Helmet To Helmet Hits

[UNI88]

Mount Union, the best D3 school in the nation, NEVER practices in pads

Isn't Mt. Union's team filled with Buckeye recruits that either didn't qualify academically or got kicked out for a variety of unethical activities?

And I believe the Wahawks of the University of Wisconsin - Whitewater are ranked #1 in D3.

[clenz]

Mount Union, the best D3 school in the nation, NEVER practices in pads

Isn't Mt. Union's team filled with Buckeye recruits that either didn't qualify academically or got kicked out for a variety of unethical activities?

And I believe the Wahawks of the University of Wisconsin - Whitewater are ranked #1 in D3.

I don't know much about Mt. Union's players...other than the fact their coach doesn't cut players so they have over 200 kids on the team.

Mt Union has 10 national titles since 1993, and 6 since 2000.

Since 1986 Mt Union is Mount Record: 289-21-3...that is when their current coach took over.

It very much so is Whitewater, Mount Union, and every body else in D3 though

[Wedgebuster]

Again, this isn't hard to understand - people are using their helmets to hit other people. Whether they hit the opponents head or not, the helmet is being used as a weapon. And as helmets get more and more sophisticated and provide more protection, people have and are using the helmet more and more. You can't tell me that player making the hit in many of the big hits this weekend had their eyes up and saw what they were hitting - they weren't. They had their heads down and led with the helmet. It's been a long time since we've seen guys make tackles with their heads and eyes up - it just isn't done that way anymore and eventually, the league is going to have to get back to that. However it's done, something has to be done to stop people using the helmet as the primary and lead part of a tackle.

I hate these new helmets, for the main reason, they fall off all the time. What the hell is that crap? Go back to the old suspension helmets or at least the old air padded ones.

About the time I sit down to enjoy an NFL game and see a bunch of "illegal hitting" penalties I am going to be done as a viewer. It's already bad enough with all the nit picky pass interference calls. Further intervention by the stripes, and a bunch of new incoherent rules and the game will have to move out of the country so it can be played like it was meant to be played.

Money talks and BS walks, if they start to lose their audience, something will have to give.

[clenz]

Helmets wouldn't fly off as easy if the players would actually strap their chinstraps up

[89Hen]

About the time I sit down to enjoy an NFL game and see a bunch of "illegal hitting" penalties I am going to be done as a viewer. It's already bad enough with all the nit picky pass interference calls. Further intervention by the stripes, and a bunch of new incoherent rules and the game will have to move out of the country so it can be played like it was meant to be played.

Money talks and BS walks, if they start to lose their audience, something will have to give.

And there's the thing... the goal by giving fines is to hopefully reduce the number of illegal hits, so you should be happy you won't see as many penalties being called. Glad you're on the path to enlightenment Wedgie.

[Wedgebuster]

Helmets wouldn't fly off as easy if the players would actually strap their chinstraps up

I been looking at that clenzy, they are flying off with chin straps attached. I am sick of seeing them rolling around during/after plays. It's total BS.

[tampajag]

Helmets wouldn't fly off as easy if the players would actually strap their chinstraps up

Bingo!

[Wedgebuster]

About the time I sit down to enjoy an NFL game and see a bunch of "illegal hitting" penalties I am going to be done as a viewer. It's already bad enough with all the nit picky pass interference calls. Further intervention by the stripes, and a bunch of new incoherent rules and the game will have to move out of the country so it can be played like it was meant to be played.

Money talks and BS walks, if they start to lose their audience, something will have to give.

And there's the thing... the goal by giving fines is to hopefully reduce the number of illegal hits, so you should be happy you won't see as many penalties being called. Glad you're on the path to enlightenment Wedgie.

Hen, you have established your self here as a pussy, nothing is going to change that.

Sorry..

[89Hen]

Hen, you have established your self here as a pussy, nothing is going to change that.

Sorry..

Oh gee Wedge. That really hurts coming from you. Don't you have a baseball movie to go watch?

[clenz]

Helmets wouldn't fly off as easy if the players would actually strap their chinstraps up

I been looking at that clenzy, they are flying off with chin straps attached. I am sick of seeing them rolling around during/after plays. It's total BS.

If that is the case, they aren't properly fitted helmet.

I used "regular air padded" helmets 7th-10th grade, the "first" Revo helmet my Jr year of HS, the "second" Revo my senior year of high school and in college. Before we were allowed to leave the equipment room all our helmets had to be put on and strapped to make sure there was proper fit...by a coach and athletic trainer. There as many revo's around my jr year of HS through my time in college, and I don't remember them coming off at any higher rate than normal helmets (re: almost never).

I wasn't around long enough to try out the new Revo Speed, or any of the new "concussion" style helmets, so I can't speak for how easily they come off. I do, however, watch a ton of high school and college (NAIA through FBS) football and can tell you I don't see any helmet coming off in the college game compared to the pros.

Hell, in high school it's a penalty if a player doesn't have his chinstrap completely strapped up at the snap of the ball.

[Wedgebuster]

I been looking at that clenzy, they are flying off with chin straps attached. I am sick of seeing them rolling around during/after plays. It's total BS.

If that is the case, they aren't properly fitted helmet.

I used "regular air padded" helmets 7th-10th grade, the "first" Revo helmet my Jr year of HS, the "second" Revo my senior year of high school and in college. Before we were allowed to leave the equipment room all our helmets had to be put on and strapped to make sure there was proper fit...by a coach and athletic trainer. There as many revo's around my jr year of HS through my time in college, and I don't remember them coming off at any higher rate than normal helmets (re: almost never)

I suspect the loose helmets are a fad amongst the hip hops who think they are so beautiful, that their mug must be seen on TV, and since it is now a penalty for removing your helmet on the field of play, they make it look accidental.

So, I would also say that improperly fitted helmets and unstrapped helmets do not properly protect the player from concussions, and there might be the answer to this whole mess.

If all that matters to those like the two girls who have posted their whiny shit on here is player safety, then why do they let their pretty boy wide outs play without hip pads, knee pads, and thigh pads?

Answer that one ladies.

[89Hen]

If all that matters to those like the two girls who have posted their whiny shit on here is player safety, then why do they let their pretty boy wide outs play without hip pads, knee pads, and thigh pads?

Answer that one ladies.

is right. We get it. You want no rules on hitting. If a player wants to do without his leg pads, who gives a rats ass?

[Wedgebuster]

If all that matters to those like the two girls who have posted their whiny shit on here is player safety, then why do they let their pretty boy wide outs play without hip pads, knee pads, and thigh pads?

Answer that one ladies.

is right. We get it. You want no rules on hitting. If a player wants to do without his leg pads, who gives a rats ass?

And we get it that you do not like hitting except in baseball

Grow a pair and come on out of the closet Hen, you are already outed anyways.

[89Hen]

And we get it that you do not like hitting except in baseball

You didn't earn the King of Hyperbole title for nothing.

[andy7171]

UNI, I would suggest insisting that your players keep their heads up, and eyes open at all times when hitting. I used to think of the crosses of my facemask as the crosshairs of a scope, keeping the target in the middle of the crosshairs all the way to impact. Make 'em practice that way, make it a habit, and you will have no more strained necks and shoulders.

We stress hitting with your should pad and putting your facemask on the ball but I've got a couple of hard cases that just won't listen to me. One is a Harrison type of player that is looking to inflict pain and uses his helmet as a weapon. The crosshairs example might appeal to him. I think the other is afraid of the initial contact and thinks his helmet will help protect him despite all of my warnings about the risks of leading with the crown.

Andy, any help you can give will be appreciated. I don't want a kid to end up paralyzed.

As far as the arguments on here go:
- any player (offensive or defensive) that initiates contact with the crown of their helmet should be penalized and if necessary suspended. That is for the offending player's safety as much as it is for the other player.
- I tell the kids that I coach that I want them to inflict pain on the other team because I want the other players to be a little afraid any time they touch the ball. I do not want them to injure the other players and IMO headshots are malicious as well as being poor form. You should be tackling the body not trying to remove the head.
- as someone who played a little WR and took some nasty blind side shots (and started hearing footsteps as a result), I've never been a big fan of the "defenseless player" argument. It's the QB's job to not put the receiver in jeopardy. The DB/LB should not have to hold back and risk giving up a big gain because the QB threw a ball that put the receiver at risk from a big hit. As a DB in those situations I would aim for the kidney not the head.

I have to admit, on interceptions at towson and in high school when I played defense, I enjoyed spearing people in the lower back.

[Wedgebuster]

What folks who are just fans don't understand Andy, is that it is war out there, there is nothing huggy about the competition in the game, and it is certainly not for everybody. Another thing that cracks me up about the non football experienced fan is the hang up on size. "Oh I was not big enough to play high school football."

No the fact is, it takes a football/hockey/rugby demeanor to play the game, and size is not nearly as big an issue as attitude/demeanor/toughness.

Baseball and golf people will never fully understand.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Mount Union, the best D3 school in the nation, NEVER practices in pads

I saw a documentary or an extended news piece on them about 5 or 6 yrs. ago. Couldn't remember that it was Mount Union but I thought it was cool how successful they were on the field without using pads until gameday.

[89Hen]

What folks who are just fans don't understand Andy, is that it is war out there, there is nothing huggy about the competition in the game, and it is certainly not for everybody. Another thing that cracks me up about the non football experienced fan is the hang up on size. "Oh I was not big enough to play high school football."

No the fact is, it takes a football/hockey/rugby demeanor to play the game, and size is not nearly as big an issue as attitude/demeanor/toughness.

Baseball and golf people will never fully understand.

Uh Wedge, I've been an ice hockey player since age 4.

[andy7171]

What folks who are just fans don't understand Andy, is that it is war out there, there is nothing huggy about the competition in the game, and it is certainly not for everybody. Another thing that cracks me up about the non football experienced fan is the hang up on size. "Oh I was not big enough to play high school football."

No the fact is, it takes a football/hockey/rugby demeanor to play the game, and size is not nearly as big an issue as attitude/demeanor/toughness.

Baseball and golf people will never fully understand.

Some of the lightest players on my high school teams were the hardest hitters.

I hardly consider myself a dirty player. But if something bad happened, like an interception and I had a shot, I wanted to kill the person with the ball. Not particularly proud of those shots I took looking back, but I wasn't thinking quite clearly/at all.

[andy7171]

What folks who are just fans don't understand Andy, is that it is war out there, there is nothing huggy about the competition in the game, and it is certainly not for everybody. Another thing that cracks me up about the non football experienced fan is the hang up on size. "Oh I was not big enough to play high school football."

No the fact is, it takes a football/hockey/rugby demeanor to play the game, and size is not nearly as big an issue as attitude/demeanor/toughness.

Baseball and golf people will never fully understand.

Uh Wedge, I've been an ice hockey player since age 4.

Yeah, but not the enforcer.

[Wedgebuster]

Uh Wedge, I've been an ice hockey player since age 4.

Yeah, but not the enforcer.

Goalie?

[UNI88]

What folks who are just fans don't understand Andy, is that it is war out there, there is nothing huggy about the competition in the game, and it is certainly not for everybody. Another thing that cracks me up about the non football experienced fan is the hang up on size. "Oh I was not big enough to play high school football."

No the fact is, it takes a football/hockey/rugby demeanor to play the game, and size is not nearly as big an issue as attitude/demeanor/toughness.

Baseball and golf people will never fully understand.

Some of the lightest players on my high school teams were the hardest hitters.

I hardly consider myself a dirty player. But if something bad happened, like an interception and I had a shot, I wanted to kill the person with the ball. Not particularly proud of those shots I took looking back, but I wasn't thinking quite clearly/at all.

Too many concussions?

I never played at the level that Andy did but I was taught to get lower than the ballcarrier and hit him with everything I had and I frequently led with my helmet. Knowing what we know now, that was dumber than shit! Hitting someone with the crown of your helmet, especially in their head or back/spine is dangerous to both players and should be illegal and subject to fines and suspensions. Driving your shoulder pad into someone's kidney can be painful but it's a part of the game.

[andy7171]

Some of the lightest players on my high school teams were the hardest hitters.

I hardly consider myself a dirty player. But if something bad happened, like an interception and I had a shot, I wanted to kill the person with the ball. Not particularly proud of those shots I took looking back, but I wasn't thinking quite clearly/at all.

Too many concussions?

I never played at the level that Andy did but I was taught to get lower than the ballcarrier and hit him with everything I had and I frequently led with my helmet. Knowing what we know now, that was dumber than shit! Hitting someone with the crown of your helmet, especially in their head or back/spine is dangerous to both players and should be illegal and subject to fines and suspensions. Driving your shoulder pad into someone's kidney can be painful but it's a part of the game.

I always used the top of my facemask. The dangerous part is when you put your chin down, is when your vertibrae becomes vunerable. Like wedgie said, as long as your head is up and your eyes are open, your fine. The whole yellow part of the Michigan helmet is fair game to run into someone.
You don't have many chance to devastate someone with one hit playing o-line. Usually only when you are out in space pulling do you get up enough velocity going. And more times than not I would just cut the DB or LB. Those little DBs can make you look awefully foolish out in the open if you choose to engauge them up high. I just took their legs out from under them and removed them completely from the play.
And I said cut not chop. There is a difference.

[89Hen]

Yeah, but not the enforcer.

Goalie?

Hockey players make football players look like pussies.

[Wedgebuster]

Goalie?

Hockey players make football players look like pussies.

Well then Nancy, insist they make no hitting rules.