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I think that when it came down to the last at large bid, SC States resume looked better than everyone else's.kirkblitz wrote:Is it possible that the MEAC received 2 bids this to discourse them from dropping out of the playoffs to play their bowl game? It seems like that could be a possible reason. Thoughts?
That's certainly true. There's no doubt that recent history played a big role in this pick. SCSU has performed well in the playoffs lately, and the MEAC as a conference has had more national success than the Big South. Combine that with only one FCS loss, and it's clear those are the things the committee stressed. I still think, if just having a good W-L record was the criteria, that Dayton and Jacksonville's was better than SCSU's, but again, that's where the bias towards the MEAC for recent performance, and since it's a conference with a little more name recognition.BlueHen86 wrote:I think that when it came down to the last at large bid, SC States resume looked better than everyone else's.kirkblitz wrote:Is it possible that the MEAC received 2 bids this to discourse them from dropping out of the playoffs to play their bowl game? It seems like that could be a possible reason. Thoughts?
Montana only had 6 D-I wins.
Liberty had 3 losses. No disrespect intended toward the Big South, but I don't think the Big South has proven itself to the point where a 3 loss Big South team automatically deserves a bid over a 2 loss MEAC team.
THIS MAN, will stop at nothing to garner support for his bowl game, even with a clever "divide-and-conquer" strategy. And as a former SWACKO, it is right up his alley. The only reason that it didn't happen this year was because of the outrage and public backlash over the summer by MEAC fans and Alums. Although there is still an legit argument for HAVING the game, the sticking point was whether we should still keep our AQ and send a replacement team in its place. Success in the playoffs is paramount. The only one of our schools that has one of these...
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I disagree, this was BS pure and simple.BlueHen86 wrote:I think that when it came down to the last at large bid, SC States resume looked better than everyone else's.kirkblitz wrote:Is it possible that the MEAC received 2 bids this to discourse them from dropping out of the playoffs to play their bowl game? It seems like that could be a possible reason. Thoughts?
Montana only had 6 D-I wins.
Liberty had 3 losses. No disrespect intended toward the Big South, but I don't think the Big South has proven itself to the point where a 3 loss Big South team automatically deserves a bid over a 2 loss MEAC team.
- Liberty's FBS win was over 4-8 Ball St. All FBS wins are nice, but some are nicer than others. Beating Ball St. wasn't enough to make up for 3 FCS losses.aceinthehole wrote:I disagree, this was BS pure and simple.BlueHen86 wrote:
I think that when it came down to the last at large bid, SC States resume looked better than everyone else's.
Montana only had 6 D-I wins.
Liberty had 3 losses. No disrespect intended toward the Big South, but I don't think the Big South has proven itself to the point where a 3 loss Big South team automatically deserves a bid over a 2 loss MEAC team.
- SC State had NO WINS of any value and 2 losses. Liberty had 3 losses, but they at least had a FBS win.
- The Big South was ranked above the MEAC (although the NEC was ranked above both of them).
- The undeserved high ranking in the human polls heped SCSU cause.
- A 7-4 win Montana (even with a D-II win), or a 8-3 Liberty (with an FBS win) was better resume than 9-2 SCSU, period.
danefan wrote:None of the bubble teams really deserved to get in, but I have to question whether SCST deserved it more than any others.
I certainly don't think SCST has done anything this year to show they were the best available team left and isn't that what the Committee is supposed to do?
Except how then did they get to SCST?mcveyrl wrote:danefan wrote:None of the bubble teams really deserved to get in, but I have to question whether SCST deserved it more than any others.
I certainly don't think SCST has done anything this year to show they were the best available team left and isn't that what the Committee is supposed to do?
I think it's obvious that they started with the qualifier of seven wins. Everybody else got wiped off the table.
Then, they looked at strength of schedule and wiped the PFLs off the table and anybody with seven wins in the "weaker" conferences was out too. This eliminated Jacksonville, Dayton, ODU and Liberty.
At that point, I think they had their 20.
SCST had eight wins. That's the ONLY way they got there, by just counting wins. Like you said on the other thread, I think in the "weaker" conferences, they resorted to a counting game. Eight D1 is greater than seven, SCST wins. Not saying it's right, but I think that's what they did.danefan wrote:Except how then did they get to SCST?mcveyrl wrote:
I think it's obvious that they started with the qualifier of seven wins. Everybody else got wiped off the table.
Then, they looked at strength of schedule and wiped the PFLs off the table and anybody with seven wins in the "weaker" conferences was out too. This eliminated Jacksonville, Dayton, ODU and Liberty.
At that point, I think they had their 20.
Terrible SOS. No signature wins and loses to the best two teams they played. Oh and the MEAC was terrible as a league this year.
It's not even close. Compare Liberty and SCSU head to head.BlueHen86 wrote:- Liberty's FBS win was over 4-8 Ball St. All FBS wins are nice, but some are nicer than others. Beating Ball St. wasn't enough to make up for 3 FCS losses.aceinthehole wrote:
I disagree, this was BS pure and simple.
- SC State had NO WINS of any value and 2 losses. Liberty had 3 losses, but they at least had a FBS win.
- The Big South was ranked above the MEAC (although the NEC was ranked above both of them).
- The undeserved high ranking in the human polls heped SCSU cause.
- A 7-4 win Montana (even with a D-II win), or a 8-3 Liberty (with an FBS win) was better resume than 9-2 SCSU, period.
- Human polls are not part of the selection process.
- Montana may have an argument, but they don't have any quality wins either. They were 6-4 against FCS competition and no wins against playoff teams.
I'm sure the decision was close and I don't think it was BS. I wouldn't have had a problem with the spot going to either Montana or Liberty or SC St.
As DF said, how is the MEAC not a weaker conference?mcveyrl wrote:danefan wrote:None of the bubble teams really deserved to get in, but I have to question whether SCST deserved it more than any others.
I certainly don't think SCST has done anything this year to show they were the best available team left and isn't that what the Committee is supposed to do?
I think it's obvious that they started with the qualifier of seven wins. Everybody else got wiped off the table.
Then, they looked at strength of schedule and wiped the PFLs off the table and anybody with seven wins in the "weaker" conferences was out too. This eliminated Jacksonville, Dayton, ODU and Liberty.
At that point, I think they had their 20.
This is possible. We're unproven in a lot of ways (not that SCSU was more proven this year, but in years past they made the playoffs, as you said).Pwns wrote:Why would the NCAA care if the MEAC decides to drop their autobid? if anything, they'd like the big crowds the LB would draw. On top of that, I'm sure there are many schools that would like their conference to get the MEAC's autobid should they give theirs up.
If there is a bias that hurt Liberty, it's the bias that the committee will favor teams that have been to the playoffs before over those that have not. In 2002 Wofford beat GSU and App. State (both playoff teams) in Statesboro and Boone and Eastern Illinois got chosen over them even though Wofford was in all likelihood better than EIU was that year.
I don't think there's any question the MEAC is weaker then the Big South, but I think the two got lumped together in the committee room. 8 wins beat 7 wins. Again, I'm not saying that's right, I'm just saying that's the only way they can justify it. Nothing else makes sense.ToTheLeft wrote:As DF said, how is the MEAC not a weaker conference?mcveyrl wrote:
I think it's obvious that they started with the qualifier of seven wins. Everybody else got wiped off the table.
Then, they looked at strength of schedule and wiped the PFLs off the table and anybody with seven wins in the "weaker" conferences was out too. This eliminated Jacksonville, Dayton, ODU and Liberty.
At that point, I think they had their 20.
I'm sure that's what happened, but let's be real. The fact is the MEAC had an awful year and they've lost their last 10 games in the playoffs.Pwns wrote:Why would the NCAA care if the MEAC decides to drop their autobid? if anything, they'd like the big crowds the LB would draw. On top of that, I'm sure there are many schools that would like their conference to get the MEAC's autobid should they give theirs up.
If there is a bias that hurt Liberty, it's the bias that the committee will favor teams that have been to the playoffs before over those that have not. In 2002 Wofford beat GSU and App. State (both playoff teams) in Statesboro and Boone and Eastern Illinois got chosen over them even though Wofford was in all likelihood better than EIU was that year.
That's was all of SC State's non-conf wins over the last past 4 years - they have just two (2) DI non-conf wins in that time! By comparison, look at what Liberty and CCSU have done over the past 4 years:aceinthehole wrote: Q: Name SCSU's best non-conference win in the past 4 season?
A: Benedict (2008 & 2100), Grambling (2009), or Miss Valley St (2010).
The FACTS speak for themselves, SCSU was the least deserving "bubble team" the committe could have picked!
We're talking about the #20 team to get in, I'm not losing sleep over that one. But if you really want to get into it...aceinthehole wrote:I disagree, this was BS pure and simple.
- SC State had NO WINS of any value and 2 losses. Liberty had 3 losses, but they at least had a FBS win.
- The Big South was ranked above the MEAC (although the NEC was ranked above both of them).
- The undeserved high ranking in the human polls heped SCSU cause.
- A 7-4 win Montana (even with a D-II win), or a 8-3 Liberty (with an FBS win) was better resume than 9-2 SCSU, period.
Of course you don't care because it doesn't effect UD or the CAA, but for other teams/conferences this has much more of an effect.89Hen wrote:We're talking about the #20 team to get in, I'm not losing sleep over that one. But if you really want to get into it...
152 Ball State
Ahhh, here we go. "Elitist"...aceinthehole wrote:For years, you and other elitiest UD/CAA fans have posted how NEC and Big South teams have to WIN games vs playoff conferences yet you don't want to hold that same standard for MEAC teams? Why should they get a pass from you long-held criteria, especially when no one on this board can't even remember when SC State last WON a meaningful non-conference game?
And what is your point about Ball State? It is still a much better WIN than anything SCSU had this year. In fact, Dayton has a better win (vs RMU) than SC State (vs FAMU)!
The fact is there is nothing objective that says SCSU deserved this bid over a whole bunch of teams.
Liberty had 8 D1 wins, not 7. This was not an 8>7 argument.mcveyrl wrote:I don't think there's any question the MEAC is weaker then the Big South, but I think the two got lumped together in the committee room. 8 wins beat 7 wins. Again, I'm not saying that's right, I'm just saying that's the only way they can justify it. Nothing else makes sense.
I think thats the point that we are missing in all of this here...89Hen wrote:Ahhh, here we go. "Elitist"...aceinthehole wrote:For years, you and other elitiest UD/CAA fans have posted how NEC and Big South teams have to WIN games vs playoff conferences yet you don't want to hold that same standard for MEAC teams? Why should they get a pass from you long-held criteria, especially when no one on this board can't even remember when SC State last WON a meaningful non-conference game?
And what is your point about Ball State? It is still a much better WIN than anything SCSU had this year. In fact, Dayton has a better win (vs RMU) than SC State (vs FAMU)!
The fact is there is nothing objective that says SCSU deserved this bid over a whole bunch of teams.
Show me where I ever said SCSt was deserving or that the MEAC shouldn't be held to the same standards. Again, we're talking about the last one or two teams in the field. Honestly, NONE of them are deserving. The fact that you can't build a case for SCSt doesn't mean you're building a case for Liberty.