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UTGrizfan wrote:I do agree that there are some bad apples on Egriz dont get me wrong, it just seems that the sheer number of east coast and jmu fans all year and after the game of fans like that has been astounding. Not at all bad mouthing the teams and those good fans, just those who dont know how to shut up.

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:I seriously don't get what the hell is up with some of our fans. Who gives a god damn if they have an opinion that they are better? That's normally what you think or hope when you go into a playoff game and I don't fault them for thinking like I do...my team is better than yours and we're gonna win. I personally couldn't give a shit less if any of them respect us. If we win that's all the proof I need. The arguments and the banter is exactly what draws me to these boards. I don't come here to see a mutual dick sucking contest. Everything you mentioned in your post I have seen done by Griz posters and to act like egriz doesn't have the same elements that you describe about the CAA board is disingenuous at the very least.

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:I don't come here to see a mutual dick sucking contest.

Ursus A. Horribilis wrote:I seriously don't get what the hell is up with some of our fans. Who gives a god damn if they have an opinion that they are better? That's normally what you think or hope when you go into a playoff game and I don't fault them for thinking like I do...my team is better than yours and we're gonna win. I personally couldn't give a shit less if any of them respect us. If we win that's all the proof I need. The arguments and the banter is exactly what draws me to these boards. I don't come here to see a mutual dick sucking contest. Everything you mentioned in your post I have seen done by Griz posters and to act like egriz doesn't have the same elements that you describe about the CAA board is disingenuous at the very least.

godukes wrote: I knew Montana was a good team and same with Cal Poly and the others out west. I admit I was more worried about the Nova game than the Montana game since Nova had a much harder schedule than Montana,

AZGrizFan wrote:

godukes wrote: I knew Montana was a good team and same with Cal Poly and the others out west. I admit I was more worried about the Nova game than the Montana game since Nova had a much harder schedule than Montana,

See, godukes, it's THIS crap that really gets people's blood boiling. JMU went undefeated in "the best conference in America". Montana went 7-1 against a "soft" schedule. Then Montana owns JMU. Me thinks you might want to give just a TAD more respect to Montana's schedule, which you seem to think was so much easier than JMU's.

Villanova's OOC schedule consisted of Lehigh, Penn, Colgate and an FBS body bag game. Their only three tough FCS games were JMU and Richmond and UNH. Their schedule is littered with teams that posted gaudy records, but didn't beat ANYBODY of significance. You really need to let this go that the CAA's schedules were "much harder".

godukes wrote: Don't forget W&M who almost made the playoffs and West Virginia whom Villanova played also. Oh btw I would much rather have the Championship win over Montana in 04, than just an apperance in another championship in 08.

AZGrizFan wrote:

godukes wrote: Don't forget W&M who almost made the playoffs and West Virginia whom Villanova played also. Oh btw I would much rather have the Championship win over Montana in 04, than just an apperance in another championship in 08.

Ahhh...Bill & Mary....the POSTER CHILD for proving my point about teams with gaudy records not beating ANYONE of significance (fine, I'll give you UNH). They lost to every other good tam they played.

As far as your last comment, so you were expecting to lose this year had you made it? Or are you now predicting a Richmond victory over Montana?

godukes wrote:

AZGrizFan wrote: Ahhh...Bill & Mary....the POSTER CHILD for proving my point about teams with gaudy records not beating ANYONE of significance (fine, I'll give you UNH). They lost to every other good tam they played.

As far as your last comment, so you were expecting to lose this year had you made it? Or are you now predicting a Richmond victory over Montana?

W&M took Richmond to OT, beat UNH, and some other good teams. Since the CAA is so big, not everyone in the conference plays each other. UNH did beat Army by a decent margin. UNH is a perfect example of Montana not playing anybody besides like 2 or 3 ranked teams. I will take sports writers/analyst over your opinion who's conference is the best, but that's not at issue. Well, I am half for Richmond and half for Montana. I don't want Richmond being NC because some of my friends are Spiders fans(I live in Richmond) and JMU won the conference and beat Richmond and I don't want to hear Richmond with a 13-3 record is better than JMU who is 12-2 who beat Richmond. But then again, one of my friend's brother is a nice guy and plays for Richmond so I want him to get a ring.

godukes wrote:W&M took Richmond to OT, beat UNH, and some other good teams. Since the CAA is so big, not everyone in the conference plays each other. I will take sports writers/analyst over your opinion who's conference is the best, but that's not at issue. Well, I am half for Richmond and half for Montana. I don't want Richmond being NC because some of my friends are Spiders fans(I live in Richmond) and JMU won the conference and beat Richmond and I don't want to hear Richmond with a 13-3 record is better than JMU who is 12-2 who beat Richmond. But then again, one of my friend's brother is a nice guy and plays for Richmond so I want him to get a ring.

godukes wrote:

AZGrizFan wrote: Ahhh...Bill & Mary....the POSTER CHILD for proving my point about teams with gaudy records not beating ANYONE of significance (fine, I'll give you UNH). They lost to every other good tam they played.

As far as your last comment, so you were expecting to lose this year had you made it? Or are you now predicting a Richmond victory over Montana?

W&M took Richmond to OT, beat UNH, and some other good teams. Since the CAA is so big, not everyone in the conference plays each other. I will take sports writers/analyst over your opinion who's conference is the best, but that's not at issue. Well, I am half for Richmond and half for Montana. I don't want Richmond being NC because some of my friends are Spiders fans(I live in Richmond) and JMU won the conference and beat Richmond and I don't want to hear Richmond with a 13-3 record is better than JMU who is 12-2 who beat Richmond. But then again, one of my friend's brother is a nice guy and plays for Richmond so I want him to get a ring.

AZGrizFan wrote:

godukes wrote:
W&M took Richmond to OT, beat UNH, and some other good teams. Since the CAA is so big, not everyone in the conference plays each other. I will take sports writers/analyst over your opinion who's conference is the best, but that's not at issue. Well, I am half for Richmond and half for Montana. I don't want Richmond being NC because some of my friends are Spiders fans(I live in Richmond) and JMU won the conference and beat Richmond and I don't want to hear Richmond with a 13-3 record is better than JMU who is 12-2 who beat Richmond. But then again, one of my friend's brother is a nice guy and plays for Richmond so I want him to get a ring.

Aw, hell, Dukie. Just go ahead and say whay you've been beatin' around the bush about for 2 days....you're a closet Griz FAN!!!!

travelinman67 wrote:

godukes wrote:W&M took Richmond to OT, beat UNH, and some other good teams. Since the CAA is so big, not everyone in the conference plays each other. I will take sports writers/analyst over your opinion who's conference is the best, but that's not at issue. Well, I am half for Richmond and half for Montana. I don't want Richmond being NC because some of my friends are Spiders fans(I live in Richmond) and JMU won the conference and beat Richmond and I don't want to hear Richmond with a 13-3 record is better than JMU who is 12-2 who beat Richmond. But then again, one of my friend's brother is a nice guy and plays for Richmond so I want him to get a ring.

Where the problem lies is that pundits are trying to compare conferences/programs with different methods/systems. It's extremely difficult to compare a program like W. Ill or MT who tend to run traditional size 50%/speed 50% with other FCS modeled pgms running speed 80%/size20% recruiting. With W/C, Run & Gun, Spread, 3-4, and Option only packages having become the norm throughout both the FBS and FCS, there are so many variables it's hard to prioritize them.
I kinda laughed when I saw the Duke's Coach's post game comments attributing the loss (in effect) entirely on the turnovers. While those turnovers were killer, aside from that, aside from the stats, when it came time to execute, MT executed and JMU did not (...btw, ask yourself when the last time was you saw a goal line stop [yes, that was stopped regardless of what the ACC blindmen said] like the Dudzik dive, at ANY level. That stop displayed the strength, athleticism, and speed of the Griz.). Anyway, anytime you start thinking that players born in Virginny are the best, or kids prepped in OH high schools are better prepared, or size trumps speed or vice-versa, go back and look at the Appy/Mich game. There could hardly be two programs with a more diverse recruiting/development/gameplan method, yet, with all the money and coaching and recruiting at Michigan's disposal, on any given day, Applachian went into Ann Arbor and schooled the Wolverines in their house.

Point is, don't judge based principally on past history or other "voodoo", non-tangibles such as which side of the river the player was born. Look at how they play.

godukes wrote:So I looked up Drew and I found out that he was a top 30 Virginia player on rivals.com coming out of HS. They didn't even say Landers was in top 100. Gives me hope about Drew and JMU.

putter wrote:

godukes wrote:So I looked up Drew and I found out that he was a top 30 Virginia player on rivals.com coming out of HS. They didn't even say Landers was in top 100. Gives me hope about Drew and JMU.

JMU was good and any Griz fan who says otherwise is not being honest. That being said, JMU did not beat themselves...they made mistakes where were forced by a defense that has been doing that all year long. I kind of disagree about Landers. What, really, could he have done that Drew didn't? Drew ran for 2 TD's and got the 2 pt conversion, Landers could not have done better than that. IMO, Drew's passes in the second half were right on target, the JMU receivers just dropped the ball. Landers was not quite on as his stats show. Drew gave you everything that Landers would have, unless you are saying RL would have been given 2 TD's for one. The JMU D had a very difficult time stopping our O and that was the biggest blow.

Not Punting..and leading in TOP and Yards. When you take into consideration that, after the turnovers, the Griz had short fields and scored quickly those stats dont matter. When you are a running team like JMU or Wofford, you will burn up the clock..it is just that the job is more difficult when you are trailing by 18 points you had to score more quickly.

godukes wrote:

putter wrote: JMU was good and any Griz fan who says otherwise is not being honest. That being said, JMU did not beat themselves...they made mistakes where were forced by a defense that has been doing that all year long. I kind of disagree about Landers. What, really, could he have done that Drew didn't? Drew ran for 2 TD's and got the 2 pt conversion, Landers could not have done better than that. IMO, Drew's passes in the second half were right on target, the JMU receivers just dropped the ball. Landers was not quite on as his stats show. Drew gave you everything that Landers would have, unless you are saying RL would have been given 2 TD's for one. The JMU D had a very difficult time stopping our O and that was the biggest blow.

Not Punting..and leading in TOP and Yards. When you take into consideration that, after the turnovers, the Griz had short fields and scored quickly those stats dont matter. When you are a running team like JMU or Wofford, you will burn up the clock..it is just that the job is more difficult when you are trailing by 18 points you had to score more quickly.

Like I said before Landers weighs a lot more than Dudzik. I know they would have gotten in on that goalline stop. Then when I mean they beat themselves is by those turnovers especially the one by McGee which 100% had nothing to do with Montana and then the dropped balls by the WRs had nothing to do with Montana either except for maybe the last one. Yea I agree Montana almost played mistake free football on offense, but when you give a team a short field and drop passes, overthrow passes, or ints that doesn't help at all for JMU's offense. I believe that if Landers was in he would have gotten in for a TD and if McGee and Ward didn't fumble on Special Teams, then they would have won the game. I couldn't see if Ward muffed the return or if it was stripped from where I was sitting or if he had the ball hanging loose so I am not going to necessarily blame Ward for that fumble. Yea JMU's defense couldn't stop Montana, but they were given a short field had I think 50yds to go for 14pts.

AZGrizFan wrote:

godukes wrote: Like I said before Landers weighs a lot more than Dudzik. I know they would have gotten in on that goalline stop. Then when I mean they beat themselves is by those turnovers especially the one by McGee which 100% had nothing to do with Montana and then the dropped balls by the WRs had nothing to do with Montana either except for maybe the last one. Yea I agree Montana almost played mistake free football on offense, but when you give a team a short field and drop passes, overthrow passes, or ints that doesn't help at all for JMU's offense. I believe that if Landers was in he would have gotten in for a TD and if McGee and Ward didn't fumble on Special Teams, then they would have won the game. I couldn't see if Ward muffed the return or if it was stripped from where I was sitting or if he had the ball hanging loose so I am not going to necessarily blame Ward for that fumble. Yea JMU's defense couldn't stop Montana, but they were given a short field had I think 50yds to go for 14pts.

Were you watching the same game I was? I have it on tape, if you'd like me to send you a copy. All three fumbles were becuase of hits or strips. It's not like they just dropped the friggin' ball. Dropped or overthrown balls usually have something to do with a QB forced to scramble or feeling the pressure, or a receiver hearing footsteps. You get hit once by Colt Anderson and you hear footsteps the rest of the night. I count numerous "IF's" in your statement. IF we didn't have a playoff system, JMU and ASU would have played for the title. As it stands, NEITHER was good enough ON THE FIELD to make it to the title game. Sucks for you, huh? Here's the facts, dukes: If JMU had 0 turnovers, with the yards and TOP that they had, they win that game. An int and a fumble in the red zone, a goal line stand in the red zone, and a drive stalled and forced to kick a field goal in the red zone. THATS where the game was lost. Your guys didn't come to play. Montana did. End of story. Start gettin' ready for next year, dude. The ifs and buts are starting to get real old.

godukes wrote: Landers has been going against bigger and better defenses. I know they didn't fear the Montana players, they have gone up against better defenses and prevailed the whole year. Dropped balls wasn't because of the fear of the players; I believe it was because of pressure of being on national television or just skill.

godukes wrote:
Actually no one was around McGee when he muffed the kick return. That was his fault no one elses. It's part of the game, that's why they have kickoffs and not starting the drive at the 20 or wherever. The guy said they would have stopped Landers on the goalline stop if he was in; I believe they wouldn't have because Landers is a lot bigger than Dudzik. Landers has been going against bigger and better defenses. I know they didn't fear the Montana players, they have gone up against better defenses and prevailed the whole year. Dropped balls wasn't because of the fear of the players; I believe it was because of pressure of being on national television or just skill. I am glad they have a playoff system; that's the way it should be. The INT I don't think would have happened if Landers was in there because his TD to INT ratio (he has one of the best if not the best ratio in I-AA). I do agree Montana executed and JMU didn't. The other guy on here believes different. You can also look at JMU's D which gave up a lot of points, but then again you got to look at what they were put in due to their special teams and offense. 298 yds allowed is not bad at all. Just bad situation.

godukes wrote: Actually no one was around McGee when he muffed the kick return. That was his fault no one elses. It's part of the game, that's why they have kickoffs and not starting the drive at the 20 or wherever. The guy said they would have stopped Landers on the goalline stop if he was in; I believe they wouldn't have because Landers is a lot bigger than Dudzik. Landers has been going against bigger and better defenses. I know they didn't fear the Montana players, they have gone up against better defenses and prevailed the whole year. Dropped balls wasn't because of the fear of the players; I believe it was because of pressure of being on national television or just skill. I am glad they have a playoff system; that's the way it should be. The INT I don't think would have happened if Landers was in there because his TD to INT ratio (he has one of the best if not the best ratio in I-AA). I do agree Montana executed and JMU didn't. The other guy on here believes different. You can also look at JMU's D which gave up a lot of points, but then again you got to look at what they were put in due to their special teams and offense. 298 yds allowed is not bad at all. Just bad situation.