Big Ten expansion could happen soon

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Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby Fresno St. Alum » Fri Jul 27, 2007 1:58 am

Missouri, Syracuse, Rutgers would be the top canidates since ND wants to stay Indy.


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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby Fresno St. Alum » Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:46 am

Big Ten
EAST
Michigan
Michigan St.
Ohio St.
Penn St.
Purdue
Indiana
WEST
Iowa
Minnesota
Wisconsin
Illinois
Northwestern
Missouri

Big 12 would add Colorado St. or TCU

If Rutgers or Syracuse left they'd be in the Big Ten(East)
Purdue would be in the West

Big East would add Memphis
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Fri Jul 27, 2007 5:41 am

Fresno St. Alum wrote:Big Ten
EAST
Michigan
Michigan St.
Ohio St.
Penn St.
Purdue
Indiana
WEST
Iowa
Minnesota
Wisconsin
Illinois
Northwestern
Missouri

Big 12 would add Colorado St. or TCU

If Rutgers or Syracuse left they'd be in the Big Ten(East)
Purdue would be in the West

Big East would add Memphis


If the Big 10 does go to 12 teams, I can assure you Michigan, Ohio St. and Penn St. will not end up in the same division. Each team will be able to select one other team that does not rotate off its schedule, so you'll always have the Michigan/Ohio St. matchup. The Big 10 has a similar rule now. For example, Ohio St. and Michigan St. never rotate off the Penn St. schedule.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby GeauxColonels » Fri Jul 27, 2007 12:34 pm

Missouri would make more sense than either Syracuse or Rutgers. Of course, personally, I don't see Missouri as being that attractive for the conference. Syracuse is doing horrible in football right now and Rutgers had 2 good seasons for football.

Now, Rutgers would give them much more exposure in the NYC area but I just think the geographic footprint would look horrible.

Any thoughts on adding Pittsburgh or Iowa State....or even West Virginia?
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Fri Jul 27, 2007 12:47 pm

GeauxColonels wrote:Missouri would make more sense than either Syracuse or Rutgers. Of course, personally, I don't see Missouri as being that attractive for the conference. Syracuse is doing horrible in football right now and Rutgers had 2 good seasons for football.

Now, Rutgers would give them much more exposure in the NYC area but I just think the geographic footprint would look horrible.

Any thoughts on adding Pittsburgh or Iowa State....or even West Virginia?


The conventional wisdom among a lot of Big Ten fans is that Rutgers carries the NYC market wherever it goes. Not true. Penn State and Notre Dame get much higher tv ratings in NYC than Rutgers ever has or could. Mizzou is attractive because it does bring the St. Louis and Kansas City markets. Its academic ranking is lower than that of any Big Ten school though. Iowa State really adds nothing, as it does not bring new markets and is academically comparable to Mizzou. West Virginia won't cut it academically. Pitt brings nothing in terms of new tv sets. The word on the street is that Mizzou is the early favorite and is likely to be the first school contacted by the Big Ten.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby GeauxColonels » Fri Jul 27, 2007 12:50 pm

CitadelGrad wrote:
GeauxColonels wrote:Missouri would make more sense than either Syracuse or Rutgers. Of course, personally, I don't see Missouri as being that attractive for the conference. Syracuse is doing horrible in football right now and Rutgers had 2 good seasons for football.

Now, Rutgers would give them much more exposure in the NYC area but I just think the geographic footprint would look horrible.

Any thoughts on adding Pittsburgh or Iowa State....or even West Virginia?


The conventional wisdom among a lot of Big Ten fans is that Rutgers carries the NYC market wherever it goes. Not true. Penn State and Notre Dame get much higher tv ratings in NYC than Rutgers ever has or could. Mizzou is attractive because it does bring the St. Louis and Kansas City markets. Its academic ranking is lower than that of any Big Ten school though. Iowa State really adds nothing, as it does not bring new markets and is academically comparable to Mizzou. West Virginia won't cut it academically. Pitt brings nothing in terms of new tv sets. The word on the street is that Mizzou is the early favorite and is likely to be the first school contacted by the Big Ten.

Ah OK. I know that they're looking to add TV exposure and I also know the Rutgers historically hasn't got much pub in NYC. I didn't realize that KC and STL would be brought in by Missouri. That makes plenty of sense to me. But would Missouri leave the Big-12 for the Big 10/11/12?

I really only mentioned Iowa State and Pittsburgh as they would be good pairings for existing members in Iowa and Penn State, respectively.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Fri Jul 27, 2007 12:55 pm

GeauxColonels wrote:
CitadelGrad wrote:
GeauxColonels wrote:Missouri would make more sense than either Syracuse or Rutgers. Of course, personally, I don't see Missouri as being that attractive for the conference. Syracuse is doing horrible in football right now and Rutgers had 2 good seasons for football.

Now, Rutgers would give them much more exposure in the NYC area but I just think the geographic footprint would look horrible.

Any thoughts on adding Pittsburgh or Iowa State....or even West Virginia?


The conventional wisdom among a lot of Big Ten fans is that Rutgers carries the NYC market wherever it goes. Not true. Penn State and Notre Dame get much higher tv ratings in NYC than Rutgers ever has or could. Mizzou is attractive because it does bring the St. Louis and Kansas City markets. Its academic ranking is lower than that of any Big Ten school though. Iowa State really adds nothing, as it does not bring new markets and is academically comparable to Mizzou. West Virginia won't cut it academically. Pitt brings nothing in terms of new tv sets. The word on the street is that Mizzou is the early favorite and is likely to be the first school contacted by the Big Ten.

Ah OK. I know that they're looking to add TV exposure and I also know the Rutgers historically hasn't got much pub in NYC. I didn't realize that KC and STL would be brought in by Missouri. That makes plenty of sense to me. But would Missouri leave the Big-12 for the Big 10/11/12?

I really only mentioned Iowa State and Pittsburgh as they would be good pairings for existing members in Iowa and Penn State, respectively.


Well, St. Louis and Kansas City aren't in New Mexico, so ........
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby GeauxColonels » Fri Jul 27, 2007 1:38 pm

CitadelGrad wrote:
GeauxColonels wrote:
CitadelGrad wrote:
GeauxColonels wrote:Missouri would make more sense than either Syracuse or Rutgers. Of course, personally, I don't see Missouri as being that attractive for the conference. Syracuse is doing horrible in football right now and Rutgers had 2 good seasons for football.

Now, Rutgers would give them much more exposure in the NYC area but I just think the geographic footprint would look horrible.

Any thoughts on adding Pittsburgh or Iowa State....or even West Virginia?


The conventional wisdom among a lot of Big Ten fans is that Rutgers carries the NYC market wherever it goes. Not true. Penn State and Notre Dame get much higher tv ratings in NYC than Rutgers ever has or could. Mizzou is attractive because it does bring the St. Louis and Kansas City markets. Its academic ranking is lower than that of any Big Ten school though. Iowa State really adds nothing, as it does not bring new markets and is academically comparable to Mizzou. West Virginia won't cut it academically. Pitt brings nothing in terms of new tv sets. The word on the street is that Mizzou is the early favorite and is likely to be the first school contacted by the Big Ten.

Ah OK. I know that they're looking to add TV exposure and I also know the Rutgers historically hasn't got much pub in NYC. I didn't realize that KC and STL would be brought in by Missouri. That makes plenty of sense to me. But would Missouri leave the Big-12 for the Big 10/11/12?

I really only mentioned Iowa State and Pittsburgh as they would be good pairings for existing members in Iowa and Penn State, respectively.


Well, St. Louis and Kansas City aren't in New Mexico, so ........

I know that, but being in Louisiana, you don't hear much about the Big 12. I know that the U of MO is a decent drive from either KC or STL. And KC always struck me as a NFL town more than college.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby SuperHornet » Fri Jul 27, 2007 1:41 pm

Personally, I'd think that given the presense of Iowa, adding Iowa State would be more attractive than Mizzou in terms of makinig the geographic rivalry with Iowa that much more meaningful: the rivalry game would actually count toward a conference championship, so more than pride would be involved.

Regardless, would this give the Big Ten the incentive to learn how to count?

:lol:
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Big Ten+2?

Postby EPJr » Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:35 pm

Delany: Big Ten will look at expansion, title game
Posted by Jim Carty July 26, 2007 18:29PM

Jim Delany guaranteed a much more interesting trip to Chicago for next week's Big Ten football kickoff when the commissioner told The Des Moines Register Wednesday that the Big Ten is again considering expansion. Rutgers and Syracuse are mentioned as potential targets, although Delany himself isn't specifically quoted as identifying those schools, so it's unclear whether those names represent the Big Ten commissioner's personal lead candidates.

The move would increase the reach of the Big Ten Network, underlining Delany's commitment to the league's fledgling broadcast arm:

"It changes to some extent how you think about it," Delany said of expansion. "The broader (the network) is distributed, the more value (expansion) has. We have eight states. With expansion, you could have nine."
Would expansion lead to a two-division split and a big-money conference title game?

Delany said he could live with such a scenario, but thought it had a negative impact on teams that lose in the title game. Big Ten Network president Mark Silverman, on the other hand, practically sounded like he was cheerleading for a title game:

"Any television executive would do whatever they could to be able to air a game like the Big Ten championship," said Mark Silverman, Big Ten Network president. "It would be worth a considerable amount of value.
"Fans would take to something of that nature if it were in the best interest of the conference."


It's hard to tell what to make of this right now.

Yes, expansion would be great for the Big Ten Network and, yes, a Big Ten title game would probably be the most profitable in college sports.

Michigan and Ohio State have traditionally been against expansion, and that's usually enough to kill any proposal in a league that revolves around football, but attitudes have shifted of late. Michigan coach Lloyd Carr and Ohio State coach Jim Tressel have both expressed some support for a 12th member and/or a conference title game in recent years.

Given the criticism he's received over the inability to get the Big Ten Network on most Midwest cable systems, it's hard not to cynically wonder whether Delany is essentially creating a distraction on the eve of the league's biggest media gathering.

Motivations aside, Rutgers has to be the No. 1 target if television is truly driving expansion. Rutgers is a public institution with an excellent academic profile, was one of the best feel-good stories in college sports last season under Greg Schiano, would give the Big Ten a boost in the New York and Philadelphia media markets, and has long-time ties to Penn State.

If this is about television ratings, the other schools historically suggested - Syracuse, West Virginia, Missouri, Iowa State, etc. - simply don't bring as much to the table as Rutgers.

There will be a ton more written and reported on this story out of Chicago next Tuesday and Wednesday, after which we'll have a better idea of how serious Delany and his member schools really are about adding a 12th

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Re: Big Ten expansion ...

Postby EPJr » Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:48 pm

Pitt as travel partner for PSU

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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby Fresno St. Alum » Fri Jul 27, 2007 2:56 pm

CitGrad, you don't like my East/West. Make me a set of how you think it will be.

In the article and on ESPN today the Big 10 seemed to emphasize getting into a 9th state for a new market. That would eliminate Iowa St. & Pitt.

Mark May mentioned Colorado, I don't see that at all. That would really F up the footprint.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby NDSUFREAK » Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:07 pm

So then what will be the conference name change?
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby Fresno St. Alum » Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:13 pm

It won't. The A-10 has 14. D-II the NE-10 has 15 soon to be 14.

I wonder how they can make that 11 in the BIG1T1EN logo into a 12
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:10 pm

SuperHornet wrote:Personally, I'd think that given the presense of Iowa, adding Iowa State would be more attractive than Mizzou in terms of makinig the geographic rivalry with Iowa that much more meaningful: the rivalry game would actually count toward a conference championship, so more than pride would be involved.

Regardless, would this give the Big Ten the incentive to learn how to count?

:lol:


Rivalries and pride are good, but conference expansion is about $$$. Iowa State can do absolutely nothing to enhance revenue for the conference. Mizzou can.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:16 pm

Fresno St. Alum wrote:CitGrad, you don't like my East/West. Make me a set of how you think it will be.

In the article and on ESPN today the Big 10 seemed to emphasize getting into a 9th state for a new market. That would eliminate Iowa St. & Pitt.

Mark May mentioned Colorado, I don't see that at all. That would really F up the footprint.


The Big Ten has a policy adopted by all the schools that expansion will occur only into a state that borders a current Big Ten state, so Colorado is out. Besides, Colorado isn't much of a research university and its academics are a joke.

If Missouri entered the Big Ten, I think the divisions might look like thisL'

Missouri
Iowa
Minnesota
Wisconsin
Michigan
Illinois

Northwestern
Michigan State
Indiana
Purdue
Ohio State
Penn State

You could switch Illinois and Northwestern but I put Illinois in the same division as Missouri because I think both schools would want to play each other every year. They already have a rivalry in basketball that would easily transfer to football.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:21 pm

I know that, but being in Louisiana, you don't hear much about the Big 12. I know that the U of MO is a decent drive from either KC or STL. And KC always struck me as a NFL town more than college.[/quote]

Mizzou is a two hour drive from both KC and STL on I-170. There is a great deal of interest in college football in both cities. KC is at the center of the Missouri/Kansas rivalry, which is one of the most bitter rivalries you can find.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby Fresno St. Alum » Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:24 pm

I assume you would still have Ohio St. play Michigan every year. So the rivalry isn't killed off like Oklahoma/Nebraska. I think there will either be an East/West or a North/South over a random spread but anything is possible. ACC is the only one not set in an E/W N/S
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby SuperHornet » Fri Jul 27, 2007 9:18 pm

CitadelGrad wrote:
SuperHornet wrote:Personally, I'd think that given the presense of Iowa, adding Iowa State would be more attractive than Mizzou in terms of makinig the geographic rivalry with Iowa that much more meaningful: the rivalry game would actually count toward a conference championship, so more than pride would be involved.

Regardless, would this give the Big Ten the incentive to learn how to count?

:lol:


Rivalries and pride are good, but conference expansion is about $$$. Iowa State can do absolutely nothing to enhance revenue for the conference. Mizzou can.


You care to explain that, Cit? Mizzou is a flash-in-the-pan in football, and they likely won't do much in hoops now that their Knight protege is gone. Iowa State has been improving in football as of late, has a fairly decent hoops squad, and is consistently winning in the national picture in wrestling. That and the fact that they'd make a natural travel partner with Iowa makes it a clincher in my book.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Sat Jul 28, 2007 5:18 am

SuperHornet wrote:
CitadelGrad wrote:
SuperHornet wrote:Personally, I'd think that given the presense of Iowa, adding Iowa State would be more attractive than Mizzou in terms of makinig the geographic rivalry with Iowa that much more meaningful: the rivalry game would actually count toward a conference championship, so more than pride would be involved.

Regardless, would this give the Big Ten the incentive to learn how to count?

:lol:


Rivalries and pride are good, but conference expansion is about $$$. Iowa State can do absolutely nothing to enhance revenue for the conference. Mizzou can.


You care to explain that, Cit? Mizzou is a flash-in-the-pan in football, and they likely won't do much in hoops now that their Knight protege is gone. Iowa State has been improving in football as of late, has a fairly decent hoops squad, and is consistently winning in the national picture in wrestling. That and the fact that they'd make a natural travel partner with Iowa makes it a clincher in my book.


Wow, I can't agree with a single point you made. Not sure why you think Mizzou is a flash in the pan in football and Iowa State's program is better. Iowa State football is in horrible shape and their long-time (too long) coach resigned last year. Mizzou will have one of the best offenses in the country this year and are expected by many in the national media to appear in the Big XII title game for the first time this year.

Yes, Iowa State does have a good wrestling program, but we really aren't talking about wrestling here, are we? It is a non-revenue sport and not the focus of Big Ten expansion. Besides, Mizzou wrestling took 3rd place at the NCAA tournament and has been a top 5 program for a few years now. However, if you do want to talk non-revenue sports, Mizzou is far more successful than Iowa State in everything from baseball to gymnastics.

I'm not sure who you are referring to as Knight's protege. Quinn Snyder was a Coach K protege. He played at Duke and was Coach K's asst. head coach before coming to Mizzou. I can tell you as someone who is exposed to a lot of Mizzou basketball, getting rid of Snyder was a great move. His successor has already done much to improve the program and the performance of the players that Snyder left behind. That's not just my view. It's a consensus view.

Still, you can't get around the fact that Iowa State will not add TV revenue to the Big Ten. That is why the conference plans on expanding into a new state with at least one large metropolitan area. The U. of Iowa already dominates the very small Iowa market (least populated state in the Big Ten). Mizzou, on the other hand, brings in two major TV markets (STL and KC). Even Rutgers, in the north Jersey/NYC market is not capable of bringing that many new TV sets to the Big Ten. Nobody in NYC follows Rutgers. That market is dominated by Notre Dame and Penn State.

In short, Iowa State would be a horrible choice for the Big Ten and will not even receive consideration. There are many other reasons not related to athletics that Iowa State will not be considered.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Sat Jul 28, 2007 5:23 am

Fresno St. Alum wrote:I assume you would still have Ohio St. play Michigan every year. So the rivalry isn't killed off like Oklahoma/Nebraska. I think there will either be an East/West or a North/South over a random spread but anything is possible. ACC is the only one not set in an E/W N/S


Michigan and Ohio State would play every year. Schools would be able to, as they do now, choose one or two teams by mutual agreement that would serve as their annual rivalry game. By the way, since the formation of the BigXII, Oklahoma and Nebraska do not play each other every year. All Big XII schedules are played on a rotational basis between the divisions.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby Fresno St. Alum » Sat Jul 28, 2007 11:13 am

I know that Nebraska and Oklahoma don't play every year. Thus the rivalry is killed off. The Day after thanksgiving is now Nebraska/Colorado. Just isn't the same.

Okay so if Mizzou or any other Big 12 team goes to the Big 10 who goes to the Big 12?

Colorado St.,TCU, someone else? I think it would be Colorado St. If you add TCU you'd have to move Oklahoma St. to the north and I don't TCU is that much better of an option than Colorado St.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby CitadelGrad » Sat Jul 28, 2007 12:19 pm

Fresno St. Alum wrote:I know that Nebraska and Oklahoma don't play every year. Thus the rivalry is killed off. The Day after thanksgiving is now Nebraska/Colorado. Just isn't the same.

Okay so if Mizzou or any other Big 12 team goes to the Big 10 who goes to the Big 12?

Colorado St.,TCU, someone else? I think it would be Colorado St. If you add TCU you'd have to move Oklahoma St. to the north and I don't TCU is that much better of an option than Colorado St.


It's hard to say who might take Mizzou's place. There has long been speculation about Colorado moving to the PAC10. There is a lot of dissatisfaction in the Big 12 among the old Big 8 members. I think you might actually see an exodus from the Big 12 if Mizzou were to leave. However, if the conference were to replace Mizzou, I have heard everthing from Colorado State, to Arkansas, to TCU to Houston. I suspect the Texas schools would strongly prefer TCU or Houston.
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby Fresno St. Alum » Sat Jul 28, 2007 9:28 pm

Colorado is probably a little too far east for the Pac 10. Plus the school has had lots of problems. Colorado St. vs TCU/Houston. I figure the 5 north schools would vote for Colorado St. and the 4 Texas schools would vote for TCU/Hou. If Oklahoma/Oklahoma St. want to keep their rivalry they'd vote for Colorado St. OSU should vote for CSU no matter what so they don't have to go to the north. I don't think Arkansas will leave the SEC for the B-12 but who knows.

I hope the Big 10 announces expansion by next june. If they do will the Pac 10 follow?
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Re: Big Ten expansion could happen soon

Postby SuperHornet » Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:02 am

If there's so much dissention in the Big XII, has anyone discussed the possibility of reverting to the Big 8 and re-forming the SWC? Any chance Arkansas would return to the SWC if that happened?
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