and fucks it all up to hell. And it just keeps happening over and over and over.


Although that pretty much sums up YSU the last decade or so. Now that I think about it, it is a perfect song for YSU.

[DJH]

UNI:
1) attendance +3
2) overall tradition +5
3) quality of facilities +4
4) recent success +4 arent much in the playoffs
5) competitiveness +4 = 20 Right there with YSU!!

UNI has missed the playoffs exactly 1 time in the last 4 years. 3 conference championships in that span.

NDSU has made the playoffs exactly 1 time in the last 4 years. 0 conference championships, and has yet to crack .500 in the league.

Yet he gives ndsu a +5 and UNI a +4 in recent success.


Keep 'em coming jabber.

[ArmyOfDarkness]

JBB do you really think that ndsu's recent history is anywhere near the GRIZ's

I can't believe you honestly think this crap, and rate your recent success a 5 over the GRIZ's 4 (on your asinine scale of ranking). You even stated the last five years as recent...

It's to easy...TO EASY!!!!!!!

[grizzaholic]

JBB do you really think that ndsu's recent history is anywhere near the GRIZ's

I can't believe you honestly think this crap, and rate your recent success a 5 over the GRIZ's 4 (on your asinine scale of ranking). You even stated the last five years as recent...

It's to easy...TO EASY!!!!!!!

Goes JBB

[JBB]

Give the Griz a 5 if you think they deserve one. That gives them a 25, even though they schedule inter-divisional, missed the playoffs last season, were average in conference play, have a losing record in National Championship games and their outlook is being questioned, thats your business. I wanted to remain objective.

[grizzaholic]

Give the Griz a 5 if you think they deserve one. That gives them a 25, even though they schedule inter-divisional, missed the playoffs last season, were average in conference play, have a losing record in National Championship games and their outlook is being questioned, thats your business. I wanted to remain objective.

[ArmyOfDarkness]

Give the Griz a 5 if you think they deserve one. That gives them a 25, even though they schedule inter-divisional, missed the playoffs last season, were average in conference play, have a losing record in National Championship games and their outlook is being questioned, thats your business. I wanted to remain objective.

So, what's ndsu's history in the National Championship???
What's ndsu's 5 year recent history in conference play????
What's ndsu's 5 year playoff history???
What's ndsu's 5 year average attendance figures????
What's ndsu's 5 year highest attendance????
What's ndsu's 5 year rival game history????

Shall I go on???

Want to compare 10 years????

P.S. the BSC is ranked #3.... MVC #4....

[JBB]

JBB do you really think that ndsu's recent history is anywhere near the GRIZ's

I can't believe you honestly think this crap, and rate your recent success a 5 over the GRIZ's 4 (on your asinine scale of ranking). You even stated the last five years as recent...

It's to easy...TO EASY!!!!!!!

In the past 5 years NDSU has been very successful. They have only been playoff eligible for 2 years and already have 1 run to the third round of the playoffs in the game that gave the FCS a black-eye.

In the years they weren't eligible the BISON achieved several long runs @ #!. Won the GWFC. Beat a number of BCS/FBS squads and generally became one of the nations top 10 teams and #1 in the MVFC pre season for this year.

Where-as NDSUs trend line is up, Montana has a line trending down.

[clenz]

They have only been playoff eligible for 2 years n.

Why do yo continue to spread bullshit like this? How many years have you bee in the MVFC? That is how many years you have been playoff eligible, (re: D1).

I'll give you a hint, look up how many losses you have to UNI since 2000 and that will give you your answer you dumb fucking twat faced cunt

[grizzaholic]

JBB do you really think that ndsu's recent history is anywhere near the GRIZ's

I can't believe you honestly think this crap, and rate your recent success a 5 over the GRIZ's 4 (on your asinine scale of ranking). You even stated the last five years as recent...

It's to easy...TO EASY!!!!!!!

In the past 5 years NDSU has been very successful. They have only been playoff eligible for 2 years and already have 1 run to the third round of the playoffs in the game that gave the FCS a black-eye.

In the years they weren't eligible the BISON achieved several long runs @ #!. Won the GWFC. Beat a number of BCS/FBS squads and generally became one of the nations top 10 teams and #1 in the MVFC pre season for this year.

Where-as NDSUs trend line is up, Montana has a line trending down.

So....because Montana makes the playoffs 17 years straight...12 straight BSC titles...and they finally miss out they are on a decline? WOW.

[grizzaholic]

They have only been playoff eligible for 2 years n.

Why do yo continue to spread bullshit like this? How many years have you bee in the MVFC? That is how many years you have been playoff eligible, (re: D1).

I'll give you a hint, look up how many losses you have to UNI since 2000 and that will give you your answer you dumb fucking twat faced cunt

Go get him Clenz. I just wish SE was here to partake.

[DJH]

They have only been playoff eligible for 2 years n.

Why do yo continue to spread bullshit like this? How many years have you bee in the MVFC? That is how many years you have been playoff eligible, (re: D1).

I'll give you a hint, look up how many losses you have to UNI since 2000 and that will give you your answer you dumb fucking twat faced cunt

[clenz]

In the past 5 years NDSU has been very successful. They have only been playoff eligible for 2 years and already have 1 run to the third round of the playoffs in the game that gave the FCS a black-eye.

In the years they weren't eligible the BISON achieved several long runs @ #!. Won the GWFC. Beat a number of BCS/FBS squads and generally became one of the nations top 10 teams and #1 in the MVFC pre season for this year.

Where-as NDSUs trend line is up, Montana has a line trending down.

So....because Montana makes the playoffs 17 years straight...12 straight BSC titles...and they finally miss out they are on a decline? WOW.

NDSU finally finished over .500 last season....they can finally talk shit.