Republicans (2nd) worst nightmare...

[Grizalltheway]

How much do pharma companies spend on advertising? I'm sure it pales in comparison to R&D, but still...

[Wedgebuster]

This is what healthcare costs, checked out incomes for doctors, nurses, and administrators much.. and we are fat, out of shape, eat bullshit, smoke, and drink as if there ain't no tomorrow, well maybe we are right, but we flock to the E-room with our kiddie-pots and every snivvel, get our guts stapled, need our tickers repaired, livers pampered, kidneys replaced, and cancer tortured, and they just go..

CHA-CHING!!

But you forgot incomes for insurance company executives.

...and their fancy pants brokers and agents....

And right there is one of the biggest loses suffered during negotiations with congress about the ACA in the first place, having to give up on single payer (Medicare for all) to get, as they put it "something" passed.. You continue to suck the dick of big business, yes health insurance companies and law firms..

Will be interesting if any prospective or future congress and executive ever even has the balls to open the ACA discussion up to what it really should have been in the first place. The only thing we hear from the right is abolish it, abolish it, abolish it, abolish it.....They want to go back to the good old days of high numbers of uninsured and most of those who are covered are covered through the government, 30% a year premium increases, and no insurance for "pre-existing" conditions. A real republican utopia in other words.

[andy7171]

Our company is an anomaly trip. You have no idea what the vast majority of people pay for insurance. We haven't had a real increase in well over 10-15 years.

That's scary. Before I left Booz Allen, they ate the cost the first year and the second year costs went up about 7%. It wasn't too bad, but we luckily had 1 last year of great rates just as my wife was pregnant with Rose. It cost us $500 to have Lil CCU. A friend of mine just had a baby (still at BAH) and it cost her a few thousand. Same plan, same birth center, etc...

They started a program where if you had an HSA, then they'd give you $350 if you went in for a health screening. They gave your a $700 if you and your spouse went in for the screening. On top of that, choosing the Gold Plan earned you a $500 deposit in your HSA.

Last real rate increase wasn't really one at all. It was a change in structuring the system. Ove 80% were getting the Cadillac program. They raised those rates so everyone moved down to the regular program. Still, I only pay @ $300/month with a $2500 deductible and $25 co-pay.
There is a reason I've been here for 20 years.

[Chizzang]

What if the Affordable Care Act actually ends up working...?
What if the cost reduction projects made by independent studies were right..?
What if a repeal would actually be BAD for America..?

The nightmare continues

http://www.latimes.com/business/hiltzik ... story.html

I thought you quit drinking

Is this going to count as some kind of a relapse..?

[Gil Dobie]

This is what healthcare costs, checked out incomes for doctors, nurses, and administrators much.. and we are fat, out of shape, eat bullshit, smoke, and drink as if there ain't no tomorrow, well maybe we are right, but we flock to the E-room with our kiddie-pots and every snivvel, get our guts stapled, need our tickers repaired, livers pampered, kidneys replaced, and cancer tortured, and they just go..

CHA-CHING!!

But you forgot incomes for insurance company executives.

...and their fancy pants brokers and agents....

It's obscene what the officers make, plus many of them get additional pay to be on boards of directors of other companies.

[BDKJMU]

But you forgot incomes for insurance company executives.

...and their fancy pants brokers and agents....

And right there is one of the biggest loses suffered during negotiations with congress about the ACA in the first place, having to give up on single payer (Medicare for all) to get, as they put it "something" passed.. You continue to suck the dick of big business, yes health insurance companies and law firms..

Will be interesting if any prospective or future congress and executive ever even has the balls to open the ACA discussion up to what it really should have been in the first place. The only thing we hear from the right is abolish it, abolish it, abolish it, abolish it.....They want to go back to the good old days of high numbers of uninsured and most of those who are covered are covered through the government, 30% a year premium increases, and no insurance for "pre-existing" conditions. A real republican utopia in other words.

Sure you could find an example or 2, but 30% a year premium increases wasn't even close to the norm

And the donk answer to that is to force insurance companies to take someone with a pre existing condition and only be able to charge someone 3x what they charge a young, healthy person, even if their pre existing condition costs many times that..So the insurance co can only charge "X" annually even if the treatment of the pre exisiting condition is shown to cost annually 2x, 3x, 5x, 10x, etc...So the rest of us are forced to pay for it.

[kalm]

And right there is one of the biggest loses suffered during negotiations with congress about the ACA in the first place, having to give up on single payer (Medicare for all) to get, as they put it "something" passed.. You continue to suck the dick of big business, yes health insurance companies and law firms..

Will be interesting if any prospective or future congress and executive ever even has the balls to open the ACA discussion up to what it really should have been in the first place. The only thing we hear from the right is abolish it, abolish it, abolish it, abolish it.....They want to go back to the good old days of high numbers of uninsured and most of those who are covered are covered through the government, 30% a year premium increases, and no insurance for "pre-existing" conditions. A real republican utopia in other words.

Sure you could find an example or 2, but 30% a year premium increases wasn't even close to the norm

And the donk answer to that is to force insurance companies to take someone with a pre existing condition and only be able to charge someone 3x what they charge a young, healthy person, even if their pre existing condition costs many times that..So the insurance co can only charge "X" annually even if the treatment of the pre exisiting condition is shown to cost annually 2x, 3x, 5x, 10x, etc...So the rest of us are forced to pay for it.

Ummm yeah...that's sort of how insurance works...spreading the risk and such...

[Wedgebuster]

And right there is one of the biggest loses suffered during negotiations with congress about the ACA in the first place, having to give up on single payer (Medicare for all) to get, as they put it "something" passed.. You continue to suck the dick of big business, yes health insurance companies and law firms..

Will be interesting if any prospective or future congress and executive ever even has the balls to open the ACA discussion up to what it really should have been in the first place. The only thing we hear from the right is abolish it, abolish it, abolish it, abolish it.....They want to go back to the good old days of high numbers of uninsured and most of those who are covered are covered through the government, 30% a year premium increases, and no insurance for "pre-existing" conditions. A real republican utopia in other words.

Sure you could find an example or 2, but 30% a year premium increases wasn't even close to the norm

And the donk answer to that is to force insurance companies to take someone with a pre existing condition and only be able to charge someone 3x what they charge a young, healthy person, even if their pre existing condition costs many times that..So the insurance co can only charge "X" annually even if the treatment of the pre exisiting condition is shown to cost annually 2x, 3x, 5x, 10x, etc...So the rest of us are forced to pay for it.

Wrong again pole smoker, I was in the health insurance business, you not so much..

[BDKJMU]

Sure you could find an example or 2, but 30% a year premium increases wasn't even close to the norm

And the donk answer to that is to force insurance companies to take someone with a pre existing condition and only be able to charge someone 3x what they charge a young, healthy person, even if their pre existing condition costs many times that..So the insurance co can only charge "X" annually even if the treatment of the pre exisiting condition is shown to cost annually 2x, 3x, 5x, 10x, etc...So the rest of us are forced to pay for it.

Ummm yeah...that's sort of how insurance works...spreading the risk and such...

No- no insurance isn't suppose to work by forcing companies to cover someone at a price that is GUARANTEED to lose them $ EVERY YEAR that person is covered. That would be like telling auto insurers they had to cover habitual offenders (numerous at fault accidents, numerous tickets, DUIs, etc) and were limited in what they could charge them to a fraction of the actual costs, guaranteeing the companies they would lose $$ hand over fist on those habitual offenders, and having to make that up by jacking up the rates of everyone else, esp their best customers.

[kalm]

Ummm yeah...that's sort of how insurance works...spreading the risk and such...

No- no insurance isn't suppose to work by forcing companies to cover someone at a price that is GUARANTEED to lose them $ EVERY YEAR that person is covered. That would be like telling auto insurers they had to cover habitual offenders (numerous at fault accidents, numerous tickets, DUIs, etc) and were limited in what they could charge them to a fraction of the actual costs, guaranteeing the companies they would lose $$ hand over fist on those habitual offenders, and having to make that up by jacking up the rates of everyone else, esp their best customers.

You win some, you lose some.

[Chizzang]

Insuring the FAT
In a nation where 30% of the population is obese and 60% is generally over weight...
You're suggesting that Insurance Companies should have the right to say NOPE
fat people cost too much to insure - by by and good luck

Interesting
and worth a discussion
ultimately where do you draw the line

[Ibanez]

Insuring the FAT
In a nation where 30% of the population is obese and 60% is generally over weight...
You're suggesting that Insurance Companies should have the right to say NOPE
fat people cost too much to insure - by by and good luck

Interesting
and worth a discussion
ultimately where do you draw the line

Good question. Do they insure you for the first heart attack but you're on the hook for every other one? Especially if it's proven that you haven't tried to change your eating habits?

[Pwns]

Insuring the FAT
In a nation where 30% of the population is obese and 60% is generally over weight...
You're suggesting that Insurance Companies should have the right to say NOPE
fat people cost too much to insure - by by and good luck

Interesting
and worth a discussion
ultimately where do you draw the line

You certainly don't need to be using a 19th century scale (like the CDC used to get those statistics) for determining who is obese and that tells you nothing about muscle mass, serum triglycerides and cholesterol, and about body fat percentage and visceral versus subcutaneous fat.

Then there's the large meta-analysis showing that people in the BMI range that are considered "overweight" live longer.

Even if it were true having an overweight BMI led to a shorter life, it just means that they will actually save the health care system money.

[BDKJMU]

Sure you could find an example or 2, but 30% a year premium increases wasn't even close to the norm

And the donk answer to that is to force insurance companies to take someone with a pre existing condition and only be able to charge someone 3x what they charge a young, healthy person, even if their pre existing condition costs many times that..So the insurance co can only charge "X" annually even if the treatment of the pre exisiting condition is shown to cost annually 2x, 3x, 5x, 10x, etc...So the rest of us are forced to pay for it.

Wrong again pole smoker, I was in the health insurance business, you not so much..

I don't give a f*** what you claim to have done, 30% premium increases every year wasn't the norm. Not even close.

[Bronco]

Isn't calling someone a pole smoker a derogatory term for being a homosexual?
Not very progressive of you...

If you've been in the health business you must know this Obama care is the shits and getting worse every year
Of course most of the bad news built into the system was designed to come out after elections...so they knew it.
Friend of mine went from $1,000 deductible to approaching $7,000 now and no more co-pays...and she works in a hospital

Your answer is to go full socialism...that should work

[CID1990]

ultimately where do you draw the line

somewhere between "no insurance for you, Fatbody"

and- "here's your insurance you'll never really need, skinny jogger"

or as I like to call it : "paleo-healthcare"

also known as "mother nature"



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JohnStOnge]

Chizz, I hate to have to be ad hominem but you've got a sourcing problem in that the underlying analyses and statistics come from the Urban Institute. It's been described by the same LA Times as a "Leading Liberal Think Tank."

http://articles.latimes.com/1988-06-12/ ... -institute

Doesn't necessarily mean it's wrong on any particular thing. But it's not an objective institution. It's going to be inclined to portray something like the Affordable Care Act in a favorable light.

It's kind of like if I tell you the Heritage Foundation came out with a study saying that the Affordable Care Act sucks. You're going to consider the source and be skeptical.

[JohnStOnge]

Screwed up by hitting the quote thing instead of the edit thing. And I just tried the Delete button Hen referenced at the bottom and it told me "You cannot delete posts in this forum."

[BDKJMU]

Wrong again pole smoker, I was in the health insurance business, you not so much..

I don't give a f*** what you claim to have done, 30% premium increases every year wasn't the norm. Not even close.

Health insurance costs in the United States are an individual issue and a national issue. As illustrated in Chart 1, the average annual costs for health insurance coverage for an individual have risen from $2,196 in 1990 to $5,049 in 2010. This is equivalent to an average rate of increase of 7.9% per annum compound1, which is well in excess of the rate of price inflation (2.6% per annum compound) for the same period2.

The increase in family coverage has been even greater, with average premiums rising from $5,791 in 1999 to $13,770 in 2010, a rate of increase of 8.2% per annum compound3.

http://www.healthinsurancecompanies.org/costs

[Wedgebuster]

I don't give a f*** what you claim to have done, 30% premium increases every year wasn't the norm. Not even close.

Health insurance costs in the United States are an individual issue and a national issue. As illustrated in Chart 1, the average annual costs for health insurance coverage for an individual have risen from $2,196 in 1990 to $5,049 in 2010. This is equivalent to an average rate of increase of 7.9% per annum compound1, which is well in excess of the rate of price inflation (2.6% per annum compound) for the same period2.

The increase in family coverage has been even greater, with average premiums rising from $5,791 in 1999 to $13,770 in 2010, a rate of increase of 8.2% per annum compound3.

http://www.healthinsurancecompanies.org/costs

So what is it you have done other than parrot partisan bullshit from your selected propaganda? Act like you know it all all the time, and it is same old shit. Tired fucking stuff, makes one wonder why you aren't running the country. I don't give a fuck what you think, ever, and it does not matter of course what I have done or what you believe. Your posts consistently suck, you must be a real anal cyst to live with.

[Chizzang]

Chizz, I hate to have to be ad hominem but you've got a sourcing problem in that the underlying analyses and statistics come from the Urban Institute. It's been described by the same LA Times as a "Leading Liberal Think Tank."

http://articles.latimes.com/1988-06-12/ ... -institute

Doesn't necessarily mean it's wrong on any particular thing. But it's not an objective institution. It's going to be inclined to portray something like the Affordable Care Act in a favorable light.

It's kind of like if I tell you the Heritage Foundation came out with a study saying that the Affordable Care Act sucks. You're going to consider the source and be skeptical.

Dear JohnStwrong...
Yes I am well aware that the article is basically a fluff job for the White House
Thank you for playing

we can all find articles that confirm or deny whatever our little hearts desire...
its called confirmation bias

[clenz]

And clenz: $10K?! Was that the only option available? I just signed up for health insurance with BCBS and the highest deductible was $5000/family.

Yes. Small company of 75 full time employees. Average age is 53ish. Kind of a worst case scenario for insurance.

Our company had BCBS but left due to costs and moved to United.

2013-2014 saw an 11% increase. Our company ate that increase.
2014-15 saw another 15% increase and our company ate that increase.
Going from 2015 into this year there was going to be a 29% increase.

Our company couldn't eat that. It also didn't want to pass that kind of jump to the employees so a switch was made to a cheaper premium insurance company...that just is shittier overall.

If our company had stayed with BCBS I'd be paying about $1,400 a month right now. Not sure what our dedctable and all that would have been, but we'd be at 16,800 per year in just premium costs. That doesn't include any actual bills.

Can't wait until what we get hit with next year. 3 women over the age of 56 are going through breast cancer treatments right now and a 54 year old male underwent prostate cancer surgery in March.

Company hasn't hired any younger people to offset the age. It's going to get real ugly in 5-10 years when 90% of our company is 70+ years old and or dead and are still dragging their feet on getting younger.

In my branch I'm 28, my lead inside salesman turns 25 tomorrow and my delivery driver is 37.
Another branch has ages of 48, 52, 53, 49, and 56
A third branch has 32 and then 6 guys over 45
Main branch has maybe 4 guys under 35 years old...maybe?

I'd guess there are 5 or 6 guys under 35 in our company right now.

[Ibanez]

And clenz: $10K?! Was that the only option available? I just signed up for health insurance with BCBS and the highest deductible was $5000/family.

Yes. Small company of 75 full time employees. Average age is 53ish. Kind of a worst case scenario for insurance.

Our company had BCBS but left due to costs and moved to United.

2013-2014 saw an 11% increase. Our company ate that increase.
2014-15 saw another 15% increase and our company ate that increase.
Going from 2015 into this year there was going to be a 29% increase.

Our company couldn't eat that. It also didn't want to pass that kind of jump to the employees so a switch was made to a cheaper premium insurance company...that just is shittier overall.

If our company had stayed with BCBS I'd be paying about $1,400 a month right now. Not sure what our dedctable and all that would have been, but we'd be at 16,800 per year in just premium costs. That doesn't include any actual bills.

Can't wait until what we get hit with next year. 3 women over the age of 56 are going through breast cancer treatments right now and a 54 year old male underwent prostate cancer surgery in March.

Company hasn't hired any younger people to offset the age. It's going to get real ugly in 5-10 years when 90% of our company is 70+ years old and or dead and are still dragging their feet on getting younger.

In my branch I'm 28, my lead inside salesman turns 25 tomorrow and my delivery driver is 37.
Another branch has ages of 48, 52, 53, 49, and 56
A third branch has 32 and then 6 guys over 45
Main branch has maybe 4 guys under 35 years old...maybe?

I'd guess there are 5 or 6 guys under 35 in our company right now.

Wow. That sucks....

[kalm]

Yes. Small company of 75 full time employees. Average age is 53ish. Kind of a worst case scenario for insurance.

Our company had BCBS but left due to costs and moved to United.

2013-2014 saw an 11% increase. Our company ate that increase.
2014-15 saw another 15% increase and our company ate that increase.
Going from 2015 into this year there was going to be a 29% increase.

Our company couldn't eat that. It also didn't want to pass that kind of jump to the employees so a switch was made to a cheaper premium insurance company...that just is shittier overall.

If our company had stayed with BCBS I'd be paying about $1,400 a month right now. Not sure what our dedctable and all that would have been, but we'd be at 16,800 per year in just premium costs. That doesn't include any actual bills.

Can't wait until what we get hit with next year. 3 women over the age of 56 are going through breast cancer treatments right now and a 54 year old male underwent prostate cancer surgery in March.

Company hasn't hired any younger people to offset the age. It's going to get real ugly in 5-10 years when 90% of our company is 70+ years old and or dead and are still dragging their feet on getting younger.

In my branch I'm 28, my lead inside salesman turns 25 tomorrow and my delivery driver is 37.
Another branch has ages of 48, 52, 53, 49, and 56
A third branch has 32 and then 6 guys over 45
Main branch has maybe 4 guys under 35 years old...maybe?

I'd guess there are 5 or 6 guys under 35 in our company right now.

Wow. That sucks....

That does. We're almost twice your age with two kids, pay the same premium through a private plan and have no deductible on dugs (we buy a lot) and only $1000 on the rest.

Must be huge differences from state to state and is question what your employers plan is actually doing for you.

[CAA Flagship]

Insuring the FAT
In a nation where 30% of the population is obese and 60% is generally over weight...
You're suggesting that Insurance Companies should have the right to say NOPE
fat people cost too much to insure - by by and good luck

Interesting
and worth a discussion
ultimately where do you draw the line

Who you callin' fat?