Yeah, I'm a yankmees fan.Gil Dobie wrote:Witten brought up he was a Yankees fan, so that was directed at him, sorry I didn't know you were a closet Yankees fan.AZGrizFan wrote:
So what? They beat the Yankees? Nobody expects the Twinkies to go 0-162...they're going to win some games, whether by luck or by actually playing halfway decent. And trying to make Mauer's contract look good by comparing it to ANOTHER shitty decision is just foolish.
FIFYAZGrizFan wrote:Yeah, I'm the Pride of the YankeesGil Dobie wrote:
Witten brought up he was a Yankees fan, so that was directed at him, sorry I didn't know you were a closet Yankees fan.
Everytime I write something nice or even neutral on Joe Mauer, I get emails. Oh, I get emails. Mostly from people telling me he's overpaid.
Well, if he is overpaid, it's not by much.
There are two ways of assessing a veteran player's monetary value. One is anecdotal. Talk to people in the game. They said Mauer would have made a killing as a free agent had he become one. Can you imagine what the Red Sox would have paid for a potential Hall of Fame catcher in his prime with a swing that might produce 50 doubles a year off the Green Monster, and who would constantly be on base in front of their sluggers? Probably $25 million a year. And all quality free agents end up being paid more than their actual value, because the bidding becomes a competition between super powers.
So Mauer is certainly worth $23 million anecdotally.
In terms of statistical valuation, I always turn to the great site Fangraphs.com, which calculates the obective value of a player.
Here is how Fangraphs values Mauer, year by year, since 2006: $23.1 million, $12.7 million, $26.6 million, $34.5 million, $21 million, $6.1 million and $21.2 million. This year, he is valued, so far, at $21.5 million.
Obviously, when he doesn't stay on the field, he's not worth the money, which is why 2011 was such an abomination.
When he is on the field, he's worth about what the Twins are paying him. Factor in that the Twins signed him in part to keep his contract status from ruining the opening season at Target Field, and he was an incredible bargain from 2006 through 2009, and the Twins and their fans have little to complain about other than the mystery ailments of 2011.
Mauer's real problem is he plays for a bad team. He doesn't have people on base ahead of him, and he doesn't have people who can drive him in batting behind him. He's not as valuable as Miguel Cabrera, but he's more valuable than the great majority of players with big-money contracts.
He's also the Twins' only above-average position player. He's not the guy you should be complaining about.
Yeah. THERE'S an objective source.Gil Dobie wrote:Mauer's Value
Strib Link
Everytime I write something nice or even neutral on Joe Mauer, I get emails. Oh, I get emails. Mostly from people telling me he's overpaid.
Well, if he is overpaid, it's not by much.
There are two ways of assessing a veteran player's monetary value. One is anecdotal. Talk to people in the game. They said Mauer would have made a killing as a free agent had he become one. Can you imagine what the Red Sox would have paid for a potential Hall of Fame catcher in his prime with a swing that might produce 50 doubles a year off the Green Monster, and who would constantly be on base in front of their sluggers? Probably $25 million a year. And all quality free agents end up being paid more than their actual value, because the bidding becomes a competition between super powers.
So Mauer is certainly worth $23 million anecdotally.
In terms of statistical valuation, I always turn to the great site Fangraphs.com, which calculates the obective value of a player.
Here is how Fangraphs values Mauer, year by year, since 2006: $23.1 million, $12.7 million, $26.6 million, $34.5 million, $21 million, $6.1 million and $21.2 million. This year, he is valued, so far, at $21.5 million.
Obviously, when he doesn't stay on the field, he's not worth the money, which is why 2011 was such an abomination.
When he is on the field, he's worth about what the Twins are paying him. Factor in that the Twins signed him in part to keep his contract status from ruining the opening season at Target Field, and he was an incredible bargain from 2006 through 2009, and the Twins and their fans have little to complain about other than the mystery ailments of 2011.
Mauer's real problem is he plays for a bad team. He doesn't have people on base ahead of him, and he doesn't have people who can drive him in batting behind him. He's not as valuable as Miguel Cabrera, but he's more valuable than the great majority of players with big-money contracts.
He's also the Twins' only above-average position player. He's not the guy you should be complaining about.
Don't get me wrong: If I were Joe Mauer and some stupid GM was willing to give ME $23 mil on the basis of one decent season I'd do it too....but the fact they don't spend money on anybody else doesn't make Mauer's contract make sense. And certainly not with his production SINCE he signed that contract.clenz wrote:That's not Mauers fault.
The Twins have more than enough money to spend over 120 million per year on the team...they haven't had a GM to do that.
This line completely invalidates everyone of your arguments thus far. How is it Mauer's fault that the Twins are terrible, if they are terrible no matter what he is paid?AZGrizFan wrote:
I'm PRETTY sure they Twins could have the 5th worst record in baseball WITHOUT paying Mauer $23 mil a year to do it.
Prospects Listclenz wrote:This line completely invalidates everyone of your arguments thus far. How is it Mauer's fault that the Twins are terrible, if they are terrible no matter what he is paid?AZGrizFan wrote:
I'm PRETTY sure they Twins could have the 5th worst record in baseball WITHOUT paying Mauer $23 mil a year to do it.
The Pohlad family is one of the richest in baseball, and they are willing to spend the money.
The GM has to take advantage of that. The last one did't. We'll see what happens with Ryan back in charge
I'm excited with the prospects that we have. Hopefully during the offseason Ryan goes after some help. The Twins need A LOT of help but picking up 2-3 solid pitchers and a couple position players will help.Gil Dobie wrote:Prospects Listclenz wrote: This line completely invalidates everyone of your arguments thus far. How is it Mauer's fault that the Twins are terrible, if they are terrible no matter what he is paid?
The Pohlad family is one of the richest in baseball, and they are willing to spend the money.
The GM has to take advantage of that. The last one did't. We'll see what happens with Ryan back in charge
Twins have 2 of the top 10 prospects to start with.
Seriously? You don't understand the reference? They're paying him $23 million yet suck as a team, and will for the forseeable future. They could just save the $23 mil and go the Marlins route, or spend another $30-$40 mil and actually field a competitive team. They choose to do neither.clenz wrote:This line completely invalidates everyone of your arguments thus far. How is it Mauer's fault that the Twins are terrible, if they are terrible no matter what he is paid?AZGrizFan wrote:
I'm PRETTY sure they Twins could have the 5th worst record in baseball WITHOUT paying Mauer $23 mil a year to do it.
The Pohlad family is one of the richest in baseball, and they are willing to spend the money.
The GM has to take advantage of that. The last one did't. We'll see what happens with Ryan back in charge
And how old will Mauer and Morneau be then?clenz wrote:I'm excited with the prospects that we have. Hopefully during the offseason Ryan goes after some help. The Twins need A LOT of help but picking up 2-3 solid pitchers and a couple position players will help.
I figure it's going to be 3 more years of suckage before they are back to competing for a top 3 finish in the division and probably 5 for a title.
If Morneau had not slumpled, he would be gone as of yesterday. Mauer will be mid 30's, 33-35.AZGrizFan wrote:And how old will Mauer and Morneau be then?clenz wrote: I'm excited with the prospects that we have. Hopefully during the offseason Ryan goes after some help. The Twins need A LOT of help but picking up 2-3 solid pitchers and a couple position players will help.
I figure it's going to be 3 more years of suckage before they are back to competing for a top 3 finish in the division and probably 5 for a title.
Good for him.Gil Dobie wrote:By the way, Mauer had his wife are proud parents of actual Twins, born July 24th.
Fraternal twin daughters Emily Teresa and Maren Virginia.
Gil Dobie wrote:By the way, Mauer had his wife are proud parents of actual Twins, born July 24th.
Fraternal twin daughters Emily Teresa and Maren Virginia.
Gil Dobie wrote:As of today, the Minnesota Twins have a better record than the defending World Champion SF Giants.
Mauer is a top 20 player if you go by WAR, #1 for catchers.AZGrizFan wrote:They better hurry. It looks like Mauer has run out of gas.
He just hit his first HR since June 22nd, and is batting a robust .206 for the month of August.
"One good season."AZGrizFan wrote:Don't get me wrong: If I were Joe Mauer and some stupid GM was willing to give ME $23 mil on the basis of one decent season I'd do it too....but the fact they don't spend money on anybody else doesn't make Mauer's contract make sense. And certainly not with his production SINCE he signed that contract.clenz wrote:That's not Mauers fault.
The Twins have more than enough money to spend over 120 million per year on the team...they haven't had a GM to do that.
I'm PRETTY sure they Twins could have the 5th worst record in baseball WITHOUT paying Mauer $23 mil a year to do it.
Even a clock is right twice a day, DJ.DJH wrote:5 hits today.
Buxton and Sano are inset on the cover of this weeks SI. Story tells of how Buxton threw a football 83 yards in high school, in front of scouts, just to show-off his arm strength.Gil Dobie wrote:Prospects Listclenz wrote: This line completely invalidates everyone of your arguments thus far. How is it Mauer's fault that the Twins are terrible, if they are terrible no matter what he is paid?
The Pohlad family is one of the richest in baseball, and they are willing to spend the money.
The GM has to take advantage of that. The last one did't. We'll see what happens with Ryan back in charge
Twins have 2 of the top 10 prospects to start with.
