Coronavirus COVID-19
- Winterborn
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
Or only follow the letter of the law.
I find it very funny that I am required to wear a "face covering" but what type "face covering" is not specified (here in ND it must consist of at least two layers but not what those layers are made of, they also allow gaiters (single layer)). ND gives some generic terms that it cannot be (visible holes, valved maskes, etc) but outside of that it is free reign.
“The best of all things is to learn. Money can be lost or stolen, health and strength may fail, but what you have committed to your mind is yours forever.” – Louis L’Amour
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"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
- 89Hen
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
FWIW, if you thought you were low risk and wearing a mask didn't protect you as much as claims, you would feel you were endangering yourself. I really doubt your concern for those choosing to not wear masks is genuine.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
- 89Hen
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
Ok but why would my concern for others not be genuine?
- GannonFan
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
All of these are things that were thought about when they (the experts) originally decided not to require masks. Sure, they were worried about supply to the front line health care workers, but they were also concerned about the ineffectiveness of masks in general against this type of airborne transmission, made even worse by the tremendous variation in mask type, manufacture, how well it fit to the face, the duration of its use, and ultimately the reliability of the person wearing the mask. To expect precision adherence regarding mask wearing (technique-wise and fit-wise) as well as to expect the masks themselves to be exceedingly technically capable was always a reach. They serve some purpose and are better than not having them, but are minimal at best in terms of being able to mitigate spread of the virus. There will always be surges in places where the virus exists regardless of mask usage. We need the vaccines.Winterborn wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:11 amDon't disagree on your point, but have you ever seen a time study done of the effectiveness of a mask during usage? Unless you are switching them out constantly, after a period of time they become like you were not even wearing one in the first place. After a few hours of use (and they get damp/dirty) and one should be switching them out.
Giving it a SWAG here that most people have gone through less than 20 of the disposable masks since this thing started and if they are wearing the homemade/non-n95/gaiters it has been probably washed a couple of times and the "effectiveness" is even less than it was before (which is nothing from a COVID transmissible standpoint).
A big clue to this is the rates when states/countries issue a mask mandate and what happens in the months to follow.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
Agree. My big pet-peve is when people tout the wearing of masks as a perfect measure to stop the spread.GannonFan wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:40 amAll of these are things that were thought about when they (the experts) originally decided not to require masks. Sure, they were worried about supply to the front line health care workers, but they were also concerned about the ineffectiveness of masks in general against this type of airborne transmission, made even worse by the tremendous variation in mask type, manufacture, how well it fit to the face, the duration of its use, and ultimately the reliability of the person wearing the mask. To expect precision adherence regarding mask wearing (technique-wise and fit-wise) as well as to expect the masks themselves to be exceedingly technically capable was always a reach. They serve some purpose and are better than not having them, but are minimal at best in terms of being able to mitigate spread of the virus. There will always be surges in places where the virus exists regardless of mask usage. We need the vaccines.Winterborn wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:11 am
Don't disagree on your point, but have you ever seen a time study done of the effectiveness of a mask during usage? Unless you are switching them out constantly, after a period of time they become like you were not even wearing one in the first place. After a few hours of use (and they get damp/dirty) and one should be switching them out.
Giving it a SWAG here that most people have gone through less than 20 of the disposable masks since this thing started and if they are wearing the homemade/non-n95/gaiters it has been probably washed a couple of times and the "effectiveness" is even less than it was before (which is nothing from a COVID transmissible standpoint).
A big clue to this is the rates when states/countries issue a mask mandate and what happens in the months to follow.
What it has done is get people to change their habits of going out and now they are staying home (having less interactions with others) due to either people not wanting to put one on or just the hassle of the whole experience. People are only doing the essentials and that is about it, which is what one wants if you are really trying to limit peoples interactions (and spreading).
Heard from a friend that the Health Care workers should be receiving a chance for the vaccine here in the next couple of weeks (some already have) at least here in ND. In about a month if projections hold ND will hit approximately a 50% immunity rate of our population and that is without the having the vaccine widely distributed.
“The best of all things is to learn. Money can be lost or stolen, health and strength may fail, but what you have committed to your mind is yours forever.” – Louis L’Amour
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
- Gil Dobie
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
I haven't really heard that people have said mask will stop the spread. As you know we need mask, distancing, washing etc, to slow the spread, keep the economy going and save as many lives as we can. Not much of that is going on from my point of view.Winterborn wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:40 amAgree. My big pet-peve is when people tout the wearing of masks as a perfect measure to stop the spread.GannonFan wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:40 am
All of these are things that were thought about when they (the experts) originally decided not to require masks. Sure, they were worried about supply to the front line health care workers, but they were also concerned about the ineffectiveness of masks in general against this type of airborne transmission, made even worse by the tremendous variation in mask type, manufacture, how well it fit to the face, the duration of its use, and ultimately the reliability of the person wearing the mask. To expect precision adherence regarding mask wearing (technique-wise and fit-wise) as well as to expect the masks themselves to be exceedingly technically capable was always a reach. They serve some purpose and are better than not having them, but are minimal at best in terms of being able to mitigate spread of the virus. There will always be surges in places where the virus exists regardless of mask usage. We need the vaccines.
What it has done is get people to change their habits of going out and now they are staying home (having less interactions with others) due to either people not wanting to put one on or just the hassle of the whole experience. People are only doing the essentials and that is about it, which is what one wants if you are really trying to limit peoples interactions (and spreading).
Heard from a friend that the Health Care workers should be receiving a chance for the vaccine here in the next couple of weeks (some already have) at least here in ND. In about a month if projections hold ND will hit approximately a 50% immunity rate of our population and that is without the having the vaccine widely distributed.
- GannonFan
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
Hard to make that call - heck, this could be what "slowing the spread" looks like. Maybe the move to being outside less that coincides with the change in seasons is what's driving this increase and it would be even worse if people weren't wearing masks, distancing, washing, etc. We want to blame all these nameless people for not wearing masks and disregarding theirs and other's safety and health (and in politics that means the left are blaming the Trumpers and the right are blaming the protestors and Biden victory celebrants) but the reality could also be that these measures may only be effective to a point. Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants. I'm just saying that from a perspective that compliance where I live appears on the surface to be pretty good, yet we're having pretty much the same level of surge that people in other areas are having.Gil Dobie wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:55 amI haven't really heard that people have said mask will stop the spread. As you know we need mask, distancing, washing etc, to slow the spread, keep the economy going and save as many lives as we can. Not much of that is going on from my point of view.Winterborn wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:40 am
Agree. My big pet-peve is when people tout the wearing of masks as a perfect measure to stop the spread.
What it has done is get people to change their habits of going out and now they are staying home (having less interactions with others) due to either people not wanting to put one on or just the hassle of the whole experience. People are only doing the essentials and that is about it, which is what one wants if you are really trying to limit peoples interactions (and spreading).
Heard from a friend that the Health Care workers should be receiving a chance for the vaccine here in the next couple of weeks (some already have) at least here in ND. In about a month if projections hold ND will hit approximately a 50% immunity rate of our population and that is without the having the vaccine widely distributed.
Last edited by GannonFan on Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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- Winterborn
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
In a couple of years looking back at this, my feeling is that the data will bear this out. It already shows signs that this is the case but it is a bit early to say for certain.GannonFan wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:07 amHard to make that call - heck, this could be what "slowing the spread" looks like. Maybe the move to being outside less that coincides with the change in seasons is what's driving this increase and it would be even worse if people weren't wearing masks, distancing, washing, etc. We want to blame all these nameless people for not wearing masks and disregarding theirs and other's safety and health (and in politics that means the left are blaming the Trumpers and the right are blaming the protestors and Biden victory celebrants) but the reality could also be that these measures may only be effective to a point. Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants.
“The best of all things is to learn. Money can be lost or stolen, health and strength may fail, but what you have committed to your mind is yours forever.” – Louis L’Amour
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
- SDHornet
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
This happened as many counties in CA revamped to the most strict tier due to case counts.
- Gil Dobie
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
I think that's what I said, they are only effective to a point. I've seen Trumpers and Biden supports not following the protocol. I'll trust what my Doctor tells me over what the politicians or social media experts say.GannonFan wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:07 amHard to make that call - heck, this could be what "slowing the spread" looks like. Maybe the move to being outside less that coincides with the change in seasons is what's driving this increase and it would be even worse if people weren't wearing masks, distancing, washing, etc. We want to blame all these nameless people for not wearing masks and disregarding theirs and other's safety and health (and in politics that means the left are blaming the Trumpers and the right are blaming the protestors and Biden victory celebrants) but the reality could also be that these measures may only be effective to a point. Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants.
Last edited by Gil Dobie on Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
Agreed. It'll likely bear out that anything less than an N95 rated mask is useless. My favorite analogy when people harp on masks is that they are like using a chain link fence to catch a mosquito.Winterborn wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:13 amIn a couple of years looking back at this, my feeling is that the data will bear this out. It already shows signs that this is the case but it is a bit early to say for certain.GannonFan wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:07 am
Hard to make that call - heck, this could be what "slowing the spread" looks like. Maybe the move to being outside less that coincides with the change in seasons is what's driving this increase and it would be even worse if people weren't wearing masks, distancing, washing, etc. We want to blame all these nameless people for not wearing masks and disregarding theirs and other's safety and health (and in politics that means the left are blaming the Trumpers and the right are blaming the protestors and Biden victory celebrants) but the reality could also be that these measures may only be effective to a point. Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
From the Mayo ClinicSDHornet wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:20 amAgreed. It'll likely bear out that anything less than an N95 rated mask is useless. My favorite analogy when people harp on masks is that they are like using a chain link fence to catch a mosquito.Winterborn wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:13 am
In a couple of years looking back at this, my feeling is that the data will bear this out. It already shows signs that this is the case but it is a bit early to say for certain.
How do the different types of masks work?
Surgical masks
Also called a medical mask, a surgical mask is a loose-fitting disposable mask that protects the wearer's nose and mouth from contact with droplets, splashes and sprays that may contain germs. A surgical mask also filters out large particles in the air. Surgical masks may protect others by reducing exposure to the saliva and respiratory secretions of the mask wearer.
At this time, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration has not approved any type of surgical mask specifically for protection against the coronavirus, but these masks may provide some protection when N95 masks are not available.
N95 masks
Actually a type of respirator, an N95 mask offers more protection than a surgical mask does because it can filter out both large and small particles when the wearer inhales. As the name indicates, the mask is designed to block 95% of very small particles. Some N95 masks have valves that make them easier to breathe through. With this type of mask, unfiltered air is released when the wearer exhales.
Health care providers must be trained and pass a fit test to confirm a proper seal before using an N95 respirator in the workplace. Like surgical masks, N95 masks are intended to be disposable. However, researchers are testing ways to disinfect N95 masks so they can be reused.
Some N95 masks, and even some cloth masks, have one-way valves that make them easier to breathe through. But because the valve releases unfiltered air when the wearer breathes out, this type of mask doesn't prevent the wearer from spreading the virus. For this reason, some places have banned them.
Cloth masks
A cloth mask is intended to trap droplets that are released when the wearer talks, coughs or sneezes. Asking everyone to wear cloth masks can help reduce the spread of the virus by people who have COVID-19 but don't realize it.
Cloth face coverings are most likely to reduce the spread of the COVID-19 virus when they are widely used by people in public settings. And countries that required face masks, testing, isolation and social distancing early in the pandemic have successfully slowed the spread of the virus.
While surgical and N95 masks may be in short supply and should be reserved for health care providers, cloth face coverings and masks are easy to find or make, and can be washed and reused.
Masks can be made from common materials, such as sheets made of tightly woven cotton. Instructions are easy to find online. Cloth masks should include multiple layers of fabric. The CDC website even includes directions for no-sew masks made from bandannas and T-shirts.
- BDKJMU
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
The Mich gov's husband, VA Gov Blackface, Pelosi & her hair salon, Newsom, the list goes on an on..
Good enough for thee, but not for me.
..peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard..
JMU Football: 2022 & 2023 Sun Belt East Champions...But you have to go home now. We have to have peace…
..I know how you feel, but go home, and go home in peace.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
You can’t pity someone for their actions? I was brought up to think you should.
- 89Hen
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
Agreed with “to a point” or are they useless? What science are you basing this off of?SDHornet wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:20 amAgreed. It'll likely bear out that anything less than an N95 rated mask is useless. My favorite analogy when people harp on masks is that they are like using a chain link fence to catch a mosquito.Winterborn wrote: ↑Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:13 am
In a couple of years looking back at this, my feeling is that the data will bear this out. It already shows signs that this is the case but it is a bit early to say for certain.
I like the analogy of two guys pissing while wearing pants and not wearing pants.
(No homo)
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
- GannonFan
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
The analogy is probably too kind towards masks. Maybe with pants with a bunch of holes in the pants?
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- Gil Dobie
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
- GannonFan
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
Hence why they're not terribly effective. Heck, think of all the people who pull their masks off to sneeze and there goes the main function of the mask, and it wasn't even that effective of a function to begin with. Vaccine can't come soon enough.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19
Restaurants and Bars that have closed in my county since Covid shutdowns started....
Addie’s (Park Potomac)
Addis Ababa (Silver Spring)
Aroma (Montgomery Mall)
Bagel City (Rockville)
Beefsteak (Montgomery Mall)
Breadsmith (Potomac)
Buena Vida (Silver Spring)
Cafe Deluxe (Bethesda)
Chuck E. Cheese (Gaithersburg)
Chuy’s (Rockville)
Cici’s Pizza (Rockville)
Da Marco The Italian Place (Germantown)
Diya Bistro (Kentlands)
Dokiya Ramen (Rockville)
Dolcezza (Bethesda, announced closure)
Eggpectation (Silver Spring)
Ejji Ramen (Montgomery Mall)
Flower Child (Rockville)
George’s Chophouse (Bethesda)
Green Turtle (Germantown)
Gumbo Ya Ya (Rockville)
Gusto (Bethesda)
Gusto (Montgomery Mall, listed as temporary)
Harp & Fiddle (Bethesda)
Honeyfish (Rockville)
Jaleo (Bethesda, will become Spanish Diner under same ownership)
JennyCakes Bakery (Kensington)
Jimmy John’s (Germantown)
Jimmy John’s (Silver Spring)
Jumbo Jumbo (Rockville)
Khyber Kitchen (Silver Spring)
La Madeleine (Bethesda)
La Tasca (Rockville)
Le Pain Quotidien (Potomac)
Le Vieux Logis (Bethesda)
Little Beet Table (Chevy Chase, listed as temporary)
Lucy’s (Bethesda)
Minerva Express (Gaithersburg, not the full-service Minerva)
Mirch Masala (Montgomery Mall)
Mistik Taverna (Germantown)
Nantucket’s Reef (Rockville, listed as closed by Yelp)
Nava Thai (Wheaton, listed as temporary)
Nestle Toll House (Kentlands)
Nestle Toll House (Wheaton Mall)
Not Your Average Joe’s (Silver Spring)
P.F. Chang’s (Chevy Chase)
Panera (Rockville Town Center, listed as temporary)
Panera (Wheaton Mall)
PassionFish (Bethesda)
Peet’s Coffee (Bethesda)
Poke Papa (Bethesda)
Prima (Bethesda)
Roti (Chevy Chase, listed as temporary)
Roti (Pike & Rose, listed as temporary)
Ruby Tuesday (Lakeforest)
Sergio Ristorante (Silver Spring)
Spice 6 (Montgomery Mall)
Subway (Rockville Federal Plaza)
Starbucks (Rio)
Subway (Rockville Federal Plaza)
Sweetly Anchored (Potomac)
Taste of New Orleans- Seneca Smokehouse (Darnestown)
Thai Pavilion (Rockville Town Square)
The Grille (Flower Hill)
Tortacos (Gaithersburg)
Union Jack’s (Gaithersburg)
Urban BBQ (Rockville- Chapman location)
Urban Butcher (Silver Spring, listed as temporary)
Watershed Cafe (Poolesville)
Wine Harvest (Park Potomac)
Ziki Japanese Steakhouse (Gaithersburg, listed as temporary)
Addie’s (Park Potomac)
Addis Ababa (Silver Spring)
Aroma (Montgomery Mall)
Bagel City (Rockville)
Beefsteak (Montgomery Mall)
Breadsmith (Potomac)
Buena Vida (Silver Spring)
Cafe Deluxe (Bethesda)
Chuck E. Cheese (Gaithersburg)
Chuy’s (Rockville)
Cici’s Pizza (Rockville)
Da Marco The Italian Place (Germantown)
Diya Bistro (Kentlands)
Dokiya Ramen (Rockville)
Dolcezza (Bethesda, announced closure)
Eggpectation (Silver Spring)
Ejji Ramen (Montgomery Mall)
Flower Child (Rockville)
George’s Chophouse (Bethesda)
Green Turtle (Germantown)
Gumbo Ya Ya (Rockville)
Gusto (Bethesda)
Gusto (Montgomery Mall, listed as temporary)
Harp & Fiddle (Bethesda)
Honeyfish (Rockville)
Jaleo (Bethesda, will become Spanish Diner under same ownership)
JennyCakes Bakery (Kensington)
Jimmy John’s (Germantown)
Jimmy John’s (Silver Spring)
Jumbo Jumbo (Rockville)
Khyber Kitchen (Silver Spring)
La Madeleine (Bethesda)
La Tasca (Rockville)
Le Pain Quotidien (Potomac)
Le Vieux Logis (Bethesda)
Little Beet Table (Chevy Chase, listed as temporary)
Lucy’s (Bethesda)
Minerva Express (Gaithersburg, not the full-service Minerva)
Mirch Masala (Montgomery Mall)
Mistik Taverna (Germantown)
Nantucket’s Reef (Rockville, listed as closed by Yelp)
Nava Thai (Wheaton, listed as temporary)
Nestle Toll House (Kentlands)
Nestle Toll House (Wheaton Mall)
Not Your Average Joe’s (Silver Spring)
P.F. Chang’s (Chevy Chase)
Panera (Rockville Town Center, listed as temporary)
Panera (Wheaton Mall)
PassionFish (Bethesda)
Peet’s Coffee (Bethesda)
Poke Papa (Bethesda)
Prima (Bethesda)
Roti (Chevy Chase, listed as temporary)
Roti (Pike & Rose, listed as temporary)
Ruby Tuesday (Lakeforest)
Sergio Ristorante (Silver Spring)
Spice 6 (Montgomery Mall)
Subway (Rockville Federal Plaza)
Starbucks (Rio)
Subway (Rockville Federal Plaza)
Sweetly Anchored (Potomac)
Taste of New Orleans- Seneca Smokehouse (Darnestown)
Thai Pavilion (Rockville Town Square)
The Grille (Flower Hill)
Tortacos (Gaithersburg)
Union Jack’s (Gaithersburg)
Urban BBQ (Rockville- Chapman location)
Urban Butcher (Silver Spring, listed as temporary)
Watershed Cafe (Poolesville)
Wine Harvest (Park Potomac)
Ziki Japanese Steakhouse (Gaithersburg, listed as temporary)