Free Money!

[kalm]

The market hasn't done **** and isn't going to.

They're not going to go back to sending hundreds of guys down in the mines out of the goodness of their hearts when they can just take down the mountain with some heavy machinery with a fraction of the workforce.

I don't see why it would be any different for retail jobs or any other industry that will be disappearing.

And your leftist government is going to send them back down. Or are they going to give them a living wage and a heroin ration to numb their senses?

How have central economies done historically? You want me to trust the government with my welfare?

The solution is government oversight and targeted encouragement and the question is how much.

It’s not your welfare I’m worried about. UNI88 is self reliant. It’s the pitchfork masses we’re talking about here. Not enough of them understand the concept of bootstraps and too many of us are catastrophic illness or accident away from not being self reliant...at least in the 1st world problems sort of way...

[CID1990]

Where does this trust in our government to do things right come from?

So, we should trust the market to show pity as people fall out of the workforce? The invisible hand is going start patting people on the back whose skills are no longer needed.

We've seen this already happen with coal mining. Next time you're back in the states, go down to Grundy Co., VA and see if the market, charity or ANYTHING is doing much to help a region left behind by the economy.

Government isn't a perfect solution. But, I'm not seeing a better one.

No, Mr. Straw Man, we shouldn't. At least not completely. But the same market that you claim won't do anything has done all kinds of things when you put a guaranteed non-labor backed dollar in someone's hands ... reliably on the first of every month. The market quickly learns how to take that dollar without providing an additional ounce of value-added service.

As I have said- I'm all for a guaranteed basic income. I'm even open to raising it to a level where people can subsist off of it without having to work... just a point or two above the poverty level. But in return for that, people who accept basic are responsible for their choices - where they will pay rent, what kinds of things they will buy, how many children they will have (children subject to diminishing percentage returns in payments) everything - nothing will be subsidized. No more HUD run Section 8 housing. No more food stamps. No more AFDC.

And when you accept basic, you can work - and those jobs that Americans don't want to do (because we are all fat and lazy and entitled)... those jobs become a supplement instead of a mainstay.. Basic keeps you from starving. Working pads your nest.

And if you decide to spend all your basic down at the slot machines or on booze, you can starve. Society doesn't have a responsibility to protect people from stupid choices

Do that - and I'll be happy to pay for it

Don't do it - and I'll be just as happy to stick with the status quo

[GannonFan]

CID's on target here - the market is very good at knowing what money is out there that can be taken and taking it. It's the reason why bumps in minimum wage never seem to have long lasting, positive outcomes for those making minimum wage once inflation takes into account that they have more money. It's why all those pesky "not-for-profit" colleges were able to jack up tuitions to be just ahead of any increases in student loans over the past decade or so and it was more than just coincidental. Being poor and being out of work sucks, but there's no easy answer and no easy way out of those situations either, and our answers to those problems are imperfect at the moment. And the answers aren't all going to be external, government-led solutions either.

[Chizzang]

There will always be working "poor" as long as there is a system in place
where money production and accumulation is as simple as moving decimal points

and just in case you were wondering:
No The Federal Reserve Transparency Act does noting to change that little problem

The stories The Italian used to tell me were mildly horrifying
Example:
After the Chilean debt crisis in the 80's
Our Federal Reserve now just moves a decimal point in to reduce Chilean debt every once in a while
She says this as blandly and matter of fact as though it were common knowledge



Think about that for a minute...
Turning Billions into Millions in one click
and nothing in the world changes (nothing!)

What is international debt..?
What is student loan debt exactly..?

What would happen if it just turned to zero like we gifted General Motors...?

[CAA Flagship]

There will always be working "poor" as long as there is a system in place
where money production and accumulation is as simple as moving decimal points

and just in case you were wondering:
No The Federal Reserve Transparency Act does noting to change that little problem

The stories The Italian used to tell me were mildly horrifying
Example:
After the Chilean debt crisis in the 80's
Our Federal Reserve now just moves a decimal point in to reduce Chilean debt every once in a while
She says this as blandly and matter of fact as though it were common knowledge



Think about that for a minute...
Turning Billions into Millions in one click
and nothing in the world changes (nothing!)

What is international debt..?
What is student loan debt exactly..?

What would happen if it just turned to zero like we gifted General Motors...?