The Planned Parenthood video...

[∞∞∞]

I have no fight over these (edited) videos. I'm just glad Planned Parenthood exists; I think the social benefits it's brought to people really outweigh any negative ideas a few in the organization have.

[Chizzang]

I have no fight over these (edited) videos. I'm just glad Planned Parenthood exists; I think the social benefits it's brought to people really outweigh any negative ideas a few in the organization have.

Huckabee thinks the U.S. Military should be used to forcibly close them down..!!!
and he's running for President

[JoltinJoe]

In today's fifth video release, the PP rep says how exciting it is to dissect 20-week-old fully intact fetuses.

“It would be exciting too if you needed it dissected, because LaShonda and I are the most Curious George of the group,” Farrell says. “I know it’s sickening on some level, but it’s fun.”

I'm wondering in what context that statement is acceptable.

http://dailycaller.com/2015/08/04/new-p ... z3htbKerit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[kalm]

In today's fifth video release, the PP rep says how exciting it is to dissect 20-week-old fully intact fetuses.

“It would be exciting too if you needed it dissected, because LaShonda and I are the most Curious George of the group,” Farrell says. “I know it’s sickening on some level, but it’s fun.”

I'm wondering in what context that statement is acceptable.

http://dailycaller.com/2015/08/04/new-p ... z3htbKerit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

What's next? ISIS is performing the procedures?

This sounds really bad but I'll wait to watch the unedited version.

[JoltinJoe]

In today's fifth video release, the PP rep says how exciting it is to dissect 20-week-old fully intact fetuses.

“It would be exciting too if you needed it dissected, because LaShonda and I are the most Curious George of the group,” Farrell says. “I know it’s sickening on some level, but it’s fun.”

I'm wondering in what context that statement is acceptable.

http://dailycaller.com/2015/08/04/new-p ... z3htbKerit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

What's next? ISIS is performing the procedures?

This sounds really bad but I'll wait to watch the unedited version.

No doubt Cecile the Liar will apologize for the "tone."

[JoltinJoe]

I've had a chance to look at the StemExpress documents that have been posted on line, and I realized that we are missing the forest for the trees here.

42 U.S.C. Section 289 provides: “It shall be unlawful for any person to knowingly acquire, receive, or otherwise transfer any human fetal tissue for valuable consideration if the transfer affects interstate commerce.”

StemExpress has technicians on site at the PP affiliates who immediately collect fetal tissue after an abortion, and then transport that tissue to StemExpress. At the StemExpress labs, technicians then process the tissue, fulfill orders, and arrange for shipping to StemExpress customers who have placed orders for certain specific types of fetal tissue (liver, pancreas, etc.).

StemExpress' processing costs a lot of money. It involves the use of expensive machinery, and the cost of shipping tissue so that it arrives in a usable form at the research center is also very expensive.

Nonetheless, StemExpress prices the tissue to involve a substantial profit for it. It is a "for profit" corporation. While the focus of all this has been on the fees received by PP, it is readily apparent, once you review StemExpress' documents, that is involved in the "transfer [of] .. human fetal tissue for valuable consideration" in a way that affects interstate commerce, in apparent violation of federal law.

Frankly, it does not appear that PP incurs any additional costs in connection with this process, since the fetal tissue is immediately turned over to StemExpress. In truth, this procedure probably saves PP money, since PP does not incur the high cost of disposing of the tissue as a classified "medical waste."

Putting aside whether the fees paid to PP constitute payment of costs or a profit, StemExpress is violating federal criminal law.

Moreover, it seems that the decision to engage in a relationship with a procurement firm is made by each PP affiliate on an affiliate-by-affiliate basis, and it seems that the practice is not common among PP affiliates.

This raises the question, in my mind, whether there are specific PP employees/doctors who are PERSONALLY profiting from sales by firms like StemExpress, by way of kickback or otherwise. This needs to be investigated in the famous journalistic practice of "follow the money."

Moreover, from what other sources does StemExpress obtain fetal tissue? It has a handful of contracts with PP affiliates, but these PP affiliates seem incapable of providing StemExpress with the volume of tissue necessary for StemExpress' operations, at least based on my review of the documents on line. Is StemExpress obtaining fetal tissue from nefarious sources, and using its contracts with PP affiliates as cover?

Moreover, these PP affiliates are, at the very least, participating in a conspiracy to violate federal law, and I strongly suspect there are individuals at these affiliates who are personally profiting by way of kickback or other personal payments/benefits.

[D1B]

I've had a chance to look at the StemExpress documents that have been posted on line, and I realized that we are missing the forest for the trees here.

42 U.S.C. Section 289 provides: “It shall be unlawful for any person to knowingly acquire, receive, or otherwise transfer any human fetal tissue for valuable consideration if the transfer affects interstate commerce.”

StemExpress has technicians on site at the PP affiliates who immediately collect fetal tissue after an abortion, and then transport that tissue to StemExpress. At the StemExpress labs, technicians then process the tissue, fulfill orders, and arrange for shipping to StemExpress customers who have placed orders for certain specific types of fetal tissue (liver, pancreas, etc.).

StemExpress' processing costs a lot of money. It involves the use of expensive machinery, and the cost of shipping tissue so that it arrives in a usable form at the research center is also very expensive.

Nonetheless, StemExpress prices the tissue to involve a substantial profit for it. It is a "for profit" corporation. While the focus of all this has been on the fees received by PP, it is readily apparent, once you review StemExpress' documents, that is involved in the "transfer [of] .. human fetal tissue for valuable consideration" in a way that affects interstate commerce, in apparent violation of federal law.

Frankly, it does not appear that PP incurs any additional costs in connection with this process, since the fetal tissue is immediately turned over to StemExpress. In truth, this procedure probably saves PP money, since PP does not incur the high cost of disposing of the tissue as a classified "medical waste."

Putting aside whether the fees paid to PP constitute payment of costs or a profit, StemExpress is violating federal criminal law.

Moreover, it seems that the decision to engage in a relationship with a procurement firm is made by each PP affiliate on an affiliate-by-affiliate basis, and it seems that the practice is not common among PP affiliates.

This raises the question, in my mind, whether there are specific PP employees/doctors who are PERSONALLY profiting from sales by firms like StemExpress, by way of kickback or otherwise. This needs to be investigated in the famous journalistic practice of "follow the money."

Moreover, from what other sources does StemExpress obtain fetal tissue? It has a handful of contracts with PP affiliates, but these PP affiliates seem incapable of providing StemExpress with the volume of tissue necessary for StemExpress' operations, at least based on my review of the documents on line. Is StemExpress obtaining fetal tissue from nefarious sources, and using its contracts with PP affiliates as cover?

Moreover, these PP affiliates are, at the very least, participating in a conspiracy to violate federal law, and I strongly suspect there are individuals at these affiliates who are personally profiting by way of kickback or other personal payments/benefits.

This, from a monster who defended a serial pedophile who raped several hundred handicapped boys.

[D1B]

Ok. That long post only confirms everything I've said. Glad you agree with me that the prior restraints are of dubious legality.

I don't actually see a response to anything I wrote -- only confirmation, and I accept your thanks for having educated you yet again -- so I'll leave you with this final thought.

The expert I spoke to on Thursday also said: "PP could remove any question of profiteering by having the patient, when she signs the consent form for donation, to further consent to having a technician from the procurement firm present at the abortion, and take immediate possession of the tissue. This way, PP would have no costs, and the procurement firm would be absorbing all costs of the donation. This would mean, though, that PP would have to disclose to the patient the presence of a non-PP employee, and explain why that person is there. That they don't do that might mean that PP is sometimes providing fetal tissue to the procurement company even in cases in which the patient did not consent."

Joe, I asked you whether you were at least a little skeptical about the videos. You then went all over the place. Talk about dubious.

Joe's the quintessential dodger.

[D1B]

He was very skeptical of the reports and data assembled against the Catholic Church
In fact he assured us it was entirely concocted nonsense

But this is totally real... and way different

Well, my observations about the abuse scandal have proven to be accurate. There are now FOUR studies that suggest that the rate of abuse by Catholic priests is lower than the rate of abuse by clergy in other denominations; lower than the rate of public school teachers; and lower than the rate among the population at large.

A child is far more likely to be sexually abused by a school teacher or a relative.

Others have just proven more adept at covering up their misdeeds. And lawyers are not going to take cases against smaller denominations with no centralized assets.

Catholic child rape and torture scandal one of the worst crimes against humanity ever recorded. The scale and sophistication of the cover up confirms it was only the tip of the iceberg - fact.

Lawyers are a pedophiles best friend.


Nice work Joe.

[D1B]

You've gotta be shitting us. There's no way you could actually believe something like that.

The rate of abuse by teachers is nearly twice as likely as by a Catholic priest, and the number school teachers in the US vastly exceed the number of priests.

Now discuss what you know about sex abuse cases in the schools in the 1960s through 2002.

Catholic child rape scandal was is the worst.

Keep defending pedophiles, Joe.

[D1B]

to allow his government and others to kill and enslave innocent people so that he can drive a car, live in a nice house...and golf (eff the environment, too ).

And he's OK with it. In fact, he, and you, and most everyone in a first world country, support lifestyles at the expense of other innocent lives.

The fact is that giving up your lifestyle so that others can live (period), or live better lives, would be waaaaaaaaay too inconvenient for you. You pride yourselves that you are getting ahead...living the good life, and making things better for your children in this dog eat dog world. 100,000s of thousand of people have died recently because we want the US of A to be the gawd damned US of A...and no sand nigg...err, nihilist is going to get in our way.

Yet you want someone else to give up their lifestyle in order to stay pregnant in order to deliver an innocent baby that they, and most of the world, don't want.

That isn't nihilism, jj, that is hypocrisy.

We've already beaten this horse Cluck. Everyone who believes murder should be a punishable offense is a hypocrite by your definition. You keep bringing it up as if it's a hole in the pro-life arguement. It's not.

If your daughter was impregnated by a man of color, you'd be chairing the PP golf fundraiser the next week.

[D1B]

The rate of abuse by teachers is nearly twice as likely as by a Catholic priest, and the number school teachers in the US vastly exceed the number of priests.

Now discuss what you know about sex abuse cases in the schools in the 1960s through 2002.

Catholic child rape scandal was is the worst.

Keep defending pedophiles, Joe.

This just in from another morally bankrupt catholic archdiocese.

MINNESOTA
Star Tribune

By Jean Hopfensperger Star Tribune AUGUST 4, 2015

A day after the deadline for filing clergy abuse claims against the St. Paul and Minneapolis archdiocese, interim Archbishop Bernard Hebda described the number of victims who stepped forward as “staggering.”

“It’s helped me to realize how much pain there can be out there on these issues, that there can be 407 people carrying these burdens,” said Hebda, who became interim archbishop of the St. Paul and Minneapolis Archdiocese in June.

“The number encourages me not to underestimate that.”

The U.S. Bankruptcy Court Tuesday showed a final tally of 669 claims against the archdiocese, of which 407 were for clergy abuse and another 150 or so were from parishes seeking indemnification from abuse claims and also to protect their medical and dental insurance.

The others were filed by creditors and individuals, including archdiocese whistleblower Jennifer Haselberger, who filed a notice of claim for alleged defamation, and John Bussmann, a former priest charged with sexual misconduct who seeks compensation for living expenses and other support.

Just a tip of the iceberg. According to research, only a small fraction report sexual abuse. In this case alone there are probably tens of thousands of victims.

[D1B]

Catholic child rape scandal was is the worst.

Keep defending pedophiles, Joe.

This just in from another morally bankrupt catholic archdiocese.

MINNESOTA
Star Tribune

By Jean Hopfensperger Star Tribune AUGUST 4, 2015

A day after the deadline for filing clergy abuse claims against the St. Paul and Minneapolis archdiocese, interim Archbishop Bernard Hebda described the number of victims who stepped forward as “staggering.”

“It’s helped me to realize how much pain there can be out there on these issues, that there can be 407 people carrying these burdens,” said Hebda, who became interim archbishop of the St. Paul and Minneapolis Archdiocese in June.

“The number encourages me not to underestimate that.”

The U.S. Bankruptcy Court Tuesday showed a final tally of 669 claims against the archdiocese, of which 407 were for clergy abuse and another 150 or so were from parishes seeking indemnification from abuse claims and also to protect their medical and dental insurance.

The others were filed by creditors and individuals, including archdiocese whistleblower Jennifer Haselberger, who filed a notice of claim for alleged defamation, and John Bussmann, a former priest charged with sexual misconduct who seeks compensation for living expenses and other support.

Just a tip of the iceberg. According to research, only a small fraction report sexual abuse. In this case alone there are probably tens of thousands of victims.

Liar Joe returns.

[Ibanez]

I've had a chance to look at the StemExpress documents that have been posted on line, and I realized that we are missing the forest for the trees here.

42 U.S.C. Section 289 provides: “It shall be unlawful for any person to knowingly acquire, receive, or otherwise transfer any human fetal tissue for valuable consideration if the transfer affects interstate commerce.”

StemExpress has technicians on site at the PP affiliates who immediately collect fetal tissue after an abortion, and then transport that tissue to StemExpress. At the StemExpress labs, technicians then process the tissue, fulfill orders, and arrange for shipping to StemExpress customers who have placed orders for certain specific types of fetal tissue (liver, pancreas, etc.).

StemExpress' processing costs a lot of money. It involves the use of expensive machinery, and the cost of shipping tissue so that it arrives in a usable form at the research center is also very expensive.

Nonetheless, StemExpress prices the tissue to involve a substantial profit for it. It is a "for profit" corporation. While the focus of all this has been on the fees received by PP, it is readily apparent, once you review StemExpress' documents, that is involved in the "transfer [of] .. human fetal tissue for valuable consideration" in a way that affects interstate commerce, in apparent violation of federal law.

Frankly, it does not appear that PP incurs any additional costs in connection with this process, since the fetal tissue is immediately turned over to StemExpress. In truth, this procedure probably saves PP money, since PP does not incur the high cost of disposing of the tissue as a classified "medical waste."

Putting aside whether the fees paid to PP constitute payment of costs or a profit, StemExpress is violating federal criminal law.

Moreover, it seems that the decision to engage in a relationship with a procurement firm is made by each PP affiliate on an affiliate-by-affiliate basis, and it seems that the practice is not common among PP affiliates.

This raises the question, in my mind, whether there are specific PP employees/doctors who are PERSONALLY profiting from sales by firms like StemExpress, by way of kickback or otherwise. This needs to be investigated in the famous journalistic practice of "follow the money."

Moreover, from what other sources does StemExpress obtain fetal tissue? It has a handful of contracts with PP affiliates, but these PP affiliates seem incapable of providing StemExpress with the volume of tissue necessary for StemExpress' operations, at least based on my review of the documents on line. Is StemExpress obtaining fetal tissue from nefarious sources, and using its contracts with PP affiliates as cover?

Moreover, these PP affiliates are, at the very least, participating in a conspiracy to violate federal law, and I strongly suspect there are individuals at these affiliates who are personally profiting by way of kickback or other personal payments/benefits.

This, from a monster who defended a serial pedophile who raped several hundred handicapped boys.

What's that have to do with this? Red herring.

[JoltinJoe]

I've had a chance to look at the StemExpress documents that have been posted on line, and I realized that we are missing the forest for the trees here.

42 U.S.C. Section 289 provides: “It shall be unlawful for any person to knowingly acquire, receive, or otherwise transfer any human fetal tissue for valuable consideration if the transfer affects interstate commerce.”

StemExpress has technicians on site at the PP affiliates who immediately collect fetal tissue after an abortion, and then transport that tissue to StemExpress. At the StemExpress labs, technicians then process the tissue, fulfill orders, and arrange for shipping to StemExpress customers who have placed orders for certain specific types of fetal tissue (liver, pancreas, etc.).

StemExpress' processing costs a lot of money. It involves the use of expensive machinery, and the cost of shipping tissue so that it arrives in a usable form at the research center is also very expensive.

Nonetheless, StemExpress prices the tissue to involve a substantial profit for it. It is a "for profit" corporation. While the focus of all this has been on the fees received by PP, it is readily apparent, once you review StemExpress' documents, that is involved in the "transfer [of] .. human fetal tissue for valuable consideration" in a way that affects interstate commerce, in apparent violation of federal law.

Frankly, it does not appear that PP incurs any additional costs in connection with this process, since the fetal tissue is immediately turned over to StemExpress. In truth, this procedure probably saves PP money, since PP does not incur the high cost of disposing of the tissue as a classified "medical waste."

Putting aside whether the fees paid to PP constitute payment of costs or a profit, StemExpress is violating federal criminal law.

Moreover, it seems that the decision to engage in a relationship with a procurement firm is made by each PP affiliate on an affiliate-by-affiliate basis, and it seems that the practice is not common among PP affiliates.

This raises the question, in my mind, whether there are specific PP employees/doctors who are PERSONALLY profiting from sales by firms like StemExpress, by way of kickback or otherwise. This needs to be investigated in the famous journalistic practice of "follow the money."

Moreover, from what other sources does StemExpress obtain fetal tissue? It has a handful of contracts with PP affiliates, but these PP affiliates seem incapable of providing StemExpress with the volume of tissue necessary for StemExpress' operations, at least based on my review of the documents on line. Is StemExpress obtaining fetal tissue from nefarious sources, and using its contracts with PP affiliates as cover?

Moreover, these PP affiliates are, at the very least, participating in a conspiracy to violate federal law, and I strongly suspect there are individuals at these affiliates who are personally profiting by way of kickback or other personal payments/benefits.

This, from a monster who defended a serial pedophile who raped several hundred handicapped boys.

How did you graduate high school with such poor reading comprehension skills?

Concerning that case, what I said was that the number of "200 victims" was derived at by attorneys by assuming that every child who attended that school for the deaf was an abuse victim during the period the abusive priest served there.

I then pointed you to the pdf documents that accompanied the NY Times story concerning "200 victims." These documents showed that the number of students who made accusations against that priest totaled 39, and that the priest subsequently admitted to 29 of those allegations, and denied the other 10.

Therefore, what I said was the number of "200 victims" was an exaggeration, and the actual number was probably 29 to 39.

[JoltinJoe]

Catholic child rape scandal was is the worst.

Keep defending pedophiles, Joe.

This just in from another morally bankrupt catholic archdiocese.

MINNESOTA
Star Tribune

By Jean Hopfensperger Star Tribune AUGUST 4, 2015

A day after the deadline for filing clergy abuse claims against the St. Paul and Minneapolis archdiocese, interim Archbishop Bernard Hebda described the number of victims who stepped forward as “staggering.”

“It’s helped me to realize how much pain there can be out there on these issues, that there can be 407 people carrying these burdens,” said Hebda, who became interim archbishop of the St. Paul and Minneapolis Archdiocese in June.

“The number encourages me not to underestimate that.”

The U.S. Bankruptcy Court Tuesday showed a final tally of 669 claims against the archdiocese, of which 407 were for clergy abuse and another 150 or so were from parishes seeking indemnification from abuse claims and also to protect their medical and dental insurance.

The others were filed by creditors and individuals, including archdiocese whistleblower Jennifer Haselberger, who filed a notice of claim for alleged defamation, and John Bussmann, a former priest charged with sexual misconduct who seeks compensation for living expenses and other support.

Just a tip of the iceberg. According to research, only a small fraction report sexual abuse. In this case alone there are probably tens of thousands of victims.

407 claims over a period of 50 years.

Now, you say that this is "only a small fraction," but experts don't think that is the case concerning claims against the Catholic Church.

One expert has sworn in an affidavit that he believes, based on his review and investigation of claims, that the rate of false reports of abuse against Catholic clergy, for claims asserted for the first time after 2002, is 50%. That rate is significantly higher if the claim was never made anywhere prior to 2002, and the priest has no other accusations.

So, while ordinarily experts believe that sex abuse is an under-reported crime, that does not hold regarding claims that were first made after 2002 against Catholic clergy.

So, with regard to the 407 claims, if I'm an attorney for the Diocese, I would accept as valid any claim for which there is some record prior to 2002.

I would investigate any claim for which there is no record prior to 2002.

And I would assume that any claim made for the first time after 2002 against a priest with no other accusations is false.

[andy7171]

Catholic child rape and torture scandal one of the worst crimes against humanity ever recorded. The scale and sophistication of the cover up confirms it was only the tip of the iceberg - fact.

I agree. The cover up does really rank up there, almost as worse as the crime. But where exactly does the delivering live babies just to harvest their organs rank? Comparatively?

[BDKJMU]

This, from a monster who defended a serial pedophile who raped several hundred handicapped boys.

What's that have to do with this? Red herring.

He did 7 straight, mostly 1 liner posts, that said nothing of substance..

[kalm]

Catholic child rape and torture scandal one of the worst crimes against humanity ever recorded. The scale and sophistication of the cover up confirms it was only the tip of the iceberg - fact.

I agree. The cover up does really rank up there, almost as worse as the crime. But where exactly does the delivering live babies just to harvest their organs rank? Comparatively?

Your not helping the argument.

[89Hen]

I agree. The cover up does really rank up there, almost as worse as the crime. But where exactly does the delivering live babies just to harvest their organs rank? Comparatively?

Your not helping the argument.

He's helping more than DB1 who is trying his best to derail this thread.

[Ibanez]

D1b, God love him, is just trolling.

[D1B]

This, from a monster who defended a serial pedophile who raped several hundred handicapped boys.

How did you graduate high school with such poor reading comprehension skills?

Concerning that case, what I said was that the number of "200 victims" was derived at by attorneys by assuming that every child who attended that school for the deaf was an abuse victim during the period the abusive priest served there.

I then pointed you to the pdf documents that accompanied the NY Times story concerning "200 victims." These documents showed that the number of students who made accusations against that priest totaled 39, and that the priest subsequently admitted to 29 of those allegations, and denied the other 10.

Therefore, what I said was the number of "200 victims" was an exaggeration, and the actual number was probably 29 to 39.

Liar Joe!

[D1B]

This, from a monster who defended a serial pedophile who raped several hundred handicapped boys.

What's that have to do with this? Red herring.

Pointing out that Joe lacks credibility on these issues and his opinions are suspect and usually based on lies, logical fallacies, deception, etc.

Actually several other have done the same, albeit with less panache.

[JoltinJoe]

What's that have to do with this? Red herring.

Pointing out that Joe lacks credibility on these issues and his opinions are suspect and usually based on lies, logical fallacies, deception, etc.

Actually several other have done the same, albeit with less panache.

I own you. Everyone knows it.

D6.93

[D1B]

Pointing out that Joe lacks credibility on these issues and his opinions are suspect and usually based on lies, logical fallacies, deception, etc.

Actually several other have done the same, albeit with less panache.

I own you. Everyone knows it.

D6.93

Personal attacks. Yawn.

I accept your surrender, once again.

No one trusts or believes you regarding these issues.