United Healthcare CEO Shooter

[Bobcat]

Yes, the left threw him away, because hes not insane enough for them. Oh and I am sure RFK Jrs a Russian asset too. Everyone is

So RFK, you, and CH are pro socialized health insurance?

That’s cool.

Oh no I am not.

I am for everyone buying their own health care. Government cant do anything right and shouldn't be allowed anywhere near something like this

People that want it for free, need to move somewhere that better aligns with their communism.

[Caribbean Hen]

Yes, the left threw him away, because hes not insane enough for them. Oh and I am sure RFK Jrs a Russian asset too. Everyone is

So RFK, you, and CH are pro socialized health insurance?

That’s cool.

Nope

You’ve been on X way to long and the real world is passing you

Take a look at our porky youth, riddled with diabetes and other health ailments way to young

Dems wanted no part of anything to address it and why is that?

[Caribbean Hen]

So you’re one of the perps fanboys…. Not surprised

Why are they denying claims? I bet you think your strangling government and Obumba care has nothing to do with it …

These CEOs should be more open about what goes on behind the scenes

They make a profit by denying claims. It’s literally cooked into their strategy.

Every strangling government in the developed world provides health coverage. The strangling governments do it for at least half of what it costs us. Sometimes more. With better health outcomes. Seriously, these facts have been around for a long time. How are you not aware of this?

Obama care was a Republican plan created by Heritage. Remember them? The Lroject /0/5 folks? Of course you don’t.

For God’s sake, please read up on things. At least a little. From better sources. There are tons out there.

Name the foreign countries you’ve received medical care in

[UNI88]

You're right, one cold blooded killing doesn't compare to an angry mob being sent to the Capital to attempt to stop the Constitutional transfer of power and do bodily harm, even kill the Vice President, Speaker of the House, etc.

The riot may have been foolish and poorly planned but incompetence and stupidity don't change the clear intent and the multiple deaths that were a result.

Americans are so tired of that lying narrative

Point out the lies.

A trump supporter does not have the high ground when it comes to complaining about a lying narrative. You've either chosen or been duped into believing some lies and not others.

[kalm]

They make a profit by denying claims. It’s literally cooked into their strategy.

Every strangling government in the developed world provides health coverage. The strangling governments do it for at least half of what it costs us. Sometimes more. With better health outcomes. Seriously, these facts have been around for a long time. How are you not aware of this?

Obama care was a Republican plan created by Heritage. Remember them? The Lroject /0/5 folks? Of course you don’t.

For God’s sake, please read up on things. At least a little. From better sources. There are tons out there.

Name the foreign countries you’ve received medical care in

Those are well know statistics. There are data analytics companies that, you know, are able to track these things.

[kalm]

So RFK, you, and CH are pro socialized health insurance?

That’s cool.

Nope

You’ve been on X way to long and the real world is passing you

Take a look at our porky youth, riddled with diabetes and other health ailments way to young

Dems wanted no part of anything to address it and why is that?

Democratic politicians? Not enough because they are literally paid to not address it. Same as Republicans.

[Bobcat]

The whole Jan6th thing is made up bullshit. Anyone with a brain knows it was done by Pelosi to try and make Trump look bad. Just like the Steele dossier, EVERY SINGLE RUSSIAN agent bullshit lie.

All of it is dismissed by normal Americans because they know the media is lying about Trump everyday all day for the last 9 years.

Trying to pin other peoples behavior on Trump is beyond comprehendible.

[BDKJMU]

So you’re one of the perps fanboys…. Not surprised

Why are they denying claims? I bet you think your strangling government and Obumba care has nothing to do with it …

These CEOs should be more open about what goes on behind the scenes

They make a profit by denying claims. It’s literally cooked into their strategy.

Every strangling government in the developed world provides health coverage. The strangling governments do it for at least half of what it costs us. Sometimes more. With better health outcomes. Seriously, these facts have been around for a long time. How are you not aware of this?

Obama care was a Republican plan created by Heritage. Remember them? The Lroject /0/5 folks? Of course you don’t.

For God’s sake, please read up on things. At least a little. From better sources. There are tons out there.

Now do it adjusted for race. Because these developed countries you want to compare us to (ie Western Europeam and Asian (white adjacent according to the left) have lower minority (black and brown) populations. Guess what- just like in the US, those Western European countries have racial disparities in health outcomes also.

Secondly, America is fat as fuck (all races, but even higher among minorities). I have traveled all over Europe (about 15 countries, Western Europe all but Sweden, Norway, Finland, and have seen with my own eyes we have WAY more obese people than those folks. For a multitude of reasons- sedentary jobs and lifestyles, poor diet, lack of exercise, or simply laziness, we are a FAT nation. You could have the social utopian dream health care system, and as long as America is full of fat bodies, we are going to have worse outcomes.

In way I hope we do get the Medicaid/Medicare for all. Then when the inevitable rationing comes about with longer wait times and lower levels of care (because the best docs will go private care) the wealthy and upper middle class will pay for private care, and we will have exposes and caterwauling from the left on the unfairness of the US health care system how the masses face longer wait times and lower levels of care and outcomes compared to those who can afford private care.

[UNI88]

The whole Jan6th thing is made up bullshit. Anyone with a brain knows it was done by Pelosi to try and make Trump look bad. Just like the Steele dossier, EVERY SINGLE RUSSIAN agent bullshit lie.

All of it is dismissed by normal Americans because they know the media is lying about Trump everyday all day for the last 9 years.

Trying to pin other peoples behavior on Trump is beyond comprehendible.

January 6 was an cold-blooded attempt by trump to have mike pence and nancy pelosi assassinated.

And everyone knows that the whole July 13 thing is made up bullshit.Anyone with a brain knows it was a false flag operation done by trump to make him seem sympathetic and distract attention from his crimes.


MAQA yahoos aren't the only ones who can pull whackadoodle bullshit conspiracy theories out of their assholes.

[Caribbean Hen]

So you’re one of the perps fanboys…. Not surprised

Why are they denying claims? I bet you think your strangling government and Obumba care has nothing to do with it …

These CEOs should be more open about what goes on behind the scenes

They make a profit by denying claims. It’s literally cooked into their strategy.

Every strangling government in the developed world provides health coverage. The strangling governments do it for at least half of what it costs us. Sometimes more. With better health outcomes. Seriously, these facts have been around for a long time. How are you not aware of this?

Obama care was a Republican plan created by Heritage. Remember them? The Lroject /0/5 folks? Of course you don’t.

For God’s sake, please read up on things. At least a little. From better sources. There are tons out there.

You don’t say… if they didn’t profit you realize they would go out of business…. If that happened you wouldn’t have any health care

[kalm]

They make a profit by denying claims. It’s literally cooked into their strategy.

Every strangling government in the developed world provides health coverage. The strangling governments do it for at least half of what it costs us. Sometimes more. With better health outcomes. Seriously, these facts have been around for a long time. How are you not aware of this?

Obama care was a Republican plan created by Heritage. Remember them? The Lroject /0/5 folks? Of course you don’t.

For God’s sake, please read up on things. At least a little. From better sources. There are tons out there.

You don’t say… if they didn’t profit you realize they would go out of business…. If that happened you wouldn’t have any health care

Insurance works by simply spreading the risk pool. It doesn’t have to be for profit to accomplish this. And there’s also the well reported efforts by insurers to increase denials via things like AI and creating a nightmare of hoops to jump through and labyrinthine customer service departments to even get care or have an appeal heard.

EG: I had to go through a year of nerve studies, pain management clinics, PT, 3 denials for referral from my PCP and two sports medicine docs before they finally approved a referral for an MRI from a surgeon that showed my shoulder and arm pain was not bursitis but 3 herniated disks in my neck.

[clenz]

You don’t say… if they didn’t profit you realize they would go out of business…. If that happened you wouldn’t have any health care

Insurance works by simply spreading the risk pool. It doesn’t have to be for profit to accomplish this. And there’s also the well reported efforts by insurers to increase denials via things like AI and creating a nightmare of hoops to jump through and labyrinthine customer service departments to even get care or have an appeal heard.

EG: I had to go through a year of nerve studies, pain management clinics, PT, 3 denials for referral from my PCP and two sports medicine docs before they finally approved a referral for an MRI from a surgeon that showed my shoulder and arm pain was not bursitis but 3 herniated disks in my neck.

My favorite was 4 months ago when my insurance decided to start denying my insulin because they deemed it was no longer medically necessary because I had my A1C at 6.3. I mean, my A1C was 6.3 because my dead pancreas started working again, and not because the insulin was working/saving my life. Right? Right?

That's what I was told. My endo, PCP, and I spent countless hours on the phone, sending letters, records, etc. trying to figure out how they just decided to stop covering my insulin.

After about 2-3 weeks they changed their reason for denial to "Treatment considered too invasive/advanced. Must try lesser treatments first to determine their efficacy."

Thankfully my endo office were real ones and during one of my visits trying to figure things out went "I'm just going to leave these 3 boxes of fast-acting insulin and 3 boxes of long-acting insulin on this desk. I will forget I put them there once I walk out of this door. So if they aren't there when I come back I won't even know they aren't there. If they are there I'll think I must have forgotten to put them away".

Turns out insurance companies figured out it's more profitable not to cover insulin, have a Type 1 decline in overall health for a few months, end up in DKA, spend a week in the hospital in kidney/liver failure and die than it is to keep them on insulin and alive/healthier for years more.


I sure would hate some CEO to not get their pay bumped from 42.5 million to 43 million because their profits were just a little bit less due to people actually getting covered.


End of story kicker - finally got my insulin reapproved but they denied the needles that connect to the pens. So I had my insulin, just no way to get it in me. Thankfully those are cheap enough and can be grabbed basically anywhere but I couldn't help but laugh at that one.

[kalm]

Insurance works by simply spreading the risk pool. It doesn’t have to be for profit to accomplish this. And there’s also the well reported efforts by insurers to increase denials via things like AI and creating a nightmare of hoops to jump through and labyrinthine customer service departments to even get care or have an appeal heard.

EG: I had to go through a year of nerve studies, pain management clinics, PT, 3 denials for referral from my PCP and two sports medicine docs before they finally approved a referral for an MRI from a surgeon that showed my shoulder and arm pain was not bursitis but 3 herniated disks in my neck.

My favorite was 4 months ago when my insurance decided to start denying my insulin because they deemed it was no longer medically necessary because I had my A1C at 6.3. I mean, my A1C was 6.3 because my dead pancreas started working again, and not because the insulin was working/saving my life. Right? Right?

That's what I was told. My endo, PCP, and I spent countless hours on the phone, sending letters, records, etc. trying to figure out how they just decided to stop covering my insulin.

After about 2-3 weeks they changed their reason for denial to "Treatment considered too invasive/advanced. Must try lesser treatments first to determine their efficacy."

Thankfully my endo office were real ones and during one of my visits trying to figure things out went "I'm just going to leave these 3 boxes of fast-acting insulin and 3 boxes of long-acting insulin on this desk. I will forget I put them there once I walk out of this door. So if they aren't there when I come back I won't even know they aren't there. If they are there I'll think I must have forgotten to put them away".

Turns out insurance companies figured out it's more profitable not to cover insulin, have a Type 1 decline in overall health for a few months, end up in DKA, spend a week in the hospital in kidney/liver failure and die than it is to keep them on insulin and alive/healthier for years more.


I sure would hate some CEO to not get their pay bumped from 42.5 million to 43 million because their profits were just a little bit less due to people actually getting covered.


End of story kicker - finally got my insulin reapproved but they denied the needs that connect to the pens. So I had my insulin, just no way to get it in me. Thankfully those are cheap enough and can be grabbed basically anywhere but I couldn't help but laugh at that one.

Sadly, a way more common story than the media or those who haven’t gone through it yet realize.

Motherfucking leeches.

Glad you’re finding the work arounds and that some pancreatic function has come back, brother. It’s amazing how related the pancreas, liver, kidneys, and gall bladder are so related, ain’t it?

[Caribbean Hen]

Insurance works by simply spreading the risk pool. It doesn’t have to be for profit to accomplish this. And there’s also the well reported efforts by insurers to increase denials via things like AI and creating a nightmare of hoops to jump through and labyrinthine customer service departments to even get care or have an appeal heard.

EG: I had to go through a year of nerve studies, pain management clinics, PT, 3 denials for referral from my PCP and two sports medicine docs before they finally approved a referral for an MRI from a surgeon that showed my shoulder and arm pain was not bursitis but 3 herniated disks in my neck.

My favorite was 4 months ago when my insurance decided to start denying my insulin because they deemed it was no longer medically necessary because I had my A1C at 6.3. I mean, my A1C was 6.3 because my dead pancreas started working again, and not because the insulin was working/saving my life. Right? Right?

That's what I was told. My endo, PCP, and I spent countless hours on the phone, sending letters, records, etc. trying to figure out how they just decided to stop covering my insulin.

After about 2-3 weeks they changed their reason for denial to "Treatment considered too invasive/advanced. Must try lesser treatments first to determine their efficacy."

Thankfully my endo office were real ones and during one of my visits trying to figure things out went "I'm just going to leave these 3 boxes of fast-acting insulin and 3 boxes of long-acting insulin on this desk. I will forget I put them there once I walk out of this door. So if they aren't there when I come back I won't even know they aren't there. If they are there I'll think I must have forgotten to put them away".

Turns out insurance companies figured out it's more profitable not to cover insulin, have a Type 1 decline in overall health for a few months, end up in DKA, spend a week in the hospital in kidney/liver failure and die than it is to keep them on insulin and alive/healthier for years more.


I sure would hate some CEO to not get their pay bumped from 42.5 million to 43 million because their profits were just a little bit less due to people actually getting covered.


End of story kicker - finally got my insulin reapproved but they denied the needs that connect to the pens. So I had my insulin, just no way to get it in me. Thankfully those are cheap enough and can be grabbed basically anywhere but I couldn't help but laugh at that one.

Part of the strategy and not only with healthcare is, drown them in red tape and bureaucracy because they know many will just give up and go away...

[clenz]

My favorite was 4 months ago when my insurance decided to start denying my insulin because they deemed it was no longer medically necessary because I had my A1C at 6.3. I mean, my A1C was 6.3 because my dead pancreas started working again, and not because the insulin was working/saving my life. Right? Right?

That's what I was told. My endo, PCP, and I spent countless hours on the phone, sending letters, records, etc. trying to figure out how they just decided to stop covering my insulin.

After about 2-3 weeks they changed their reason for denial to "Treatment considered too invasive/advanced. Must try lesser treatments first to determine their efficacy."

Thankfully my endo office were real ones and during one of my visits trying to figure things out went "I'm just going to leave these 3 boxes of fast-acting insulin and 3 boxes of long-acting insulin on this desk. I will forget I put them there once I walk out of this door. So if they aren't there when I come back I won't even know they aren't there. If they are there I'll think I must have forgotten to put them away".

Turns out insurance companies figured out it's more profitable not to cover insulin, have a Type 1 decline in overall health for a few months, end up in DKA, spend a week in the hospital in kidney/liver failure and die than it is to keep them on insulin and alive/healthier for years more.


I sure would hate some CEO to not get their pay bumped from 42.5 million to 43 million because their profits were just a little bit less due to people actually getting covered.


End of story kicker - finally got my insulin reapproved but they denied the needs that connect to the pens. So I had my insulin, just no way to get it in me. Thankfully those are cheap enough and can be grabbed basically anywhere but I couldn't help but laugh at that one.

Part of the strategy and not only with healthcare is, drown them in red tape and bureaucracy because they know many will just give up and go away...

Yeah - the red tape and hoping people just stop fighting is a massive part of it

It's why UHC denies a third of all claims. They know the majority of those people will never fight it so they don't have to pay for anything. Of those that do fight it they can/will approve a very small number of them. I'm not claiming the government doesn't have any part in that but it's the fucking insurance companies doing it. It's them lobbying the government to make it harder to get coverage. It's them lobbying the government to make sure they can keep cutting benefits and raising costs. They spend hundreds of millions of dollars a year lobbying the government to make sure they can do what they want instead of using that money to pay claims for live-saving operations, medications, devices, etc. Those things don't have an ROI. The money spent lobbying the government does.

Same reason - different topic but same reason - that the republicans are now trying to kill the free IRS tax filling option. They are getting hundreds of millions from Intuit and TurboTax and H&R Block, etc. to make it so you can't file for free. To make the tax code even more complicated. That way you have to spend hundreds, or thousands, of dollars to file through them.

My father was diagnosed with Stage 4 Mantle Cell non-Hodgkin Lymphoma a few years back. The 2 year survival rate when he was diagnosed was something like 15% and the 5 year rate was like 3%. They were denied all treatment options because they were deemed "not medically necessary tof him to continue to live.". Sure, he would have continued to live for another year or two without treatment so they are right. However, for him to live past that mark, and have any sort of QOL treatment is 100% needed. However, their actuaries and formulas decided the cost to cover his treatments wasn't worth the cost, thus it wasn't needed for him.

Thankfully he got on a trial through Mayo and were able to get that covered through federal grants or it was 25k a month

[kalm]

Part of the strategy and not only with healthcare is, drown them in red tape and bureaucracy because they know many will just give up and go away...

Yeah - the red tape and hoping people just stop fighting is a massive part of it

It's why UHC denies a third of all claims. They know the majority of those people will never fight it so they don't have to pay for anything. Of those that do fight it they can/will approve a very small number of them. I'm not claiming the government doesn't have any part in that but it's the fucking insurance companies doing it. It's them lobbying the government to make it harder to get coverage. It's them lobbying the government to make sure they can keep cutting benefits and raising costs. They spend hundreds of millions of dollars a year lobbying the government to make sure they can do what they want instead of using that money to pay claims for live-saving operations, medications, devices, etc. Those things don't have an ROI. The money spent lobbying the government does.

Same reason - different topic but same reason - that the republicans are now trying to kill the free IRS tax filling option. They are getting hundreds of millions from Intuit and TurboTax and H&R Block, etc. to make it so you can't file for free. To make the tax code even more complicated. That way you have to spend hundreds, or thousands, of dollars to file through them.

Spot fucking on.

[kalm]

Also…ALL of this.

Democracy exists to give every citizen a voice; the alternative is a consolidation of power to a handful of ultrawealthy and well-connected people. Healthy democracies, combined with conscious-minded, empathetic citizens, actively prevent oppression and political violence. That is their primary function.


Since the killing of UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson and the subsequent response from the American public, I have done some reflecting on the state of our country. As a humanitarian and Christian, I cannot and will not condone or encourage taking a life. This is reflected in my staunch opposition to the death penalty, even for people convicted with 100 percent certainty of the most heinous offenses. It is why I have spoken up and will continue to speak up for those in Palestine, Congo, Sudan, and anywhere else injustice is happening. These values are also why I have fought tirelessly for many policies, including single-payer health care.

Over the past few days, like many Americans, I have read many stories from working-class Americans about their experiences with our for-profit health care system. This is not a Democrat vs. Republican issue; it is a “do you have the money to afford getting sick or hurt” issue. In other words, it is about class.

https://jacobin.com/2024/12/nina-turner ... e-thompson

[Caribbean Hen]

I'm no fan of the Health Care companies but how come nobody is mad at the ridiculous prices doctors charge and costs for the related testing?

many parts to the problem, and it's a hard fact that these health care companies cannot approve everything because then we wouldn't have any health care

[Bobcat]

The whole Jan6th thing is made up bullshit. Anyone with a brain knows it was done by Pelosi to try and make Trump look bad. Just like the Steele dossier, EVERY SINGLE RUSSIAN agent bullshit lie.

All of it is dismissed by normal Americans because they know the media is lying about Trump everyday all day for the last 9 years.

Trying to pin other peoples behavior on Trump is beyond comprehendible.

January 6 was an cold-blooded attempt by trump to have mike pence and nancy pelosi assassinated.

And everyone knows that the whole July 13 thing is made up bullshit.Anyone with a brain knows it was a false flag operation done by trump to make him seem sympathetic and distract attention from his crimes.


MAQA yahoos aren't the only ones who can pull whackadoodle bullshit conspiracy theories out of their assholes.

Look, we get you are not that sharp but if your are going to try and sell an assassination attempt at least have the common courtesy to be honest and admit that 100% of the "rioters" were not armed with guns. You know, those scary black weapons of war you clutch pearls over 24/7/365

How stupid do you think America is? We know your department of education is doing everything it can to get us where you need us to be to believe this bullshit lie you are selling

[UNI88]

January 6 was an cold-blooded attempt by trump to have mike pence and nancy pelosi assassinated.

And everyone knows that the whole July 13 thing is made up bullshit. Anyone with a brain knows it was a false flag operation done by trump to make him seem sympathetic and distract attention from his crimes.

MAQA yahoos aren't the only ones who can pull whackadoodle bullshit conspiracy theories out of their assholes.

Look, we get you are not that sharp but if your are going to try and sell an assassination attempt at least have the common courtesy to be honest and admit that 100% of the "rioters" were not armed with guns. You know, those scary black weapons of war you clutch pearls over 24/7/365

How stupid do you think America is? We know your department of education is doing everything it can to get us where you need us to be to believe this bullshit lie you are selling

You're projecting ...


100% is a pretty strong statement and you can't back it up:
- Mario Mares
- Christopher Alberts
- John Banuelos
- Jerod Bargar

The DoE has done an excellent job of doing everything it can to get people to believe bullshit lies that are being sold. Just look at all the suckers who believe trump's lies for evidence.

What whackadoodle MAQA yahoo conspiracy theory are you going to push next?

[Caribbean Hen]

Name the foreign countries you’ve received medical care in

Those are well know statistics. There are data analytics companies that, you know, are able to track these things.

so your health care in foreign countries is being tracked and studied?

[clenz]

I'm no fan of the Health Care companies but how come nobody is mad at the ridiculous prices doctors charge and costs for the related testing?

many parts to the problem, and it's a hard fact that these health care companies cannot approve everything because then we wouldn't have any health care

Yes, they do over charge an insane amount

Do you realize they set costs based on what insurance states they are willing to cover?

The chargemaster is a person/document that lists all prices hospitals use to "charge us what they want".

Not all that long ago, within the last century, hospitals worked like anywhere else "Cost of procedure/medicine/etc. + a small percent to make money.

As insurance companies grew, and lobbied for more power, billing got far more complicated. Why? Well, largely because the insurance companies started demanding discounts because of "all the business they send to the hospital". This would have/did result in hospitals losing large amounts of money because thy weren't even getting to keep the cost of whatever it is they did. To ae up for it the hospitals (and this is where they get evil in this) started creating artificial and inflated prices at astronomical rates so that they could go back to the insurance company and go "Here is our price on things, and here is what you need to cover. Look at the incredible discounts we are giving you!!"

As time has gone on those prices have only continued to skyrocket for hospitals to profit more (yes, the admin side of hospitals is also just as evil as how I view insurance administrators) insurance companies have started taking bigger cuts for themselves. They have also started to deny more and more claims as they started realizing if we don't cover things we make more money, and if the person dies we don't have to cover anything anymore. Hell, they discovered they can make doctors out of network because they are "too specialized" and don't want to cover any of it. Hospitals continue to charge those fake prices to everyone regardless of insurance prices It's why they are so willing to negotiate if you tell them you will pay them cash.

So you get hospital admin and health insurance admin both lobbying the government to make it harder for the public to actually get access to the care they need, and be able to pay for it. The healthcare industry spends more on lobbying that the oil and defense industries combined.

It's not the doctors charging those rates. It's the admin.

I did billing for a private practice for a few years. I know a thing or two about how it all works on the backend and all the fighting providers do with insurance companies. It's not the providers. Well, maybe some I can't make a blanket 100% statement like that. Providers and nurses hate insurance as much, if not more, than the general public. There are significant numbers of providers in a private practice, whom are paid directly by insurance who sets the rates they can charge, and it can take months for insurance to pay out a claim to the provider. Let's say you see a provider on 8/1 and bill through insurnace. The chances that provider gets paid for that appointment before November, at the extreme earliest, is significantly lower than the declination rate of UHC. Most are will be waiting until December if not January to get paid for the appointment slot

[kalm]

Those are well know statistics. There are data analytics companies that, you know, are able to track these things.

so your health care in foreign countries is being tracked and studied?

Obtuse much?

Yes…CH…OECD, WHO, and agencies from all participating countries share data. It’s a good thing.

[kalm]

I'm no fan of the Health Care companies but how come nobody is mad at the ridiculous prices doctors charge and costs for the related testing?

many parts to the problem, and it's a hard fact that these health care companies cannot approve everything because then we wouldn't have any health care

Yes, they do over charge an insane amount

Do you realize they set costs based on what insurance states they are willing to cover?

The chargemaster is a person/document that lists all prices hospitals use to "charge us what they want".

Not all that long ago, within the last century, hospitals worked like anywhere else "Cost of procedure/medicine/etc. + a small percent to make money.

As insurance companies grew, and lobbied for more power, billing got far more complicated. Why? Well, largely because the insurance companies started demanding discounts because of "all the business they send to the hospital". This would have/did result in hospitals losing large amounts of money because thy weren't even getting to keep the cost of whatever it is they did. To ae up for it the hospitals (and this is where they get evil in this) started creating artificial and inflated prices at astronomical rates so that they could go back to the insurance company and go "Here is our price on things, and here is what you need to cover. Look at the incredible discounts we are giving you!!"

As time has gone on those prices have only continued to skyrocket for hospitals to profit more (yes, the admin side of hospitals is also just as evil as how I view insurance administrators) insurance companies have started taking bigger cuts for themselves. They have also started to deny more and more claims as they started realizing if we don't cover things we make more money, and if the person dies we don't have to cover anything anymore. Hell, they discovered they can make doctors out of network because they are "too specialized" and don't want to cover any of it. Hospitals continue to charge those fake prices to everyone regardless of insurance prices It's why they are so willing to negotiate if you tell them you will pay them cash.

So you get hospital admin and health insurance admin both lobbying the government to make it harder for the public to actually get access to the care they need, and be able to pay for it. The healthcare industry spends more on lobbying that the oil and defense industries combined.

It's not the doctors charging those rates. It's the admin.

I did billing for a private practice for a few years. I know a thing or two about how it all works on the backend and all the fighting providers do with insurance companies. It's not the providers. Well, maybe some I can't make a blanket 100% statement like that. Providers and nurses hate insurance as much, if not more, than the general public. There are significant numbers of providers in a private practice, whom are paid directly by insurance who sets the rates they can charge, and it can take months for insurance to pay out a claim to the provider. Let's say you see a provider on 8/1 and bill through insurnace. The chances that provider gets paid for that appointment before November, at the extreme earliest, is significantly lower than the declination rate of UHC. Most are will be waiting until December if not January to get paid for the appointment slot

[UNI88]

I'm no fan of the Health Care companies but how come nobody is mad at the ridiculous prices doctors charge and costs for the related testing?

many parts to the problem, and it's a hard fact that these health care companies cannot approve everything because then we wouldn't have any health care

Yes, they do over charge an insane amount

Do you realize they set costs based on what insurance states they are willing to cover?

The chargemaster is a person/document that lists all prices hospitals use to "charge us what they want".

Not all that long ago, within the last century, hospitals worked like anywhere else "Cost of procedure/medicine/etc. + a small percent to make money.

As insurance companies grew, and lobbied for more power, billing got far more complicated. Why? Well, largely because the insurance companies started demanding discounts because of "all the business they send to the hospital". This would have/did result in hospitals losing large amounts of money because thy weren't even getting to keep the cost of whatever it is they did. To ae up for it the hospitals (and this is where they get evil in this) started creating artificial and inflated prices at astronomical rates so that they could go back to the insurance company and go "Here is our price on things, and here is what you need to cover. Look at the incredible discounts we are giving you!!"

As time has gone on those prices have only continued to skyrocket for hospitals to profit more (yes, the admin side of hospitals is also just as evil as how I view insurance administrators) insurance companies have started taking bigger cuts for themselves. They have also started to deny more and more claims as they started realizing if we don't cover things we make more money, and if the person dies we don't have to cover anything anymore. Hell, they discovered they can make doctors out of network because they are "too specialized" and don't want to cover any of it. Hospitals continue to charge those fake prices to everyone regardless of insurance prices It's why they are so willing to negotiate if you tell them you will pay them cash.

So you get hospital admin and health insurance admin both lobbying the government to make it harder for the public to actually get access to the care they need, and be able to pay for it. The healthcare industry spends more on lobbying that the oil and defense industries combined.

It's not the doctors charging those rates. It's the admin.

I did billing for a private practice for a few years. I know a thing or two about how it all works on the backend and all the fighting providers do with insurance companies. It's not the providers. Well, maybe some I can't make a blanket 100% statement like that. Providers and nurses hate insurance as much, if not more, than the general public. There are significant numbers of providers in a private practice, whom are paid directly by insurance who sets the rates they can charge, and it can take months for insurance to pay out a claim to the provider. Let's say you see a provider on 8/1 and bill through insurnace. The chances that provider gets paid for that appointment before November, at the extreme earliest, is significantly lower than the declination rate of UHC. Most are will be waiting until December if not January to get paid for the appointment slot

How significant is the impact of the cost of malpractice and other insurance on healthcare costs?

I'm also guessing the number of behind the scenes bureaucrats has ballooned in comparison to the number of people on the front lines actually providing care (doctors, nurses, etc.) and that has significantly impacted the cost of care.