Well, I doubt kalmie read the whole post, he's gotten less thorough in his quest for partisan non-partisan standing. The mental gymnastics he puts himself through everyday must be exhausting.
Trump can and should be dragged through the courts for criminal and civil culpability. Having a partisan Congressional committee do this does nothing to hold him accountable (Congress can't punish him anyway, only ultimately passing it on to the courts) and sets up the stage for similar partisan pursuits by future Congresses. I don't care if the GOP only offered up the most incendiary members to be on this committee - the majority party dictating who is or who isn't acceptable from the minority party is not how they've functioned before and itself sets a bad precedent for how things get handled in the future. You lost any chance to have this be a non-partisan committee when that happened and it actually gave cover to the worst elements of the GOP rather than letting them embarrass themselves out in the open. Remember, it was the Dems who pushed the button on the nuclear option for going to simple majorities for approval of judges, and that of course opened the door for the same thing to happen with SCOTUS judges. Every time we justify unprecedented departures from past norms in government processes because we say we can't proceed as normal because the other side is evil we get further and further away from the ability to truly solve problems and issues in the bi-partisan way that big picture issues have to be solved. Congress hasn't worked well for a good decade now, if not longer than that. This isn't the way to fix it.
Jan 6th didn’t just involve Trump and his crime family. It involved past and current employees of the DOJ, DOD, USSS, congressional members, staffers, it’s clearly within the purview of a congressional investigation to bring everything and everyone to the light. Voters can purse the information presented as they wish. Perhaps you think voters aren’t responsible or informed enough to draw their own conclusions? Weird.
Sunlight disinfectant. I’m sorry it makes you uncomfortable and the timing isn’t right.
The sunlight is already there, it has been from the start. What have we learned that we didn't already know? And what sunlight are we getting know from a partisan committee clouding up the investigation (weather analogies are awesome). Trump is just as guilty now of what he did and didn't do around Jan 6th and that was without the committee having to do anything. We had a chance to have a thorough bipartisan Congressional committee review and produce a report that would've documented this for the ages. If the GOP wanted to embarrass themselves with putting political hacks on the committee so be it, all the better to have the GOP's own buffoonery on display. Now we've gotten a partisan review that has only hardened the divisions and has been more about impacting midterm elections than doing anything of note about Jan 6th. I'm sorry that makes you uncomfortable.
Jan 6th didn’t just involve Trump and his crime family. It involved past and current employees of the DOJ, DOD, USSS, congressional members, staffers, it’s clearly within the purview of a congressional investigation to bring everything and everyone to the light. Voters can purse the information presented as they wish. Perhaps you think voters aren’t responsible or informed enough to draw their own conclusions? Weird.
Sunlight disinfectant. I’m sorry it makes you uncomfortable and the timing isn’t right.
The sunlight is already there, it has been from the start. What have we learned that we didn't already know? And what sunlight are we getting know from a partisan committee clouding up the investigation (weather analogies are awesome). Trump is just as guilty now of what he did and didn't do around Jan 6th and that was without the committee having to do anything. We had a chance to have a thorough bipartisan Congressional committee review and produce a report that would've documented this for the ages. If the GOP wanted to embarrass themselves with putting political hacks on the committee so be it, all the better to have the GOP's own buffoonery on display. Now we've gotten a partisan review that has only hardened the divisions and has been more about impacting midterm elections than doing anything of note about Jan 6th. I'm sorry that makes you uncomfortable.
BDKJMU wrote: ↑Thu Oct 13, 2022 9:04 pmBasically (assuming there aren’t many who view both favorably) 80+% of the country view either Trump or Biden favorably
Interesting way of looking at things. Without putting any effort into it, I would have spitball that number to be about 40% combined. 20% favoring Trump, 20% favoring Biden, with the rest of the country not liking either of them.
BDKJMU wrote: ↑Thu Oct 13, 2022 9:04 pmBasically (assuming there aren’t many who view both favorably) 80+% of the country view either Trump or Biden favorably
Interesting way of looking at things. Without putting any effort into it, I would have spitball that number to be about 40% combined. 20% favoring Trump, 20% favoring Biden, with the rest of the country not liking either of them.
GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 14, 2022 7:27 am
Well, I doubt kalmie read the whole post, he's gotten less thorough in his quest for partisan non-partisan standing. The mental gymnastics he puts himself through everyday must be exhausting.
Trump can and should be dragged through the courts for criminal and civil culpability. Having a partisan Congressional committee do this does nothing to hold him accountable (Congress can't punish him anyway, only ultimately passing it on to the courts) and sets up the stage for similar partisan pursuits by future Congresses. I don't care if the GOP only offered up the most incendiary members to be on this committee - the majority party dictating who is or who isn't acceptable from the minority party is not how they've functioned before and itself sets a bad precedent for how things get handled in the future. You lost any chance to have this be a non-partisan committee when that happened and it actually gave cover to the worst elements of the GOP rather than letting them embarrass themselves out in the open. Remember, it was the Dems who pushed the button on the nuclear option for going to simple majorities for approval of judges, and that of course opened the door for the same thing to happen with SCOTUS judges. Every time we justify unprecedented departures from past norms in government processes because we say we can't proceed as normal because the other side is evil we get further and further away from the ability to truly solve problems and issues in the bi-partisan way that big picture issues have to be solved. Congress hasn't worked well for a good decade now, if not longer than that. This isn't the way to fix it.
Jan 6th didn’t just involve Trump and his crime family. It involved past and current employees of the DOJ, DOD, USSS, congressional members, staffers, it’s clearly within the purview of a congressional investigation to bring everything and everyone to the light. Voters can purse the information presented as they wish. Perhaps you think voters aren’t responsible or informed enough to draw their own conclusions? Weird.
Sunlight disinfectant. I’m sorry it makes you uncomfortable and the timing isn’t right.
Why now? Issuing the subpoena 3 weeks before the mid-term election was not a coincidence. They could have issued this subpoena a year ago.
Still more concerned about the actions of a handful of Secret Service agents on January 6 rather than the coordinated, top-down actions of the DoJ and FBI during the Russian collusion and following investigations into trump? Government employees and agencies attempting to subvert an election is ok as long as trump is the target?
Being wrong about a topic is called post partisanism - kalm
MAQA - putting the Q into qrazy qanon qonspiracy theories since 2015.
kalm wrote: ↑Fri Oct 14, 2022 10:14 am
Let’s start a list of things Ganny knew on Jan. 7th 2021:
For weeks people talked about the violence that was likely to happen on Jan 6th. None of this was secret, we knew Trump was pointing to that date and was inciting people to act. We know that because almost every stupid thing he did (which were a lot) he tweeted about or talked incessantly about. Lucky for us, only a relatively small crowd (relative in the scope of what a true coup would require) materialized and we have all of that covered by video and can track down everyone, which we're doing. We may not be as lucky in future real coups, but this mob was poorly organized, lightly armed, and more a result of a petulant man-child lashing out rather than a real attack on the Republic's integrity. But again, we knew this was coming (at least the violence), we talked about it in the leadup to Jan 6th, and by the end of the day on Jan 6th we generally knew what happened.
BDKJMU wrote: ↑Thu Oct 13, 2022 9:04 pmBasically (assuming there aren’t many who view both favorably) 80+% of the country view either Trump or Biden favorably
Interesting way of looking at things. Without putting any effort into it, I would have spitball that number to be about 40% combined. 20% favoring Trump, 20% favoring Biden, with the rest of the country not liking either of them.
I would say that each side has a 20% that think favor Biden or trump as the lesser evil. AZ doesn't like trump and wishes he would go away views him favorably and would likely vote for him if the other choice was Biden. The interesting part of that is that the 20% who favor trump like that tend to be more moderate Republicans while the 20% who favor Biden like that tend to be more extremist Democrats.
Being wrong about a topic is called post partisanism - kalm
MAQA - putting the Q into qrazy qanon qonspiracy theories since 2015.
kalm wrote: ↑Fri Oct 14, 2022 10:14 am
Let’s start a list of things Ganny knew on Jan. 7th 2021:
For weeks people talked about the violence that was likely to happen on Jan 6th. None of this was secret, we knew Trump was pointing to that date and was inciting people to act. We know that because almost every stupid thing he did (which were a lot) he tweeted about or talked incessantly about. Lucky for us, only a relatively small crowd (relative in the scope of what a true coup would require) materialized and we have all of that covered by video and can track down everyone, which we're doing. We may not be as lucky in future real coups, but this mob was poorly organized, lightly armed, and more a result of a petulant man-child lashing out rather than a real attack on the Republic's integrity. But again, we knew this was coming (at least the violence), we talked about it in the leadup to Jan 6th, and by the end of the day on Jan 6th we generally knew what happened.
....you're starting to believe your own bullshit
The only thing lightly armed was the cops - contrast them with the reception committee waiting at the same location when the left was expected.
You matter. Unless you multiply yourself by c squared. Then you energy.
"I really love America. I just don't know how to get there anymore."John Prine
Interesting way of looking at things. Without putting any effort into it, I would have spitball that number to be about 40% combined. 20% favoring Trump, 20% favoring Biden, with the rest of the country not liking either of them.
I would say that each side has a 20% that think favor Biden or trump as the lesser evil. AZ doesn't like trump and wishes he would go away views him favorably and would likely vote for him if the other choice was Biden. The interesting part of that is that the 20% who favor trump like that tend to be more moderate Republicans while the 20% who favor Biden like that tend to be more extremist Democrats.
they're only "extremists" because the corporate wing of the Democrats has moved right.
You matter. Unless you multiply yourself by c squared. Then you energy.
"I really love America. I just don't know how to get there anymore."John Prine
UNI88 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 14, 2022 12:15 pm
I would say that each side has a 20% that think favor Biden or trump as the lesser evil. AZ doesn't like trump and wishes he would go away views him favorably and would likely vote for him if the other choice was Biden. The interesting part of that is that the 20% who favor trump like that tend to be more moderate Republicans while the 20% who favor Biden like that tend to be more extremist Democrats.
they're only "extremists" because the corporate wing of the Democrats has moved right.
Biden is representative of the corporate wing of the Democratic Party. Compare his positions now to 20 years ago and show me how he (and they) has moved right.
Being wrong about a topic is called post partisanism - kalm
MAQA - putting the Q into qrazy qanon qonspiracy theories since 2015.
kalm wrote: ↑Fri Oct 14, 2022 10:14 am
Let’s start a list of things Ganny knew on Jan. 7th 2021:
For weeks people talked about the violence that was likely to happen on Jan 6th. None of this was secret, we knew Trump was pointing to that date and was inciting people to act. We know that because almost every stupid thing he did (which were a lot) he tweeted about or talked incessantly about. Lucky for us, only a relatively small crowd (relative in the scope of what a true coup would require) materialized and we have all of that covered by video and can track down everyone, which we're doing. We may not be as lucky in future real coups, but this mob was poorly organized, lightly armed, and more a result of a petulantu man-child lashing out rather than a real attack on the Republic's integrity. But again, we knew this was coming (at least the violence), we talked about it in the leadup to Jan 6th, and by the end of the day on Jan 6th we generally knew what happened.
Interesting way of looking at things. Without putting any effort into it, I would have spitball that number to be about 40% combined. 20% favoring Trump, 20% favoring Biden, with the rest of the country not liking either of them.
I would say that each side has a 20% that think favor Biden or trump as the lesser evil. AZ doesn't like trump and wishes he would go away views him favorably and would likely vote for him if the other choice was Biden. The interesting part of that is that the 20% who favor trump like that tend to be more moderate Republicans while the 20% who favor Biden like that tend to be more extremist Democrats.
That jives with my observations are as well. That split is going to have an interesting affect on both parties (some of which we are seeing play out right now).
“The best of all things is to learn. Money can be lost or stolen, health and strength may fail, but what you have committed to your mind is yours forever.” – Louis L’Amour
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
No. Did you read what Ganny posted? He explicitly stated "If Trump deserves a criminal charge and conviction for what he did, charge him in the courts and let the legal system work this."
The Jan 6 Committee isn't about justice, prosecution of illegal behavior or even finding the truth. It's political theater and they've intentionally dragged it out to increase its impact on midterm election. Subpoenaing a former POTUS is crossing the Rubicon and could have a more detrimental effect on our republic than anything trump did. As Ganny also stated "Long term, this actually damages the Republic the legislators are so eager to drape themselves in."
The House will subpoena Biden in 2023 or another Democrat POTUS further in the future and Democrats will only have themselves to blame for setting the precedent. Subpoenaing a POTUS, getting rid of the filibuster, packing the court, etc. might sound good when you're in charge of White House and Congress but they set precedents with long-term consequences.
What is good for the goose is good for the gander.
D's party platform tends to be about more short term policy, where the R's tend to be long term, at least it has been historically. The short term thinking (i.e. Harry Reid getting rid of the 60 vote rule on Judaical nominations) tends to come back and bite them.
“The best of all things is to learn. Money can be lost or stolen, health and strength may fail, but what you have committed to your mind is yours forever.” – Louis L’Amour
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
Going the civil route shows how weak a case Letitia James has and it is a gamble that may not pay off. Also it is interesting that if it does pay off, what it will do to real estate development in NY.
Making risky bets is what happens when one bases their decisions on emotion and tries to justify them after the fact.
“The best of all things is to learn. Money can be lost or stolen, health and strength may fail, but what you have committed to your mind is yours forever.” – Louis L’Amour
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
Going the civil route shows how weak a case Letitia James has and it is a gamble that may not pay off. Also it is interesting that if it does pay off, what it will do to real estate development in NY.
Making risky bets is what happens when one bases their decisions on emotion and tries to justify them after the fact.
It's not a riskt bet and the decision wasn't made based on emotion.
Well, I believe that I must tell the truth
And say things as they really are
But if I told the truth and nothing but the truth
Could I ever be a star? Deep Purple: No One Came
No. Did you read what Ganny posted? He explicitly stated "If Trump deserves a criminal charge and conviction for what he did, charge him in the courts and let the legal system work this."
The Jan 6 Committee isn't about justice, prosecution of illegal behavior or even finding the truth. It's political theater and they've intentionally dragged it out to increase its impact on midterm election. Subpoenaing a former POTUS is crossing the Rubicon and could have a more detrimental effect on our republic than anything trump did. As Ganny also stated "Long term, this actually damages the Republic the legislators are so eager to drape themselves in."
The House will subpoena Biden in 2023 or another Democrat POTUS further in the future and Democrats will only have themselves to blame for setting the precedent. Subpoenaing a POTUS, getting rid of the filibuster, packing the court, etc. might sound good when you're in charge of White House and Congress but they set precedents with long-term consequences.
What is good for the goose is good for the gander.
D's party platform tends to be about more short term policy, where the R's tend to be long term, at least it has been historically. The short term thinking (i.e. Harry Reid getting rid of the 60 vote rule on Judaical nominations) tends to come back and bite them.
You matter. Unless you multiply yourself by c squared. Then you energy.
"I really love America. I just don't know how to get there anymore."John Prine
Going the civil route shows how weak a case Letitia James has and it is a gamble that may not pay off. Also it is interesting that if it does pay off, what it will do to real estate development in NY.
Making risky bets is what happens when one bases their decisions on emotion and tries to justify them after the fact.
Exhibit A: "..just say the election was corrupt and leave the rest to me and the Republican congressmen..."
At this rate Winterbortion will blow right past Xi Jin Ping and go straight to shilling Kim Jon Un next.
You matter. Unless you multiply yourself by c squared. Then you energy.
"I really love America. I just don't know how to get there anymore."John Prine
Going the civil route shows how weak a case Letitia James has and it is a gamble that may not pay off. Also it is interesting that if it does pay off, what it will do to real estate development in NY.
Making risky bets is what happens when one bases their decisions on emotion and tries to justify them after the fact.
So we should base criminal law on how it potentially affects real estate markets?
A revealing, behind-the-scenes examination of how Congress twice fumbled its best chance to hold accountable a president many considered one of the most dangerous in American history. The definitive—and only—insider account of both Trump impeachments, as told by the two reporters on the front lines covering them for The Washington Post and Politico.
Being wrong about a topic is called post partisanism - kalm
MAQA - putting the Q into qrazy qanon qonspiracy theories since 2015.
Going the civil route shows how weak a case Letitia James has and it is a gamble that may not pay off. Also it is interesting that if it does pay off, what it will do to real estate development in NY.
Making risky bets is what happens when one bases their decisions on emotion and tries to justify them after the fact.
It's not a riskt bet and the decision wasn't made based on emotion.
In my limited understand of the law that is being referred to it is (I just like to read), but I will let the experts handle that and we will see what actually sticks in the end.
As for emotion, I am guessing you did not watch her campaign speeches or read comments on Trump. Then it again, even if you did, it wouldn't make much difference in your opinion.
“The best of all things is to learn. Money can be lost or stolen, health and strength may fail, but what you have committed to your mind is yours forever.” – Louis L’Amour
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf
"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
