Coronavirus COVID-19

[Winterborn]

I'm stupid and stuff don't ask me how to manage life............. I'm sure Ibanez will comment a couple thousand times on how to do so.


P. S. All business could do this........ They choose not to
Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

I do it for four months every year...sometimes five. You ain’t so special!

Farmers do about 6 or so.

[Pwns]

Oh, and just to add on to this, for me, this is make it or break it time for US pharmaceutical companies and academic (i.e. University) health research centers. We as a country have shouldered for years higher drug prices and other economic windfalls for pharma companies based on the idea that we have the vast majority of scientists and labs and R&D in this country and that it's in our national self-interest to foster and cater to this market since we can expect cutting-edge and life-saving research to be coming out of these places. Well, time to deliver. We need to see some crazy-innovation where we can come up with a vaccine, or at a minimum a successful treatment, in extremely rapid time (and not by sometime next year, I mean something in the next few months) or it's time to close shop on all of these companies and start demanding huge discounts on drugs and so on. I'm already on record that we should have a national health care system (ala the NHS in England), warts and all (and we'll have the same setup where the rich can still pay for the good health care while the rest just get the mediocre "national" one), but if our vast array of pharma companies and university research centers can't successfully and quickly respond to this virus, then what's the point of having them anyway?

I'm not sure how you can speed up the vaccine development process. If i was a cure it could be faster but it takes longer to test something that prevents instead of treats, unless you've got volunteers willing to get the vaccine and get deliberately exposed to the virus.

We absolutely do need to expand the NIH instead of cutting it but that's not going to improve our pandemic response. We need to be able to produce and deploy testing like South Korea and Japan, and we need to be able to produce critical medical equipment as we need it.

[kalm]

I do it for four months every year...sometimes five. You ain’t so special!

Farmers do about 6 or so.

Yeah...but they only really work for about 3 of those other 6 months...

[GannonFan]

Oh, and just to add on to this, for me, this is make it or break it time for US pharmaceutical companies and academic (i.e. University) health research centers. We as a country have shouldered for years higher drug prices and other economic windfalls for pharma companies based on the idea that we have the vast majority of scientists and labs and R&D in this country and that it's in our national self-interest to foster and cater to this market since we can expect cutting-edge and life-saving research to be coming out of these places. Well, time to deliver. We need to see some crazy-innovation where we can come up with a vaccine, or at a minimum a successful treatment, in extremely rapid time (and not by sometime next year, I mean something in the next few months) or it's time to close shop on all of these companies and start demanding huge discounts on drugs and so on. I'm already on record that we should have a national health care system (ala the NHS in England), warts and all (and we'll have the same setup where the rich can still pay for the good health care while the rest just get the mediocre "national" one), but if our vast array of pharma companies and university research centers can't successfully and quickly respond to this virus, then what's the point of having them anyway?

I'm not sure how you can speed up the vaccine development process. If i was a cure it could be faster but it takes longer to test something that prevents instead of treats, unless you've got volunteers willing to get the vaccine and get deliberately exposed to the virus.

We absolutely do need to expand the NIH instead of cutting it but that's not going to improve our pandemic response. We need to be able to produce and deploy testing like South Korea and Japan, and we need to be able to produce critical medical equipment as we need it.

People are dying now, no? Why not try it on them before they die? No matter how much we "bend the curve" thousands. or tens of thousands, are going to die prior to a 12 month vaccine program. Better to give those folks a shot at life rather than just writing it off to procedural delay.

[CAA Flagship]

I'm not sure how you can speed up the vaccine development process. If i was a cure it could be faster but it takes longer to test something that prevents instead of treats, unless you've got volunteers willing to get the vaccine and get deliberately exposed to the virus.

We absolutely do need to expand the NIH instead of cutting it but that's not going to improve our pandemic response. We need to be able to produce and deploy testing like South Korea and Japan, and we need to be able to produce critical medical equipment as we need it.

Yup. You can't intentionally expose people to a disease to test a vaccine.
It takes a long time to develop one even if you hit a home run on the first swing.

Our FDA is extremely cautious. And it may have bit us in the ass with the tests.
There are many drugs that are approved for use in other countries but not in the US. I can point to a drug called Walivra that is approved in several countries, including the EU, but was denied by the US even though the FDA Advisory Panel (think of them as a lower court) approved it by a 5 to 4 vote. And Waylivra is the only drug in the world that has had any success fighting a certain disease.

[CAA Flagship]

I'm not sure how you can speed up the vaccine development process. If i was a cure it could be faster but it takes longer to test something that prevents instead of treats, unless you've got volunteers willing to get the vaccine and get deliberately exposed to the virus.

We absolutely do need to expand the NIH instead of cutting it but that's not going to improve our pandemic response. We need to be able to produce and deploy testing like South Korea and Japan, and we need to be able to produce critical medical equipment as we need it.

People are dying now, no? Why not try it on them before they die? No matter how much we "bend the curve" thousands. or tens of thousands, are going to die prior to a 12 month vaccine program. Better to give those folks a shot at life rather than just writing it off to procedural delay.

You are confusing a vaccine with a therapeutic. Both drugs are necessary and the world is working on both of them.

[GannonFan]

People are dying now, no? Why not try it on them before they die? No matter how much we "bend the curve" thousands. or tens of thousands, are going to die prior to a 12 month vaccine program. Better to give those folks a shot at life rather than just writing it off to procedural delay.

You are confusing a vaccine with a therapeutic. Both drugs are necessary and the world is working on both of them.

Not confusing, we need both. And I know we're working on it. My point is that we shouldn't have to wait 12-18 months from now to get them. We've sunk a ton of money into the pharma industry, I just expect better and faster results. It's like taking an edge rusher with a high pick in the draft - I expect a fair number of sacks, even in the rookie year.

[CAA Flagship]

You are confusing a vaccine with a therapeutic. Both drugs are necessary and the world is working on both of them.

Not confusing, we need both. And I know we're working on it. My point is that we shouldn't have to wait 12-18 months from now to get them. We've sunk a ton of money into the pharma industry, I just expect better and faster results. It's like taking an edge rusher with a high pick in the draft - I expect a fair number of sacks, even in the rookie year.

But you talked about testing a vaccine on people who are about to die. Think about it. What if they die anyway? Would you call the vaccine safe? There is no way to tell. A vaccine is measured by administering it to healthy people and determining if it is safe and if they get infected. You can't run a trial of a vaccine designed to ward off infection with people that are already infected.

Regarding the therapeutic, there are existing drugs that are designed for a different marker that are being tested right now (and some show early signs of success). These are the best chance we have at getting through this quickly since the safety part is already known and the efficacy part can be determined within a few days/weeks.

[GannonFan]

Not confusing, we need both. And I know we're working on it. My point is that we shouldn't have to wait 12-18 months from now to get them. We've sunk a ton of money into the pharma industry, I just expect better and faster results. It's like taking an edge rusher with a high pick in the draft - I expect a fair number of sacks, even in the rookie year.

But you talked about testing a vaccine on people who are about to die. Think about it. What if they die anyway? Would you call the vaccine safe? There is no way to tell. A vaccine is measured by administering it to healthy people and determining if it is safe and if they get infected. You can't run a trial of a vaccine designed to ward off infection with people that are already infected.

Regarding the therapeutic, there are existing drugs that are designed for a different marker that are being tested right now (and some show early signs of success). These are the best chance we have at getting through this quickly since the safety part is already known and the efficacy part can be determined within a few days/weeks.

I wouldn't use the vaccine on dying people as part of the test to see if the vaccine worked and is safe, I would use it on them to see if they could live at all. When the choice is death or maybe not dying, I'd think maybe not dying would be a better alternative.

[CAA Flagship]

But you talked about testing a vaccine on people who are about to die. Think about it. What if they die anyway? Would you call the vaccine safe? There is no way to tell. A vaccine is measured by administering it to healthy people and determining if it is safe and if they get infected. You can't run a trial of a vaccine designed to ward off infection with people that are already infected.

Regarding the therapeutic, there are existing drugs that are designed for a different marker that are being tested right now (and some show early signs of success). These are the best chance we have at getting through this quickly since the safety part is already known and the efficacy part can be determined within a few days/weeks.

I wouldn't use the vaccine on dying people as part of the test to see if the vaccine worked and is safe, I would use it on them to see if they could live at all. When the choice is death or maybe not dying, I'd think maybe not dying would be a better alternative.

But a vaccine is not designed to cure someone. They are designed to prevent infection.
If you get the flu, you aren't given a vaccine, you are given a therapeutic to help your immune system destroy the virus.
You are asking all the right questions, but you have to say "therapeutic" rather than "vaccine".

[dbackjon]

Super. You might be the only one left. Most businesses just can't shut down for months on end and then just pop back up again. And like I said, what do the poor slobs who work for these shuttered businesses do in the meantime when all their bills come due every month? We can give out $1000 right now to every adult, but that gets us basically through another month. Do we keep doing that every month until we get a solution to all of this?

I'm stupid and stuff don't ask me how to manage life............. I'm sure Ibanez will comment a couple thousand times on how to do so.


P. S. All business could do this........ They choose not to
Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

So no bailouts for the airline industry, cruise industry, etc

[kalm]

I'm stupid and stuff don't ask me how to manage life............. I'm sure Ibanez will comment a couple thousand times on how to do so.


P. S. All business could do this........ They choose not to
Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

So no bailouts for the airline industry, cruise industry, etc

Alpha already owns a cruise ship. Prolly looking into getting a plane too.

[BDKJMU]

Oh, and just to add on to this, for me, this is make it or break it time for US pharmaceutical companies and academic (i.e. University) health research centers. We as a country have shouldered for years higher drug prices and other economic windfalls for pharma companies based on the idea that we have the vast majority of scientists and labs and R&D in this country and that it's in our national self-interest to foster and cater to this market since we can expect cutting-edge and life-saving research to be coming out of these places. Well, time to deliver. We need to see some crazy-innovation where we can come up with a vaccine, or at a minimum a successful treatment, in extremely rapid time (and not by sometime next year, I mean something in the next few months) or it's time to close shop on all of these companies and start demanding huge discounts on drugs and so on. I'm already on record that we should have a national health care system (ala the NHS in England), warts and all (and we'll have the same setup where the rich can still pay for the good health care while the rest just get the mediocre "national" one), but if our vast array of pharma companies and university research centers can't successfully and quickly respond to this virus, then what's the point of having them anyway?

From the summary on the Imperial College London Report:

How quickly will a vaccine be here? Last week three separate research teams announced they had developed vaccines. Yesterday, one of them (with FDA approval) injected its vaccine into a live person, without waiting for animal testing. That's an extreme measure, but necessary.
Now, though, they have to monitor the test subject for 14 months to make sure the vaccine is safe. This part can't be rushed: if you're going to inoculate all humans, you have to make absolutely sure the vaccine itself won't kill them. It probably won't, but you have to be sure.
Assuming the vaccine is safe and effective, it will still take several months to produce enough to inoculate the global population. For this reason, the Imperial College team estimated it will be about 18 months until the vaccine is available

Like EVERYTHING else R&D and safety related in time of war, it can, and will be rushed. I heard a doc say yesterday that the SARS vaccine was done in a record 20 months, but this would take minimum 9-12 months.

Also non vaccinating antiviral/therapeutic that at least mitigates the effects & allows somewhat normalcy will come well before a vaccine. Heck, there was something yesterday about the malarial drug.

Edit: Nevermind, see this has already been covered..

[kalm]

From the summary on the Imperial College London Report:

Like EVERYTHING else R&D and safety related in time of war, it can, and will be rushed. I heard a doc say yesterday that the SARS vaccine was done in a record 20 months, but this would take minimum 9-12 months.

Also non vaccinating antiviral that at least mitigates the effects & allows somewhat normalcy will come well before a vaccine. Heck, there was something yesterday about the malarial drug.

That’s the hope. But be prepared for life to be disrupted for more than a few weeks is the takeaway.

[BDKJMU]

Like EVERYTHING else R&D and safety related in time of war, it can, and will be rushed. I heard a doc say yesterday that the SARS vaccine was done in a record 20 months, but this would take minimum 9-12 months.

Also non vaccinating antiviral that at least mitigates the effects & allows somewhat normalcy will come well before a vaccine. Heck, there was something yesterday about the malarial drug.

That’s the hope. But be prepared for life to be disrupted for more than a few weeks is the takeaway.

Sure, keeping 6 feet separated, bars shutdown, restaurants only takeway, theaters & amusement parks, etc could go manage to go on for at least a few months, if not longer. Some of that can be taken up by shift from (grocery stores, Amazon, Walmart, delivery drivers, trucking companies, etc hiring or need to). Saw yesterday that Walmart announced they hiring 150k more).

These haphazard manufacturing & retail shutdowns can't go on for months.

[Gil Dobie]

My daughters Uncle just got the call to get tested for COVID-19. Appears he was in contact with a person that tested positive.

Speculation Minnesota is considering a Cali/NY lockdown soon.

[kalm]

That’s the hope. But be prepared for life to be disrupted for more than a few weeks is the takeaway.

Sure, keeping 6 feet separated, bars shutdown, restaurants only takeway, theaters & amusement parks, etc could go manage to go on for at least a few months, if not longer. Some of that can be taken up by shift from (grocery stores, Amazon, Walmart, delivery drivers, trucking companies, etc hiring or need to). Saw yesterday that Walmart announced they hiring 150k more).

These haphazard manufacturing & retail shutdowns can't go on for months.

They will. And then we’ll relax. Then we’ll see another spike and then shut down again...until a vaccine is ready...which will likely be 18 months. Buckle up!

[Winterborn]

Farmers do about 6 or so.

Yeah...but they only really work for about 3 of those other 6 months...

Fishing is working.

[HI54UNI]

My daughters Uncle just got the call to get tested for COVID-19. Appears he was in contact with a person that tested positive.

Speculation Minnesota is considering a Cali/NY lockdown soon.

So is that your brother or your wife's brother?

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

I'm stupid and stuff don't ask me how to manage life............. I'm sure Ibanez will comment a couple thousand times on how to do so.


P. S. All business could do this........ They choose not to
Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

So no bailouts for the airline industry, cruise industry, etc

Absolutely, none of them should get anything except what they earned. (Bankruptcy)

To big to fail is bullshit. If you make that kind of money and you fuck it up you deserve to fail.

Sent from my SM-G975F using Tapatalk

[Gil Dobie]

My daughters Uncle just got the call to get tested for COVID-19. Appears he was in contact with a person that tested positive.

Speculation Minnesota is considering a Cali/NY lockdown soon.

So is that your brother or your wife's brother?

Ex-wife's brother-in-law

[AZGrizFan]

So no bailouts for the airline industry, cruise industry, etc

Absolutely, none of them should get anything except what they earned. (Bankruptcy)

To big to fail is bullshit. If you make that kind of money and you fuck it up you deserve to fail.

Agreed.

[BDKJMU]

Deputies pull over stolen trailer full of toilet paper in Guildford Co.
https://www.wect.com/2020/03/20/deputie ... ldford-co/

[GannonFan]

Absolutely, none of them should get anything except what they earned. (Bankruptcy)

To big to fail is bullshit. If you make that kind of money and you fuck it up you deserve to fail.

Agreed.

I agree with that too, at least in these cases. Airlines will fail, they do it all the time. Others will rise in their place, they do all the time.

[BDKJMU]

Immunity to the virus is completely different from the disease’s mortality rate

King of All Blacks on the Howard Stern Show is claiming that blacks are immune.

Until I see proof that a negro has died of it, I believe him.

NBC News employee dies after testing positive for coronavirus

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/nb ... s-n1164696