VP debate 10/7 9 PM ECB.

[Ibanez]

Didn't watch any of it. Saw a CNN headline claiming it was a draw so I assume Pence won.

Oh and regarding the lack of an answer on packing the court, here you go:

Packing the court is just stupid. It kills me that politicians will lie, their opponents will run ads that lie and at the end nobody remembers the truth.

Case in point - last night I saw a series of Lindsey Graham and Jamie Harrison Ads. Lindsey runs ads that say Harrison supports defunding the police. Literally, the next ad is Jamie, with videos of himself saying he opposes defunding the police. Then another ad pointing out Lindsey on record lying and back tracking. It's mudslinging at this point.

[Pwns]

That's exactly why I can't get too worked up about Trump's promise to not be a sore loser if he loses.

If you're going to expand the court because you don't like who is on it, why even have a Supreme Court?

[AZGrizFan]

That's exactly why I can't get too worked up about Trump's promise to not be a sore loser if he loses.

If you're going to expand the court because you don't like who is on it, why even have a Supreme Court?

Dems epitomize sore losers.

Didn’t win the election? Solution: abolish the electoral college and spend 4 years attempting to impeach the president
Can’t get a SCJ nomination through? solution: pack the court as soon as they have control again
Criminals killed by cops? Solution: burn down and loot every major city in America

[catbooster]

That's exactly why I can't get too worked up about Trump's promise to not be a sore loser if he loses.

If you're going to expand the court because you don't like who is on it, why even have a Supreme Court?

Dems epitomize sore losers.

Didn’t win the election? Solution: abolish the electoral college and spend 4 years attempting to impeach the president
Can’t get a SCJ nomination through? solution: pack the court as soon as they have control again
Criminals killed by cops? Solution: burn down and loot every major city in America

See? You said it yourself - The Dem's are the party of solutions.

[houndawg]

IMO, the moderator's questioning was transparently biased. The issues she chose; even the phrasing of the questions, i.e., "Trump has said he will not voluntarily relinquish power. What will you do when he does that?" Seriously? This necessitated Pence to speak over his time limit, because he was trying to get some of his issues injected into the discussion.

But I think he ultimately won, because he managed to make the sound bite of the night Harris refusing to commit to not packing the Supreme Court. That issue alone is likely to keep the Senate red, as Middle Americans overwhelmingly fear what a Court, influenced by Democratic politics, would do to the First and Second Amendments. And they fear the Court will go back to the Roe standard on abortion rejected by Casey in 1992.

So Pence won this on that issue alone.

Not so sure - Pence spent a lot of time talking over Harris and ignoring the (female) moderator and every woman in the audience felt the sound bite moment was when Harris said "I'm speaking" as Pence talked over her. Pence's continual condescension and patronizing of the women will be felt on election day I think.

[BDKJMU]

IMO, the moderator's questioning was transparently biased. The issues she chose; even the phrasing of the questions, i.e., "Trump has said he will not voluntarily relinquish power. What will you do when he does that?" Seriously? This necessitated Pence to speak over his time limit, because he was trying to get some of his issues injected into the discussion.

But I think he ultimately won, because he managed to make the sound bite of the night Harris refusing to commit to not packing the Supreme Court. That issue alone is likely to keep the Senate red, as Middle Americans overwhelmingly fear what a Court, influenced by Democratic politics, would do to the First and Second Amendments. And they fear the Court will go back to the Roe standard on abortion rejected by Casey in 1992.

So Pence won this on that issue alone.

Not so sure - Pence spent a lot of time talking over Harris and ignoring the (female) moderator and every woman in the audience felt the sound bite moment was when Harris said "I'm speaking" as Pence talked over her. Pence's continual condescension and patronizing of the women will be felt on election day I think.

Wrong. It was Harris who was seen as more condescending with her eye rolls, smirks, funny faces, and condescending remarks like the ‘I‘m speakibg‘. There‘s a reason she got less than 1% of the vote during the donk primary.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video ... nding.html#!

[JohnStOnge]

The scientific polls indicate that more people who watched the debate perceived Harris as the winner than perceived Pence as the winner.

[SuperHornet]

This debate was MUCH more civilized, yet I was still disgusted with Harris. She interrupted Pence about as often as Trump interrupted Biden (though her "interruptions" amounted to not much more than condescending snickering. She came across as phony with her claims to "faith," particularly when she confirmed her commitment to infanticide. She wants nothing more than a Commie police state. And her refusal to answer a certain question was quite disconcerting.

Pence, too, was evasive. I wasn't thrilled with that, but he WAS quite a bit more forthcoming than any of the other three.

I was REALLY upset with that so-called "moderator." She was about as one-sided as it gets when it came to "enforcing the rules," cracking down on Pence a whole lot more than Harris, and allowing Harris extra time to do what she wanted.

I, too, was wondering what was up with that fly. Brazen dude, wasn't he?

[89Hen]

The scientific polls indicate that more people who watched the debate perceived Harris as the winner than perceived Pence as the winner.

according to a CNN Instant Poll of registered voters who watched. About 6 in 10 (59%) said Harris won, while 38% said Vice President Mike Pence had the better night.

Those results roughly matched voters' expectations heading into the debate. In interviews conducted before the debate, 61% of those same voters said they expected Harris to win, 36% thought Pence would.

By my scientific method, looks like Pence won. Harris lost 2% and Pence gained 2% with the SAME people. So yeah.

[kalm]

The scientific polls indicate that more people who watched the debate perceived Harris as the winner than perceived Pence as the winner.

according to a CNN Instant Poll of registered voters who watched. About 6 in 10 (59%) said Harris won, while 38% said Vice President Mike Pence had the better night.

Those results roughly matched voters' expectations heading into the debate. In interviews conducted before the debate, 61% of those same voters said they expected Harris to win, 36% thought Pence would.

By my scientific method, looks like Pence won. Harris lost 2% and Pence gained 2% with the SAME people. So yeah.

She just didn’t cover the spread.

[89Hen]

By my scientific method, looks like Pence won. Harris lost 2% and Pence gained 2% with the SAME people. So yeah.

She just didn’t cover the spread.

Clever, but not the same.

[JohnStOnge]

She just didn’t cover the spread.

Clever, but not the same.

I don't think who they thought was going to win tells you much. People have been expecting Harris to win a VP debate with Pence for a long time. I can remember that, when Biden was considering who to pick, there were reports that the Trump team was worried that if it was Harris she would beat Pence in the VP debate.

In the CNN poll, Independents thought Harris won by a 63% to 31% margin and moderates thought Harris won by a 68% to 28% margin.

There was a morning consult poll that was better for Pence. It had Pence winning among Independent respondents by 41% to 39%. But that's a "statistical tie." He lost among moderates by 52% to 34%. What's also interesting is that, in the Morning Consult poll, Harris inspired a lot more confidence among Democrats than Pence described among Republicans. Democrats thought Harris did better by 89% to 6%. Republicans thought Pence did better by 81% to 12%.

I think it is pretty clear that, in terms of perception, Harris won. You can argue that she shouldn't have and I wouldn't be able to disagree because I didn't watch it. But she won in terms of perception.

[JohnStOnge]

Just as an aside:

By the CNN poll, White college grads said Harris won by 64% to 32%. White people who did not graduate from college said Pence won by 52% to 44%.

Just one more thing to suggest that the "intelligence factor" is not working in favor of the Republicans. Look, I know that is insulting and I know that there are some very intelligent people who didn't graduate from college. Bill Gates doesn't have a college degree.

But we all know that if you took the average IQ of White college graduates and the average IQ of White people who have not graduated form college the average of the college graduates is going to be notably higher. It is what it is.

The Republican side is not the "smart" side right now. People who are more intelligent, on average, and more informed, on average, favor the Democrats.

Unfortunately, the Republican Party has become the Party of relatively ignorant White people. That's just the truth.

[89Hen]

Just as an aside:

By the CNN poll, White college grads said Harris won by 64% to 32%. White people who did not graduate from college said Pence won by 52% to 44%.

Just one more thing to suggest that the "intelligence factor" is not working in favor of the Republicans. Look, I know that is insulting and I know that there are some very intelligent people who didn't graduate from college. Bill Gates doesn't have a college degree.

But we all know that if you took the average IQ of White college graduates and the average IQ of White people who have not graduated form college the average of the college graduates is going to be notably higher. It is what it is.

The Republican side is not the "smart" side right now. People who are more intelligent, on average, and more informed, on average, favor the Democrats.

Unfortunately, the Republican Party has become the Party of relatively ignorant White people. That's just the truth.

We've been over this John. Degrees =/= intelligence. Some of the most educated people I've met are also the most dense people lacking common sense.

[89Hen]

I didn't watch it

Enough said.

[BDKJMU]

Just as an aside:

By the CNN poll, White college grads said Harris won by 64% to 32%. White people who did not graduate from college said Pence won by 52% to 44%.

Just one more thing to suggest that the "intelligence factor" is not working in favor of the Republicans. Look, I know that is insulting and I know that there are some very intelligent people who didn't graduate from college. Bill Gates doesn't have a college degree.

But we all know that if you took the average IQ of White college graduates and the average IQ of White people who have not graduated form college the average of the college graduates is going to be notably higher. It is what it is.

The Republican side is not the "smart" side right now. People who are more intelligent, on average, and more informed, on average, favor the Democrats.

Unfortunately, the Republican Party has become the Party of relatively ignorant White people. That's just the truth.

Which wasn’t a poll of likely voters.

[houndawg]

Not so sure - Pence spent a lot of time talking over Harris and ignoring the (female) moderator and every woman in the audience felt the sound bite moment was when Harris said "I'm speaking" as Pence talked over her. Pence's continual condescension and patronizing of the women will be felt on election day I think.

Wrong. It was Harris who was seen as more condescending with her eye rolls, smirks, funny faces, and condescending remarks like the ‘I‘m speakibg‘. There‘s a reason she got less than 1% of the vote during the donk primary.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video ... nding.html#!

by butthurt males - every woman in the nation related, negatively, to Pence's patronizing condescension.


Blue tsunami, bro.

[houndawg]

This debate was MUCH more civilized, yet I was still disgusted with Harris. She interrupted Pence about as often as Trump interrupted Biden (though her "interruptions" amounted to not much more than condescending snickering. She came across as phony with her claims to "faith," particularly when she confirmed her commitment to infanticide. She wants nothing more than a Commie police state. And her refusal to answer a certain question was quite disconcerting.

Pence, too, was evasive. I wasn't thrilled with that, but he WAS quite a bit more forthcoming than any of the other three.

I was REALLY upset with that so-called "moderator." She was about as one-sided as it gets when it came to "enforcing the rules," cracking down on Pence a whole lot more than Harris, and allowing Harris extra time to do what she wanted.

I, too, was wondering what was up with that fly. Brazen dude, wasn't he?

He found a stool he liked.

[DuckDuckGriz]

This debate was MUCH more civilized, yet I was still disgusted with Harris. She interrupted Pence about as often as Trump interrupted Biden (though her "interruptions" amounted to not much more than condescending snickering. She came across as phony with her claims to "faith," particularly when she confirmed her commitment to infanticide. She wants nothing more than a Commie police state. And her refusal to answer a certain question was quite disconcerting.

Pence, too, was evasive. I wasn't thrilled with that, but he WAS quite a bit more forthcoming than any of the other three.

I was REALLY upset with that so-called "moderator." She was about as one-sided as it gets when it came to "enforcing the rules," cracking down on Pence a whole lot more than Harris, and allowing Harris extra time to do what she wanted.

I, too, was wondering what was up with that fly. Brazen dude, wasn't he?

He found a stool he liked.

This is no time to be fecetious.

[JohnStOnge]

Just as an aside:

By the CNN poll, White college grads said Harris won by 64% to 32%. White people who did not graduate from college said Pence won by 52% to 44%.

Just one more thing to suggest that the "intelligence factor" is not working in favor of the Republicans. Look, I know that is insulting and I know that there are some very intelligent people who didn't graduate from college. Bill Gates doesn't have a college degree.

But we all know that if you took the average IQ of White college graduates and the average IQ of White people who have not graduated form college the average of the college graduates is going to be notably higher. It is what it is.

The Republican side is not the "smart" side right now. People who are more intelligent, on average, and more informed, on average, favor the Democrats.

Unfortunately, the Republican Party has become the Party of relatively ignorant White people. That's just the truth.

We've been over this John. Degrees =/= intelligence. Some of the most educated people I've met are also the most dense people lacking common sense.

Yes I know that is the populist schtick. But we all know that if you were to do any kind of test as to what is going on in the world the people with college degrees would score higher, on average, than the people without them would. There is no evidence, at all, that people without college degrees have more "common sense" (however that is defined) than people with college degrees do.

[89Hen]

Yes I know that is the populist schtick. But we all know that if you were to do any kind of test as to what is going on in the world the people with college degrees would score higher, on average, than the people without them would. There is no evidence, at all, that people without college degrees have more "common sense" (however that is defined) than people with college degrees do.

Depends on what you define as "what is going on". People with college degrees probably know that Iceland had big banking reform, but those same people think it would work in the US. So...

[89Hen]

by butthurt males - every woman in the nation related, negatively, to Pence's patronizing condescension.

Mrs 89 said she cannot vote for Biden because of that smarmy bitch Harris since she would end up POTUS pretty quickly. So you are incorrect. Not surprising.

[kalm]

by butthurt males - every woman in the nation related, negatively, to Pence's patronizing condescension.

Mrs 89 said she cannot vote for Biden because of that smarmy bitch Harris since she would end up POTUS pretty quickly. So you are incorrect. Not surprising.

This is THE reason Hillary lost.

Women in power have it tough from a personality standpoint, even with other women.

[GannonFan]

Mrs 89 said she cannot vote for Biden because of that smarmy bitch Harris since she would end up POTUS pretty quickly. So you are incorrect. Not surprising.

This is THE reason Hillary lost.

Women in power have it tough from a personality standpoint, even with other women.

Well, that and the tremendous rank corruption on her part. That wasn't really a positive for her.

[UNI88]

Mrs 89 said she cannot vote for Biden because of that smarmy bitch Harris since she would end up POTUS pretty quickly. So you are incorrect. Not surprising.

This is THE reason Hillary lost.

Women in power have it tough from a personality standpoint, even with other women.

I don't think I'm intimidated by strong, successful women but I think that in Hillary's case the highlighted term is accurate. I don't know if it is in Harris'. I don't care if she used sex to help get ahead. If she's a ho for sleeping her way up the ladder then what is Melania? You use the assets you have and are willing to use - hard work, brains, ideas, money, charisma, sex, etc.