Federal Judge Blocks Part of Arizona Immigration Bill

[Skjellyfetti]

The company the US is keeping speaks volumes as well.

The company we keep? You're the one suggesting we follow El Salvador, Nicaragua, and Bolivia's lead in regards to human rights.

[ASUG8]

I don't think it's a problem with asking foreigners for their papers, I think it's a problem of identifying who is and who isn't a US Citizen without profiling. Pretty impossible problem to solve in a "melting pot," right? That part of the discussion goes back to the "what can be used as identification" thread though.

I have no problem with profiling. I get profiled in every foreign country I visit on planet earth, particularly the ones where I look different than the general population. So, you get asked for papers, you provide them, you move on. What's the big fucking deal?

The deal is that you tell them how long you're going to stay, then you leave when you say you will....because other countries enforce those laws unlike here - instead we put those illegals who are needy on the freakin' payroll.

I have no problem with someone who desires a better standard of living emigrating to the US through legal channels. The ones that bother me is the woman I saw on TV at lunch today - she had been in Arizona illegally for 18 years and was crying because she was having to uproot her life and move to another US state. Oh, and they had to run all this through a translator too because she couldn't be troubled to learn the language of her illegally adopted state.
If I commit a crime in the US and get caught, I expect some form of punishment be it speeding, murder, rape, etc. This is a law that is being broken, and there is a cost for doing so - would any of you in support of illegal immigration NOT expect any of the countries currently suing Arizona NOT to lock you up or deport you for an immigration violation? /rant

[citdog]

So, in a lawsuit that pits Ecuador, Guatemala, El Salvador, Mexico, Honduras, Columbia, Peru, Chile, Argentina, Bolivia, Ecuador, Nicaragua, Paraguay and the US Government against the states of Arizona, Michigan, Alabama, Florida, Nebraska, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, South Dakota, Texas and Virginia, you side with the criminals, theives, cutthroats and murderers. Not surprising.

EVERY SINGLE COUNTRY LISTED has laws which require foreigners to show their papers when requested (and every single country except America gleefully enforces those laws), yet they have the gall to sue an American state that requires the same thing.

The hypocrisy of the US government and pukes like you knows no bounds.

Thank you for acknowledging that South Carolina is an independant country.

You are welcome CD.

thanks Ol FU. is there any doubt in anyone's mind that the people of the Confederate States mentioned above are more deserving of their own country than the "nations" mentioned above? i do know this. The Confederate States of America would have NO problems controlling its southern border.

as for lubeboy siding with the illegals......BIG suprise there........when we RISE it's off to the camps with him.

[AZGrizFan]

EVERY SINGLE STEP taken AFTER Arizona's immigration law passed to get the federal government off their dead ASSES and do something about this invasion.

Obama could give a flying vertical **** about illegal immigrants, except to give them all amnesty so they'll vote democrat for the rest of their lives. THAT is his only political motivation here. You know it. I know it. Anyone with a brainstem knows it.

Well, on second thought then, maybe you DON'T know it.

No, not AFTER Arizona's law you ignorant hick.

From March 2009:
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/24/ ... index.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The plan commits $700 million to bolster Mexican law enforcement and crime prevention efforts. The funds will provide, among other things, five new helicopters to increase mobility for the Mexican army and air force as well as new surveillance aircraft for the Mexican navy.

The funds also will support enhanced communications technology for Mexican prosecutors, law enforcement and immigration officials.

The $700 million allocation, meant to assist what administration officials described as an "anti-smuggling effort," will complement ongoing U.S. aid to Mexico under the Merida initiative: a three-year, $1.4 billion package aimed at helping Mexico fight the drug cartels with law enforcement training, military equipment and improved intelligence cooperation.

Nothing like letting the fox guard the henhouse. Lets give MEXICO $700 million so THEY can prevent THEIR citizens from crossing OUR border. Who are we fucking kidding?

Big fucking deal, dipshit. Obama, just like Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Carter, Nixon, etc., etc before him doesn't give two SHITS how many illegals are entering this country daily. All they care is how can they gain political capital by leveraging these illegals to their advantage.

For $1.4 billion we could station a US Soldier every 10 paces along the entire border from San Ysidro to Boca Chica. The Mexican government will spend it on hookers and blow.

[Skjellyfetti]

We do enforce immigration laws.

We deport ~200,000 people every year.

We just have standards for how we do it. We don't just go knock on doors and round up brown people or people that talk with a funny accent.

[AZGrizFan]

The company the US is keeping speaks volumes as well.

The company we keep? You're the one suggesting we follow El Salvador, Nicaragua, and Bolivia's lead in regards to human rights.

When countries like El Salvador, Nicaragua and Bolivia SUPPORT our government's actions doesn't THAT tell you something? Or do they need to hit you over the head with a rolling pin?

[AZGrizFan]

We do enforce immigration laws.

We deport ~200,000 people every year.

We just have standards for how we do it. We don't just go knock on doors and round up brown people or people that talk with a funny accent.

...and 199,900 of them are back the next night.

[Skjellyfetti]

The plan commits $700 million to bolster Mexican law enforcement and crime prevention efforts. The funds will provide, among other things, five new helicopters to increase mobility for the Mexican army and air force as well as new surveillance aircraft for the Mexican navy.

The funds also will support enhanced communications technology for Mexican prosecutors, law enforcement and immigration officials.

The $700 million allocation, meant to assist what administration officials described as an "anti-smuggling effort," will complement ongoing U.S. aid to Mexico under the Merida initiative: a three-year, $1.4 billion package aimed at helping Mexico fight the drug cartels with law enforcement training, military equipment and improved intelligence cooperation.

Nothing like letting the fox guard the henhouse. Lets give MEXICO $700 million so THEY can prevent THEIR citizens from crossing OUR border. Who are we **** kidding?

Big **** deal, dipshit. Obama, just like Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Carter, Nixon, etc., etc before him doesn't give two SHITS how many illegals are entering this country daily. All they care is how can they gain political capital by leveraging these illegals to their advantage.

For $1.4 billion we could station a US Soldier every 10 paces along the entire border from San Ysidro to Boca Chica. The Mexican government will spend it on hookers and blow.

So you don't want Mexico to fight their cartels? You just want us to do it on our own?

And you left out the paragraph where I pulled measures taken by Obama over a year ago:

In an interview with CNN later Tuesday, she said, "It's all about border safety and security and making sure that spillover violence does not erupt in our own country."

The new federal plan, developed by the departments of Justice and Homeland Security, calls for doubling the number of border security task force teams and moving a significant number of other federal agents, equipment and resources to the border. It also involves greater intelligence sharing aimed at cracking down on the flow of money and weapons into Mexico that helps fuel the drug trade, senior administration officials said.

And it would cost a fuckload more than 1 billion to shut down the border militarily.

For the amount we've spent in Iraq and Afghanistan we haven't come close to shutting down the Iran-Iran border of the Afghanistan-Pakistan border.

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

Bad decision and I hope Arizona disregards it and starts enforcing the law.

I also hope somebody clips a few illegals tonight in protest, if they want to break the law so can we.

[AZGrizFan]

So you don't want Mexico to fight their cartels? You just want us to do it on our own?

And you left out the paragraph where I pulled measures taken by Obama over a year ago:

In an interview with CNN later Tuesday, she said, "It's all about border safety and security and making sure that spillover violence does not erupt in our own country."

The new federal plan, developed by the departments of Justice and Homeland Security, calls for doubling the number of border security task force teams and moving a significant number of other federal agents, equipment and resources to the border. It also involves greater intelligence sharing aimed at cracking down on the flow of money and weapons into Mexico that helps fuel the drug trade, senior administration officials said.

And it would cost a fuckload more than 1 billion to station soldiers at 10 paces across the border.

For the amount we've spent in Iraq and Afghanistan we haven't come close to shutting down the Iran-Iran border of the Afghanistan-Pakistan border.

You'll get no argument from me on the last point.

But, if Mexico TRULY wanted to "fight their cartels", they'd have them cleaned up in a week with the tactics they use. Any amount of money we give them is like pouring it down a bottomless pit.

And finally, ANY steps taken by the Federal government (under Obama's regime or any OTHER in recent history) is done PURELY for political gain. Again, they have NO interest in stemming the flow of illegals. They only want to figure out the best way to leverage them for political gain. If they DID have any interest, they'd actually enforce the fucking law that's ALREADY on our books. They'd PERFORM their CONSTITUTIONAL DUTY that they've ignore for many decades.

The likelihood of that actually happening increased significantly with the passage of AZ 1070. And although the LAW itself may get shot down, it will hopefully have ultimately served its purpose which is to get the government off its dead ASS and quit attempting to solve problems that don't exist and actually work on a problem that DOES exist.

P.S.: Fuck Napolireno and the horse she rode in on. Her and her fucked up pussy-ass tactics are what helped get AZ into this mess we're in in the first place. She's the LAST person you want to use as SUPPORT for any argument you're making for the US case.

[Col Hogan]

So, in a lawsuit that pits Ecuador, Guatemala, El Salvador, Mexico, Honduras, Columbia, Peru, Chile, Argentina, Bolivia, Ecuador, Nicaragua, Paraguay and the US Government against the states of Arizona, Michigan, Alabama, Florida, Nebraska, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, South Dakota, Texas and Virginia, you side with the criminals, theives, cutthroats and murderers. Not surprising.

EVERY SINGLE COUNTRY LISTED has laws which require foreigners to show their papers when requested (and every single country except America gleefully enforces those laws), yet they have the gall to sue an American state that requires the same thing.

The hypocrisy of the US government and pukes like you knows no bounds.

And we have more freedom than Ecuador, Guatemala, El Salvador, Mexico, Honduras, Columbia, Peru, Chile, Argentina, Bolivia, Ecuador, Nicaragua, and Paraguay. We have different standards for these sorts of things. Do you really think we should follow that list of countries' example as far as human rights, civil rights, freedom, liberty, etc.? I doubt it.

I'm not siding with thieves, cutthroats, and murders you ****. I'm siding with legal residents and citizens of the US whose rights would be infringed upon.

How very selective of you...you want to protect legal residents and citizens from having their rights infringed upon on this case....but support restrictive gun control laws that infringe on citizens rights...

What a hypocrite...

[GannonFan]

Thank you for acknowledging that South Carolina is an independant country.

You are welcome CD.

i do know this. The Confederate States of America would have NO problems controlling its southern border.

Why would you say that? I mean, isn't the fact that the CSA couldn't control it's borders (the North seeming to be able to invade from any direction) the reason why there isn't a CSA today?

[ASUG8]

So you don't want Mexico to fight their cartels? You just want us to do it on our own?

And you left out the paragraph where I pulled measures taken by Obama over a year ago:



And it would cost a fuckload more than 1 billion to station soldiers at 10 paces across the border.

For the amount we've spent in Iraq and Afghanistan we haven't come close to shutting down the Iran-Iran border of the Afghanistan-Pakistan border.

You'll get no argument from me on the last point.

But, if Mexico TRULY wanted to "fight their cartels", they'd have them cleaned up in a week with the tactics they use. Any amount of money we give them is like pouring it down a bottomless pit.

And finally, ANY steps taken by the Federal government (under Obama's regime or any OTHER in recent history) is done PURELY for political gain. Again, they have NO interest in stemming the flow of illegals. They only want to figure out the best way to leverage them for political gain. If they DID have any interest, they'd actually enforce the fucking law that's ALREADY on our books. They'd PERFORM their CONSTITUTIONAL DUTY that they've ignore for many decades.

The likelihood of that actually happening increased significantly with the passage of AZ 1070. And although the LAW itself may get shot down, it will hopefully have ultimately served its purpose which is to get the government off its dead ASS and quit attempting to solve problems that don't exist and actually work on a problem that DOES exist.

If there was a rep button here I'd be hitting it right now.

[Pwns]

the tricky part is now how to address the whole illegal immigration part going forward. If you're going to block this, then the question becomes what is your alternative. I'm not sure I see answer coming to this before the Fall

Obama has no problem buffing up security at the border. He order 1,200 more National Guard troops down there a couple of months ago, he's doubled border security task force teams along the US-Mexico border, he's increased funding to police forces along the border, he's increased high tech equipment at the border, etc. etc. etc.

And what good does more border security do for Arizona? There's already a critical mass of illegal immigrants in Arizona who are a big drain on the state's budget. Unlike our sorry-a** federal government, the states don't have magic vaults that never run out of money and they have to get their budgets in the black.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with the Arizona law, and it's absolutely sickening that donks play the civil liberties card when they have essentially no problem with the Patriot Act and Military Comissions Act which are far more a threat to civil liberties than a simple check for citizenship that has to be accompanied with traffic infractions or a crime.

[AZGrizFan]

Obama has no problem buffing up security at the border. He order 1,200 more National Guard troops down there a couple of months ago, he's doubled border security task force teams along the US-Mexico border, he's increased funding to police forces along the border, he's increased high tech equipment at the border, etc. etc. etc.

And what good does more border security do for Arizona? There's already a critical mass of illegal immigrants in Arizona who are a big drain on the state's budget. Unlike our sorry-a** federal government, the states don't have magic vaults that never run out of money and they have to get their budgets in the black.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with the Arizona law, and it's absolutely sickening that donks play the civil liberties card when they have essentially no problem with the Patriot Act and Military Comissions Act which are far more a threat to civil liberties than a simple check for citizenship that has to be accompanied with traffic infractions or a crime.

The donk platform on current illegals can be summed up in one word: Amnesty.

[GannonFan]

We do enforce immigration laws.

We deport ~200,000 people every year.

We just have standards for how we do it. We don't just go knock on doors and round up brown people or people that talk with a funny accent.

Come on, you can't mean that seriously? It's hard to believe that we are really doing a good job of enforcing immigration laws when you see so many interviews with illegals here in this country, many for decades and multiple generations, making good livings and getting good education.

If we deport 200k a year (and I don't doubt that, I'm sure we do), considering we have maybe 20M people here illegally, that means that we only enforce immigration laws to the tune of 1% deportment. Heck, if I wanted to enter the US illegally and I knew I would have a 99% chance of not being kicked out, I'd do it too.

[AZGrizFan]

We do enforce immigration laws.

We deport ~200,000 people every year.

We just have standards for how we do it. We don't just go knock on doors and round up brown people or people that talk with a funny accent.

Come on, you can't mean that seriously? It's hard to believe that we are really doing a good job of enforcing immigration laws when you see so many interviews with illegals here in this country, many for decades and multiple generations, making good livings and getting good education.

If we deport 200k a year (and I don't doubt that, I'm sure we do), considering we have maybe 20M people here illegally, that means that we only enforce immigration laws to the tune of 1% deportment. Heck, if I wanted to enter the US illegally and I knew I would have a 99% chance of not being kicked out, I'd do it too.

Oh, but he DOES mean it seriously, GF.

[JMU DJ]

I have no problem with profiling. I get profiled in every foreign country I visit on planet earth, particularly the ones where I look different than the general population. So, you get asked for papers, you provide them, you move on. What's the big fucking deal?

We're not every foreign country, we have American Exceptionalism. There are laws against profiling. You don't like the law Z?

Obama could give a flying vertical FUCK about illegal immigrants, except to give them all amnesty so they'll vote democrat for the rest of their lives. THAT is his only political motivation here. You know it. I know it. Anyone with a brainstem knows it.

The donk platform on current illegals can be summed up in one word: Amnesty.

Wasn't your boy Bush a proponent amnesty?

Please, that ol' "they'll vote democrat" line? If the GOP was actually smart, they'd realize that their party is more politically appealing to a majority of immigrants and use it to their advantage, like your boy Bush did.

Jesus. It's like talking to a 1st grader here.

Remember when I called you a 3rd grader?

[Skjellyfetti]

How very selective of you...you want to protect legal residents and citizens from having their rights infringed upon on this case....but support restrictive gun control laws that infringe on citizens rights...

What a hypocrite...

How very selective of you, Col. You want to protect gun rights and citizens from having their rights infringed upon on t gun cases... but support restrictive laws that infringe upon brown people's rights on this.

What a hypocrite....


That's bullshit logic, Col. Obviously neither of us supports infringing on peoples' rights. We just disagree with what the Constitution allows...

[GannonFan]

the tricky part is now how to address the whole illegal immigration part going forward. If you're going to block this, then the question becomes what is your alternative. I'm not sure I see answer coming to this before the Fall

Obama has no problem buffing up security at the border. He order 1,200 more National Guard troops down there a couple of months ago, he's doubled border security task force teams along the US-Mexico border, he's increased funding to police forces along the border, he's increased high tech equipment at the border, etc. etc. etc.

As the other poster pointed out, that just ignores the big elephant in the room. 20M illegals in the country and the only response so far is to out a few more guards on the border and increase funding? And strangely, it took Arizona passing this law just to get the Feds to do that much.

[01lugrad]

This all boils down to the following:

Federal law is not being followed by the feds.
A state decided to enforce the federal law.
The feds said, "Hey! You can't do that! It's our job (not to do it)."
Unless the injunction is lifted by the AC or the SC, the law will continue to be unenforced.

[AZGrizFan]

How very selective of you...you want to protect legal residents and citizens from having their rights infringed upon on this case....but support restrictive gun control laws that infringe on citizens rights...

What a hypocrite...

How very selective of you, Col. You want to protect gun rights and citizens from having their rights infringed upon on t gun cases... but support restrictive laws that infringe upon brown people's rights on this.

What a hypocrite....


That's bullshit logic, Col. Obviously neither of us supports infringing on peoples' rights. We just disagree with what the Constitution allows...

How about what the Constitution REQUIRES?

provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity,

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

[Col Hogan]

How very selective of you...you want to protect legal residents and citizens from having their rights infringed upon on this case....but support restrictive gun control laws that infringe on citizens rights...

What a hypocrite...

How very selective of you, Col. You want to protect gun rights and citizens from having their rights infringed upon on t gun cases... but support restrictive laws that infringe upon brown people's rights on this.

What a hypocrite....


That's bullshit logic, Col. Obviously neither of us supports infringing on peoples' rights. We just disagree with what the Constitution allows...

You and people of your ilk keep referring to "brown people"...where is that in the law....or is that just your racial prejudice showing...

I don't care what the color of somebody who is here illegally...and you shouldn't either....

[LeadBolt]

I'm sorry, I'm just too simple for this debate. What part of illegal am I missing?

What part of reasonable suspicion for law enforcement is wrong?

What would happen to you if you attempted to illegally immigrate to those countries?

Why are we supposed to be above securing our borders and insuring the safety of our populace?

We wouldn't have a country, if not for the population owning guns. The Japanese wouldn't have stopped at a long range bombing mission of Pearl Harbor, if we hadn't had guns.

The successors to Hitler, etc. would be running the world, if we the American people didn't have guns.

Having the right to be armed makes us citizens and protects our freedom. Not being able to be armed, makes us subjects.

[Skjellyfetti]

We do enforce immigration laws.

We deport ~200,000 people every year.

We just have standards for how we do it. We don't just go knock on doors and round up brown people or people that talk with a funny accent.

Come on, you can't mean that seriously? It's hard to believe that we are really doing a good job of enforcing immigration laws when you see so many interviews with illegals here in this country, many for decades and multiple generations, making good livings and getting good education.

If we deport 200k a year (and I don't doubt that, I'm sure we do), considering we have maybe 20M people here illegally, that means that we only enforce immigration laws to the tune of 1% deportment. Heck, if I wanted to enter the US illegally and I knew I would have a 99% chance of not being kicked out, I'd do it too.

No, you're bad at math.

We deport ~200,000 every year. There are ~500,000 illegals that enter the country every year (this number is hard to pin down... but, that's the first answer I found).

That's 40% deportment.

You use the figure of 20,000,000... that's built up from decades of immigration. It doesn't make sense to use a figure from one year of deportment vs. decades of immigration. Obviously there is a difference between the amount that come in and the amount that are ultimately deported....... but, we have to deport people within the bounds of the law and the standards upon which we stand as a country. We can't sacrifice them in order to round up more illegals. You obviously disagree and that's fine. But, I'm glad the courts are siding with me.