2017 MLB Thread

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:35 am

Gil Dobie wrote:
89Hen wrote:I think you went a little further Gil. Sounded like you were expressing why you liked it.


I don't mind it.

You are a Twins fan, yes? :coffee: :kisswink:

BTW, I will be rooting for the NL WC to beat the Dodgers. 8-)
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby Gil Dobie » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:36 am

89Hen wrote:
Gil Dobie wrote:
I don't mind it.

You are a Twins fan, yes? :coffee: :kisswink:


Nope, just pulling the Twins with the Tigers down this year.
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:36 am

89Hen wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:Why is an 8th placed team winning the cup a good thing?

They are an NHL team. Why is it a bad thing?

Because there may have been as many as 15 teams that were better than them during the regular season.

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:38 am

CAA Flagship wrote:
89Hen wrote:They are an NHL team. Why is it a bad thing?

Because there may have been as many as 15 teams that were better than them during the regular season.

So why have playoffs at all? Man, you are more a moving target than Klean on the NFL thread. :lol:
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:40 am

Gil Dobie wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:Why is an 8th placed team winning the cup a good thing?


In 2012, the team with the 13th most points won the Stanley Cup. Many years the cup comes down to a hot goalie. Even with the play-in game, baseball only has 10 teams in the playoffs.

Yes. Baseball = right. Hockey = Wrong

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby dbackjon » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:41 am

89Hen wrote:
Gil Dobie wrote:
I don't mind it.

You are a Twins fan, yes? :coffee: :kisswink:

BTW, I will be rooting for the NL WC to beat the Dodgers. 8-)



Dodgers have lost season series to only two teams this year - Dbacks and Rockies
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby dbackjon » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:41 am

Great post for number 40,000
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:50 am

dbackjon wrote:Great post for number 40,000

You mean 40,001
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:51 am

CAA Flagship wrote:
Gil Dobie wrote:
In 2012, the team with the 13th most points won the Stanley Cup. Many years the cup comes down to a hot goalie. Even with the play-in game, baseball only has 10 teams in the playoffs.

Yes. Baseball = right. Hockey = Wrong

Why is it wrong in baseball?
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby dbackjon » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:56 am

89Hen wrote:
dbackjon wrote:Great post for number 40,000

You mean 40,001

Was referring to previous post.
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:58 am

89Hen wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:Because there may have been as many as 15 teams that were better than them during the regular season.

So why have playoffs at all? Man, you are more a moving target than Klean on the NFL thread. :lol:

Ugh. :ohno: :ohno:

I'm OK with playoffs, but it should not exceed a certain percentage of the league. 10/30 is OK. 16/31 (NHL) is too many.

I recognize that teams experience key injuries during the season, or make trades during the season that improve them in the second half. And I recognize that WC teams may have a better record than Division winners. Also, from a perspective of maintaining fan interest in the league, WC teams do a tremendous job in August and September. For these reasons, I like an appropriate number of WC teams. But I believe that basketball is the only sport that has a truly effective home field/court advantage (Football being a distant second).

Once the playoffs start, I want to see the higher seeds with an appropriate advantage as a reward for their accomplishments during the season. I don't believe that 1 extra home game in a series is enough of a reward.
But forcing the WC teams to burn an ace in a single game playoff helps to tilt the advantage to the top seed. I like that (and this year is a good example of how many teams can stay in the WC race well into Sept with the 2nd WC slot >>> two birds, one stone).

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:01 am

89Hen wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:Yes. Baseball = right. Hockey = Wrong

Why is it wrong in baseball?

What? Where? Who?
I said baseball does it right.

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:03 am

dbackjon wrote:
89Hen wrote:You are a Twins fan, yes? :coffee: :kisswink:

BTW, I will be rooting for the NL WC to beat the Dodgers. 8-)



Dodgers have lost season series to only two teams this year - Dbacks and Rockies

They must have lost a couple of series to one or both of those teams, no? Can't be just 2 series lost the entire year.

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby clenz » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:09 am

And we can build this dream together
Standing strong forever
Nothing's gonna stop us now

































Except probably the Yankees

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:19 am

CAA Flagship wrote:
89Hen wrote:So why have playoffs at all? Man, you are more a moving target than Klean on the NFL thread. :lol:

Ugh. :ohno: :ohno:

I'm OK with playoffs, but it should not exceed a certain percentage of the league. 10/30 is OK. 16/31 (NHL) is too many.

I recognize that teams experience key injuries during the season, or make trades during the season that improve them in the second half. And I recognize that WC teams may have a better record than Division winners. Also, from a perspective of maintaining fan interest in the league, WC teams do a tremendous job in August and September. For these reasons, I like an appropriate number of WC teams. But I believe that basketball is the only sport that has a truly effective home field/court advantage (Football being a distant second).

Once the playoffs start, I want to see the higher seeds with an appropriate advantage as a reward for their accomplishments during the season. I don't believe that 1 extra home game in a series is enough of a reward.
But forcing the WC teams to burn an ace in a single game playoff helps to tilt the advantage to the top seed. I like that (and this year is a good example of how many teams can stay in the WC race well into Sept with the 2nd WC slot >>> two birds, one stone).

A lot to digest here JSO.

Playoff size should be different for every sport. I think the more games played during the regular season, the fewer playoff teams there should be (BTW, I'm all for cutting a month off the baseball season, but that's for another thread). Many times in the NHL, there's not a lot separating 1st from 8th or 1st in the division to barely making the playoffs. Last year Toronto was the #8 team in the Eastern and they were only 8 points behind division winner Montreal (one more regulation loss than the Habs). Nashville was the #8 seed in the West and I had no problem with them making the finals (and they didn't have to sit their starting goalie in Game 1 of the first round).

IMO, in the playoffs it's you line up your best team, I line up my best team and we go at it. You feel it's better for baseball that the #1 seed get a bigger advantage in that regard and I don't. We will have to agree to disagree on that one.

NBA... I'd rather watch women's bowling (not kidding) but the "home court advantage" is a mirage. It's just that there is no longer parity in that league. The home team wins most of the time because there is a GIANT rift in the talent of the top 2-4 teams in the league and the rest of the pack. It's only one of the reasons I loathe the NBA.
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby dbackjon » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:19 am

CAA Flagship wrote:
dbackjon wrote:

Dodgers have lost season series to only two teams this year - Dbacks and Rockies

They must have lost a couple of series to one or both of those teams, no? Can't be just 2 series lost the entire year.


They were 8-11 vs Arizona, including losing last 6 (3 at home, 3 on the road) to Arizona
They are currently 7-9 vs Colorado, including last 4. Dodgers close the season at Colorado. Can salvage season series if they sweep the Rockies
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:20 am

CAA Flagship wrote:
dbackjon wrote:

Dodgers have lost season series to only two teams this year - Dbacks and Rockies

They must have lost a couple of series to one or both of those teams, no? Can't be just 2 series lost the entire year.

Season series.
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby Gil Dobie » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:24 am

89Hen wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:Ugh. :ohno: :ohno:

I'm OK with playoffs, but it should not exceed a certain percentage of the league. 10/30 is OK. 16/31 (NHL) is too many.

I recognize that teams experience key injuries during the season, or make trades during the season that improve them in the second half. And I recognize that WC teams may have a better record than Division winners. Also, from a perspective of maintaining fan interest in the league, WC teams do a tremendous job in August and September. For these reasons, I like an appropriate number of WC teams. But I believe that basketball is the only sport that has a truly effective home field/court advantage (Football being a distant second).

Once the playoffs start, I want to see the higher seeds with an appropriate advantage as a reward for their accomplishments during the season. I don't believe that 1 extra home game in a series is enough of a reward.
But forcing the WC teams to burn an ace in a single game playoff helps to tilt the advantage to the top seed. I like that (and this year is a good example of how many teams can stay in the WC race well into Sept with the 2nd WC slot >>> two birds, one stone).

A lot to digest here JSO.

Playoff size should be different for every sport. I think the more games played during the regular season, the fewer playoff teams there should be (BTW, I'm all for cutting a month off the baseball season, but that's for another thread). Many times in the NHL, there's not a lot separating 1st from 8th or 1st in the division to barely making the playoffs. Last year Toronto was the #8 team in the Eastern and they were only 8 points behind division winner Montreal (one more regulation loss than the Habs). Nashville was the #8 seed in the West and I had no problem with them making the finals (and they didn't have to sit their starting goalie in Game 1 of the first round).

IMO, in the playoffs it's you line up your best team, I line up my best team and we go at it. You feel it's better for baseball that the #1 seed get a bigger advantage in that regard and I don't. We will have to agree to disagree on that one.

NBA... I'd rather watch women's bowling (not kidding) but the "home court advantage" is a mirage. It's just that there is no longer parity in that league. The home team wins most of the time because there is a GIANT rift in the talent of the top 2-4 teams in the league and the rest of the pack. It's only one of the reasons I loathe the NBA.


And the NHL winner depends mostly on a hot goalie.
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:40 am

Gil Dobie wrote:And the NHL winner depends mostly on a hot goalie.

That's somewhat a fallacy Gil. A hot goalie can win you a game or two, but did you know the Lowest GAA and highest Save Percentage in the playoffs 2016?... Braden Holtby. I'm too familiar with how that turned out.

Last year for the Pens Flower started 15 games in the playoffs and Murray 10.
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:46 am

89Hen wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:Ugh. :ohno: :ohno:

I'm OK with playoffs, but it should not exceed a certain percentage of the league. 10/30 is OK. 16/31 (NHL) is too many.

I recognize that teams experience key injuries during the season, or make trades during the season that improve them in the second half. And I recognize that WC teams may have a better record than Division winners. Also, from a perspective of maintaining fan interest in the league, WC teams do a tremendous job in August and September. For these reasons, I like an appropriate number of WC teams. But I believe that basketball is the only sport that has a truly effective home field/court advantage (Football being a distant second).

Once the playoffs start, I want to see the higher seeds with an appropriate advantage as a reward for their accomplishments during the season. I don't believe that 1 extra home game in a series is enough of a reward.
But forcing the WC teams to burn an ace in a single game playoff helps to tilt the advantage to the top seed. I like that (and this year is a good example of how many teams can stay in the WC race well into Sept with the 2nd WC slot >>> two birds, one stone).

A lot to digest here JSO.

Playoff size should be different for every sport. I think the more games played during the regular season, the fewer playoff teams there should be (BTW, I'm all for cutting a month off the baseball season, but that's for another thread). Many times in the NHL, there's not a lot separating 1st from 8th or 1st in the division to barely making the playoffs. Last year Toronto was the #8 team in the Eastern and they were only 8 points behind division winner Montreal (one more regulation loss than the Habs). Nashville was the #8 seed in the West and I had no problem with them making the finals (and they didn't have to sit their starting goalie in Game 1 of the first round).

IMO, in the playoffs it's you line up your best team, I line up my best team and we go at it. You feel it's better for baseball that the #1 seed get a bigger advantage in that regard and I don't. We will have to agree to disagree on that one.

NBA... I'd rather watch women's bowling (not kidding) but the "home court advantage" is a mirage. It's just that there is no longer parity in that league. The home team wins most of the time because there is a GIANT rift in the talent of the top 2-4 teams in the league and the rest of the pack. It's only one of the reasons I loathe the NBA.

Hockey plays 80 games and a fairly balanced schedule. There is no reason that the cutoff can't be at 10 or 12 teams vs. the 16. In fact, I have a better way of doing the NHL playoffs but.......different thread.

Again, 162 games is a long season. Should be a bigger advantage for higher seeds. OK, agree to disagree.

There is no question that basketball is the biggest home advantage in sports. It's not just talent. It's a matter of the background for shooters. And home crowd has something to do with it also, helping to energize the home team. "Energizing the team" does not work in baseball nearly as much as in hockey, football and basketball. Baseball home crowds just make the celebration after the play better.

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:49 am

89Hen wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:They must have lost a couple of series to one or both of those teams, no? Can't be just 2 series lost the entire year.

Season series.

Ahh, dyslexia on my part. :lol: :lol: Gracias :D

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:51 am

CAA Flagship wrote:
89Hen wrote:A lot to digest here JSO.

Playoff size should be different for every sport. I think the more games played during the regular season, the fewer playoff teams there should be (BTW, I'm all for cutting a month off the baseball season, but that's for another thread). Many times in the NHL, there's not a lot separating 1st from 8th or 1st in the division to barely making the playoffs. Last year Toronto was the #8 team in the Eastern and they were only 8 points behind division winner Montreal (one more regulation loss than the Habs). Nashville was the #8 seed in the West and I had no problem with them making the finals (and they didn't have to sit their starting goalie in Game 1 of the first round).

IMO, in the playoffs it's you line up your best team, I line up my best team and we go at it. You feel it's better for baseball that the #1 seed get a bigger advantage in that regard and I don't. We will have to agree to disagree on that one.

NBA... I'd rather watch women's bowling (not kidding) but the "home court advantage" is a mirage. It's just that there is no longer parity in that league. The home team wins most of the time because there is a GIANT rift in the talent of the top 2-4 teams in the league and the rest of the pack. It's only one of the reasons I loathe the NBA.

Hockey plays 80 games and a fairly balanced schedule. There is no reason that the cutoff can't be at 10 or 12 teams vs. the 16. In fact, I have a better way of doing the NHL playoffs but.......different thread.

Again, 162 games is a long season. Should be a bigger advantage for higher seeds. OK, agree to disagree.

There is no question that basketball is the biggest home advantage in sports. It's not just talent. It's a matter of the background for shooters. And home crowd has something to do with it also, helping to energize the home team. "Energizing the team" does not work in baseball nearly as much as in hockey, football and basketball. Baseball home crowds just make the celebration after the play better.

For NHL, then you're talking about teams sitting around for two weeks while a series goes 7 games???? No thanks. 8 is too few, and I don't like byes, so I'm stuck with 16. And the fact that the 8 seed has won the Cup (went last year) pretty much supports that they're not letting in too many dregs.

On the NBA, you can't prove that in any way, shape or form. Talent wins out in bball. How many #8's have beaten #1's? I think the answer is still none. Rest my case on that one.
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:08 pm

Let's say you took the top 4 in each conference for NHL and NBA playoffs.

Recent NHL Cup finalists that wouldn't have made the playoffs (Cup champions bolded):

2017 - Nashville
2016 - San Jose
2014 - Kings and Rangers
2012 - Kings and Devils

NBA finalists that wouldn't have made the playoffs:

NONE

Let's reduce it to top 2 in each conference for the NBA:

NONE

I guess it's home court advantage. :kisswink:
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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby CAA Flagship » Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:10 pm

89Hen wrote:
CAA Flagship wrote:Hockey plays 80 games and a fairly balanced schedule. There is no reason that the cutoff can't be at 10 or 12 teams vs. the 16. In fact, I have a better way of doing the NHL playoffs but.......different thread.

Again, 162 games is a long season. Should be a bigger advantage for higher seeds. OK, agree to disagree.

There is no question that basketball is the biggest home advantage in sports. It's not just talent. It's a matter of the background for shooters. And home crowd has something to do with it also, helping to energize the home team. "Energizing the team" does not work in baseball nearly as much as in hockey, football and basketball. Baseball home crowds just make the celebration after the play better.

For NHL, then you're talking about teams sitting around for two weeks while a series goes 7 games???? No thanks. 8 is too few, and I don't like byes, so I'm stuck with 16. And the fact that the 8 seed has won the Cup (went last year) pretty much supports that they're not letting in too many dregs.

On the NBA, you can't prove that in any way, shape or form. Talent wins out in bball. How many #8's have beaten #1's? I think the answer is still none. Rest my case on that one.

On basketball, I'm talking about two closely matched teams, pro or college. Even the RPI calculation recognizes the homecourt advantage. And I think oddsmakers give the biggest edge to home basketball teams than any other sport.

I agree with you on hockey. Can't sit and wait. But if you went to say 12 teams, one of the things you could do is include a round robin type format early on. I think this would spur greater fan interest in the "other" games.
For example: If the Devils were playing the Caps in Round 1 (7 game series), and the Rangers were playing the Flyers, the Caps fans have little interest in the Rangers/Flyers series. Some yes, but not nearly as much as their own series.
A round robin format boils down to the team with the best record in a group of teams. If the Caps were playing game 5 with a 2-2 record, they would be interested in the Rangers/Flyers game with hopes that a certain team wins/loses or both tie. Can't say I have that all worked out, but the top seeds could also get more home games vs. the bottom seeds. After it boils down to 8, or maybe even 4, teams, then do the 7 game series.

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Re: 2017 MLB Thread

Postby 89Hen » Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:13 pm

CAA Flagship wrote:I agree with you on hockey. Can't sit and wait. But if you went to say 12 teams, one of the things you could do is include a round robin type format...

You lost me quickly on this post Flaggy... and a vast majority of hockey fans I'm guessing too. Round robin? :suspicious: This isn't gay soccer. :lol:
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