Coronavirus COVID-19

[AshevilleApp]

Is that since the first onset of Covid or since the variant?

Total, but they'll never come close to catching up.

Okay. Are Texas and Florida being hit hard right now? That might explain the news focus. I'm paying more attention to how things are going locally, so haven't tried to keep up nationally.

[Gil Dobie]

Many of you are too young to remember Polio victims. A lot few deaths than covid, but similar survival data.

Like a horror movie, throughout the first half of the 20th century, the polio virus arrived each summer, striking without warning. No one knew how polio was transmitted or what caused it. There were wild theories that the virus spread from imported bananas or stray cats. There was no known cure or vaccine.

For the next four decades, swimming pools and movie theaters closed during polio season for fear of this invisible enemy. Parents stopped sending their children to playgrounds or birthday parties for fear they would “catch polio.”

In the outbreak of 1916, health workers in New York City would physically remove children from their homes or playgrounds if they suspected they might be infected. Kids, who seemed to be targeted by the disease, were taken from their families and isolated in sanitariums.

In 1952, the number of polio cases in the U.S. peaked at 57,879, resulting in 3,145 deaths. Those who survived this highly infectious disease could end up with some form of paralysis, forcing them to use crutches, wheelchairs or to be put into an iron lung, a large tank respirator that would pull air in and out of the lungs, allowing them to breathe.

Ultimately, poliomyelitis was conquered in 1955 by a vaccine developed by Jonas Salk and his team at the University of Pittsburgh.

[89Hen]

Total, but they'll never come close to catching up.

Okay. Are Texas and Florida being hit hard right now? That might explain the news focus. I'm paying more attention to how things are going locally, so haven't tried to keep up nationally.

New York had 12,000 new deaths reported.

[89Hen]

Many of you are too young to remember Polio victims....

In the outbreak of 1916

JFC, how old are you Gil???

[UNI88]

I don't care what the DNC thinks. I will never agree to vaccine mandates for everyone. But I have no problem with places like schools and hospitals and public transportation and international travel and restaurants and gyms and other locations requiring vaccinations to use those facilities. You make a choice if you want to use those places or if you want to stay unvaccinated. Your call.

And just because you have a magical 8 year window before you deem a vaccination to be safe doesn't mean that others have to abide by your 8 year window. We didn't do that before with other vaccines so I don't see why this one needs such special protection.

If a private business wants to mandate proof of vaccine or negative test for their customers that is their right.. But govt has no business telling private businesses like restaurants, bars, gyms, private schools, pro sports teams, etc, that they have to mandate it for their customers.

Pro sports teams using private facilities? No. Sports arenas owned by a public entity/authority? Different story.

[Gil Dobie]

Total, but they'll never come close to catching up.

Okay. Are Texas and Florida being hit hard right now? That might explain the news focus. I'm paying more attention to how things are going locally, so haven't tried to keep up nationally.

Florida deaths per million is going up faster than most states right now. California isn't in the top 25, actually #36.

[BDKJMU]

Rushed to market doesn't mean that a safety check or something critical was missed or ignored. Coronaviruses aren't new the development of vaccines against them were already underway. Furthermore, the massive investment helped get things done quickly. It's also important to point out that the mRNA vaccines are traditionally quicker to develop.

One of the main reasons why it takes long for vaccines to become improved has more to do with funding. The usual 3 trials are done one at a time, each time trying to acquire more funding for the next round. Those delays between trials can be years due to funding The actual science of vaccine development, while important to the vaccine timeline, isn't the main driver of the schedule.

Plenty of money, international support and critical need along with the science which was already there, is the short and simple reason as to why the vaccine was quick to market.

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articl ... onaviruses

That's a good article outlining how the vaccine came to be available so quickly.

TL/DR - the research, science and development along with investment already existed.

Then why the liability removal? Why the dual approach now that Pfizer has been “approved”?

That right there is a very good question.

[UNI88]

Many of you are too young to remember Polio victims....

In the outbreak of 1916

JFC, how old are you Gil???

I don't think he's as old as JFC ...

[Gil Dobie]

Many of you are too young to remember Polio victims....

In the outbreak of 1916

JFC, how old are you Gil???

Child of the 50's. 2 men on my block were polio victims, one in a wheelchair, the other with a leg brace.

[UNI88]

Total, but they'll never come close to catching up.

Okay. Are Texas and Florida being hit hard right now? That might explain the news focus. I'm paying more attention to how things are going locally, so haven't tried to keep up nationally.

Understanding current trends is important to knowing what is and isn't working. If Florida is blowing up relative to other states, that can and should impact a DeSantis' president campaign.

[BDKJMU]

What do the studies show of people 2,3, 5 years after taking the vaccine? 2,3,5 years and more after taking the booster shot?

They’re still alive?

People were getting the Covid vax 2,3,5 years ago?

[SeattleGriz]

Why is the news on Covid all about Texas and Florida?

Deaths per million of population
1 New Jersey
2 New York
3 Mississippi
4 Louisiana
5 Massachusetts
6 Rhode Island
7 Arizona
8 Alabama
9 Connecticut
10 South Dakota
11 Arkansas
12 Pennsylvania
13 Michigan
14 New Mexico
15 Indiana
16 Georgia
17 Illinois
18 Nevada
19 North Dakota
20 South Carolina
21 Florida
22 Iowa
23 Oklahoma
24 Tennessee
25 Texas

Because those Governor's didn't win an Emmy.

[Gil Dobie]

What do the studies show of people 2,3, 5 years after taking the vaccine? 2,3,5 years and more after taking the booster shot?

They’re still alive?

Serious side effects that could cause a long-term health problem are extremely unlikely following any vaccination, including COVID-19 vaccination. Vaccine monitoring has historically shown that side effects generally happen within six weeks of receiving a vaccine dose.

[Gil Dobie]

I don't know. But to say it was rushed just because it came to market in less than 1 year is ignoring some pretty important facts about the vaccine development process.


Why is approved in ""? Do you doubt it received approval this week? I'm not sure i'm following your implication.

You don’t know why Pfizer and the others were granted a release from any liability? Can you think for a minute or two and maybe come up with a reason or two?

And I say “approved” because the “approved” vaccine is IDENTICAL to the “unapproved” vaccine, yet THE LIABILITY WAIVER REMAINS IN PLACE FOR THOSE WHO GOT THE UNAPPROVED VACCINE.

Explain THAT to me, Myron…..

From Myron......

According to 42 U.S. Code § 300aa–22, "No vaccine manufacturer shall be liable in a civil action for damages arising from a vaccine-related injury or death associated with the administration of a vaccine after October 1, 1988, if the injury or death resulted from side effects that were unavoidable even though the vaccine was properly prepared and was accompanied by proper directions and warnings."

[kalm]

They’re still alive?

People were getting the Covid vax 2,3,5 years ago?

Well you asked what the studies show…

[AshevilleApp]

Okay. Are Texas and Florida being hit hard right now? That might explain the news focus. I'm paying more attention to how things are going locally, so haven't tried to keep up nationally.

Understanding current trends is important to knowing what is and isn't working. If Florida is blowing up relative to other states, that can and should impact a DeSantis' president campaign.

Why do you think I asked if Texas and Florida are being hit hard now?

[AshevilleApp]

Okay. Are Texas and Florida being hit hard right now? That might explain the news focus. I'm paying more attention to how things are going locally, so haven't tried to keep up nationally.

New York had 12,000 new deaths reported.

Where would they rank on the chart if the delta variant was isolated?

[GannonFan]

I don't care what the DNC thinks. I will never agree to vaccine mandates for everyone. But I have no problem with places like schools and hospitals and public transportation and international travel and restaurants and gyms and other locations requiring vaccinations to use those facilities. You make a choice if you want to use those places or if you want to stay unvaccinated. Your call.

And just because you have a magical 8 year window before you deem a vaccination to be safe doesn't mean that others have to abide by your 8 year window. We didn't do that before with other vaccines so I don't see why this one needs such special protection.

If a private business wants to mandate proof of vaccine or negative test for their customers that is their right.. But govt has no business telling private businesses like restaurants, bars, gyms, private schools, pro sports teams, etc, that they have to mandate it for their customers.

I don't disagree with that - govt can dictate a mandate in the public settings (i.e. airports, govt buildings, schools, etc) and I'm fine with businesses making that call on their own.

[UNI88]

Understanding current trends is important to knowing what is and isn't working. If Florida is blowing up relative to other states, that can and should impact a DeSantis' president campaign.

Why do you think I asked if Texas and Florida are being hit hard now?

That post was meant to support your point.

[kalm]

Doctors are losing compassion for the unvaxxed.

“Outside his hospital door, I took a deep breath — battening down my anger and frustration — and went in. I had been working the COVID-19 units for 17 months straight, all day, every day. I had cared for hundreds of COVID patients. We all had, without being able to take breaks long enough to help us recover from this unending ordeal. Compassion fatigue was setting in. For those of us who hadn’t left after the hardest year of our professional lives, even hope was now in short supply.

Shouting through my N95 mask and the noise of the HEPA filter, I introduced myself. I calmly asked him why he decided not to get vaccinated.

“Well, I’m not an anti-vaxxer or anything. I was just waiting for the FDA to approve the vaccine first. I didn’t want to take anything experimental. I didn’t want to be the government’s guinea pig, and I don’t trust that it’s safe,” he said.

“Well,” I said, “I can pretty much guarantee we would have never met had you gotten vaccinated, because you would have never been hospitalized. All of our COVID units are full and every single patient in them is unvaccinated. Numbers don’t lie. The vaccines work.”

This was a common excuse people gave for not getting vaccinated, fearing the vaccine because the Food and Drug Administration had granted it only emergency use authorization so far, not permanent approval. Yet the treatments he had turned to — antibiotics, monoclonal antibodies and hydroxychloroquine — were considered experimental, with mixed evidence to support their use.

The only proven lifesaver we’ve had in this pandemic is a vaccine that many people don’t want. A vaccine we give away to other countries because supply overwhelms demand in the U.S. A vaccine people in other countries stand in line for hours to receive, if they can get it at all.

“Well,” I said, “I am going to treat you with remdesivir, which only recently received FDA approval.” I explained that it had been under an EUA for most of last year and had not been studied or administered as widely as COVID-19 vaccines. That more than 353 million doses of COVID-19 vaccine had been administered in the U.S. along with more than 4.7 billion doses worldwide without any overwhelming, catastrophic side effects. “Not nearly as many doses of remdesivir have been given or studied in people and its long-term side effects are still unknown,” I said. “Do you still want me to give it to you?”

“Yes” he responded, “Whatever it takes to save my life.”

It did not work.“

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2 ... octor-shot

[AZGrizFan]

Doctors are losing compassion for the unvaxxed.

“Outside his hospital door, I took a deep breath — battening down my anger and frustration — and went in. I had been working the COVID-19 units for 17 months straight, all day, every day. I had cared for hundreds of COVID patients. We all had, without being able to take breaks long enough to help us recover from this unending ordeal. Compassion fatigue was setting in. For those of us who hadn’t left after the hardest year of our professional lives, even hope was now in short supply.

Shouting through my N95 mask and the noise of the HEPA filter, I introduced myself. I calmly asked him why he decided not to get vaccinated.

“Well, I’m not an anti-vaxxer or anything. I was just waiting for the FDA to approve the vaccine first. I didn’t want to take anything experimental. I didn’t want to be the government’s guinea pig, and I don’t trust that it’s safe,” he said.

“Well,” I said, “I can pretty much guarantee we would have never met had you gotten vaccinated, because you would have never been hospitalized. All of our COVID units are full and every single patient in them is unvaccinated. Numbers don’t lie. The vaccines work.”

This was a common excuse people gave for not getting vaccinated, fearing the vaccine because the Food and Drug Administration had granted it only emergency use authorization so far, not permanent approval. Yet the treatments he had turned to — antibiotics, monoclonal antibodies and hydroxychloroquine — were considered experimental, with mixed evidence to support their use.

The only proven lifesaver we’ve had in this pandemic is a vaccine that many people don’t want. A vaccine we give away to other countries because supply overwhelms demand in the U.S. A vaccine people in other countries stand in line for hours to receive, if they can get it at all.

“Well,” I said, “I am going to treat you with remdesivir, which only recently received FDA approval.” I explained that it had been under an EUA for most of last year and had not been studied or administered as widely as COVID-19 vaccines. That more than 353 million doses of COVID-19 vaccine had been administered in the U.S. along with more than 4.7 billion doses worldwide without any overwhelming, catastrophic side effects. “Not nearly as many doses of remdesivir have been given or studied in people and its long-term side effects are still unknown,” I said. “Do you still want me to give it to you?”

“Yes” he responded, “Whatever it takes to save my life.”

It did not work.“

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2 ... octor-shot

So? I notice the article doesn’t talk about this one’s comorbidities….

[JohnStOnge]

Why is the news on Covid all about Texas and Florida?

Deaths per million of population
1 New Jersey
2 New York
3 Mississippi
4 Louisiana
5 Massachusetts
6 Rhode Island
7 Arizona
8 Alabama
9 Connecticut
10 South Dakota
11 Arkansas
12 Pennsylvania
13 Michigan
14 New Mexico
15 Indiana
16 Georgia
17 Illinois
18 Nevada
19 North Dakota
20 South Carolina
21 Florida
22 Iowa
23 Oklahoma
24 Tennessee
25 Texas

Because those Governor's didn't win an Emmy.

A number of the States near the top of the list got hit before the country really had come to grips with what was going on. They got hit first. Like New York. Yes. Things were very bad there in the beginning. But now things are much worse in Florida and Texas. As of now, if you use the Worldometers site, you calculate that during August to date there have been 22 COVID-19 deaths per million population in New York vs. 87 in Texas and a whopping 166 in Florida.

And it's happening in the context of a situation in which the Governors of Texas and Florida are obviously acting like complete idiots. Texas and Florida don't have the legitimate "excuse" of having been blindsided like New York was. Texas and Florida just have an obvious "Party of Stupid" problem.

[SeattleGriz]

Because those Governor's didn't win an Emmy.

A number of the States near the top of the list got hit before the country really had come to grips with what was going on. They got hit first. Like New York. Yes. Things were very bad there in the beginning. But now things are much worse in Florida and Texas. As of now, if you use the Worldometers site, you calculate that during August to date there have been 22 COVID-19 deaths per million population in New York vs. 87 in Texas and a whopping 166 in Florida.

And it's happening in the context of a situation in which the Governor's of Texas and Florida are obviously acting like complete idiots. Texas and Florida don't have the legitimate "excuse" of having been blindsided like New York was. Texas and Florida just have an obvious "Party of Stupid" problem.

I believe this is their seasonal surge...and Delta. Both had spikes starting in June last year as well.

[SDHornet]

Agreed we're not a police state. But your mentality of keeping those that aren't vaxxed out of public places will certainly lead to one if the DNC had their way. Of course you'd have no problem with it as you previously stated.

And more conflation with existing vaccination which is a different situation that the novel coronavirus we've been dealing with for the past 18 months.

I don't care what the DNC thinks. I will never agree to vaccine mandates for everyone. But I have no problem with places like schools and hospitals and public transportation and international travel and restaurants and gyms and other locations requiring vaccinations to use those facilities. You make a choice if you want to use those places or if you want to stay unvaccinated. Your call.

And just because you have a magical 8 year window before you deem a vaccination to be safe doesn't mean that others have to abide by your 8 year window. We didn't do that before with other vaccines so I don't see why this one needs such special protection.

So basically you want society to function like Australia's currently is. Can't do nothing without a vax....so basically a police state.

And the 8 years is my window for my kid given the current "safe for 12 and older" bullshit. I couldn't give a fuck what others want to do with their kids.

[SDHornet]

Rushed to market doesn't mean that a safety check or something critical was missed or ignored. Coronaviruses aren't new the development of vaccines against them were already underway. Furthermore, the massive investment helped get things done quickly. It's also important to point out that the mRNA vaccines are traditionally quicker to develop.

One of the main reasons why it takes long for vaccines to become improved has more to do with funding. The usual 3 trials are done one at a time, each time trying to acquire more funding for the next round. Those delays between trials can be years due to funding The actual science of vaccine development, while important to the vaccine timeline, isn't the main driver of the schedule.

Plenty of money, international support and critical need along with the science which was already there, is the short and simple reason as to why the vaccine was quick to market.

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articl ... onaviruses

That's a good article outlining how the vaccine came to be available so quickly.

TL/DR - the research, science and development along with investment already existed.

Then why the liability removal? Why the dual approach now that Pfizer has been “approved”?

Saw that this "approval" was just an extension of their emergency use status. Not sure if true.

And yes, good point on the liability removal.