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http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/14558 ... os-angeles


The Raiders will stay in Oakland. The Chargers still have to decide if they want to share a stadium with the Rams.

Good. Now send the Cardinals back to St. Louis and give Phoenix an expansion team....

AZGrizFan wrote:Good. Now send the Cardinals back to St. Louis and give Phoenix an expansion team....

No.

AZGrizFan wrote:Good. Now send the Cardinals back to St. Louis and give Phoenix an expansion team....

AZGrizFan wrote:Good. Now send the Cardinals back to St. Louis and give Phoenix an expansion team....

Send them all the way back to Chicago and the Rams back to Cleveland, and the Ravens back to Cleveland and........oh well.

I'm selfishly happy that the Raiders stayed in Oakland. My favorite ex-relative is my BIL in Oakland. Dude was half Rican, drove a pimped out 70s El Camino for his around town car and a brand new BMW 740 for his business vehicle (which he promptly gave me the keys to and let us use for a week after he picked us up at the airport). I didn't really press on what he did for a living. I mentioned Rich Gannon was a Delaware grad and he went to his closet and tossed me an authentic Gannon jersey and said to take it.

Anyway, Oakland and the East Bay love their Raiders. I hope they can get a new stadium built for them soon.

Gil Dobie wrote:

AZGrizFan wrote:Good. Now send the Cardinals back to St. Louis and give Phoenix an expansion team....

Send them all the way back to Chicago and the Rams back to Cleveland, and the Ravens back to Cleveland and........oh well.

Can we get the Philadelphia Stars back? They did more in three years than the Eagles have done in fifty.

AZGrizFan wrote:Good. Now send the Cardinals back to St. Louis and give Phoenix an expansion team....

The Cardinals actually played 2 home games in Minnesota in 1959.

AZGrizFan wrote:Good. Now send the Cardinals back to St. Louis and give Phoenix an expansion team....

They've been in Phoenix as long as they were in St. Louis

And have one of the nicest stadiums so no

Are you to become a fan of the San Antonio Raiders when they move there next year?

No brainer move. LA is infinitely better bottom line business decision. I love how Kronke put his dick on the table and called his shot. There was some whining and crying from some of the other owners (like the Chargers’ Spanos) claiming they would block it but in the end cold hard cash prevails…

…then the NFL slaps Spanos even more and essentially are forcing him to take a deal as a tenant in Kronke’s new stadium (a deal he is going to accept). I love it.

Oakland/East Bay will not be building a new stadium for the Raiders anytime soon. LA is only getting a stadium because billionaire Kronke is building one on his own.

dbackjon wrote:They've been in Phoenix as long as they were in St. Louis

Wow, that's hard to believe.

89Hen wrote:

dbackjon wrote:They've been in Phoenix as long as they were in St. Louis

Wow, that's hard to believe.

Yup - moved to St. Louis in 1960, last season was 1987
Moved to Phoenix in 1988

SDHornet wrote:No brainer move. LA is infinitely better bottom line business decision. I love how Kronke put his dick on the table and called his shot. There was some whining and crying from some of the other owners (like the Chargers’ Spanos) claiming they would block it but in the end cold hard cash prevails…

…then the NFL slaps Spanos even more and essentially are forcing him to take a deal as a tenant in Kronke’s new stadium (a deal he is going to accept). I love it.

Oakland/East Bay will not be building a new stadium for the Raiders anytime soon. LA is only getting a stadium because billionaire Kronke is building one on his own.

When the Rams moved from LA to St Louis Kronke bought 30% of the team. He now gets to bring them back.

As you said he went "I have the biggest dick here, prove me wrong" and flopped it on the table. Everyone started to call the bluff and then looked in their pants and went "Shit....he wins".

Is $100m enough to entice a team to stay? US Bank Stadium in Minneapolis is over a billion. 100m is 100m, but is it enough to make a difference?

dbackjon wrote:

89Hen wrote: Wow, that's hard to believe.

Yup - moved to St. Louis in 1960, last season was 1987
Moved to Phoenix in 1988

Bloody hell I'm getting old.

It seems like Stump Mitchell and Neil Lomax weren't that long ago.

St. Louis has stadium plans and financing in place.

Oakland has no plan and no financing in place to build one even if they did have plans, but the NFL is going to give the Raiders millions to help finance a stadium for which there are no plans and no other financing in place. Of course that money will come in part from the Rams' relocation fee.

Kroenke said his team faces financial ruin without a modern stadium, but won't play in Inglewood until 2019.

The Chargers are going to rent space in Kroenke's stadium and pay the rent with the Rams' relocation fee. Spanos will never have his own stadium.

Tell me how St. Louis didn't get royally fucked in this deal.

kalm wrote:

dbackjon wrote:
Yup - moved to St. Louis in 1960, last season was 1987
Moved to Phoenix in 1988

Bloody hell I'm getting old.

It seems like Stump Mitchell and Neil Lomax weren't that long ago.

I would have guessed they moved to AZ in the 90's.

CitadelGrad wrote:Tell me how St. Louis didn't get royally fucked in this deal.

They're a two sport city.

89Hen wrote:

kalm wrote:
Bloody hell I'm getting old.

It seems like Stump Mitchell and Neil Lomax weren't that long ago.

I would have guessed they moved to AZ in the 90's.

I do remember it happening in the 80s because I remember Norman Braman dangling the Eagles name out there as a potential Arizona mover, which I believe got the top ring of luxury boxes built by the City of Philadelphia in the Vet. It was strictly a leverage move by the guy who made his players buy their own uniform socks (true story). Jews I'm sure Encyclopedia Brown (aka GannonFan) will be sure to set my memory straight on the luxury boxes.

93henfan wrote:

89Hen wrote: I would have guessed they moved to AZ in the 90's.

I do remember it happening in the 80s because I remember Norman Braman dangling the Eagles name out there as a potential Arizona mover, which I believe got the top ring of luxury boxes built by the City of Philadelphia in the Vet. It was strictly a leverage move by the guy who made his players buy their own uniform socks (true story). Jews I'm sure Encyclopedia Brown (aka GannonFan) will be sure to set my memory straight on the luxury boxes.

there was actually a deal to move the Eagles to Arizona, but the story was leaked and Braman had to backpedal.

Braman has his own circle of hell in Arizona - he was the one that led the charge to deny Arizona the Super Bowl after the MLK holiday fracas (never mind the fact that he was open for business on MLK Day, and refused to give his own employees that day off).

kalm wrote:

dbackjon wrote:
Yup - moved to St. Louis in 1960, last season was 1987
Moved to Phoenix in 1988

Bloody hell I'm getting old.

It seems like Stump Mitchell and Neil Lomax weren't that long ago.

The very first Cardinals game I went to was on November 6th, 1988. SF jumped out to a 23-0 lead, then Lomax led the Cardinals back to a 24-23 victory. It was also Lomax's last full game in the NFL. He was injured the next week in the Cards win over NY Giants. Cards were 7-4 at that point. Without Lomax, finished 7-9.

CitadelGrad wrote:St. Louis has stadium plans and financing in place.

Oakland has no plan and no financing in place to build one even if they did have plans, but the NFL is going to give the Raiders millions to help finance a stadium for which there are no plans and no other financing in place. Of course that money will come in part from the Rams' relocation fee.

Kroenke said his team faces financial ruin without a modern stadium, but won't play in Inglewood until 2019.

The Chargers are going to rent space in Kroenke's stadium and pay the rent with the Rams' relocation fee. Spanos will never have his own stadium.

Tell me how St. Louis didn't get royally fucked in this deal.

StL didn’t get screwed by the Rams, they screwed themselves. They should have negotiated a better lease (way back when) so their tenant couldn’t bolt at a moments notice. Oh, and no one outside of StL give a shit that the Rams are bailing.

SDHornet wrote:

CitadelGrad wrote:St. Louis has stadium plans and financing in place.

Oakland has no plan and no financing in place to build one even if they did have plans, but the NFL is going to give the Raiders millions to help finance a stadium for which there are no plans and no other financing in place. Of course that money will come in part from the Rams' relocation fee.

Kroenke said his team faces financial ruin without a modern stadium, but won't play in Inglewood until 2019.

The Chargers are going to rent space in Kroenke's stadium and pay the rent with the Rams' relocation fee. Spanos will never have his own stadium.

Tell me how St. Louis didn't get royally fucked in this deal.

StL didn’t get screwed by the Rams, they screwed themselves. They should have negotiated a better lease (way back when) so their tenant couldn’t bolt at a moments notice. Oh, and no one outside of StL give a shit that the Rams are bailing.

95% of St Louis doesn't give a fuck either.

Flaggy can correct me but I've been to St Louis more than a handful of times - will be there later this month again. I've yet to see ANYONE wearing Rams gear. It's 100% Cards and Blues. The Cards outdraw the Rams. The Blues, in a larger building, would be damn close.

If I had to guess there is "outrage" in St Louis right now, but it's about 15K people that are genuinely upset and then the media covering to stir up fauxtrage over "St Louis being fucked"

clenz wrote:

SDHornet wrote: StL didn’t get screwed by the Rams, they screwed themselves. They should have negotiated a better lease (way back when) so their tenant couldn’t bolt at a moments notice. Oh, and no one outside of StL give a shit that the Rams are bailing.

95% of St Louis doesn't give a fuck either.

Flaggy can correct me but I've been to St Louis more than a handful of times - will be there later this month again. I've yet to see ANYONE wearing Rams gear. It's 100% Cards and Blues. The Cards outdraw the Rams. The Blues, in a larger building, would be damn close.

If I had to guess there is "outrage" in St Louis right now, but it's about 15K people that are genuinely upset and then the media covering to stir up fauxtrage over "St Louis being fucked"

From my brief time here, it's clearly a Cardinals town. But the Cards have been playing great the last 5 or so years and the Rams have sucked. And if you go back even further, the baseball Cards had much more success than the football Cards. But I think you will find the same pattern in similar sized cities. The Rams were extremely popular when they were good with "The Greatest Show On Turf".

It takes a combination of things to garner a lot of support and buzz. Winning is one of them, but being around for a couple of generations is important for the lean years, especially in "homegrown" towns. St. Louis has had football for a long enough time but it went from Cardinals to Rams and had limited success. And because of the popularity of the baseball Cards, a team that is often in the playoffs during football season, it is a unique case in St. Louis. Other perennial football losers in "homegrown" towns (Cincy, Detroit, Buffalo, KC, Denver, Carolina, Minnesota, Tennessee) have not had strong baseball franchises to draw interest away from football.

People here are disappointed, but they understand the business decision of the move. The thing that pisses off everyone here are the lies that were told. There was a lot of work done in putting a new stadium plan together that included a lot of public money, because that was what Kroenke and the NFL told them they needed to do. Turns out that Kroenke didn't need the public money since he will be self funding the complex in Inglewood. In Kroenke's relocation application, there were a number of misleading statements, false statements, etc. He painted the picture he wanted the owners to see. He kept with the narrative of wanting to stay in St. Louis right up through the last home game in order to maintain attendance, even though he had a team of people working on plans for the new stadium in Inglewood for over two years. Now St. Louis is stuck with a stadium that they paid for and have no team to play in it. Inglewood doesn't have to pay a cent for their new neighbor.

It's a shitty situation that will be replayed again in other cities that put up a lot of public funds to build a stadium.

dbackjon wrote:

AZGrizFan wrote:Good. Now send the Cardinals back to St. Louis and give Phoenix an expansion team....

They've been in Phoenix as long as they were in St. Louis

And have one of the nicest stadiums so no

I just wish they would change the mascot to something that fits the location. Arizona Cardinals is kind of like the Utah Jazz.