Mediocrity Returns- Keeler Minus Flacco-Devlin

[bluehenbillk]

I was there. I'd put it at 11-12,000 actual.

I trust your estimate.

I've heard the excuses (first "cold" game of the year; some of the fan base might have sustained Sandy damage or been without power), but man that's just bad attendance, particularly with the team still holding onto playoff hope, however slim, at the time.

How was the scrapple?

I expect to see your ass at the 'Nova game.

[CAA Flagship]

I trust your estimate.

I've heard the excuses (first "cold" game of the year; some of the fan base might have sustained Sandy damage or been without power), but man that's just bad attendance, particularly with the team still holding onto playoff hope, however slim, at the time.

How was the scrapple?

I expect to see your ass at the 'Nova game.

Hey, if that is what floats your boat.....

[BDKJMU]

It was still the third highest figure at an FCS game and higher than seven FBS games Saturday ...

Well, that's because ironically App State, Montana, and JMU were all away last weekend.

Actually, App State, Montana, JMU and ODU were all away last weekend.

[93henfan]

Well, that's because ironically App State, Montana, and JMU were all away last weekend.

Actually, App State, Montana, JMU and ODU were all away last weekend.

App State and Montana are rabid fanbases. I'll give you that.

ODU, I thought, was a rabid fanbase, but I was there two weeks ago, and unless my ears and eyes were deceiving me, I heard at least three ODU fans say to me "I can't believe how few people are here today" and when I got in the stadium, it appeared to be slightly more than half full with the student section having huge empty sections. There were posts on Monarch Nation after the game questioning attendance, especially the students. I also heard a comment that "this is fun, but the real season (basketball) starts in a few weeks". Flaggy and Trip, I am not diming you guys out. You guys were there, on a crappy weather day with me, with a big storm coming up the coast, in a steady second half rain. I had a blast with you two. I'm just question the fair weather part of your fanbase and the guy that apparently thinks your b-ball program trumps f-ball.

And JMU. Have you guys even sold out a game this year? Your box scores show you only topping 25K once, and some games with paid (not even actual) attendance 5K+ below capacity. Something about glass houses and throwing stones.

[UD77]

The point is that even in a bad year or declining attendance UD is still top ten, most likely top 5. We have a long way to fall before we become UNH or Villanova.

There are a lot of advantages to having less people at the game.
1. Easier in and out with parking.
2. shorter lines at the pee wall
3. Can pick any seat that you would like.
4. Can follow either the dance team or the cheerleader - take your pick
5. Might be able to finally sit in a Box seat.
6. Your choice of parking spots
7. No waiting for a hot dog
8. Can visit section J and join in on the fun
9. No one to step over when you leave your seats to use the facilities
10. Don't have to worry about hearing loss - as there is no noise
11. Can hear the visiting teams conversations (I sit on the visitors side) (reason being #10)
12. Can follow the team as they drive down the field (just pick any seat as they move down the field) (I'll give you the point that you don't have to do this as much this year).
13. Can change locations to track the sun if it gets cold or hot.
14. If you don't like who you are sitting near - just move
15. Not enough people in the stands to do the "Blue" - "Hens" cheer
16. Can get all of your friends in one location
17. And 93 you will like this one - can buy an $8 ticket - pick any place in the premium seats on the 50 right next to the guy that paid something like $40 for his ticket. Then turn to that same guy and talk about the great deal you got. Heck you might be able to return the $8 ticket for a refund as you didn't get your monies worth.

[93henfan]

The point is that even in a bad year or declining attendance UD is still top ten, most likely top 5. We have a long way to fall before we become UNH or Villanova.

There are a lot of advantages to having less people at the game.
1. Easier in and out with parking.
2. shorter lines at the pee wall
3. Can pick any seat that you would like.
4. Can follow either the dance team or the cheerleader - take your pick
5. Might be able to finally sit in a Box seat.
6. Your choice of parking spots
7. No waiting for a hot dog
8. Can visit section J and join in on the fun
9. No one to step over when you leave your seats to use the facilities
10. Don't have to worry about hearing loss - as there is no noise
11. Can hear the visiting teams conversations (I sit on the visitors side) (reason being #10)
12. Can follow the team as they drive down the field (just pick any seat as they move down the field) (I'll give you the point that you don't have to do this as much this year).
13. Can change locations to track the sun if it gets cold or hot.
14. If you don't like who you are sitting near - just move
15. Not enough people in the stands to do the "Blue" - "Hens" cheer
16. Can get all of your friends in one location
17. And 93 you will like this one - can buy an $8 ticket - pick any place in the premium seats on the 50 right next to the guy that paid something like $40 for his ticket. Then turn to that same guy and talk about the great deal you got. Heck you might be able to return the $8 ticket for a refund as you didn't get your monies worth.

Post of the year in the combined humor/practicality category.




And your point is well taken. My shots taken at our attendance are never out of some joy at getting back at the AD/UDAF. They are taken out of depression at the 2008->present attendance trend. Sad to see a STH base go from mid 11Ks to mid 7Ks in three years. The very scary part is the sense of resignation on GoHens and in the stands.

[BDKJMU]

Actually, App State, Montana, JMU and ODU were all away last weekend.

App State and Montana are rabid fanbases. I'll give you that.

ODU, I thought, was a rabid fanbase, but I was there two weeks ago, and unless my ears and eyes were deceiving me, I heard at least three ODU fans say to me "I can't believe how few people are here today" and when I got in the stadium, it appeared to be slightly more than half full with the student section having huge empty sections. There were posts on Monarch Nation after the game questioning attendance, especially the students. I also heard a comment that "this is fun, but the real season (basketball) starts in a few weeks". Flaggy and Trip, I am not diming you guys out. You guys were there, on a crappy weather day with me, with a big storm coming up the coast, in a steady second half rain. I had a blast with you two. I'm just question the fair weather part of your fanbase and the guy that apparently thinks your b-ball program trumps f-ball.

And JMU. Have you guys even sold out a game this year? Your box scores show you only topping 25K once, and some games with paid (not even actual) attendance 5K+ below capacity. Something about glass houses and throwing stones.

JMU's low for a CAA game was 22,271 vs W&M. Yeah, never had more than 18-20k butts in seats, and towards the end was maybe 15k in a close game, go figure.

UD's low for a CAA game 16,252 vs TU. And UD never had more than what, according to you in your post on page 1, 10k butts in seats?

[93henfan]

Why qualify with CAA games? Oh that's right, because your OOC games were even lower in attendance.

[UD77]

93 said
"And your point is well taken. My shots taken at our attendance are never out of some joy at getting back at the AD/UDAF. They are taken out of depression at the 2008->present attendance trend. Sad to see a STH base go from mid 11Ks to mid 7Ks in three years. The very scary part is the sense of resignation on GoHens and in the stands."

I understand your points and I do agree. I take zero pleasure in not having the stands full. I remember when the noise level was an advantage at our games and certainly added to fun of being there. Some games it would cause a couple of off sides or the need to call a time out to keep from having a penalty. I am concerned that I may not see that anymore.

[BDKJMU]

Why qualify with CAA games? Oh that's right, because your OOC games were even lower in attendance.

Comparing CAA games to CAA games = apples to apples. Comparing CAA to OOC = apples to oranges.

[NorthHen]

So...... my questions were.....

When is the UD-Pitt game?
Is this the last scheduled FBS game for the Hens under KCs scheduling philosophy?
At what point does an FBS "money game" become economically advantageous? Keeler's theory has been "We're Delaware! We don't have to make money on FBS games since we make so much for home games against the likes of Duquesne, Bucknell, Delaware State, and West Chester. And our fans love home games." Recent drops in attendance from 23,000 sellouts to far less undermine the "Keeler All Cupcakes All-The Time" philosophy.

[BDKJMU]

Why qualify with CAA games? Oh that's right, because your OOC games were even lower in attendance.

No, not really. Of the 5 home games so far, the 2 OOC cupcakes were #2 and #5 in attendance.

Alcorn: 20,239
W&M: 22,271
GST: 22,813
SFU: 23,248
TU: 25,077

[UD77]

From Northhen
"So...... my questions were.....

When is the UD-Pitt game?
Is this the last scheduled FBS game for the Hens under KCs scheduling philosophy?
At what point does an FBS "money game" become economically advantageous? Keeler's theory has been "We're Delaware! We don't have to make money on FBS games since we make so much for home games against the likes of Duquesne, Bucknell, Delaware State, and West Chester. And our fans love home games." Recent drops in attendance from 23,000 sellouts to far less undermine the "Keeler All Cupcakes All-The Time" philosophy."

I believe Navy is next year, Pitt is scheduled for 2014 and another date in the future maybe 2017.

Not sure how to answer your second question. According to the administration the change in the policy (parking and seat fees) has increase the amount of money they have to give to scholarships.

In terms of the comments about who we play ... I really don't think that who we play makes a difference in attendance. Last game we played, Towson (last years CAA champ), a very much required win for either team if they had any hopes of getting a play-off position - and that was the lowest attended game of the year. Yes much less than West Chester, Bucknell, Del State and if I remember correctly Duquesne from a previous year. I believe, and I think the attendance figures will back it up, that playing a cup cake doesn't make any difference. The student section this year has had the best attendance in many years - almost completely packed. Last game there were about 20 , game started at 12 noon, maybe the turning the clocks back thing got them confused. I also don't believe that the average fan in most of our stadiums knows anything about the competition. They couldn't tell you who is ahead in the CAA or who is good in Big Sky. The 200 people that look at this site are the exception to that comment. I can tell you that the people that sit to my left at the UD games couldn't answer that question and they have been going to the games for about 30 years.

I would say the drop in UD attendence and in this order but it is cumulative.
1. The economy
2. The administrations method of increase revenue for the parking pass holders - three years ago
3. The admins method of increasing revenue by implementing a mandatory contribution to the athletic fund last year
4. The admins putting a private security force in place that thought they were there to drive all the fun out of the game.
5. Change in some of the tailgating policies (such as no re-entry if you leave at half time).
6. The general attitude of the admin when implementing numbers 2 - 5 above. If you don't like it you can walk. They got what they asked for.
7. Relatively boring form of offense that we currently use. Even with QB's like Flacco and Devlin and running backs like Cuff and AP you leave feeling that it is still boring.
8. Last but I don't think it makes a difference in only about 20 tickets a game is who we actually play.

[93henfan]

7. Relatively boring form of offense that we currently use. Even with QB's like Flacco and Devlin and running backs like Cuff and AP you leave feeling that it is still boring.

This is the big kicker for me. I am just not entertained by this offense, even when we win. I feel worn out watching. It's SO... GOD... DAMN... PREDICTABLE.

Attending the Georgia Southern game last week in Statesboro vs Appy was the most fun I've had at a football game (inside the stadium) since the last time we (UD) hosted Georgia Southern in the '10 semifinals.

[UD77]

UD Ga Southern Game was great. Their offense has been impressive each time that we have played them. I believe our record is either 2 & 2 or that last game may have put us ahead. Reminds me of the Wing T back in the hay day. I think if you could use that offense but mix in 25 - 30 % passes - what trip that would be.

[bluehenbillk]

I would say the drop in UD attendence and in this order but it is cumulative.
1. The economy
2. The administrations method of increase revenue for the parking pass holders - three years ago
3. The admins method of increasing revenue by implementing a mandatory contribution to the athletic fund last year
4. The admins putting a private security force in place that thought they were there to drive all the fun out of the game.
5. Change in some of the tailgating policies (such as no re-entry if you leave at half time).
6. The general attitude of the admin when implementing numbers 2 - 5 above. If you don't like it you can walk. They got what they asked for.
7. Relatively boring form of offense that we currently use. Even with QB's like Flacco and Devlin and running backs like Cuff and AP you leave feeling that it is still boring.
8. Last but I don't think it makes a difference in only about 20 tickets a game is who we actually play.

I know a few on gohens bring it up but #5 has nothing to do with attendance at the Tub. Hell, it's been more than a decade now I believe since you were able to re-enter.

[93henfan]

UD Ga Southern Game was great. Their offense has been impressive each time that we have played them. I believe our record is either 2 & 2 or that last game may have put us ahead. Reminds me of the Wing T back in the hay day. I think if you could use that offense but mix in 25 - 30 % passes - what trip that would be.

FYI, UD vs GSU all-time (3-2):

12/18/2010 @ Newark (FCS Semis) - UD 27 GSU 10
8/29/2002 @ Newark - UD 22 GSU 19
9/8/2001 @ Statesboro - GSU 38 UD 7
12/9/2000 @ Newark (FCS Semis) - GSU 27 UD 18
12/6/1997 @ Newark (FCS Quarters) - UD 16 GSU 7

[UD77]

I would say the drop in UD attendence and in this order but it is cumulative.
1. The economy
2. The administrations method of increase revenue for the parking pass holders - three years ago
3. The admins method of increasing revenue by implementing a mandatory contribution to the athletic fund last year
4. The admins putting a private security force in place that thought they were there to drive all the fun out of the game.
5. Change in some of the tailgating policies (such as no re-entry if you leave at half time).
6. The general attitude of the admin when implementing numbers 2 - 5 above. If you don't like it you can walk. They got what they asked for.
7. Relatively boring form of offense that we currently use. Even with QB's like Flacco and Devlin and running backs like Cuff and AP you leave feeling that it is still boring.
8. Last but I don't think it makes a difference in only about 20 tickets a game is who we actually play.

I know a few on gohens bring it up but #5 has nothing to do with attendance at the Tub. Hell, it's been more than a decade now I believe since you were able to re-enter.

Re-entry did not affect me either as I never did it. But what I meant was the way the security started closing down tailgates during the game - not letting people open them up again at half time - even if they were not going back in. That sort of thing. As I stated - I don't just one of these issues caused the drop but 3 out of the 7 might have.

[Grizalltheway]

I still can't comprehend that some schools won't let you come back in after half time. Wa-Griz would literally be 90% empty for the second half if they had that policy there.

[GannonFan]

I still can't comprehend that some schools won't let you come back in after half time. Wa-Griz would literally be 90% empty for the second half if they had that policy there.

Some schools? Heck, most schools have that rule, especially at the FBS level. SEC schools specifically don't allow it, and I think most other FBS schools are the same.

I'm fine with the no re-entry rule, but I never understood why they put the no tailgating during the game rule in play (i.e. once the game starts, enter the stadium or leave the premises and no resumption of tailgating until after the game). They've certainly relaxed that criteria in the more expensive lots now, but it certainly pushed away many of the fans who were there predominately for the atmosphere of the football game as opposed to just the x's and the o's and those fans may not be coming back anytime soon. Like another poster said, we on sites like this are by far a small, small minority of fans - I had people sit next to me for years who swore that Northeastern was a school in West Virginia and I'm sure today they couldn't tell the difference between Georgia Southern and Georgia State. Who the opponent is has about zero to do with attendance, at least at UD. The social parts of the experience (tailgating, game atmosphere, etc) have always played a bigger part in the majority of people coming and that's where UD is suffering now.