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Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 11:45 pm
by T-Dog
"The Big East very recently communicated its interest in adding Villanova as a football member," Villanova athletic director Vince Nicastro told the Daily News yesterday. "As a result, we have decided to embark on an in-depth evaluation of this opportunity.
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/201 ... _UPS_.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
And a letter from the head cheese.
Dear Faculty and Staff:
I am writing to share with you some recent conversations that have taken place regarding the Villanova Football program and its relationship with the Big East Conference. As you know, the program currently competes in the Football Championship Subdivision (FCS), formerly known as Division I-AA. The student-athletes, coaches, and administrators are excellent representatives of the University and have established a winning tradition that culminated with a national championship last year.
The landscape of college athletics continues to face dramatic changes and there has been a great deal of speculation over the past few months regarding conference realignments nationwide. The Big East Conference has not been immune to such speculation and Villanova’s position regarding football has been frequently discussed on the internet, in the media, and among alumni around the country.
Prior to Labor Day, Big East Commissioner John Marinatto paid a visit to Villanova and reported that the football schools were interested in adding Villanova as a football member of the Conference. We currently compete in the Big East in all other varsity sports, however, joining the Conference as a football member would require that the program move up to the Football Bowl Subdivision (FBS), formerly known as Division I-A. This would represent a significant change for the University and its Athletic Department.
As part of the University’s Strategic Planning process, the Board of Trustees Athletic Committee has been studying all of our athletic programs. After consulting with our Board’s leadership and the President’s Cabinet, we have decided that the most prudent course of action is to expedite our timeframe and embark upon an in-depth and thorough evaluation of this opportunity presented by the Big East. This is a complicated issue with many multi-dimensional factors that come into play, and it is important that we investigate scenarios related to making—or not making—such a move.
More than likely, you will read or hear speculation from outside sources as we conduct this assessment. I ask you to consider it just that – speculation. As we undertake this evaluation, I can assure you that a decision will be made only after the Board of Trustees conducts a careful and complete analysis. We will do what’s right for Villanova and will not jeopardize our community-wide commitment to meeting the University’s strategic objectives.
I will keep you informed as we move forward through this process.
Sincerely,
Father Peter Donohue, O.S.A.
President
If I was Nova, I would jump at the chance. It's a BCS conference and there probably wouldn't be a better chance than now.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:22 am
by jd of de
NC Year - 8 home games and they average 7,111/home game and that include a home game against Delaware and 3 home playoffs games. I ask the Big East; WHY? I know Wildcats fans are sensitive to the attendance issue, but come on Big East.
For Villanova, undergrad enrollment 6,200, FCS level is where they belong.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:33 am
by andy7171
jd of de wrote:NC Year - 8 home games and they average 7,111/home game and that include a home game against Delaware and 3 home playoffs games. I ask the Big East; WHY? I know Wildcats fans are sensitive to the attendance issue, but come on Big East.
For Villanova, undergrad enrollment 6,200, FCS level is where they belong.
Jealousy noted.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:35 am
by 93henfan
More power to Villanova to try I-A football. Again.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:44 am
by jd of de
andy7171 wrote:jd of de wrote:NC Year - 8 home games and they average 7,111/home game and that include a home game against Delaware and 3 home playoffs games. I ask the Big East; WHY? I know Wildcats fans are sensitive to the attendance issue, but come on Big East.
For Villanova, undergrad enrollment 6,200, FCS level is where they belong.
Jealousy noted.
You assumed and made a ass of yourself. UD is not move up worthy either.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:47 am
by ASUG8
jd of de wrote:NC Year - 8 home games and they average 7,111/home game and that include a home game against Delaware and 3 home playoffs games. I ask the Big East; WHY? I know Wildcats fans are sensitive to the attendance issue, but come on Big East.
For Villanova, undergrad enrollment 6,200, FCS level is where they belong.
What the heck does enrollment have to do with it? Wake is 4,400, Duke is 6,400, Stanford is 6,900 and I'm sure there are plenty of other examples of small schools that are competitive.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 5:50 am
by 93henfan
Bottom line: Penn State owns the Philly TV market. Villanova could make it, if you consider being a second Temple "making it", but they will not prosper like Connecticut did. They'll be a middle of the road FBS team playing to crowds under 30K. If that's what they aspire to, so be it. As the article states, if moving the football team to the Big East helps protect Villanova's basketball team against Big East football vs basketball school volatility, then I think it's mission accomplished for Villanova. They're a basketball school first and foremost, and it sounds like moving up the football team may be a thinly disguised basketball decision.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:02 am
by andy7171
jd of de wrote:andy7171 wrote:
Jealousy noted.
You assumed and made a ass of yourself. UD is not move up worthy either.
Oh please. GF and 86 have been dreaming of Big East football for years.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:08 am
by 93henfan
andy7171 wrote:jd of de wrote:
Jealousy noted.
You assumed and made a ass of yourself. UD is not move up worthy either.
Oh please. GF and 86 have been dreaming of Big East football for years.
Who doesn't? I'd love a Big East or an ACC invite. Unfortunately, I don't think either is coming any time soon.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:11 am
by clenz
So they haven't actually been invited yet have they?
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:11 am
by 89Hen
93henfan wrote:Villanova could make it, if you consider being a second Temple "making it", but they will not prosper like Connecticut did.
Bingo. I don't see the Commonwealth building VU a new stadium. TU was already in the Big East and got no support. Temple is a MUCH larger school, was also good in bball when they played football in the BE, had the same footprint, etc... Plus, didn't VU already have I-A football?
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:23 am
by bluehenbillk
If I'm VU I would do it in a hearbeat. Yes, they'll have a HUGE stadium issue to overcome, but how many times does a BCS league come knocking??
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:25 am
by 93henfan
Just to get an idea where football pans out in the Phiily market once you peel away the Eagles and the Nittany Lions:
Last night, in Philadelphia, in a game televised on ESPNU, in a pristine NFL stadium, in a game between the defending conference champion versus the preseason pick to be this year's conference champion, in perfect 70 degree weather, on a night the Phillies had off, the Temple Owls drew an announced crowd of...
wait for it...
15,152.
How's that for big-time football excitement?
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:32 am
by Green Cookie Monster
Private school, big, deep pockets.
Do it.
I guess the FCS NC didn't curl their toes.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:33 am
by Green Cookie Monster
93henfan wrote:Just to get an idea where football pans out in the Phiily market once you peel away the Eagles and the Nittany Lions:
Last night, in Philadelphia, in a game televised on ESPNU, in a pristine NFL stadium, in a game between the defending conference champion versus the preseason pick to be this year's conference champion, in perfect 70 degree weather, on a night the Phillies had off, the Temple Owls drew an announced crowd of...
wait for it...
15,152.
How's that for big-time football excitement?
Hummm, looks eerily like a SJSU game in the SF bay area.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:52 am
by CAA Flagship
ASUG8 wrote:jd of de wrote:NC Year - 8 home games and they average 7,111/home game and that include a home game against Delaware and 3 home playoffs games. I ask the Big East; WHY? I know Wildcats fans are sensitive to the attendance issue, but come on Big East.
For Villanova, undergrad enrollment 6,200, FCS level is where they belong.
What the heck does enrollment have to do with it? Wake is 4,400, Duke is 6,400, Stanford is 6,900 and I'm sure there are plenty of other examples of small schools that are competitive.
Enrollment has a lot to do with it. For one, student activity fees often fund a large percentage of the athletic budget. If they have deep pockets, this can overcome that hurdle. Second, enrollment size translates to number of living alumni who are potential ticket buying spectators. Revenues from ticket sales, merchandise sales, etc. helps fund the budget. It's all about money and the bigger the fan base, the easier it is to cope. Will the casual Philly area resident embrace Villanova more than Temple? My guess is yes but by how much more? This is a difficult decision, and the opportunity may only present itself this one time.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:04 am
by GoneTribal
if it weren't a BCS conference I wouldn't entertain the idea, but I think they have to jump at this opportunity. Attendance/stadium issue will be a huge hurdle to overcome, but I think the rewards outweigh the risk here.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:06 am
by ASUG8
CAA Flagship wrote:ASUG8 wrote:
What the heck does enrollment have to do with it? Wake is 4,400, Duke is 6,400, Stanford is 6,900 and I'm sure there are plenty of other examples of small schools that are competitive.
Enrollment has a lot to do with it. For one, student activity fees often fund a large percentage of the athletic budget. If they have deep pockets, this can overcome that hurdle. Second, enrollment size translates to number of living alumni who are potential ticket buying spectators. Revenues from ticket sales, merchandise sales, etc. helps fund the budget. It's all about money and the bigger the fan base, the easier it is to cope. Will the casual Philly area resident embrace Villanova more than Temple? My guess is yes but by how much more? This is a difficult decision, and the opportunity may only present itself this one time.
Each school I listed draws ~ 30K per home game. Granted, they're all private schools with an assumed wealthy alumni base in reasonably good sized metro areas. It's a shame Nova doesn't draw any better than they do because they put a quality product on the field. Maybe a move up would get their students/alumni off their butts before basketball starts in November.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:09 am
by BlueHen86
andy7171 wrote:jd of de wrote:
Jealousy noted.
You assumed and made a ass of yourself. UD is not move up worthy either.
Oh please. GF and 86 have been dreaming of Big East football for years.
I wouldn't say I was dreaming about it (I like UD's current situation), but joining the Big East or ACC was the only way that I'd support UD moving up to FBS. Now, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with Delaware joining the Big East, it seems like only a matter of time befroe the Big East gets raided again.
It makes more sense for Villanova to move up. Villanova is a bigger name in college sports than Delaware, they might be one of the Big East schools that gets raided.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:16 am
by henfan
CAA Flagship wrote:...the opportunity may only present itself this one time...
...or until the BEC makes it's third offer. Of course the BEC has already offered VU FB membership in the '90's.
There's no evidence to suggest that Philly area fans would support VU FB at the FBS level at all. Despite their competitive problems since the '80's, Temple FB has a much longer and stronger foothold on Philly area fans than suburban VU ever did. It was true in the '60's and '70's and still it's true today. Granted, the differences have always been marginal, but they are differences nevertheless. Philly is very much an NFL town. Most causal FB fans in SE PA typically follow the State College team, when they follow FBS FB at all. Fans aren't going to flock to VU FB by the tens of thousands just because they reclassified.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:19 am
by Dane96
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5553575" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Made it to the "big-time".
I'd say this is probably a go.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:25 am
by 93henfan
Yeah, the "big-time" cites its source as the original article in the PDN.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:26 am
by SmallCollegeFBFan
Even if the study says not to go I'm sure they will go anyway because of the opportunity. I certainly wish them the best. I think they could be a middle of the pack team in that league right now and with 22 more scholarships and a bigger recruiting area I am sure they could do even better than 4th or so in the Big East.
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:27 am
by 93henfan
henfan wrote:CAA Flagship wrote:...the opportunity may only present itself this one time...
...or until the BEC makes it's third offer. Of course the BEC has already offered VU FB membership in the '90's.
There's no evidence to suggest that Philly area fans would support VU FB at the FBS level at all. Despite their competitive problems since the '80's, Temple FB has a much longer and stronger foothold on Philly area fans than suburban VU ever did. It was true in the '60's and '70's and still it's true today. Granted, the differences have always been marginal, but they are differences nevertheless. Philly is very much an NFL town. Most causal FB fans in SE PA typically follow the State College team, when they follow FBS FB at all. Fans aren't going to flock to VU FB by the tens of thousands just because they reclassified.
Here's an idea how well big-time football went over in Philly.
I was curious about how Temple used to draw when they were playing more exciting teams, so I went back into the history books to pull up these nuggets:
2005 - The U of Miami at Temple: "The announced crowd of 23,129 for homecoming was Temple's largest of the season, though there were more orange shirts than cherry and white ones at Lincoln Financial Field - home of the Philadelphia Eagles."
2003 - "There were many positives to the 2003 Big East campaign under Wallace. First and foremost was the University's agreement with the Philadelphia Eagles for Temple to play its home games at Lincoln Financial Field. It marked the first time since 1991 the Owls played all their home games at the same site. Temple's five games at the venue drew an average 24,147 fans, a 21 percent increase from the prior season's average."
Re: Villanova football invited to Big East
Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:32 am
by Dane96
93henfan wrote:
Yeah, the "big-time" cites its source as the original article in the PDN.
That was the "irony" in my post.
In reality though, I'd say it's a done deal for NUMEROUS reasons mentioned here. Look, Temple can't get big time schools to come play them for a multitude of reasons, so I am not dare pointing out Temple (nor should others) as an attendance comparison. Furthermore, there are people who love college football and absolutely wont be driving to Happy Valley from Philly to see Penn State. Give them the option of seeing 'Nova vs. Notre Dame...or 'Nova vs. BC....or 'Nova vs. Rutgers...and you can get people in the stands. Boston is a notoriously NON-COLLEGE sports town. BC students are jackasses and do not make the primary fan base of the 44,000 fans that fill Alumni Field on Saturdays. Yes, the Stadium is on campus...but again, the majority of seats (probably 38,000) go to non-students. IF BC CAN DO IT...so CAN 'Nova. And same from UCONN (Stadium is about 30-45 minutes from campus on a non-traffic day).
You add in "scheduling arrangements" for 'Nova hoops (we will come play you if you play us in football in Philly)...and you have more big name schools coming in. You not only would you get a nice Big East Schedule that would spur fan interest (including easy road trips for Rutgers fans)...but you likely will have some sort of scheduling arrangement with BYU, Notre Dame, Army, Navy, Boston College and other schools with east coast interests. Hell, it would not shock me to see Wisconsin, USC and other schools with NY, NJ and PA recruiting interests come out to play in 2 for 1's.
On pay day alone, Villanova will be able to build the program. Local fans of rival teams will fill the seats. And there is no doubt the teams I mentioned above would prefer to have an east coast game by playing a more than winnable "road game" in prime recruiting territory. Would you rather play Rutgers, Maryland, WVU, UConn, etc...for an East Coast "recruiting trip"...or newly promoted 'Nova.