Poll: Do You Support Re-Opening Most of America?

[AZGrizFan]

Of course it does...and your economic fear porn is not all that different. At least with economics we know the curative measures and vaccines....if we choose them.

Notice how very few had these economic fears a year ago when most Americans were still just $500 away from economic catastrophe?

My economic fear porn? I've been calling for balancing the medical impacts with the sociological, psychological and economic impacts almost from the beginning. How is it fear porn if I'm calling for balancing the many impacts? Fear porn is using tales economic doom or killing grandma to argue for prioritizing one impact at the expense of others.

What are the curative measures and vaccines for the economic impacts? We have things that have helped in the short-term but can we keep doing them for longer? At what cost? I have and will continue to argue that we can't keep throwing money at this problem. Government revenues are dropping and will continue to drop as long as people are out of work. IMO, continuing to print money to throw at people and companies is going to have some very serious long-term ramifications.

Americans refusal to save is a problem that was well known but has been further exposed by COVID-19.

It's come down to this, 88: If you support the reopening of America, even with proper protocols in place, it's fear porn. Unless you support the continual moving of the goal posts, it's fear porn. Until you support complete shutdown without 100% testing, tracing, and zero new cases, it's fear porn.

[kalm]

I think what's confusing you AZ... is that he doesn't believe you actually believe that

not that he doesn't "get it"

you sure about that? Because I have been saying it since the beginning of this thing. Been pretty effing clear....

“Of this thing” being my point that went sailing over your nuanced head.

[AZGrizFan]

you sure about that? Because I have been saying it since the beginning of this thing. Been pretty effing clear....

“Of this thing” being my point that went sailing over your nuanced head.

speak English, motherfucker. Say what you mean.

[kalm]

Of course it does...and your economic fear porn is not all that different. At least with economics we know the curative measures and vaccines....if we choose them.

Notice how very few had these economic fears a year ago when most Americans were still just $500 away from economic catastrophe?

My economic fear porn? I've been calling for balancing the medical impacts with the sociological, psychological and economic impacts almost from the beginning. How is it fear porn if I'm calling for balancing the many impacts? Fear porn is using tales economic doom or killing grandma to argue for prioritizing one impact at the expense of others.

What are the curative measures and vaccines for the economic impacts? We have things that have helped in the short-term but can we keep doing them for longer? At what cost? I have and will continue to argue that we can't keep throwing money at this problem. Government revenues are dropping and will continue to drop as long as people are out of work. IMO, continuing to print money to throw at people and companies is going to have some very serious long-term ramifications.

Americans refusal to save is a problem that was well known but has been further exposed by COVID-19.

I’m using fear porn sarcastically in response to some using “crisis porn”.

There’s legit concerns for both.

We can’t print money forever but as I’ve mentioned before, CCC and WPA type projects are a no brainer for getting people back to work and reinjecting tax revenue especially on a local and state level.

History doesn’t repeat but it echoes. We’ve gone through economic crisis before and have come out the back end with profits from public investments.

We’re not talking years, we’re talking months or even weeks if we play it right and the health situation is massively reduced...quickly.

[kalm]

“Of this thing” being my point that went sailing over your nuanced head.

speak English, motherfucker. Say what you mean.

I literally quoted your phrase. Figure it out or regroup your thoughts.

[UNI88]

My economic fear porn? I've been calling for balancing the medical impacts with the sociological, psychological and economic impacts almost from the beginning. How is it fear porn if I'm calling for balancing the many impacts? Fear porn is using tales economic doom or killing grandma to argue for prioritizing one impact at the expense of others.

What are the curative measures and vaccines for the economic impacts? We have things that have helped in the short-term but can we keep doing them for longer? At what cost? I have and will continue to argue that we can't keep throwing money at this problem. Government revenues are dropping and will continue to drop as long as people are out of work. IMO, continuing to print money to throw at people and companies is going to have some very serious long-term ramifications.

Americans refusal to save is a problem that was well known but has been further exposed by COVID-19.

I’m using fear porn sarcastically in response to some using “crisis porn”.

There’s legit concerns for both.

We can’t print money forever but as I’ve mentioned before, CCC and WPA type projects are a no brainer for getting people back to work and reinjecting tax revenue especially in a local and state level.

History doesn’t repeat but it echoes. We’ve gone through economic crisis before and have come out the back end with profits from public investments.

We’re not talking years, we’re talking months or even weeks if we play it right and the health situation is massively reduced...quickly.

Why are you using your fear porn sarcasm on me? I've been an advocate of a balanced approach but you seem to be fighting the "fear porn" by taking more of the extreme opposite "crisis porn" position.

If people can work on CCC and WPA type projects why can't they just go back to their regular jobs? How are they safer?

I'm all for smart public investments especially those that help improve infrastructure but long-term private sector jobs are better than short-term public sector jobs.

Where were you 11 years ago when Obama was putting in place his shovel-ready projects and I was calling for CCC/WPA type infrastructure improvements instead of throwing asphalt in potholes?

As Ganny has asked, what is going to change in the months or even weeks? What will be different that will make it ok to start opening up then? That's the question that needs to be answered.

[AZGrizFan]

speak English, motherfucker. Say what you mean.

I literally quoted your phrase. Figure it out or regroup your thoughts.

What's your issue with "this thing"?

[dbackjon]

expenses are higher.

Insurance?

food is more expensive, spending money on sanitizers, masks, etc. Somewhat offset by lower gas prices

[kalm]

I’m using fear porn sarcastically in response to some using “crisis porn”.

There’s legit concerns for both.

We can’t print money forever but as I’ve mentioned before, CCC and WPA type projects are a no brainer for getting people back to work and reinjecting tax revenue especially in a local and state level.

History doesn’t repeat but it echoes. We’ve gone through economic crisis before and have come out the back end with profits from public investments.

We’re not talking years, we’re talking months or even weeks if we play it right and the health situation is massively reduced...quickly.

Why are you using your fear porn sarcasm on me? I've been an advocate of a balanced approach but you seem to be fighting the "fear porn" by taking more of the extreme opposite "crisis porn" position.

If people can work on CCC and WPA type projects why can't they just go back to their regular jobs? How are they safer?

I'm all for smart public investments especially those that help improve infrastructure but long-term private sector jobs are better than short-term public sector jobs.

Where were you 11 years ago when Obama was putting in place his shovel-ready projects and I was calling for CCC/WPA type infrastructure improvements instead of throwing asphalt in potholes?

As Ganny has asked, what is going to change in the months or even weeks? What will be different that will make it ok to start opening up then? That's the question that needs to be answered.

Good points.

Many of these businesses and jobs won’t come back. Some them operated on a mirage of economic security and artificial demand. There’s also a far greater level of safety compliance on a government level (yeah...I know compliance like common good are scary topics ).

Again, what will hopefully change over the next few months is learning more from places like Sweden and Georgia. Gallup, NM, Veterans homes in Mass. Curative Medical procedures and drugs. Track and trace tech (another scary concept).

Things are already opening back up. There’s still a ton to learn.

[dbackjon]

Too early to reopen - the second wave will be worse.

Income has been affected in the household (temporarily, will soon resume), expenses are higher.

The reopen early states are going to be new hotspots.

You have all the idiots that think requiring masks is "infringing on their Freedum" or other idiotic statements the far-right is churning out.

How are expense higher? I have more disposable income than I've EVER had. Not eating out, not making frivolous trips to Target or Lowes or Home Depot or any of a number of other retail outlets....combine that with the fact that almost every lender has given a 90 day deferral of payments (if you choose to take advantage of that) and if your income hasn't been disrupted you should be swimming in cash right now.

We didn't eat out much before. Food has become more expensive. Buying sanitizers, masks, etc. Chase isn't giving a deferral per se - you have to pay it all back in a lump sum after 3 months (greedy bastards).

[kalm]

I literally quoted your phrase. Figure it out or regroup your thoughts.

What's your issue with "this thing"?

It took a crisis for many to understand the underlying economic shortfalls.

[dbackjon]

Of course it does...and your economic fear porn is not all that different. At least with economics we know the curative measures and vaccines....if we choose them.

Notice how very few had these economic fears a year ago when most Americans were still just $500 away from economic catastrophe?

See, it's not the ACTUAL economy I'm worried about. Yes, the economy will eventually come back. It's the people BEHIND that economy. The lives that are destroyed. The lives that are lost. The things desperate people do when their livelihood is stripped away suddenly and permanently like that.

Do you get the difference? Or is it too nuanced?

So you are supporting a $15-$20 minimum wage?

[dbackjon]

Let me give you an example as to why he might not believe you..
You said that we should all just ignore Trump's words and judge him by his actions
while you spent the previous 8 years judging Obama by his words

Just as "an example" of why somebody might find you "suspicious" regarding what you believe

No, I've judged Obama by his words and his actions. He failed in both respects.

And I'm not Trump. I can't lie with that kind of ease. Or even have a fake persona with that kind of ease.

LMAO that anyone thinks Obama was a failure, especially a Cult45er like you.

[dbackjon]

Of course it does...and your economic fear porn is not all that different. At least with economics we know the curative measures and vaccines....if we choose them.

Notice how very few had these economic fears a year ago when most Americans were still just $500 away from economic catastrophe?

My economic fear porn? I've been calling for balancing the medical impacts with the sociological, psychological and economic impacts almost from the beginning. How is it fear porn if I'm calling for balancing the many impacts? Fear porn is using tales economic doom or killing grandma to argue for prioritizing one impact at the expense of others.

What are the curative measures and vaccines for the economic impacts? We have things that have helped in the short-term but can we keep doing them for longer? At what cost? I have and will continue to argue that we can't keep throwing money at this problem. Government revenues are dropping and will continue to drop as long as people are out of work. IMO, continuing to print money to throw at people and companies is going to have some very serious long-term ramifications.

Americans refusal to save is a problem that was well known but has been further exposed by COVID-19.

You mean like Obamacare "death panels" or "Gays are ruining society fear porn?

[AZGrizFan]

See, it's not the ACTUAL economy I'm worried about. Yes, the economy will eventually come back. It's the people BEHIND that economy. The lives that are destroyed. The lives that are lost. The things desperate people do when their livelihood is stripped away suddenly and permanently like that.

Do you get the difference? Or is it too nuanced?

So you are supporting a $15-$20 minimum wage?

I'm supporting people being allowed to make a living. Not really that difficult to understand. And if they're good, they'll make a lot more than $15 or $20 an hour. No need to pay pimple-faced teenaged burger flippers $15.

[AZGrizFan]

No, I've judged Obama by his words and his actions. He failed in both respects.

And I'm not Trump. I can't lie with that kind of ease. Or even have a fake persona with that kind of ease.

LMAO that anyone thinks Obama was a failure, especially a Cult45er like you.

I'm hardly a cultist, and yes Obama was a massive failure, especially considering the opportunity that was presented to him as the first black president.

[BDKJMU]

Insurance?

food is more expensive, spending money on sanitizers, masks, etc. Somewhat offset by lower gas prices

How in the hell are you spending more on food? Most Americans have gone from a mix of eating out and eating at home, to mostly eating at home. Meals from grocery bought food are A LOT cheaper than meals at restaurants. And if you stocked up on food, going from a week or 2 in your fridge and pantry to several months, that isn't spending more on food- it just means you stocked up, spent more now, less later.

If you're spending THAT much $$ on sanitizers & masks you're either getting ripped off, or you're not that resourceful. You can make cheap home made versions of both..

[BDKJMU]

Too early to reopen - the second wave will be worse.

Income has been affected in the household (temporarily, will soon resume), expenses are higher.

The reopen early states are going to be new hotspots.

You have all the idiots that think requiring masks is "infringing on their Freedum" or other idiotic statements the far-right is churning out.

How are expense higher? I have more disposable income than I've EVER had. Not eating out, not making frivolous trips to Target or Lowes or Home Depot or any of a number of other retail outlets....combine that with the fact that almost every lender has given a 90 day deferral of payments (if you choose to take advantage of that) and if your income hasn't been disrupted you should be swimming in cash right now.

Yeah, overall consumer spending is way down. 7.5% in March.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/rpt-wrap ... 00066.html
When the April #s come out it will surely be a double digit drop. So when anyone claims their expenses are up, that sure isn't typical..

[Ibanez]

food is more expensive, spending money on sanitizers, masks, etc. Somewhat offset by lower gas prices

How in the hell are you spending more on food? Most Americans have gone from a mix of eating out and eating at home, to mostly eating at home. Meals from grocery bought food are A LOT cheaper than meals at restaurants. And if you stocked up on food, going from a week or 2 in your fridge and pantry to several months, that isn't spending more on food- it just means you stocked up, spent more now, less later.

If you're spending THAT much $$ on sanitizers & masks you're either getting ripped off, or you're not that resourceful. You can make cheap home made versions of both..

The food bill is high b/c it's coming in at once but we are certainly spending less than we normally would. And we're going to try to continue this going forward. We support 1 local company a week. We aren't going to the brewery and spending money 1-2 nights a week. In the beginning we had about $300 grocery bills but we realized that was to get a bunch of basics. We've go to the store once a week and usually spend about $100. We went over board last week and spent about $224.

But we also aren't filling up the cars 1x a week, spending $88/mo on transit, spending money out at the brewery, the restaurants around time, etc.. 2-3 x a week.

[kalm]

See, it's not the ACTUAL economy I'm worried about. Yes, the economy will eventually come back. It's the people BEHIND that economy. The lives that are destroyed. The lives that are lost. The things desperate people do when their livelihood is stripped away suddenly and permanently like that.

Do you get the difference? Or is it too nuanced?

So you are supporting a $15-$20 minimum wage?

The world needs ditch diggers too....

[HI54UNI]

My economic fear porn? I've been calling for balancing the medical impacts with the sociological, psychological and economic impacts almost from the beginning. How is it fear porn if I'm calling for balancing the many impacts? Fear porn is using tales economic doom or killing grandma to argue for prioritizing one impact at the expense of others.

What are the curative measures and vaccines for the economic impacts? We have things that have helped in the short-term but can we keep doing them for longer? At what cost? I have and will continue to argue that we can't keep throwing money at this problem. Government revenues are dropping and will continue to drop as long as people are out of work. IMO, continuing to print money to throw at people and companies is going to have some very serious long-term ramifications.

Americans refusal to save is a problem that was well known but has been further exposed by COVID-19.

I’m using fear porn sarcastically in response to some using “crisis porn”.

There’s legit concerns for both.

We can’t print money forever but as I’ve mentioned before, CCC and WPA type projects are a no brainer for getting people back to work and reinjecting tax revenue especially on a local and state level.

History doesn’t repeat but it echoes. We’ve gone through economic crisis before and have come out the back end with profits from public investments.

We’re not talking years, we’re talking months or even weeks if we play it right and the health situation is massively reduced...quickly.

Honest question - do you really think that people will go to work on CCC or WPA type projects? We didn't even make people on welfare do that prior to the pandemic. There's no way in hell a person that worked an inside retail or office job is going to go be a ditch digger without some work requirement. And there's no way Congress would ever pass a work requirement because it will be racist/sexist/homophobic/etc.

[89Hen]

Insurance?

food is more expensive, spending money on sanitizers, masks, etc. Somewhat offset by lower gas prices

Not sure why food is more expensive, I'm not seeing that here. In fact, I'm saving tons of money during this thing.

[89Hen]

The food bill is high b/c it's coming in at once but we are certainly spending less than we normally would.

Wha?

If you're spending less, then your bills are lower. One $200 charge for groceries is less than 3 x $75. I assume it's all going on a card that you pay once month, no?

[kalm]

Here’s how Washington is rolling. Soft reopening by mid May if things go well.



“SPOKANE, Wash. — As Washington state begins the gradual reopening of its economy, leaders in Spokane County continue to push for a different timeline at the local level.

Golfing at city and county courses, and fishing, hiking and hunting at many state parks and lands can resume on Tuesday.

The state Parks and Recreation Commission has released a list of over 100 state parks and properties that will open for day-use only, including some in the Spokane area.

On Friday, Washington Gov. Jay Inslee extended his "Stay Home, Stay Healthy" order aimed at curbing the spread of coronavirus through May 31.

Inslee unveiled a four-phase approach to reopening the state. Without outlining a firm timeline on the next phases, he said it would be at least three weeks between each reopening phase.

Inslee also said that counties with smaller populations and low numbers of cases can also explore possibilities of moving to phase two earlier than the rest of the state. “


https://www.krem.com/mobile/article/new ... 0ce27389ea

[kalm]

I’m using fear porn sarcastically in response to some using “crisis porn”.

There’s legit concerns for both.

We can’t print money forever but as I’ve mentioned before, CCC and WPA type projects are a no brainer for getting people back to work and reinjecting tax revenue especially on a local and state level.

History doesn’t repeat but it echoes. We’ve gone through economic crisis before and have come out the back end with profits from public investments.

We’re not talking years, we’re talking months or even weeks if we play it right and the health situation is massively reduced...quickly.

Honest question - do you really think that people will go to work on CCC or WPA type projects? We didn't even make people on welfare do that prior to the pandemic. There's no way in hell a person that worked an inside retail or office job is going to go be a ditch digger without some work requirement. And there's no way Congress would ever pass a work requirement because it will be racist/sexist/homophobic/etc.

I’m not saying it will happen but it should. I find it similar to “Americans won’t pick fruit in the fields argument”. If you cut off their P.A. and they get hungry or it threatens their streaming service...they will.

Kalm...out conking the conks....