Coronavirus COVID-19

[CAA Flagship]

To take Flaggy's side here, if this was all an attempt by Trump to boost the performance of one of his mutual funds, which he disclosed in federal forms that he does own (so it's been out in the public sphere since he filed that form), wouldn't this be a rotten way to do it? Before all of this, Sanofi was one of the leading producers of the drug. If it does happen that this drug is effective, now all of these other companies are jumping into the game (as the drug is a generic and not really a big money maker anyway as a result) and Sanofi's share of the market for this drug is going to plummet as a result. So in some respects, he'd be screwing his own mutual fund holdings as a result.

The lost point in all this is astounding...
a non-doctor pedestrian, as well as the office of the president (who also is NOT a doctor)
should not be giving sketchy medical advice - it increases hysteria and leads to sketchy conclusions and empowers other non-doctors

and secondly
the sad fact that it is also a part of his portfolio only strengthens point 1 above

and thirdly
why would anybody waster one breath defending this action - on any grounds and for any reason..?

Here's what we need to know:
Why has the FDA granted approval for compassionate use of the drug for COVID? This could be the REAL conspiracy.

If Trump forced the FDA to do it based on media reports, that's a problem. Did he do this in order to provide any "good" news he could muster?

If Trump is just expanding on the FDA's expert advice (compassionate use), then all he is doing is spreading hope to people. Should he give hope? For some it acts as a safety net, and for others it makes them buy more toilet paper and soup. Not sure if this is a major problem. Unless you hate Trump.

[Ibanez]

The lost point in all this is astounding...
a non-doctor pedestrian, as well as the office of the president (who also is NOT a doctor)
should not be giving sketchy medical advice - it increases hysteria and leads to sketchy conclusions and empowers other non-doctors

and secondly
the sad fact that it is also a part of his portfolio only strengthens point 1 above

and thirdly
why would anybody waster one breath defending this action - on any grounds and for any reason..?

Here's what we need to know:
Why has the FDA granted approval for compassionate use of the drug for COVID? This could be the REAL conspiracy.

If Trump forced the FDA to do it based on media reports, that's a problem. Did he do this in order to provide any "good" news he could muster?

If Trump is just expanding on the FDA's expert advice (compassionate use), then all he is doing is spreading hope to people. Should he give hope? For some it acts as a safety net, and for others it makes them buy more toilet paper and soup. Not sure if this is a major problem. Unless you hate Trump.

Giving hope is one thing.

Giving hope with an unproven drug that the experts say need more study is totally different. That's false hope.

[BDKJMU]

Link as to what medical experts have said "hydroxychloroquine isn't good for the treatment of this virus."

All I've seen is some have touted it's effect against the Chinese virus, and others (probably the majority) have exercised caution, said its anecdotal, and we need more study and proof.

Sorry. Unproven. It's effect is unproven. Unproven to be effective and everything at this point is purely anecdotal. A drug that has produced such severe side effects that it's administration has been discontinued. So yeah, let's push an unproven drug. That's sounds smart.

So Trump is ignoring the medical experts and is pushing an unproven drug, giving false hope to people and furthermore is peddling misinformation. That's a solid plan.

There's some pretty strong anecdotal evidence though- see French study and testimony of other docs who've administered it.

Wrong- it hasn't been discontinued. Heck, my GF's co-worker with lupus just got a prescription filled, which she apparently had to go to several pharmacies to accomplish, because a lot of pharmacies are out of it, because so many docs are prescribing it in use against the Chinese virus.

[CAA Flagship]

Here's what we need to know:
Why has the FDA granted approval for compassionate use of the drug for COVID? This could be the REAL conspiracy.

If Trump forced the FDA to do it based on media reports, that's a problem. Did he do this in order to provide any "good" news he could muster?

If Trump is just expanding on the FDA's expert advice (compassionate use), then all he is doing is spreading hope to people. Should he give hope? For some it acts as a safety net, and for others it makes them buy more toilet paper and soup. Not sure if this is a major problem. Unless you hate Trump.

Giving hope is one thing.

Giving hope with an unproven drug that the experts say need more study is totally different. That's false hope.

Sound bites are a bitch. I hear him say it might work, it might not.

[BDKJMU]

Giving hope is one thing.

Giving hope with an unproven drug that the experts say need more study is totally different. That's false hope.

Sound bites are a bitch. I hear him say it might work, it might not.

Heard him say that multiple times the last 3-4 press conferences in a row.

[Ibanez]

Sorry. Unproven. It's effect is unproven. Unproven to be effective and everything at this point is purely anecdotal. A drug that has produced such severe side effects that it's administration has been discontinued. So yeah, let's push an unproven drug. That's sounds smart.

So Trump is ignoring the medical experts and is pushing an unproven drug, giving false hope to people and furthermore is peddling misinformation. That's a solid plan.

There's some pretty strong anecdotal evidence though- see French study and testimony of other docs who've administered it.

Wrong- it hasn't been discontinued. Heck, my GF's co-worker with lupus just got a prescription filled, which she apparently had to go to several pharmacies to accomplish, because a lot of pharmacies are out of it, because so many docs are prescribing it in use against the Chinese virus.

BDK, try to stay on track. I said it's been discontinued as treatment for COVID in many places. I didn't say overall for the illness which we KNOW it actually treats.

Btw, is that the same French study that is criticized for being poorly conducted?

[Ivytalk]

There's some pretty strong anecdotal evidence though- see French study and testimony of other docs who've administered it.

Wrong- it hasn't been discontinued. Heck, my GF's co-worker with lupus just got a prescription filled, which she apparently had to go to several pharmacies to accomplish, because a lot of pharmacies are out of it, because so many docs are prescribing it in use against the Chinese virus.

is that the same French study that is criticized for being poorly conducted?

Is there any other kind of French study?

[GannonFan]

is that the same French study that is criticized for being poorly conducted?

Is there any other kind of French study?

Yup, ever since the Curie's poisoned themselves, it's been all downhill for the French on the scientific front.

[SDHornet]

Berenson is a former NYT reporter questioning what this model is spitting out. And engineers deal with plenty of non-linear models, not really sure where you were going with that one.

And I know at least two mechanics who grasp this better than both you and Berenson.

Engineers tend toward linear thinking which has some huge advantages...just not in this case.

[Ivytalk]

And I know at least two mechanics who grasp this better than both you and Berenson.

Engineers tend toward linear thinking which has some huge advantages...just not in this case.

The dark purple line really measures the effect of Grizza’s bikini thread posts.

[UNI88]

is that the same French study that is criticized for being poorly conducted?

Is there any other kind of French study?

[CAA Flagship]

[Gil Dobie]

The dark purple line really measures the effect of Grizza’s bikini thread posts.

Stay the fuck at home woodies

[kalm]

And I know at least two mechanics who grasp this better than both you and Berenson.

Engineers tend toward linear thinking which has some huge advantages...just not in this case.

Still not getting it I see.

[SDHornet]

Still not getting it I see.

That the model is over shooting real life numbers? Naw, I totally get it. The model is busted even after it is adjusted to include current deaths.



And 2 pages of mutual fund arguments and no pointers on what to invest in?

[kalm]

The lost point in all this is astounding...
a non-doctor pedestrian, as well as the office of the president (who also is NOT a doctor)
should not be giving sketchy medical advice - it increases hysteria and leads to sketchy conclusions and empowers other non-doctors

and secondly
the sad fact that it is also a part of his portfolio only strengthens point 1 above

and thirdly
why would anybody waster one breath defending this action - on any grounds and for any reason..?

Here's what we need to know:
Why has the FDA granted approval for compassionate use of the drug for COVID? This could be the REAL conspiracy.

If Trump forced the FDA to do it based on media reports, that's a problem. Did he do this in order to provide any "good" news he could muster?

If Trump is just expanding on the FDA's expert advice (compassionate use), then all he is doing is spreading hope to people. Should he give hope? For some it acts as a safety net, and for others it makes them buy more toilet paper and soup. Not sure if this is a major problem. Unless you hate Trump.

Yeah...when I think of an honest grasp of anything and the hope that goes along with it, I turn to stable geniuses....

Seriously just stop. The hole is deep enough.

[SDHornet]

It's not there anymore for the USA. They use to have it but took it down. Maybe those numbers aren't being reported?

What are you looking at? Did you open the link above? Are you looking at the list of countries?

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries
Serious cases listed in the "active cases" box. Not this is the "countries" page.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/
No serious cases listed, only total cases, deaths, and recovered. There used to be a "serious cases" count provided. This is on the USA page.

[kalm]

Still not getting it I see.

That the model is over shooting real life numbers? Naw, I totally get it. The model is busted even after it is adjusted to include current deaths.



And 2 pages of mutual fund arguments and no pointers on what to invest in?

Go back and read the posts related to predictive models that effect policy making, and the resulting shift in those models as results come in.

Jesus.

[SDHornet]

That the model is over shooting real life numbers? Naw, I totally get it. The model is busted even after it is adjusted to include current deaths.



And 2 pages of mutual fund arguments and no pointers on what to invest in?

Go back and read the posts related to predictive models that effect policy making, and the resulting shift in those models as results come in.

Jesus.

Huh? They literally update the model that doesn't match the deaths that are released THE SAME DAY as the update. You realize that makes no sense right?

[SDHornet]

I'll put it to you this way kalm. As an engineer, I've dealt with plenty of flow capacity models for sewer systems. If I presented a model that didn't use the current flows as a baseline and project out from there, I'd get laughed out of the room.

Now let's say I take that same flow model and revise it at a later date and didn't use newly obtained flow data to reset the baseline or adjust to include the actual data in its projections. How much confidence would you put in my flow model projection?

Get it now?

Oh and flow models aren't linear.

[kalm]

Go back and read the posts related to predictive models that effect policy making, and the resulting shift in those models as results come in.

Jesus.

Huh? They literally update the model that doesn't match the deaths that are released THE SAME DAY as the update. You realize that makes no sense right?

Link?

[CAA Flagship]

What are you looking at? Did you open the link above? Are you looking at the list of countries?

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries
Serious cases listed in the "active cases" box. Not this is the "countries" page.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/
No serious cases listed, only total cases, deaths, and recovered. There used to be a "serious cases" count provided. This is on the USA page.

Not sure what you mean by the first comment. Looks correct to me. I see 9150 serious cases for USA in the proper column

I don't recall serious cases listed by state before. Maybe it had it before, but I don't pay too much attention at the states except for deaths.

[Ibanez]

And I know at least two mechanics who grasp this better than both you and Berenson.

Engineers tend toward linear thinking which has some huge advantages...just not in this case.

Weren't the initial projections based on the peak data from China. It's since been updated with more information and data from around the world. I'd say it's becoming increasingly accurate as new information is reported and the sample size expands from China to the rest of the world minus Antarctica.

Sounds like the method behind this is seriously flawed.

Funded by the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation, the IHME model embraces an entirely different statistical approach, taking the trending curve of deaths from China, and “fitting” that curve to emerging death data from U.S. cities and counties to predict what might come next.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2 ... el-agrees/

[Ibanez]

is that the same French study that is criticized for being poorly conducted?

Is there any other kind of French study?

Touche

[Ibanez]

Still not getting it I see.

That the model is over shooting real life numbers? Naw, I totally get it. The model is busted even after it is adjusted to include current deaths.



And 2 pages of mutual fund arguments and no pointers on what to invest in?

1) It's a projection that over time is using increasingly more and more data. It started with the data of 1 country and now includes most others.
2) Waffles are recession proof.